Veterans Commitee Ballot - 2017

[Gwreck]

This year (2016 vote at Winter Meetings for 2017 induction), it's the "Today's Game" era that gets consideration.

On the ballot:
Harold Baines
Albert Belle
Will Clark
Orel Hershiser
Davey Johnson
Mark McGwire
Lou Piniella
John Schuerholz
Bud Selig
George Steinbrenner

[Benjamin Grimm]

Rooting for Davey, against Steinbrenner, McGwire, and Selig.

Indifferent to all the others.

[Gwreck]

Be sure to vote. (Unless you want "none of the above.")

[Edgy MD]

What a strange ballot. How does Mark McGwire get on a ballot before, say, Lou Whittaker?

I just clicked for Johnson but Schuerholz probably is a god choice too. Managers tend to get sent packing if they don't come to the ballot with at least two championships.

[Frayed Knot]

If forced to choose one as most deserving I'd opt for Schurholz

[HahnSolo]

Frayed Knot wrote: If forced to choose one as most deserving I'd opt for Schurholz

Agreed. Maybe Belle too.

[bmfc1]

I hope that the vote for Selig ends in a tie.

[Zvon]

bmfc1 wrote: I hope that the vote for Selig ends in a tie.

BoC

I'm going to have to give this some thought (something I rarely do for anything).

[Chad ochoseis]

I second that BoC.

McGwire??? There really needs to be a rule specifying a waiting period between the BBWAA ballot and the Veterans' Committee ballot. The point of the Veterans' Committee is to right omissions by the BBWAA that can be seen as unfair from a historical perspective. One year off the BBWAA ballot isn't enough for any kind of historical perspective.

That being said, he's the only one with an HoF case to be made. I blame baseball (i.e. Bud and the ownership) for the PED proliferation in the 1990s more than any of the individuals who cheated. They looked the other way and cashed their checks when 60 home runs became the new 40 and claimed to be shocked - shocked! - when the Mitchell Report came out. But McGwire is a borderline case at best. I'd lean towards not voting for him.

I don't see anyone else on that list who belongs in the Hall. Baines was a compiler. Albert Belle was an anti-compiler whose great career was overshadowed by his utter assholery, but he's not quite a Hall of Famer. Hershiser was close, but not quite.

[Guest d'Kong76]

I don't really see Davey in the HOF, my love for him aside.
Sealeg probably should be in, he was commish for almost two decades. Dick? Yes.
HOF'r? Probably.
They should probably just put in McGwire, and the others as their non-ballot times
come up and be done with it. It is what it was, was what it is, whatever...
I'd have guessed Steingrabber was in already, I don't follow so closely I guess.

I haven't voted, just babbling here.

[Guest Rockin' Doc]

I tend to think of the Hall of Fame as being reserved for the true greats of the game. By my rigid criteria for admission, I would probably pass on all of the current crop listed above.

[MFS62]

I voted only for John Schuerholz.
He built a dynasty through smart moves (and wasn't a dick about it like Boss George).

Later

[Edgy MD]

Let me tell you about Hershiser. He pitched his arm off in 1988, and he was never the same again. Maybe the bottom line doesn't endorse him, but it's a shame his bold sacrifice got Tommy Lasorda in the Hall of Fame but leaves him on the outside.

[seawolf17]

Edgy MD wrote: Let me tell you about Hershiser. He pitched his arm off in 1988, and he was never the same again. Maybe the bottom line doesn't endorse him, but it's a shame his bold sacrifice got Tommy Lasorda in the Hall of Fame but leaves him on the outside.

LaSorda is in the Hall just for his Kingman speech.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

Bonus quiz: What former Met joined the Bowling Green U. baseball team just as Hershiser left with his first Dodgers contract?

[Guest Mets Guy in Michigan]

I voted for Davey and Pinella. When you look at some of the other managers in the Hall -- and there aren't really all that many -- they fit in. Schuerholz, too, as there are probably fewer general managers.

I don't have a beef with compilers. You need to be great to be around long enough to compile the stats you need to get into the conversation. But I think Baines still falls a little short.

I don't like it, but I think Steinbrenner gets in. No other owner with as many rings is on the outside. Of course, no other owner was probably suspended twice and has the general air of ick that surrounds Steinbrenner.

I think all the commissioners but the recent short-timers -- Bart Giamatti, Fay Vincent, Peter Ueberroth -- are in the hall, so I suspect Bud gets in.

[Ceetar]

I didn't vote for Selig but I probably should've, but..

I mean, he was the commissioner. He'll have his own legacy. Everything about the entire league during his tenure. I'm not sure what specifically putting him in the hall adds.

[Frayed Knot]

Mets Guy in Michigan wrote: I don't like it, but I think Steinbrenner gets in. No other owner with as many rings is on the outside. Of course, no other owner was probably suspended twice and has the general air of ick that surrounds Steinbrenner.

Suspended twice including a lifetime ban (later plea-bargained down ... pity), repeated attempts to sabotage the league for his own gains, paid money to dig up dirt for the purpose of blackmailing his own player because he didn't like the fact that he had been out-negotiated at FA signing time, etc.
Those aren't just checkmarks against HoF enshrinement, they're complete deal-breakers.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

I can also make a reluctant argument for Selig. I think much of his legacy will require future debate but there's no doubt the game really accelerated and changed under his rule with the main changes being erasing the differences between leagues and uniting MLB as a single thing for the first time; labor peace; socialistic and largely owner-friendly revenue sharing; the creation of MLBAM as a thing to help market the game define its brand and make $$$.

More succinctly, make $$$ is his whole thing. A very influential figure in the game for better or worse.

[Edgy MD]

Yeah, it's important not use the word "suspended" with regard to Steinbrenner. Dude was banned. And that ban wasn't lifted based on any vindication or penitential act on his part. The politics of the situation just changed and he lined up votes in his corner.

I'm going with Jerry DiPoto as my Bowling Green guy.

OE: Nope, VCU.

[nymr83]

lets hold off on Selig - there is plenty of positive but also negative, I want to see how his legacy looks in 10 years.

Steinbrenner getting in would be disgraceful

McGwire is close but as someone already said - we shouldn't have a 'Veterans Committee' putting guys in right after they didn't get in on the merits.

I'd take "none of the above"

[MFS62]

Joey Belle had a brief 12 year career, fewer than most of nominees, but a six or seven year stretch in the middle of it ranks with some of the best years of some other HOF-ers.
He was disliked by the media (especially the writers who vote for the Hall nominees). Maybe this is a second, less emotional, chance for him.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/belleal01.shtml

Later

[Edgy MD]

Nymr83 wrote: lets hold off on Selig - there is plenty of positive but also negative, I want to see how his legacy looks in 10 years. Steinbrenner getting in would be disgraceful. McGwire is close but as someone already said - we shouldn't have a 'Veterans Committee' putting guys in right after they didn't get in on the merits. I'd take "none of the above"

Well, I would disagree with the implication that an induction following a selection by the Veterans Committee isn't getting in on the merits. At least, certainly not definitively so. A gap at least until the end of the period when he would have remained on the BBWAA ballot seems prudent, though.

Steinbrenner, it should be noted was (amazingly, to my thinking) on the Board of Directors of the Hall of Fame following his reinstatement, though I doubt many of the current board served with him.

[seawolf17]

Davey/Lou/Schuerholz/Selig.

I'm a "big Hall" guy.

[ashie62]

Mark McGwire. he was one of the very great.

[Frayed Knot]

The results of this one will be announced as the winter meetings get going on Sunday night (6 PM).

It's a 16-member voting board and the same 75% requirement is needed, so 12 or more votes get you in.

[Guest sharpie]

McGwire only

[Fman99]

Davey and Albert Belle. Cause why not.

[stevejrogers]

Just Schuerholz and Selig.

Find it a bit ironic that Selig gets inducted days after one of his more infamous "legacies" with the ASG and WS home field got the boot.

[Frayed Knot]

Not surprising that an owner with 20+ years as the commissioner and nearly five decades in the game overall who is nearing his mid-80s gets in on his first try.
And, as always, any vote that keeps Steinbrenner out is a good vote.