pivot pivot PIVOT!!!

[metsmarathon]

so, where do the mets pivot to next, now that yamamoto has decided he's rather play under palm trees instead of laguardia's air traffic?



should they keep trying to go big this offseason, or go home instead?



is jordan montgomery what you want under your chritmastree, or would prefer to find a way to wrap up lucas giolito? put a bow on cody bellinger perhaps?



what do you, savvy intelligent mets fan, want your team to turn to next?



or do we just leave the couch in the stairwell and call it a day?

[Benjamin Grimm]

I'd like them to try for that other Japanese starter, Shota Imanaga. Plus a DH with power, maybe a Jorge Soler or Teoscar Hernandez.



I also think they should look at Jordan Montgomery, but everything I'm hearing says they're not going to do that.

[metirish]

As things stand the Mets are likely maybe the 3rd best team in the NL East ( all going well) Hard to see that changing with what's out there , tough to sell us fans on laying low in 24 though

[Marshmallowmilkshake]

Benjamin Grimm wrote: I'd like them to try for that other Japanese starter, Shota Imanaga. Plus a DH with power, maybe a Jorge Soler or Teoscar Hernandez. I also think they should look at Jordan Montgomery, but everything I'm hearing says they're not going to do that.

I think you are spot on. Stearns allegedly likes to trade, so I'm curious if he gets a starter that way. The Mauricio injury really kicks us in the butt since we lose a prospect trade chip -- if not him, a Baty or Vientos. You almost need all those guys now.

[A Boy Named Seo]

I try to hijack that Dylan Cease trade. He's still 27 and won't be a FA til after '25.



Take a flier on Lucas Giolioto for 1 year plus an option if he doesn't suck.



And I try to sign Brandon Woodruff to a 2-year deal. Coming off TJ but he'll be just 31 next year.



And I throw all that money not spent on Yamamoto on Roki Sasaki next year.



24:

Senga

Cease

Severino

Quintana

Giolito

Howser

Megill

Butto

Peterson



25:

Senga

Sasaki

Cease

Woodruff

Giolito

Vasil

etc.

[Fman99]

Montgomery and Snell are the two best FA pitchers left and they're both 31. I don't think Unkie Steve wants to throw big bucks at older guys. He learned with Verlander & Scherzer that it doesn't work.

[Benjamin Grimm]

Yes, but Montgomery and Snell are quite a bit younger than Scherzer (37) and Verlander (40) were when they pitched their first games with the Mets.

[Edgy MD]

Clayton Kershaw is totally out there! I mean, he's totally recovering from shoulder surgery and totally expected not to be ready for opening day, but he's TOTALLY out there.



Heck, so is Greinke, if you want to get two Hall of Fame-bound question marks.

[metsmarathon]

I absolutely love the idea of getting woodruff.

[Fman99]

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Yes, but Montgomery and Snell are quite a bit younger than Scherzer (37) and Verlander (40) were when they pitched their first games with the Mets.

But the deals that it'll take to get them would extend into those later years, presumably. I'm good with them not signing 31 year old guys to 7-8 year pitching deals, personally.

[Benjamin Grimm]

Well, yeah, if that's what it takes. But if Montgomery could be had for five years, I'd go for it.

[MFS62]

=metsmarathon post_id=143465 time=1703259871 user_id=83]
I absolutely love the idea of getting woodruff.

[Marshmallowmilkshake]

I absolutely love the idea of getting woodruff. Do we know why the drop-off in IP last year. Was he inured? Later

https://metsmerizedonline.com/report-mets-have-checked-in-on-righty-brandon-woodruff/https://metsmerizedonline.com/report-mets-have-checked-in-on-righty-brandon-woodruff/



Expected to miss most -- more likely, all -- of the season.

[batmagadanleadoff]

Six teams in each league make the playoffs. One of those teams will be, at best, the 12th best team in the majors. Maybe even the 13th or 14th best team in the bigs. The Mets should contend, even without Yamamoto. Steve Cohen's teams should contend every year, given his willingness to spend. This is the crapfest that baseball has become. The 13th or 14th best team gets a chance to win the WS.

[Benjamin Grimm]

I pretty much agree. It doesn't make sense to go into 2024 thinking it's a lost season. You can try to be a 90-win team instead of a 100-win team (just this once) and get into the playoff melee and maybe turn that into a championship.

[Johnny Lunchbucket]

STEVE PHILLIPS SHOOTS FOR THE WILD CARD

[Centerfield]

Agreed. Two 84 win teams made the playoffs last year. One of them got hot at the right time and went to the World Series. For better or worse, this is what baseball is now. The Mets should never be out of the race.



The Mets aren't a playoff team as built, but with a few tweaks they can put themselves into the mix. It's probably not realistic to think another 84 win team will make the playoffs again, but high 80s or 90 wins should do it.



It's a testament to the ineptitude of prior management that they currently project to have the highest payroll in baseball but aren't a realistic contender with a 12 team playoff.

[Bob Alpacadaca]

=Centerfield post_id=143491 time=1703269698 user_id=65]
Agreed. Two 84 win teams made the playoffs last year. One of them got hot at the right time and went to the World Series. For better or worse, this is what baseball is now. The Mets should never be out of the race.



The Mets aren't a playoff team as built, but with a few tweaks they can put themselves into the mix. It's probably not realistic to think another 84 win team will make the playoffs again, but high 80s or 90 wins should do it.



It's a testament to the ineptitude of prior management that they currently project to have the highest payroll in baseball but aren't a realistic contender with a 12 team playoff.

[Centerfield]

I hope you're right. But I don't see it. I think it's a football saying? You are what your record says you are. And the Mets were a 75 win team last year and have even less pitching going into 2024. They were 20th in runs scored, and 18th in team ERA. That's a lot of ground to make up.



For pitching, the Mets had two good pitchers (Senga and Raley) and two ok ones (Quintana, Otto). Everyone else was terrible. Ottovino is now gone. Diaz coming back helps, but this pitching staff right now is worse than it was last year.



Offensively, the Mets got strong years from Alonso, Lindor and Nimmo. McNeil might be the only hitter who was down last year that might realistically bounce back. Maybe Alvarez figures it out. I think no one else is likely to improve upon their 2023 numbers.



Realistically, they need like five pitchers, and two hitters to be a wild card team. Like I said in another thread, it speaks to the ineptitude of past regimes.

[Bob Alpacadaca]

I just wonder if they would have been a 75-win team had they not sold at the deadline and punted August and September. Clearly the higher-ups didn't think they had a shot or they wouldn't have traded everyone.

[MFS62]

We're calling it pivot.

In dating it is called the rebound - the girl you go heavy for after your real girlfriend dumps you.

I hope the next players we go for don't get the vibes that were really weren't interested in them in the first place.

Later

[ashie62]

Cohen was willing to go 325 for 12 years of Yamamoto



But doesn't seem interested in Snell or Montgomery at far far less



Stearns might let the cards in the deck settle this year and then have at it



Lotta talent out there but I'm not feeling a real desire from the Mets to make acquisitions

[Edgy MD]

There are also plenty of fish that they will pursue in the trade market.

[The Hot Corner]

Unfortunately, trades could come at the expense of the very prospects the Mets are relying on to bolster their farm system and become key components of the parent club in 2025 and beyond.

[Edgy MD]

I'm not advocating. (Trades stink.) But it all comes at an expense. Teams nonetheless bet that the return will be higher, and if it's more often not, GMs and PoBOs pack their desks. That's the game.



They flipped a not-yet-appeared guy that was half the return on Eduardo Escobar into two big-league players, so I'm guessing they're willing to go deeper into their future talent pool.



pivot pivot PIVOT!!!

[batmagadanleadoff]

=Centerfield post_id=143495 time=1703271492 user_id=65]
I hope you're right. But I don't see it. I think it's a football saying? You are what your record says you are. And the Mets were a 75 win team last year and have even less pitching going into 2024. They were 20th in runs scored, and 18th in team ERA. That's a lot of ground to make up.

[ashie62]

Were pivoting to a 74 win season at this pace



This is a rebuild until action says otherwise



Probably even dump Pete



Very disappointing off season

[A Boy Named Seo]

Were pivoting to a 74 win season at this pace This is a rebuild until action says otherwise Probably even dump Pete Very disappointing off season

Nah, it's no rebuild, it's never been. They're >$250MM for '24 and already at $140MM for '25 on six players. Those aren't "rebuild" numbers.



And Yamamoto was the action. They offered over $300MM on one dude. By all accounts, they don't want to get tangled in the luxury for a decade to come on 30-somethings like Blake Snell, which I'm great with. Their plan at this point doesn't appear to be top secret - one year, lower-dollar contracts on bounce-back guys for this season and hopefully make the playoffs. Then tax reset for '25 with guys like Mauricio, Acuña, Vasil, Christian Scott, etc. hopefully thriving.



When you're not sure, just see if they're following the Dodgers. That's always been the blueprint.

[MFS62]

A Boy Named Seo wrote: When you're not sure, just see if they're following the Dodgers. That's always been the blueprint.

Oh shit!

Y'mean they're gonna' move?





Later

[Edgy MD]

It profiles more as a shore-up than a rebuild so far from my perspective.