Angel Pagan and Jenrry Mejia for Cliff Lee???

[batmagadanleadoff]

SNY reports that the Mets and Twins are the front-runners to obtain Cliff Lee. The rumor is that the Mets will send Pagan and Mejia to obtain the lefty.

[Guest metsguyinmichigan]

I'd see that if they were able to sign Lee. But as a rental? Yeeech.

[Benjamin Grimm]

I find myself not rooting for that to happen.

Seems to me it will hurt more than help.

[Gwreck]

I'd do it. Sounds good to me.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

I don;t much like that. How about Beltran and Parnell?

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

Here's whence it came.

That makes sense. Let's do it!

Oh, wait, Lee being magically transformed to be 5 years younger and being signed for 3 years isn't part of the deal? Then no deal.

[batmagadanleadoff]

I don't have an opinion on this proposed and rumored trade yet, but it just occurred to me that Floyd Youmans was as highly touted, if not more so, than Mejia currently is.

Also, SNY is now clarifying that it is the Mariners and not the Mets that have proposed the Pagan/Mejia for Lee deal.

[Benjamin Grimm]

I'm more concerned about losing Pagan than Mejia, I think. It relies too heavily on Beltran, who's a total wild card at this point. If Beltran can't answer the bell, who's the backup? Jesus Feliciano? I fear that Pagan's absence would hurt more than Lee's presence would help.

[TransMonk]

I just find it refreshing that we have more than enough pieces to be involved in the rumor for what is likely to be the biggest deadline name this season.

Pagan/Mejia is too much unless we can guarantee an extension negotiation and they throw in a AAA CF.

IMO Pagan/Mejia are worth more than the players we sent to Minny in the Santana deal.

[Centerfield]

Funny how fast things change. Six months ago I jump at that deal. Now, I wouldn't touch it.

[Guest Kong76]

Too much of Pagan fan at this point to ship him off ... wouldn't care
if Beltran never plays here again. I can't see scratching your way into
first place and then getting rid of one of the big reasons why you did.

[metirish]

It's a funny game alright , Pagan goes from fourth outfielder to prized possession/bait in less than half a season. I'm really not sure what to make of this at all , Lee won his 6th in a row last night?

Poll on a Texas site about lee

http://www.lonestarball.com/2010/6/24/1533739/a-cliff-lee-trade-poll

[Frayed Knot]

I think that sounds like a fair deal - as in fair for both sides - keeping in mind that there's nothing in that article suggesting it's anything other than names being thrown against the wall.

But, yeah, it would be a tough one to make with Beltran being as uncertain as he is - and the dilemma is that the longer you wait to make it the fewer starts you'd get out of Lee. Right now you're probably looking at about 17 or 18 and will lose one for every five days that a deal isn't made, starts that you'll never get back on the other end.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Thing is that you can always convince yourself that you need more pitching and the grass is greener over there.

Our pitching rocks. It takes guts to stand pat. Show some guts.

[Fman99]

Edgy DC wrote: Our pitching rocks. It takes guts to stand pat. Show some guts.

I'm waffling but I think ultimately this is where I'm at. It's working, don't touch it. Don't fuck it up.

[smg58]

Mejia was more valuable than any of the three prospects the Phillies got when the deal happened, and he's a lot more valuable now as the top two guys in that deal have crashed and burned this year. (I hope the Phillies fans enjoyed Lee, and their dominance of the division, while it lasted.) The Mariners set Lee's market themselves, and Mejia is worth more than two months of Lee.

Even given Tak's performance tonight, I don't see the rotation as it's currently structured as being broken and in need of fixing. It's certainly possible that midnight will strike for Dickey and Takahashi, but I'm willing to wait a month to see if it actually happens. I'd be sniffing around instead for an eighth-inning guy and an upgrade at second base.

[Valadius]

No...

[nymr83]

Well you don't just get 2 months of Lee, you either get 2 months + you sign him or you get 2 months + 2 compensation picks, including potentially a first rounder. Given that, I'd say Pagan + Mejia is fair.... but I wouldn't do it. I think the Mets are on the verge and would happily deal Mejia for a guy like Lee, but Pagan is too valuable, at least until we see Beltran out there 7 days a week healthy and producing.

[Guest OlerudOwned]

It'd be a huge, huge, huge upgrade to the rotation. But one that may not be worth it when it's being taken right out of the offense and outfield.

If Beltran doesn't return healthy, it's hard to imagine the Mets making a deep run with Francoeur and, yeesh, Feliciano or someone as everyday outfielders.

[Zvon]

They do this I'll be pissed.
Omar, prove your the GM I always thought you'd be and get Lee without doing this deal.

Beltran is gearing up for one thing.
His contract year.

Now this stage might suit his purposes the best,
and we will reap the benefits of that when he returns,
if he is healthy, but right now Pagan is center stage and shining.

And he's got a four years on Beltran, who might be limping off
into the sunset for all we know.
Nope, Pagans too valuable to us.
What he brings is a real nice fit for this stadium.

I have not seen enough of Mejia to say he can't play the pawn
along with some other piece(s).
I would like to see him develop as a Met, but I think I wanna make the
post season more this year.

There has got to be a better way to go about getting Lee.

[soupcan]

If Lee is only going to be a rental I'd be averse to even giving them Mejia. For a rental they get a pitching prospect and a young position player that the Mets have no place for. Maybe throw another body at them as well.

If Lee will negotiate an extension, well then we're talking. Give them Mejia and Fartinez and let them pick another hotshot from the minors. If they are bent on Pagan, I'd consider it and maybe I'd pull the trigger on that gambling that Beltran will be okay.

I've said it before and I'll say it again - I'm jealous of a guy like Omar, but in reality I couldn't do that job.

[Guest Edgy DC]

smg58 wrote: It's certainly possible that midnight will strike for Dickey and Takahashi, but I'm willing to wait a month to see if it actually happens.

It's certainly possible that midnight will strike for Santana, Niese, and Pelfrey, also. The issue is how likely that is and how dark it'll get then.

But sure, wait and see who the market comes to.

[metsmarathon]

according to fangraphs, thus far this season, cliff lee is the best pitcher in the majors, at 3.7 WAR.

1. cliff lee 3.7
2. francisco liriano 3.6
3. roy halladay 3.5
4. ubaldo jiminez 3.3
5. josh johnson 3.2

thus far this season, angel pagan is the fifth best centerfielder in the majors, at 2.5 WAR, while jenrry mejia sits at -0.1 WAR.

for this season, and presuming that the performances we've seen thus far would continue (ie no improvement from mejia or regression from pagan) the trade would net us just over one win. maybe approaching a win and a half. i'm not sure it's worth it.

if we could make this trade without giving up pagan, that would be a very helpful thing to do for this season. is it worth mejia and fartinez? um... i dunno...

[soupcan]

metsmarathon wrote: is it worth mejia and fartinez? um... i dunno...

Is it worth Fartinez & Mejia if Lee signs an extension? I think so.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Maybe, but (1) we likely won't get that up front, and (2) not all extensions are equal.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

Pretty sure it's out there that Lee ain't signing an extension under any circumstances.

[batmagadanleadoff]

I'm still undecided as to whether I'd be willing to part with Pagan and Mejia, but I disagree with those that would resist acquiring Lee on grounds that the Mets rotation is fine as it is. You can never get enough top of the rotation pitching. I don't know if it applies here, but a baseball peeve of mine is hearing a team say they're looking for a number five pitcher, or a number four pitcher. What the hell does that mean? If it applies to the Mets, does it mean that they're looking for someone who's better than Ollie and Maine, but who shouldn't be better than Dickey because to be better than Dickey would break the deal? Always get the best pitcher out there (at the right price, of course).

[TransMonk]

batmagadanleadoff wrote: You can never get enough top of the rotation pitching.

Yup.

[soupcan]

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Pretty sure it's out there that Lee ain't signing an extension under any circumstances.

I know, I know. Just sayin'.

batmagadanleadoff wrote: ...a baseball peeve of mine is hearing a team say they're looking for a number five pitcher, or a number four pitcher. What the hell does that mean?

I take that to mean how much they want to pay a guy and/or how much they'd be willing to give up to get a guy.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

metsmarathon wrote: according to fangraphs, thus far this season, cliff lee is the best pitcher in the majors, at 3.7 WAR. 1. cliff lee 3.7 2. francisco liriano 3.6 3. roy halladay 3.5 4. ubaldo jiminez 3.3 5. josh johnson 3.2 thus far this season, angel pagan is the fifth best centerfielder in the majors, at 2.5 WAR, while jenrry mejia sits at -0.1 WAR. for this season, and presuming that the performances we've seen thus far would continue (ie no improvement from mejia or regression from pagan) the trade would net us just over one win. maybe approaching a win and a half. i'm not sure it's worth it. if we could make this trade without giving up pagan, that would be a very helpful thing to do for this season. is it worth mejia and fartinez? um... i dunno...

Plus, Pagan's still controllable (arb-wise) for another year (IIRC), while Mejia's remaining cheap for the better part of 5-6 years. You're trading that as well for the 1-1.5 WAR.

Additionally, keep in mind as well that, should the trade go through and the Mets let him walk post-season, the compensatory draft picks the Mets would receive would be something like a high-20s-to-low-30s pick (since the teams with a realistic shot to sign Lee are a pretty exclusive bunch) and a mid-to-high 30s pick to go with.