Dark Horse Met - 2024

[Centerfield]

I can't seem to find the prior threads about Dark Horse Mets. Does anyone remember what the criteria were?



I wish I could remember things.

[Edgy MD]

Well, I'm pretty certain you coined it, so hey, feel free to change the criteria as you see fit.



It's your horse.

[Chad ochoseis]

I remember one per season, and there was no rule about having had to have been with the org all season.



I think of John Valentin 2006 as the quintessential DHM. We were desperate for someone to play 2B after Kaz Matsui's celestial level of suckitude, and Omar somehow pulled John Valentin and his 'stache off the scrap heap to do a better than serviceable job until we were able to trade for Luis Castillo.



A few good candidates this year.



OE: JOSE Valentin

[MFS62]

I like the way Luis Torrens held down the fort in Alvarez' absence. He has contributed with his bat and thrown out 7 of 10 runners attempting to steal.



If dark horse means "I didn't predict he would do that," he gets my vote. (Until the criteria change)



Later

[Benjamin Grimm]

I think Iglesias is really the guy who came out of nowhere.

[Edgy MD]

Whatever the criteria, and whatever your standards are, https://www.billboard.com/music/latin/new-york-mets-jose-iglesias-candelita-first-no-1-billboard-chart-omg-1235728331/José has become the first Met with a #1 record, and that's gonna be something that's hard to equal.

[Benjamin Grimm]

I was sure that George Foster's "Metsmerized" was going to be boffo.

[Marshmallowmilkshake]

I did not remember this. The three batters Jacob deGrom struck out on 10 pitches in the 2015 All-Star Game? Stephen Vogt, Jason Kipnis and ... José Iglesias.

[batmagadanleadoff]

Mark Vientos, who initially, was deemed not even good enough to carry Brett Baty's water. Now he's the Mets best hitter. Lindor is the Mets best player, but Vientos is their best hitter.



How could the dark horse be anybody else but Vientos?

[DocTee]

Vientos is this year's version of 2023 Alvarez. Lets hope he does not regress in 2025.

[Cowtipper]

I wouldn't say Vientos was a dark horse, since greatness was expected at one point. Iglesias is the obvious choice to me. Torrens is #2, but pretty far back on the list.



I don't think much was expected from Garrett, either, come to think of it.

[Johnny Lunchbucket]

I dunno anyone who'd have predicted Severino or Manaea's seasons. Being good wasn't out of the realm for either but they darkhorsed their way to "this good."



My dark horse Met vanished like a glove sailing into the stands.

[kcmets]

There is another thread.



$19.86 in Cranebucks for the first to find it.

[batmagadanleadoff]

=Cowtipper post_id=168806 time=1725493841 user_id=166]
I wouldn't say Vientos was a dark horse, since greatness was expected at one point. Iglesias is the obvious choice to me. Torrens is #2, but pretty far back on the list.



I don't think much was expected from Garrett, either, come to think of it.

[Edgy MD]

I don't know what that point was. Most evaluators remained resistant to whatever charms he brought. Even as he was productive every year in the minors, he was passed by Baty.



He had his advocates, but I don't remember anybody ever saying that when Vientos arrives, we're all going to be drinking champagne with every meal and farting through silk undies.

[Frayed Knot]

.... avi

Edited September 5, 2024 by Guest

[metsmarathon]

Edgy MD wrote: I don't know what that point was. Most evaluators remained resistant to whatever charms he brought. Even as he was productive every year in the minors, he was passed by Baty. He had his advocates, but I don't remember anybody ever saying that when Vientos arrives, we're all going to be drinking champagne with every meal and farting through silk undies.

i double up on the silk undies to help keep the farts in.

[Johnny Lunchbucket]

I was a Vientos denier. I was a Baty believer.



I thought Vientos would hit some dingers but was one of those hitters who would get himself out too often, striking out a lot and get dominated by good pitching. Also I though he would kill us defensively at third base.

[batmagadanleadoff]

Johnny Lunchbucket wrote: I was a Vientos denier.... I thought Vientos would hit some dingers but was one of those hitters who would get himself out too often, striking out a lot and get dominated by good pitching. Also I though he would kill us defensively at third base.

By early this season, I think yours was the consensus opinion about Vientos. It was mine, too. I thought Vientos would turn out to be a big stiff. But since his promotion to the big club, he's been a stud, to say the least.

[Benjamin Grimm]

I recall preferring Vientos to Baty, but I didn't think the difference would be as dramatic as it has been. I think it was more that I was giving up on Baty than going all in on Vientos.

[Johnny Lunchbucket]

I wouldn't give up on Baty. He's younger than Vientos, somewhat rushed up the chain, and was hitting very well in Syracuse this year after the demotion. Gotta see Vientos as a DH long term anyway, so not in competition with Baty for long

[Benjamin Grimm]

You're right; I really meant giving up on Baty for 2024. Although I wouldn't have been too disappointed if he had gone in a deadline deal as part of an important upgrade.

[The Hot Corner]

Johnny Lunchbucket wrote: I was a Vientos denier. I was a Baty believer. I thought Vientos would hit some dingers but was one of those hitters who would get himself out too often, striking out a lot and get dominated by good pitching. Also I though he would kill us defensively at third base.

I drank the same Kool Aid you did regarding Vientos.

[MFS62]

I'm a Vientos fan, but It may all be about "OMG" José Iglesias. When he was with Syracuse, the AAA Mets were the top team in AAA. Since his promotion on May 31st, the AAA Mets have sucked and suddenly the major league Mets who were 11 games under .500 have been one of the Top 3 teams in MLB and are 25 games over .500 since he joined them.

There are some players who contribute more than what we see in the box score.



Later

[batmagadanleadoff]

Mark Vientos 406 PA .270/.328/.849 (24 HR) 140 OPS+ 2.7bWAR

Jose Iglesias 239 PA .292/.372/.436 (3 HR) 123 OPS+ 2.7bWAR

[Benjamin Grimm]

Vientos is definitely more of an impact player this year, but I suppose the question is how dark is Iglesias' fur? He came from further out of nowhere than Vientos did.

[ashie62]

Yes Iglesias did



Tyrone Taylor?



There are quite a few on the periphery

[batmagadanleadoff]

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Vientos is definitely more of an impact player this year, but I suppose the question is how dark is Iglesias' fur? He came from further out of nowhere than Vientos did.

Exactly.

[metsmarathon]

yeah... i mean, vientos was being prepped in the stable in case one of the horses on the line threw it's jockey. iglesias was chomping on carrots & crab apples out in the back fields chasing mares and playing tag with the colts.

[Centerfield]

I've forgotten the original criteria. But if I had to set it now, I'd say that to be a Dark Horse Met you must be:



1. Not reasonably expected to contribute this year. No projected starters. No big name free agents coming off a down year. So someone like Luis Severino would not qualify.

2. Not a premiere prospect (or at least, no longer one). No Drew Gilbert, Acuna, Clifford, etc. However, if Gavin Cecchini were to somehow resurface and make a contribution, he would qualify.

3. The type of player if he were hurt/released/traded prior to the season you wouldn't care. Jose Iglesias fits that bill. If he tore his ACL in spring training no one would have lost any sleep. If that happened to Mark Vientos, we'd have been upset. Kinda similar to Ronny Mauricio.



Guys that I think qualify are Iglesias, Butto. Dedniel Nunez. Luis Torrens.



I'm debating whether David Peterson qualifies. I think if I was told his rehab took a step back and he was going to miss the season, I'm not sure I would have cared much, if at all.