Inside Old Timers Day

[G-Fafif]

Andy Strasberg, a longtime Padres front office employee, shares one great inside story after another on the Vintage Baseball Photos page on Facebook, this one in particular about the evolution of Old-Timers Day and how it rose and fell as a club promotion throughout MLB in the 1980s.

In 1986 the Equitable Finance Company agreed to be the national MLB sponsor of each team's Old-Timers' games. This arrangement was unprecedented. Prior to that, not every team even held Old-Timers' games. And to my knowledge, none of the handful of teams that did salute their former players with an Old-Timers' game had a title sponsor. For those few teams with a rich history, it was decidedly easier to put together two rosters of former popular players for an entertaining three-inning game prior to a regularly scheduled game during the season. Make no mistake about it: Those old-timer's games were largely done for business reasons rather than simple nostalgia. Those games needed to show a profit after expenses, based solely on increased ticket sales for the regularly scheduled game. The Old-Timers' game was always a favorite of mine. Producing the annual event for the Padres was an honor, privilege, and a pleasure. My focus, however, never wavered from keeping costs down – including players round-trip travel, hotel accommodations, player gifts, uniforms, and receptions. Beginning with the Padres' 1978 Old-Timers' game, I was entrusted with selecting those players who would be invited. Inviting former players was not as easy as it may appear. It was a precarious balancing act because we needed to make sure that both team rosters had a willing and capable player for each position. Except in very rare cases, retired players who were not physically able to play in the game were not worth the investment that would result in them being introduced and just giving the crowd a wave. Another part of the invitation formula was inviting recognizable and popular players. They would add to the “draw” along with a few marquee names to help with the sizzle and promotion of the pre-game event. Once Equitable became involved, in addition to their financial underwriting of costs, the majority of my responsibilities for the game were taken on by Capital Sports, an independent event firm hired by Equitable to manage each team's game. My role was reduced to a team contact coordinator rather than the hands-on implementer-in-charge and overseeing everything related to the game. Since Equitable was staging games around the country, they had a roster of players to select from. Their roster of 547 former players included 41 Hall of Famers. Their list of players kept growing because Equitable, at the urging of Joe Garagiola, who was a driving force behind the sponsored concept, began paying appearance fees to each participating player. Prior to that, when teams staged these games a player would not be financially compensated but rather receive airfare, hotel accommodations and a gift. Joe rationalized that it was a payday with real money that many former players needed. He was correct. However, as cruel as it may sound, I thought that was a bad precedent. Sure, in the beginning it would work, but eventually, it would be the downfall of the Old-Timers' games for most teams. In my opinion, paying players for Old-Timers' games presented two problems. The first was how to deal with the appearance fee paid to a superstar Hall of Famer as compared to an everyday, popular player. Players' ego and pride might lead them to believe their presence was worth more than another player. Historically, this wasn't an issue – because each player received the same modest thank-you gift. The second problem was forecasting the future of the event. What happens when Equitable no longer agrees to be title sponsor and another sponsor isn't found? That's when the event would fall back to each team along with associated expenses, some of which (led by player appearance fees) were non-existent before. Under that formula, retired players would expect appearance fees, which would substantially add to the cost of producing the game. For many teams, that would turn a previously profitable event into a deal buster. At the MLB business meetings in Phoenix in the fall of 1986 I voiced my concern in front of every team's representative and those MLB personnel who attended. The result was that I found myself in a shouting match with Joe Garagiola, who was upset by my remarks. For the record, Joe did the shouting; I did the respectful listening. (After the meeting, Joe apologized to me in private. That evening, friends once again, we had a photo taken as I accepted an award that the team won for attendance). As I had predicted, the Old-Timers' game eventually faded from most teams' schedules because of cost concerns once Equitable was no longer sponsoring the event.

[stevejrogers]

When did Upper Deck enter the picture? They were the all encompassing sponsor for a few years in the early-mid 1990s. Complete with neat 8x10 stadium giveaway collectables.



Hey BatMags, certainly a size Typewriter cards should look into…well, if we end up HAVING the event as scheduled!

[Edgy MD]

I want to be the Capital Sports Events guy who called into HQ all excited, yelling, "We got Bill Wambsganss!!"

[G-Fafif]

Upper Deck was the title sponsor at Shea in 1992 and 1993. Equitable had it through at least 1990.

Edited February 21, 2022 by Guest

[stevejrogers]

=G-Fafif post_id=86091 time=1645473846 user_id=55]
Upper Deck wast he title sponsor at Shea in 1992 and 1993. Equitable had it through at least 1990.

[Edgy MD]

Shared without comment.



[media=youtube]FdfdBCdxPzE[/media]

[whippoorwill]

Am I misremembering that the Old Timers game used to be played in conjunction with the All Star game, with healthy enough retirees from all the teams in one game?

[Edgy MD]

Apart from different teams' Old Timer's Day game in their stadia, there was for a time the nationally oriented Cracker Jack Old Timer's Classic (as seen above). I think it was played in Buffalo, but maybe other cities too — usually non-MLB parks that resonated with old-timey glory.



I think you're right that it was scheduled around the All-Star Game. They also tried to differentiate it by making it at least a little bit more competitive than the team-based games. Older dudes appeared, but recently retired Johnny Bench-types tended to dominate the action.



I don't remember how much they shortened the fences — presumably they did to some degree — but I also remember in what I think was the very first of these games, a rather old (75-ish?) Luke Applinng led off with a homer, and he didn't hit a whole lot of those in his actual career.



I'm guessing that, even though it wasn't that big a national event, team's assumed that it kind of made their own OTD games seem redundant, because the local affairs started disappearing around the same time.

[Benjamin Grimm]

http://leaptoad.com/mets/clippings/Daily_News_Wed__Jul_21__1982_.jpg>

[ashie62]

Edgy MD wrote: Shared without comment. [media=youtube]FdfdBCdxPzE[/media]

This is like an adult video company that brings in "old timer" talent for the day and actually expects them to perform.

[Edgy MD]

I confess that "adult video company" wasn't the phrase that popped into my mind.

[DocTee]

I guess the Mets of my youth were too young a franchise to have OTD but I remember Celebrity and Family Softball games-- at lest I remember them being featured in the Yearbooks. I think Craig Swan had a smokeshow of a wife, and there was a picture of the Happy Days cast with Joel Youngblood or someone if I recall.

[Benjamin Grimm]

Mets old-timers days were originally about the Dodgers and the Giants.

[Johnny Lunchbucket]

Interesting article. In some other otd thread, I recall being disappointed with otd as a kid, thinking. "Where are the Mets?"

[G-Fafif]

I was, at least for the first few years I was paying attention, surprised any Mets were in the Old Timers' ceremonies seeing as how new the Mets were. It was gratifying to see them included as more and more of them began to trickle into the eligible demographic, but I really did get a kick out of the veritable pageant of uniforms you'd see when the Mets would invite players of all stripe back.



I saw Lloyd Waner swing the bat at age 70, which seemed, to the lad I was, impossibly old for a person to be doing anything remotely athletic. Did I mention I was much younger then?

[Edgy MD]

That's pretty cool.



Fun tip: If you're ever stuck for an argument when endorsing your favorite player for The Hall of Fame, compare him to Lloyd Waner.



It's cheap, but a campaign has to start somewhere.

[stevejrogers]

Mets OTD 2022 Roster announced

https://metsinsider.mlblogs.com/mets-announce-roster-for-old-timers-day-presented-by-citi-7fffca53653a?gi=82e15ff61ba9https://metsinsider.mlblogs.com/mets-announce-roster-for-old-timers-day-presented-by-citi-7fffca53653a?gi=82e15ff61ba9

[batmagadanleadoff]

Mets OTD 2022 Roster announced https://metsinsider.mlblogs.com/mets-announce-roster-for-old-timers-day-presented-by-citi-7fffca53653a?gi=82e15ff61ba9https://metsinsider.mlblogs.com/mets-announce-roster-for-old-timers-day-presented-by-citi-7fffca53653a?gi=82e15ff61ba9

Seven Polo Grounds Mets on the list, including, obviously, Ed Kranepool, and Cleon Jones and Steve Dillon, who just squeak in as Polo Groundsers, having made their MLB debuts as September, '63 callups.

[Edgy MD]

I don't know what kind of game they're going to get in, but the introductions should take over an hour.

[kcmets]

My 60th birthday! I think they should send me two luxury suite tickets.



(maybe an intern will see this and put in a good word)

[Willets Point]

=kcmets post_id=103430 time=1660243191 user_id=53]
My 60th birthday! I think they should send me two luxury suite tickets.



(maybe an intern will see this and put in a good word)

[Ceetar]

i think I Mentioned this on the podcast, but ..save some for next year? It seems like they're constantly adding on and overdoing it when they could just as easily be like "Hey, we're doing this every year! we'll call some different guys next year!" How can all those people actually _play_?

[kcmets]

Yeah, unfortunately he is here at the present time:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Haven_Correctional_Facility

Green Haven Correctional Facility

[Willets Point]

I'm surprised David Wright is not on the roster.



With all those pitchers you could have them get one out each and still have a pitcher to spare in a 9-inning game.

[Edgy MD]

Baldwin's own Steve Dillon is https://www.newsday.com/sports/baseball/mets/steve-dillon-mets-old-timers-day-kxlxa9nvpsyched to get back on the mound for Old Timer's Day.

“I play racquetball and I belong to a club,” Dillon said. “And the guys that I play ball with are ballplayers. Not professionally but they played [in] college or high school and I am throwing the ball to them. Just so if I get a chance, an opportunity to get on the mound, I at least will present myself, that I was a pitcher for real.”

As I was growing up in The Rock, struck dumb whenever Suzie Sadecki was near, the guy who would be my college roommate was checking in at St. Christopher's in Baldwin, blushing as he was seated next to Steve Dillon's daughter.

[G-Fafif]

Tommie Agee is now synonymous with education in Esst Elmhurst.



https://nypost.com/2022/08/26/queens-school-named-after-mets-tommie-agee-mayor-adams-childhood-hero/https://nypost.com/2022/08/26/queens-school-named-after-mets-tommie-agee-mayor-adams-childhood-hero/



His Old Timer teammates attended the dedication in his honor as did Hizzoner.

"The great [Mets] Hall of Famer, Tommie Agee played the role model on the young men who grew up during that era,” said Mayor Adams at the dedication ceremony outside the new Tommie L. Agee Educational Campus, PS 419 in East Elmhurst Queens — not far from where the Mets play. “I was nine years old at that time and we were in dark places as children in South Jamaica, Queens,” he said, recalling his childhood and the great 1969 team. “When we saw that team, when we saw them play, it meant so much to us…Tommie Agee meant so much to me.”

[Edgy MD]

Drafting All-Star Teams.



[media=youtube]tRurjBpvvRw[/media]



Josh Thole?

[nymr83]

Willets Point wrote: I'm surprised David Wright is not on the roster. With all those pitchers you could have them get one out each and still have a pitcher to spare in a 9-inning game.

Maybe he is claiming disability and cant be spotted swinging the bat!

[Gwreck]

Starting Lineups:



Amazins

Alfonzo 3B

Teufel 2B

Floyd RF

Piazza C

Zeile 1B

Pratt DH

Elster SS

Agbayani LF

Payton CF



Gooden P



Miracles

Reyes SS

Wilson CF

Murphy 2B

H. Johnson 1B

Mazzilli DH

Ventura 3B

S. Henderson RF

Chavez LF

Thole C



Colon P



—-

Initial reactions: Even though Murphy and Colon (?) are the closest to ML service, I like the Amazins.



Mookie over Endy in center is a choice.

[Edgy MD]

I realize the left field wall ought to be named after Endy Chavez, but competitively, ya gotta swap Steve and Endy.



I'm guessing Steve is the oldest guy out there. Maybe Lee.