Jay Bruce Traded to Cleveland

[MFS62]

For Ryder Ryan (not to be confused with Ryan Ryder), a minor league reliever. (What else?) As per Joel Sherman.
https://www.baseball-reference.com/register/player.fcgi?id=ryan--000ryd
Guess this opens up a 25 man roster spot for Dom Smith.

Later

[Frayed Knot]

Not much of a return if that is indeed the actual trade -- neither team has confirmed and the specifics of deals like this are often the last things to becomes accurate.

The Indians drafted Ryan twice, in the 40th round out of a Charlotte, NC area HS in 2014 and then again in the 30th round out of UNC in 2016
So far has turned in a very undistinguished year and a half in Rookie and Low-A ball.

[Guest 41Forever]

Ryan, a 30th-round pick of the Indians in 2016, is 3-4 with a 4.79 ERA in 33 relief appearances with Class A Lake County this year.

If this is the best we can get, then what is the point? Is the goal here to just dump some salary and open a roster spot?

[seawolf17]

So glad we waited until waivers to trade him. Crikey.

[Chad ochoseis]

The Indians have had some outfield injuries. Michael Brantley just went on the DL with an ankle sprain, which explains why the Indians needed Bruce.

Why the Mets need Ryder Ryan is beyond me.

[Fman99]

The only silver lining is that he didn't go to the MFYs. They were the other rumored team to be hot and heavy for JB.

But still, yah, color me non impressed.

[bmfc1]

The Wilpons save $4M in salary which might account for the low return. Clearly saving $ is more important than getting help for next year as only 2 of the 5 relievers that they've acquired are close to the majors. Perhaps they'll use the bounty they saved for Duda and Bruce and go for a FA but I doubt it.

[Ceetar]

bmfc1 wrote: The Wilpons save $4M in salary which might account for the low return. Clearly saving $ is more important than getting help for next year as only 2 of the 5 relievers that they've acquired are close to the majors. Perhaps they'll use the bounty they saved for Duda and Bruce and go for a FA but I doubt it.

you know what accounts for the low return? That Bruce isn't very good and no one else has wanted him during all the other attempts to trade him.

[bmfc1]

Perhaps you're right. That's what Sandy will tell us tomorrow ("the market was slow for power hitting outfielders and we acquired a live arm with a high strikeout rate"). Or perhaps the Indians were desperate for an OF given Brantley's injury, Bruce has 29 HRs so they wanted him, and Sandy said "give us any POS from your organization so long as we can save money".

http://www.milb.com/player/index.jsp?player_id=656924#/career/R/pitching/2017/ALL

[bmfc1]

Fman99 wrote: The only silver lining is that he didn't go to the MFYs. They were the other rumored team to be hot and heavy for JB. But still, yah, color me non impressed.

[tweet]

[/tweet]

[Edgy MD]

41Forever wrote: Ryan, a 30th-round pick of the Indians in 2016, is 3-4 with a 4.79 ERA in 33 relief appearances with Class A Lake County this year. If this is the best we can get, then what is the point? Is the goal here to just dump some salary and open a roster spot?

Well, those aren't altogether meaningless goals.

[Ceetar]

bmfc1 wrote: The only silver lining is that he didn't go to the MFYs. They were the other rumored team to be hot and heavy for JB. But still, yah, color me non impressed. [tweet] [/tweet]

So the Yankees would rather give up prospects than money, but the METS are cheap? This narrative has so many holes it makes swiss cheese feel ashamed.

[nymr83]

yeah, i dont buy that the Yankees valued cash over talent, they'd probably write Wilpon a cool $100 million check to trade Syndergaard for scrubs right now i the offer was available.


this trade blows, I'd have rather kept him and made the qualifying offer in November, worst case you have him back for next year on a 1 year deal with no established 1B on the roster (a position he can fake) and who know if Granderson is back either.

[Chad ochoseis]

Ceetar wrote: you know what accounts for the low return? That Bruce isn't very good and no one else has wanted him during all the other attempts to trade him.

Ten days ago, there weren't any teams in a close race who had a LH hitting starting corner outfielder on the DL. Even if you buy into the proposition that Bruce isn't very good (I don't), he started looking a lot better once a need opened up.

I'm not annoyed by missing out on the Yankee deal, because I don't know what "a portion of salary" and "better prospects" mean. But the Mets could have held out for more from a team that needed to make a deal. Or they could have walked away and QOed Bruce for 2018.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

Jay Bruce isn't great. But, at least this year, he isn't terrible (2.4 bWAR, 2.1 fWAR). Not only that, but the more you take a glove out of his hand, the better he gets. He's basically a 4-plus-WAR DH. He's an asset... all the more so if you eat some money before sending him away. Hell, maybe you'll get the exact two prospects you're seeking.

Or, you could get a 30th-round single- A reliever without much of a minor-league track record. Either way.

[Lefty Specialist]

Bruce had a knack for hitting home runs when I wasn't watching. He hit 29 homers this year and I think I saw three of them. Weird.

Seemed like a good guy and wish he'd been traded for more than a dozen Chief Wahoo jockstraps. But the writing was on the wall when Sandy couldn't move him last winter or before July 31st this year.

Which also means, don't expect a lot for Walker, Granderson or Cabrera, if they can even move them at all.

[metirish]

#Metstwitter in full meltdown mode last night

[Frayed Knot]

metirish wrote: #Metstwitter in full meltdown mode last night

Is it ever NOT in full meltdown mode?

[Centerfield]

Makes no sense.

If this is the return you just hold him and offer the QO. You know the big winner here? Jay Bruce. Who is now unrestricted this offseason.

I wonder what those Yankee prospects were. If they were better than what we got we should have taken that deal.

Was Dilson not available?

[MFS62]

Mets fans are asking what two wives and a lot of Russian hookers have said to Donald, "Is that all there is"?

Later

[Benjamin Grimm]

I imagine that all three wives asked that.

Although I'm not expecting it, I wouldn't be terribly surprised if Bruce returned to the Mets this offseason.

The player they got back seems like little more than a warm body, but who knows, maybe the Mets see something in him. I would have rather they had kept Bruce. It might have been fun to see him try to get to 40 homers.

[Frayed Knot]

A bit more on Ryder Ryan.
First of all, how often must peeps see this guy's name written out and mentally put the comma in there while assuming it's Ryan Ryder?
In fact, I think we need to call him Ryan Comma Ryder ... 'Comma' for short


Anyway, according to BA, he was actively scouted as a HS'er but teams backed off because it was assumed he was going to follow a scholarship offer to UNC, hence the 40th round Hail Mary
choice by Cleveland. But his career at UNC turned out to be not much as "he made only one appearance in two seasons (failing to record an out) before leaving the team".
Injuries? ... Discipline? BA offers no details here, but that kind of college record doesn't exactly boost the old draft stock.

Whatever the reason, when he left UNC after two years (he was older than his class in HS and so was a draft-eligible sophomore) the Indians grabbed him again in 2016, in the 30th round this time.
BA: "After making some delivery tweaks, Ryan is touching 97 mph and sitting 94-95 out of the bullpen. He shows an ability to elevate and jam hitters with his heater. His slider is less developed
and his control, while improved, has further refinement to come."


So this sounds like maybe he's got a bit more upside than the skeletal background suggests, even if it's still a long way and a lot of steps from being realized.

[Ceetar]

"his slider is less developed"

and the Mets have a reputation for developing great sliders.

[Centerfield]

A bit more on Ryder Ryan. First of all, how often must peeps see this guy's name written out and mentally put the comma in there while assuming it's Ryan Ryder? In fact, I think we need to call him Ryan Comma Ryder ... 'Comma' for short Anyway, according to BA, he was actively scouted as a HS'er but teams backed off because it was assumed he was going to follow a scholarship offer to UNC, hence the 40th round Hail Mary choice by Cleveland. But his career at UNC turned out to be not much as "he made only one appearance in two seasons (failing to record an out) before leaving the team". Injuries? ... Discipline? BA offers no details here, but that kind of college record doesn't exactly boost the old draft stock. Whatever the reason, when he left UNC after two years (he was older than his class in HS and so was a draft-eligible sophomore) the Indians grabbed him again in 2016, in the 30th round this time. BA: "After making some delivery tweaks, Ryan is touching 97 mph and sitting 94-95 out of the bullpen. He shows an ability to elevate and jam hitters with his heater. His slider is less developed and his control, while improved, has further refinement to come." So this sounds like maybe he's got a bit more upside than the skeletal background suggests, even if it's still a long way and a lot of steps from being realized.

[channeling ceetar]meh[/channeling ceetar]

[Centerfield]

A bit more on Ryder Ryan. First of all, how often must peeps see this guy's name written out and mentally put the comma in there while assuming it's Ryan Ryder? In fact, I think we need to call him Ryan Comma Ryder ... 'Comma' for short Anyway, according to BA, he was actively scouted as a HS'er but teams backed off because it was assumed he was going to follow a scholarship offer to UNC, hence the 40th round Hail Mary choice by Cleveland. But his career at UNC turned out to be not much as "he made only one appearance in two seasons (failing to record an out) before leaving the team". Injuries? ... Discipline? BA offers no details here, but that kind of college record doesn't exactly boost the old draft stock. Whatever the reason, when he left UNC after two years (he was older than his class in HS and so was a draft-eligible sophomore) the Indians grabbed him again in 2016, in the 30th round this time. BA: "After making some delivery tweaks, Ryan is touching 97 mph and sitting 94-95 out of the bullpen. He shows an ability to elevate and jam hitters with his heater. His slider is less developed and his control, while improved, has further refinement to come." This description kinda reminds me of Akeel Morris, that single A guy that got lit up in Miami, then got traded to the Braves for Kelly Johnson II. So this sounds like maybe he's got a bit more upside than the skeletal background suggests, even if it's still a long way and a lot of steps from being realized.

[Chad ochoseis]

Bruce's first stop as an Indian? Playing against Lucas Duda in Tampa Bay.

[Chad ochoseis]

An Indians fan friend pointed out to me that Progressive Field has the third smallest left field area in the majors, which will be great for Bruce. In my vague memory, at least, his only real OF problem was a lack of range. His arm is above average, and he doesn't make mental mistakes.

[RealityChuck]

More on Ryder Ryan:

What is interesting about Ryan is he pitched only one game in college because he focused on being a third baseman. To that end, he should remind you a bit of Max Kuhns. Essentially, these are arms with not a lot of mileage, a lot of potential, but the both lack polish. As a result, mechanics and location become the biggest issues. As of the moment, Ryan has a high 3.7 BB/9, but it is a step in the right direction after he posted a 4.3 BB/9 last year. He has struggled in the second half with a 10.67 ERA after posting a 1.67 ERA in the first half that earned him a spot in the Mid-season All-Star spot. Ultimately, Ryan has strikeout ability, and when batters make contact, it is in the ground.

So the low draft was because they thought he wouldn't sign, and the current low regard is because he has very little pitching experience. He seems to be better than the basic information implies. He has decent potential.

OTOH, the Mets were stupid not to take on some of Bruce's salary and get someone with even more.

[smg58]

Both Fangraphs and the Fielding Bible put Bruce's glove on the good side of average this year.

Not knowing what the Yankees offered, I can't really comment on the difference. I'd take $5M before I took two underwhelming prospects instead of one, for example.

If they got zero takers in July, there was zero reason to expect much now. If Brantley got hurt, nobody would have offered the Mets anything for Bruce. I just don't get it, but nobody wants to give up any value for a rental. Somebody will miss the playoffs because of their stubbornness and the market will eventually re-correct itself, but that will do jack shit for the Mets. The only thing that Alderson could have done was anticipate how the market and the Mets' season would go well in advance of the deadline and act proactively, but hindsight is bionic and the complaints would have been even louder.

Personally I'd have offered Bruce the QO, but I see the logic in going this route.

[Frayed Knot]

RealityChuck wrote: What is interesting about Ryan is he pitched only one game in college because he focused on being a third baseman.

Ahh, that clears up a few things.
The BA piece I read talked about how he was a two-way player in HS but then never mentioned that was the reason why he had only one college pitching appearance and I took their
silence on the matter as an implication that maybe there was something more.
And, yeah, the lower mileage on the arm has both its plusses and minuses.

OTOH, the Mets were stupid not to take on some of Bruce's salary and get someone with even more.

That's assuming one was offered.
The only story we have so far is vague reports about how the Yanx were in on talks and offered two minor leaguers but no hint as to who or how good they might be. Some of the press
has a habit of assuming MFY prospects are better based solely on what the MFYs tell them, but they could also both be shit in which case two times shit is merely twice as much shit.