José Fernandez Killed in Boating Accident

[Benjamin Grimm]

A Boy Named Seo wrote: I wondered if that had anything to do with anything, but I think not. Pitching Monday instead of Sunday, if anything, makes it less likely he'd hang out on a boat late Sunday night/early Monday AM, IMO. He was prob going on that boat anyway.

I'm not sure I follow. He died on a Saturday night/Sunday morning. If he was scheduled to pitch a Sunday afternoon game, he probably (I would think!) would have been in bed instead of on that boat at 3 a.m.

So today's game was "canceled" and not "postponed" which suggests it won't be made up. If the Marlins finish a half game out of the wild card, they'll have to circle back and play the game on Monday, which could be problematic if other tiebreaker games need to be played that day.

[Centerfield]

If he were pitching Sunday there is no way he's out on a boat at 3 am the night before.

[MFS62]

My avatar is Brian Cole. I understand how his fans and family feel.
Someone once said that nothing good ever happens after 2 AM.
RIP.

Later

[TransMonk]

I lost it along with Keith.

It's a shame. I'll always remember Fernandez as a tremendous talent and huge competitor.

[Guest Rockin' Doc]

Traagic and sad. My heart goes out to the families and friends of all three men who lost their lives early this morning.

[Edgy MD]

Just looking at the numbers here, and depending on how things shake out this week, Fernandez looks like a perfectly viable candidate for the first posthumous Cy Young Award.

[nymr83]

Edgy MD wrote: Just looking at the numbers here, and depending on how things shake out this week, Fernandez looks like a perfectly viable candidate for the first posthumous Cy Young Award.

the argument can be made.


Saw a number on ESPN that got me thinking...
http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/17633105/tragic-loss-jose-fernandez-leaves-us-wondering-been-mlb

Among right-handed pitchers whose careers began since World War II, do you know how many had a better ERA+ through 70 starts or more? That would be none. Zero. Behind Fernandez you'll find the likes of Dwight Gooden, Tom Seaver and Roger Clemens. Fernandez was off to a greater career start than all of them. Wow.

Assuming that Stark is choosing his words carefully, what Left-Handed pitcher bested that mark? All the greats I can think of - Koufax, Johnson, Carlton, Glavine - started their careers slowly. Even Bumgarner and Kershaw had at least one year as an average-ish guy before exploding, as did my next guess, Johan Santana.

I went and googled a few more names not knowing enough about their careers - Ford didn't do it. Spahn came close, but shouldn't be eligible as he began his career (barely) before or during the war.

So, who is it?

[Benjamin Grimm]

Fernando Valenzuela?

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

Carlton? Lefty Grove?

[seawolf17]

Piece of CPF history, too... Fernandez's ML Debut was at Citi Field, and was a CPF meet up game. Me, Irish, Marathon, Lunchy, and a few others with all our assorted progeny.

[stevejrogers]

IGT for that game
http://archives.thecranepool.net/19300/f14_t19351.shtml

[Benjamin Grimm]

I honestly have no memory of the Mets having had a pitcher named "Laffey".

[MFS62]

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: Carlton? Lefty Grove?

OE: I named somebody who played before WW II.
Never mind.

Later

Edited September 26, 2016 by Guest

[HahnSolo]

I was there for his last start in NY. Little Solo caught a Batting Practice HR, and Cespedes walked it off in extras. I had forgotten that he was the starter--and pitched well--until my son reminded me.

[G-Fafif]

batmagadanleadoff wrote: Jeez, I almost cried a little.

Me too, except for the almost. I've stood for dozens of moments of silences at ballparks, I suppose. There's usually enough time between the passing of whoever is being honored and the gesture of respect so that I find myself given over to reflection or appreciation. This news was four hours old yesterday. I imagine a measurable slice of the crowd was just learning of his passing from Alex Anthony.

[Centerfield]

Details are emerging now about the accident.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/mlb/2016/09/25/jose-fernandez-dies-boat-accident-details-miami-marlins/91078098/?utm_source=feedblitz&utm_medium=FeedBlitzRss&utm_campaign=usatoday-newstopstories

The boat was traveling at significant speed when it struck a jetty. The pictures are horrific. If it gives any comfort to the families, the impact of the crash appears to have killed the victims. They did not drown.

Alcohol does not appear to be a factor.

So dangerous to travel at that kind of speed, at night, when visibility is limited.

And yes, if the Marlins had not switched his start to Monday, it seems Jose would have been grieving the loss of his friends yesterday, rather than being one of the victims.

[A Boy Named Seo]

Benjamin Grimm wrote: A Boy Named Seo wrote: I wondered if that had anything to do with anything, but I think not. Pitching Monday instead of Sunday, if anything, makes it less likely he'd hang out on a boat late Sunday night/early Monday AM, IMO. He was prob going on that boat anyway. I'm not sure I follow. He died on a Saturday night/Sunday morning. If he was scheduled to pitch a Sunday afternoon game, he probably (I would think!) would have been in bed instead of on that boat at 3 a.m. So today's game was "canceled" and not "postponed" which suggests it won't be made up. If the Marlins finish a half game out of the wild card, they'll have to circle back and play the game on Monday, which could be problematic if other tiebreaker games need to be played that day.

Yeah I forgot what day it was and everything made less sense after. Nevermind me.

[batmagadanleadoff]

G-Fafif wrote: batmagadanleadoff wrote: Jeez, I almost cried a little. Me too, except for the almost. I've stood for dozens of moments of silences at ballparks, I suppose. There's usually enough time between the passing of whoever is being honored and the gesture of respect so that I find myself given over to reflection or appreciation. This news was four hours old yesterday. I imagine a measurable slice of the crowd was just learning of his passing from Alex Anthony.

I really liked Fernandez. He was my favorite active baseball player, non-Mets division. I don't always have a favorite non-Mets active that I follow closely. Willie Stargell, when I was first discovering baseball. Rickey Henderson as a teen-ager and young adult. And Fernandez. And I think that's it. I followed Fernandez's career closer than any other non-Met and that's saying something because I don't do fantasy baseball. I know that as a Mets fan, I was supposed to hope that the Mets missed him whenever they played the Marlins being how dominant Fernandez was, but I rooted for the opposite -- that the Mets would face Fernandez so that I would get to see him in action. I've been to six Marlins games over the past three seasons yet never got to see Fernandez pitch live. Seeing him pitch live was on my short list of baseball things to do. This is a terrible tragedy and I still can't get over the idea that he's dead and gone forever.

[Guest themetfairy]

We saw him pitch in a Spring Training game in March. It's surreal that this young, lively being is gone.



RIP Jose

[G-Fafif]

I really liked Fernandez. He was my favorite active baseball player, non-Mets division. I don't always have a favorite non-Mets active that I follow closely. Willie Stargell, when I was first discovering baseball. Rickey Henderson as a teen-ager and young adult. And Fernandez. And I think that's it. I followed Fernandez's career closer than any other non-Met and that's saying something because I don't do fantasy baseball. I know that as a Mets fan, I was supposed to hope that the Mets missed him whenever they played the Marlins being how dominant Fernandez was, but I rooted for the opposite -- that the Mets would face Fernandez so that I would get to see him in action. I've been to six Marlins games over the past three seasons yet never got to see Fernandez pitch live. Seeing him pitch live was on my short list of baseball things to do. This is a terrible tragedy and I still can't get over the idea that he's dead and gone forever.

Eight starts against the Mets, four at Citi Field. I got to one of them, versus Harvey, June 8, 2013. It went 20 innings. Neither phenom earned a decision.

Three of his eight starts versus the Mets had Harvey on the mound. That was going to be one of the great rivalries. The 20-inning game spoke well for both of them (1 run given up by each of them over 6 for JF, 7 for MH), but the last time they met, on June 5 of this year in Miami, was the truly sublime matchup. Matt seemed to be coming out of his morass and Jose was surely on top of his game: 4 hits, no walks, 14 K's. He won the duel, 1-0.

When I visited the team store after yesterday's game, the amount of unsold Matt Harvey merchandise was staggering. Out of sight, out of favor, I guess. As it happened, I was wearing the Mets shirt I plucked out of my drawer in the morning: HARVEY 33, which seemed too on the nose to be random in light of what I'd learned a little while before. It's the same shirt I wore to that 20-inning game.

[Edgy MD]

Wright is perhaps even more out of sight, but has not been as removed from the psyche of Mets fans or their spending habits, I imagine.

Part of that is Wright's longer tenure, to be sure. But I imagine that, taking away each of their ready ability to perform, Harvey doesn't leave you as much left to hang your hat on.

[Benjamin Grimm]

I've been wondering about that FERNANDEZ 16 jersey that was hanging in the Mets dugout. I read that they're bringing it with them to Miami. I think they should leave it there, donate it to the Marlins museum, if they have one, or just to the organization in general if they don't have a museum yet.

If they don't do that, sooner or later we may find out that they're selling it at auction, which would, of course, be crass and tasteless. Which is why I'm afraid they might do it.

[Guest Mets Guy in Michigan]

I read that the Marlins are all wearing No. 16 tonight. A nice gesture.

[G-Fafif]

Benjamin Grimm wrote: I've been wondering about that FERNANDEZ 16 jersey that was hanging in the Mets dugout. I read that they're bringing it with them to Miami. I think they should leave it there, donate it to the Marlins museum, if they have one, or just to the organization in general if they don't have a museum yet. If they don't do that, sooner or later we may find out that they're selling it at auction, which would, of course, be crass and tasteless. Which is why I'm afraid they might do it.

Jeff's idea, allegedly.

[seawolf17]

G-Fafif wrote: Benjamin Grimm wrote: I've been wondering about that FERNANDEZ 16 jersey that was hanging in the Mets dugout. I read that they're bringing it with them to Miami. I think they should leave it there, donate it to the Marlins museum, if they have one, or just to the organization in general if they don't have a museum yet. If they don't do that, sooner or later we may find out that they're selling it at auction, which would, of course, be crass and tasteless. Which is why I'm afraid they might do it. Jeff's idea, allegedly.

Which was his idea -- making the jersey, or selling it? (Or both?)

[G-Fafif]

Edgy MD wrote: Wright is perhaps even more out of sight, but has not been as removed from the psyche of Mets fans or their spending habits, I imagine. Part of that is Wright's longer tenure, to be sure. But I imagine that, taking away each of their ready ability to perform, Harvey doesn't leave you as much left to hang your hat on.

A lot of the Harvey stuff is of the "this guy is huge, let's print up more!" variety. Not HARVEY 33 as much as "Happy Harvey Day!" and ancillary gear.

Somewhere a warehouse stocked to the gills with Kaz Matsui Celebriducks bursts at its seams.

Edited September 26, 2016 by Guest

[G-Fafif]

seawolf17 wrote: G-Fafif wrote: Benjamin Grimm wrote: I've been wondering about that FERNANDEZ 16 jersey that was hanging in the Mets dugout. I read that they're bringing it with them to Miami. I think they should leave it there, donate it to the Marlins museum, if they have one, or just to the organization in general if they don't have a museum yet. If they don't do that, sooner or later we may find out that they're selling it at auction, which would, of course, be crass and tasteless. Which is why I'm afraid they might do it. Jeff's idea, allegedly. Which was his idea -- making the jersey, or selling it? (Or both?)

Just the jersey (according to Cespedes). We'll see about Authentic Game-Hung Merchandise.

Edited September 26, 2016 by Guest

[Frayed Knot]

G-Fafif wrote: Edgy MD wrote: Wright is perhaps even more out of sight, but has not been as removed from the psyche of Mets fans or their spending habits, I imagine. Part of that is Wright's longer tenure, to be sure. But I imagine that, taking away each of their ready ability to perform, Harvey doesn't leave you as much left to hang your hat on. A lot of the Harvey stuff is of the "this guy is huge, let's print up more!" variety. Not HARVEY 33 as much as "Happy Harvey Day!" and ancillary gear.

Yeah, I suspect there was a thought over last winter that the second year back from TJS would result in a CY-caliber season from Harvey (I was on that train). But then the effect of a rocky first half followed by the nonexistent second is a ton of overstock.
Wright #5 shirts are, I'm sure, not only already on more backs and in more closets in NYC than any other single piece of NYM merch but the rate of sale likely more predictable and not as given to rushes and droughts.

[Benjamin Grimm]

The clubhouse shop also stocks merchandise for Seaver, Hernandez, and Piazza, and it's really been a long time since any of them have played. Their place in Mets history, however, is secure. And the same can be said of David Wright.

[nymr83]

Edgy MD wrote: Wright is perhaps even more out of sight, but has not been as removed from the psyche of Mets fans or their spending habits, I imagine. Part of that is Wright's longer tenure, to be sure. But I imagine that, taking away each of their ready ability to perform, Harvey doesn't leave you as much left to hang your hat on.

Wright is in that category of guys - like Seaver, Strawberry, Patrick Ewing, Freakin' Jeter, etc where his jersey sales are no longer dependent on playing - he is an all-time Mets great and they'll be selling shit with his name on it 20 years from now. Harvey has not reached that category - if he never pitches for the Mets again his future jersey sales will probably be relatively nothing.