You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

[Centerfield]

So, we're to hang them for what they might have known?

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

So, we're to hang them for what they might have known?

[seawolf17]

Burkhardt reporting that they're shutting down Ollie for knee surgery.

You really can't make this stuff up.

[bmfc1]

Ollie to the DL. Done for the year.

[Benjamin Grimm]

Unreal.

[metsmarathon]

Ollie to the DL. Done for the year.[/quote:3jmfc6ht]

hey, lookathat, an injury that can make us happy!

[seawolf17]

It's okay; they're calling up Misch again to replace him. There will be two of him on the roster, since they already called him up the other day, but it's much easier that way, because it's one less person to worry about getting hurt, and as a bonus, because he's on the roster twice, you can use him out of the bullpen twice in one game.

[Guest Edgy DC]

If we've got to go back to Willie Randolph, we're trying too hard.

It's a tough game.

As for Ollie, good.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

If we've got to go back to Willie Randolph, we're trying too hard.[/quote:3a9rru8k]

It's a little facile, yes. And yeah, there's stuff that has bugged me more. But it's a brick in the wall.

[bmfc1]

I expected this one--no need for him to go out and get lit up anymore this year. Let him go go home and get his head, such as it is, together for ST.

The Mets current rotation:
Pelfrey
Figueroa--released earlier this year
Misch (probably)--released earlier this year by SF
Redding--demoted from the rotation earlier this year and then almost released
Parnell--a middle inning reliever at the start of the year.

[Guest Edgy DC]

J.R. Watkins Apothecary Liniment Topical Pain Reliever has disappointed me for the last time. Curse you, J.R. Watkins.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

Frankly, I'm kind of past automatic grant of benefit-of-the-doubt for Omar and Company. While I'm not exactly calling for heads to roll when I hear something like the pitching-with-an-injury business, I've been conditioned to expect the worst. Hell, they've done most of the conditioning; how much should one expect from a leadership that can't even seem to handle a straightforward, for-cause firing without a cross-country fiasco or a burst of scattershot accusations?

When I hear something that amounts to "just trust us" from this front office, I don't. Not any longer. The most I can muster, really, is polite wariness.

[MFS62]

And from the "Oh Shit! Why not?" category:

MIAMI - Jose Reyes may be the next Met in line for surgery, joining Johan Santana and Oliver Perez on operating tables in the coming days.

Reyes, who has not appeared in a major-league game since pulling himself from a May20 game at Dodger Stadium, has a completely torn hamstring tendon behind his right knee, a source confirmed to the Daily News.

While hardly ideal, surgery is not necessarily as ominous as it might sound. That tendon is expendable, and is sometimes partly removed and inserted into the elbow when a pitcher undergoes Tommy John surgery.

The Mets aren't resigned to Reyes undergoing surgery just yet, although the decision is looming. Reyes, who is presumed to be out for the year, continues to get treatment, with physical therapists trying to break up scar tissue that is irritating the severed tendon and causing significant pain.

Reyes was suffering from bursitis early in the season and eventually suffered a hamstring tendon strain. That injury became further irritated when Reyes tried to run full-throttle to first base during a June 3 extended spring training game in Port St. Lucie. It is believed that Reyes subsequently fully tore the tendon, the scar tissue and inflammation are aggravating the tendon. Surgery should be able to alleviate the discomfort and allow Reyes to return unimpeded next season.

Reyes, 26, was tormented by leg problems early in his career, which is one of the reasons why he signed a four-year, $23.25 million contract in August 2006. That deal is guaranteed through next season, with a team option for 2011 at $11 million. His salary leaps from $5.75 million this year to $9 million in 2010.

The shortstop will finish this season with the fewest at-bats in his career (147). He is coming off consecutive seasons in which he produced the top two plate-appearance totals in franchise history, with 765 and 763, respectively. The next-highest total is Felix Millan's 743 in 1975.

Six other players have started at shortstop for the Mets this season: Alex Cora (54 games), Anderson Hernandez (15), Ramon Martinez (nine), Wilson Valdez (eight), Angel Berroa (six) and Argenis Reyes (one). Cora also is lost for the year. He underwent surgery to repair a torn ligament in his right thumb last week, and will undergo the same procedure for a torn ligament in his left thumb in a month.

Without Reyes in the lineup, the Mets are getting the worst production in the league from the leadoff spot.

The team's No. 1 hitters this season, including Reyes, have combined to score a National League-low 68 runs. Mets shortstops have scored only 50 runs, ahead of only Pittsburgh, and are batting .241. Leadoff man Angel Pagan went 2-for-4 with three runs in yesterday's 10-3 win over the Marlins, while shortstop Wilson Valdez had two hits and scored twice.

Reyes is one of 13 Mets on the disabled list. Already this week, the Mets announced Santana will have arthroscopic surgery to remove bone chips from his left elbow and Perez will undergo a procedure to clean out his right knee.


http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/mets/2009/08/28/2009-08-28_jose_reyes.html#ixzz0PTnbbXKZ

Did we expect anything else?

Later

[seawolf17]

J.R. Watkins Apothecary Liniment Topical Pain Reliever has disappointed me for the last time. Curse you, J.R. Watkins.[/quote:32dkvap2]
Sonovabitch! Why hasn't anyone raised this issue? We should storm their headquarters and take Mr. Watkins hostage.

[Benjamin Grimm]

MIAMI - Jose Reyes may be the next Met in line for surgery, joining Johan Santana and Oliver Perez on operating tables in the coming days.

[metirish]

MIAMI - Jose Reyes may be the next Met in line for surgery, joining Johan Santana and Oliver Perez on operating tables in the coming days.

[RealityChuck]

The thing is, with all this complaints about how the Mets handled injuries this year, it's unlikely that anything they did made things worse. Even if the key players were put on the DL immediately each time, the lineup in July and August would have been the same as it was. Consider:

1. Delgado. Hip injury that required surgery. If he had gotten surgery immediately, he'd possibly be close to being able to return now (or maybe not). But it's far too late for him.

2. Reyes. His injury was originally a sprain. He could have gone on the DL earlier, but the sprain was not why he hasn't returned. The injury to his leg when he was on the DL is what's kept him out, and that was diagnosed and treated immediately. In any case, he'd still be out.

3. Beltran. He could have gone on the DL sooner, but at that rate he still would have missed most of June, July, and August and might be able to play in September. It's possible he injured himself more by not going on the DL sooner, but he'd still have been out a couple of months. As an aside, the fact that he went to an outside specialist is given as a sign the Mets's medical staff is not to be trusted. But the outside specialist came to the same conclusion as they did. Obviously, the Mets diagnosed things correctly.

4. Wright. No one has any problems with how this was handled. BTW, the comparison to Church was bogus -- Church's problems were due to his second concussion; after his first, he had an OPS of .913 and was tearing up the league. Wright certainly bears watching -- you're more prone to concussions once you have had one -- but if there's a parallel, he's going to do quite well in September and no one was complaining about Church's treatment after the first concussion.

5. Santana. Bone chips are weird things; they float around. You can pitch without pain even when you have them and on another day, be unable to throw. The team's wait-and-see was not unreasonable. But shutting him down for surgery at the all-star break would certainly have made the team worse, and would have ended his season. Ultimately, he and the team would be in the same position in either case.

6. Alex Cora. Not a star, but consider: July 15: Cora's a gutsy player who continues to play hurt. We need more players like him. August 15: The Mets mismanage an injury again. Raise your hands if you took issue to Cora's treatment before August.

7. Oliver Perez. Was put on the DL after a couple of bad starts. Came back, pitched badly, but seemed to be improving before his knee failed. In any case, he wouldn't have been available in June, July, and August after knee surgey.

8. John Maine. Again, he wouldn't have been back in time to make a difference.

9. Jonathan Niese. Joined the team when it was in free-fall; no one can complain about how the team handled his injury.

10. J.J. Putz -- pitched effectively until May 31 -- batters were hitting .200 against him and he had 9 holds, three saves and only one blown save. Is that when you shut him down? His next three appearances were disasters, however, and he went on the DL.

So it is highly unlikely the team would have had these players available (and would have missed Santana) in June and July when the season fell apart.

Another argument is that all these injuries were due to bad training methods. Possible, but in order to back that up, you need to indicate how Mets training methods differed from other team's and from how they differed from the methods used in previous years. If they are using similar regimens to the Red Sox, say, what's wrong with their methods?

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

J.R. Watkins Apothecary Liniment Topical Pain Reliever has disappointed me for the last time. Curse you, J.R. Watkins.[/quote:1ahrqiwy]
Sonovabitch! Why hasn't anyone raised this issue? We should storm their headquarters and take Mr. Watkins hostage.[/quote:1ahrqiwy]

What they don't tell you in the radio ads: The secret ingredient in J.R. Watkins Liniment... is Caribbean human cartilage!

[Piggiestomatoes]

A.P. reports today that Reyes may need surgery to repair the hamstring tendon. If that's the case, somebody's fucking head has to roll. This shit should have been handled long ago, and I don't want to hear any bullshit about having him trying to work through the injury.

[Benjamin Grimm]

Any surgery is expected to be minor because the tendon itself is nonessential, sometimes removed to replace a torn ligament in reconstructive elbow surgery. An operation would still allow Reyes to be ready by spring training.[/quote:3poimz35]

[Guest Edgy DC]

It's a forum. You're going to hear (or read) differing opinions whether you want to or not.

[Piggiestomatoes]

It's a forum. You're going to hear (or read) differing opinions whether you want to or not.[/quote:153mwm7z]

I understand how the forums work but thanks for the clarification anyway. The words I used were meant as a rhetorical device, not a demand of other forum participants.

[smg58]

I really don't like the idea of playing Wright on alternating days. Either he's healthy enough to play, or he isn't.

Regarding Putz, I said this on May 14:
"Putz has 20 innings in 33 games. That's a ridiculous workload to give a reliever coming off an injury. You have to protect your relievers sometimes too."

So yes, I do think Manuel has to take some responsibility for what happened in his case.

[ashie62]

A.P. reports today that Reyes may need surgery to repair the hamstring tendon. If that's the case, somebody's fucking head has to roll. This shit should have been handled long ago, and I don't want to hear any bullshit about having him trying to work through the injury.[/quote:1pca9vrx]

I share your frustraton and anger but am now quietly resigned from this mess of a season and await what I will be a very quiet Mets off-season.

As in..Hope the wounded heal and a couple of fill-ins..no butter

[Guest Edgy DC]

I agree that Jerry has been going nuts with his relievers. And Putz was the start of it. Find who has the hot hand, and grind him until he's cold... or hurt. That's been Jerry's motto.

I don't know what Stokes was doing in yesterday's game, but it was his third in a row and sixth in the Mets' last eight. Like, ugh, like.

[Guest themetfairy]

Whatever happened to John Maine? Wasn't he supposed to be back after the All Star Break?

[seawolf17]

Whatever happened to John Maine? Wasn't he supposed to be back after the All Star Break?[/quote:2oww376b]
The NHL All-Star Break.

[dgwphotography]

From Adam Rubin's blog:

Johan Santana and Oliver Perez will undergo their surgeries Tuesday.

I can see them operating on Santana's knee, and Perez' elbow....

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

Beltran cleared for rehab without a knee brace.

The team hasn't publicly ruled out duct tape, fun-tack or Polident.

[Centerfield]

From Adam Rubin's blog:

Johan Santana and Oliver Perez will undergo their surgeries Tuesday.

I can see them operating on Santana's knee, and Perez' elbow....