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Howie on the Caps

G-Fafif

By G-Fafif
in New York Mets Talk

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nymr83 Prep Ball

nymr83

Old-Timey Member
Posted
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they should have worn the hats and Wilpon should have announced he'll pay any fines assessed to players with a matching donation to FDNY charities


Edgy MD FCL Mets

Edgy MD

Site Manager
Posted
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Wait a minute. Which day will the Mets be wearing Howie on their caps? I want to be there that day. Will the Howie hats be available to buy at the team store?


MFS62 First Round Pick

MFS62

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted


I said this at the end of the IGT, but this is the proper thread for it and it bears repeating:

Pete Alonso did more to remember 9/11 than Derek Jeter did in his entire career.

https://www.tmz.com/2019/09/12/pete-alonso-new-york-mets-911-nypd-cleats/https://www.tmz.com/2019/09/12/pete-alonso-new-york-mets-911-nypd-cleats/



He gets it.

Thank you, Pete.

If MLB can't step up to the plate on the caps, then the team should wear these cleats every year on 9/11.

We must never forget!

Later


Guest 41Forever

Guest 41Forever

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There are a lot of ways to pay tribute to our fallen heroes, even on uniforms -- like a patch or a ribbon. Pete's shoes. I worry this is becoming more about fighting with MLB than about the tribute.


MFS62 First Round Pick

MFS62

Old-Timey Member
Posted
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Joe Torre, traitor to NYC:



https://www.sny.tv/mets/news/joe-torre-explains-why-mlb-wont-let-mets-wear-first-responder-hats-on-911/310758556https://www.sny.tv/mets/news/joe-torre-explains-why-mlb-wont-let-mets-wear-first-responder-hats-on-911/310758556


Mariano Rivera added 50 points to his baseball I.Q.

Unfortunately, nothing can be done with the actual I.Q. the cretinous slug was born with.

Later


Edgy MD FCL Mets

Edgy MD

Site Manager
Posted
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"If we do something, we want every team to do it together."



That's such a big part of what sucks about MLB. I want one team that wears underwear on their heads, another team that paints themselves with KISS Kabuki makeup. I want a team that enters walking from the concourse through the field-level seats and down to the stands, like boxers entering the ring.



I want teams that celebrate Jackie Robinson Day in different manners. I want a team that builds a stadium with no outfield wall. I want another that builds their outfield wall out of sandbags. On the outfield wall of still a third stadium, I want an active waterfall with a small, shallow pool on top.



I want Cal's Hill restored. I also want Frank's Forest, Arte's Aviary, and Fred's Fjord.



Give me a manager like Connie Mack, who passes on the uniform in favor of a jacket and smart hat. Or another manager who wears a cardigan. Still another one wears black tie and tails.



I want the Mariners to go apeshit for Arbor Day. I want the Cubs to shut down training camp for Pulaski Day.



I want a team that is addicted to trick plays — sneaking outfielders in to take the pickoff throw; or, when bunting against the wheel, if the batter reaches first, waiving him right on to second. I want a team that squeezes 100% of time if there's a runner on third and the infield back. Bunt like nobody's business. The Mets were down big in Game Two to the Dodgers, and in the ninth, LA had the unmitigated gall to put the shift on Guillorme — the Mets' best bunter — but you know if he bunted against it, they'd cry that it was bad baseball. Let 'em cry!



I want some guys to enter the game on a bullpen chart, while still others have to climb over a ladder to get onto the field.



I want a team full of sprinters who never stop stealing. Three 100-steal guys on one team and fourth guy who stole fifty. I want a team whose whole roster is full of pitchers who can hit a little and batters who can pitch a little, so you never know who is going to be deployed against you.



Some of these are worthwhile ideas. Most are bad or impractical. I just want team's to be as different as possible. I want them to really represent different things. Different ethics. Something should really be at stake when two teams square off. If the Mets wear 9-11 hats, the manager should always has to use his best pitchers and be willing to sacrifice for the win. The commissioner's office shouldn't be coordinating the teams into all being variations on the same brand. They should be assigning the umps, and regulating the height of the grass and dimensions of the infield, and that's about it.



What was I saying? Oh, yeah. Let 'em wear the stupid caps.


Gwreck Draft Eligible

Gwreck

Old-Timey Member
Posted
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We still play “God Bless America” at the games (forced patriotism left over from this tragedy) but can't do a one-game tribute that is actually meaningful. Awful.


MFS62 First Round Pick

MFS62

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted


Edgy MD wrote:

They should be assigning the umps, except for Angel Hernandez, and regulating the height of the grass and dimensions of the infield, and that's about it.

I fixed that for you.

Now, back to our rant about MLB.



Later


seawolf17 College Ball

seawolf17

Old-Timey Member
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=Gwreck post_id=22088 time=1568684107 user_id=56]
We still play “God Bless America” at the games (forced patriotism left over from this tragedy) but can't do a one-game tribute that is actually meaningful. Awful.

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HahnSolo

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted


Just wear the caps on the 11th and dare MLB to fine them. Let MLB decide if they want to take the PR hit for doing so.


Guest 41Forever

Guest 41Forever

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I don't mind the song.



I worry that the more time spent arguing about this, the less it becomes about paying tribute. I'm sure the Mets are sincere about honoring our fallen heroes. It would behoove both the Mets and MLB to have a meeting about what would be acceptable and find some common ground. If it's not caps, then what would be an appropriate way to honor the heroes on the uniforms? I believe teams did wear the ribbon patches on caps this year. If the true concern in uniformity, then wear NYPD one year, NYFD the next, and so on.



I do understand Torre's point about tragedies, and what would be appropriate for teams to do as part of a community response. Didn't a team wear Virginia Tech caps after the shooting there? But the September 11 attacks are in a special category.


G-Fafif College Ball

G-Fafif

Old-Timey Member
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There is a history with the Mets and the caps and the meaning therein that transcends Torre's suggestion that a patch would cover the same ground.



Nobody got hurt from the annual commemoration the Mets continued between 2002 and 2007, wearing the first responder caps in game once a year, keeping going the spontaneous tribute they paid between September 17, 2001, and October 7, 2001. MLB loses nothing if the commemoration resumes. It's gaining everything from the understanding that one of its teams (and by implication every one of its teams) considers itself enough a part of the community where it plays to say, in essence, "this is us, too."



When a whole new generation of players is anxious to pay tribute in some way, as Pete Alonso and the shoes illustrated, MLB needs to understand this is bigger than a crimp in their uniform regulations. This is potentially fading living memory being kept alive by younger people who recognize the importance of remembering and keeping the flame lit. If MLB is smart, they'll get out in front and act like they're leading this. And if MLB is human, they'll step out of the way and let this play out with minimal regulatory interference.



This is the real Players Weekend ethos at work, not a distasteful merchandising contrivance. This is the players, like Alonso, but also his teammates who welcomed and participated in the gesture, understanding the relationship between a baseball team and its city at its heart.



The Mets have done wonderful things for those who were directly affected and still do. They have remained in touch with and supportive of families who lost somebody. They support organizations that support them. We know they visit firehouses and invite first responders to take part in pregame ceremonies. They do a lot.



Yet the in-game wearing of the caps is a symbolic act with real resonance. It's not a burden on anybody. It's a moment that strives to connect the empathy and unity we felt after a tragedy with the sense that the people who gave their all are not forgotten -- and the people who continue to give their all are truly appreciated. And the fact that the fans bring it up every September, even if it is as a bit of a cudgel to complain, shows that the baseball audience -- comprised of MLB's customers -- cares about it, and that's not a small thing.



I listened to Joe Torre explain MLB's position and I still don't understand it. Heaven forbid another city suffers anything like a 9/11. Heaven forbid another person suffers anything like a 9/11. Heaven forbid there be anything like it. If there is, heaven help anybody if their first thought is, "oh great, somebody's gonna wanna wear a special cap in a game now."


Centerfield First Round Pick

Centerfield

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted


What Greg said. It's not MLB won't let them pay tribute. It's that they took affirmative measures to make it stop. They instituted fines starting in 2008 despite the world not ending during the yearly tributes. In 2011 when the Mets players wanted to wear the caps. The fines were prohibitive. When Wright showed up in the dugout wearing one, MLB physically took them from the Mets.



https://deadspin.com/mlb-physically-took-fdny-and-nypd-caps-from-the-mets-to-5839331https://deadspin.com/mlb-physically-took-fdny-and-nypd-caps-from-the-mets-to-5839331



And the real shame here is that no one cares about uniformity. Absolutely fucking no one. It's about licensing. MLB and New Era want the money. Plain and simple. They don't make money off of First Responder hats.


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batmagadanleadoff

Old-Timey Member
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Joe Torre, traitor to NYC:



https://www.sny.tv/mets/news/joe-torre-explains-why-mlb-wont-let-mets-wear-first-responder-hats-on-911/310758556https://www.sny.tv/mets/news/joe-torre-explains-why-mlb-wont-let-mets-wear-first-responder-hats-on-911/310758556


Everyone needs to make a huge deal out of this.


As soon as you remember that the Yankees don't have to wear NOB's on the road even though every other team does, Torre's explanation is completely undermined.


Edgy MD FCL Mets

Edgy MD

Site Manager
Posted
Posted


And the real shame here is that no one cares about uniformity. Absolutely fucking no one. It's about licensing. MLB and New Era want the money. Plain and simple. They don't make money off of First Responder hats.


I don't see how they really lose much money either. I guess it's the precedent.



The amazing thing to me is how people are got to. Every few years, you get a bold patriotic Met who says, "I don't give even the smallest of shits. I'm wearing the cap. Write it down."



Then somebody — management, agent, union, MLB flack, perhaps all of the above — pull him into a secure room the afternoon before the game, and he's suddenly playing ball with the suits and when evening comes, he's playing ball in the standard cap the Mets tell him to wear.



After the game, he's asked about what he said, and he pretends he lived up to his promise. "It was really important to represent families and the pain they went through so wearing it before the game and during batting practice and playing golf last week meant a lot to me. And the team is doing a lot for those families, you betcha."



It's like when Lindsey Graham was the president's biggest critic, and then he played a round of golf with the guy, and he became the president's biggest enabler. What happens at these secure locations that makes supposedly righteous people flip like flapjacks?


nymr83 Prep Ball

nymr83

Old-Timey Member
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Edgy MD wrote:

What happens at these secure locations that makes supposedly righteous people flip like flapjacks?


$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$


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Ceetar

Grand Central Contributor
Posted
Posted


I think comparing like, David Wright and Pete Alonso to a scumbag like Lindsey Graham is cruel.



I think there's just an avalanche of nonsense and off the field business and visits to this and that and firehouse and hospitals and all that other ancillary stuff ballplayers do, that's not playing ball, that asking them to maintain some sort of indignation about something non-baseball is pretty tough.


Edgy MD FCL Mets

Edgy MD

Site Manager
Posted
Posted



Edgy MD wrote:

What happens at these secure locations that makes supposedly righteous people flip like flapjacks?


$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$


I think it's that, but it also can be coercion, at least in part. It'd be a lot harder for the president to bribe Senator Graham than it would be to hint at what he's been able to learn from the FBI dossier on the senator. Cheaper too.


nymr83 Prep Ball

nymr83

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted


It doesn't have to be literal dollars or an illegal bribe. Trump could have legally promised to help Graham with his legislative priorities. Wilpon could have promised Alonso a big Mets donation to his favorite charity of he would just shut up and play and quietly put the FDNY hat away.


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