Terry Collins 2 year extension & option

[ashie62]

Old eggs in beer gets a two year extension with a third year team option..

Per Rubin/ESPN Press Conference expected Monday..

http://espn.go.com/new-york/mlb/story/_/id/9736366/new-york-mets-manager-terry-collins-nearing-2-year-extension-source-says

[G-Fafif]

The man who held the fort has been asked to continue holding it. Positively inspirational.

[metirish]

Not surprised I guess, I really have no idea what the expectations are with this club right now or next season.

[TransMonk]

Good for Collins.

I'm not sure about expectations either, but he now has the potential to be one of the longest tenured managers in club history without having won more than 77 games in his first three seasons with the team.

[Benjamin Grimm]

In ninth place among Mets managers in games managed:

Games
Davey Johnson 1012
Bobby Valentine 1003
Joe Torre 709
Gil Hodges 649
Yogi Berra 588
Casey Stengel 582
Willie Randolph 555
Dallas Green 512
Terry Collins 484
Jerry Manuel 417
Wes Westrum 380
Art Howe 323
Bud Harrelson 274
George Bamberger 208
Joe Frazier 207
Jeff Torborg 200
Frank Howard 116
Roy McMillan 53
Salty Parker 11
Mike Cubbage 7

Two more years would bring him into third place, with 810 games.


In eighth place in wins. Two more years would bring him, pessimistically, to around 360, which would leave him in third place. Two great years would still leave him in third place.

Wins
Davey Johnson 595
Bobby Valentine 536
Gil Hodges 339
Willie Randolph 302
Yogi Berra 292
Joe Torre 286
Dallas Green 229
Terry Collins 224
Jerry Manuel 204
Casey Stengel 175
Bud Harrelson 145
Wes Westrum 142
Art Howe 137
Joe Frazier 101
Jeff Torborg 85
George Bamberger 81
Frank Howard 52
Roy McMillan 26
Salty Parker 4
Mike Cubbage 3


He's in seventh place for losses. Two seasons of .500 or less would put him ahead of Joe Torre for second place.

Losses
Bobby Valentine 467
Joe Torre 420
Davey Johnson 417
Casey Stengel 404
Gil Hodges 309
Yogi Berra 296
Dallas Green 283
Terry Collins 260
Willie Randolph 253
Wes Westrum 237
Jerry Manuel 213
Art Howe 186
Bud Harrelson 129
George Bamberger 127
Jeff Torborg 115
Joe Frazier 106
Frank Howard 64
Roy McMillan 27
Salty Parker 7
Mike Cubbage 4

Winning Pct.
(Minimum 200 games managed)
Davey Johnson .588
Willie Randolph .544
Bobby Valentine .534
Bud Harrelson .529
Gil Hodges .523
Yogi Berra .497
Jerry Manuel .489
Joe Frazier .488
Terry Collins .463
Dallas Green .447
Jeff Torborg .425
Art Howe .424
Joe Torre .405
George Bamberger .389
Wes Westrum .375
Casey Stengel .302

[bmfc1]

Good for Collins, bad for the Mets. Another year of bunting early and often and more pitching changes because "the book" says so.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

I think Terry does too many L-R matchups in non-critical situations, but he's not nearly as bad a tactician as bfmc would have us believe. Only two teams in the NL have bunted less than us this year. in 2012 and 2011 we were right in the middle of the league in sac bunts. Jerry and Willie both bunted way more.

I am kinda shocked he's coming back all that said. Not because I believe he's incompetent but because I thought we'd want to make a different statement.

[bmfc1]

I don't know who bfmc is jcl.

Thanks for the data, really, but to me, he is still an over-manager.
I agree w/you about making a statement and Mets management has made a statement by keeping him.

[Frayed Knot]

I agree that the Mets neither bunt early nor often.
The Sac Bunts in particular have mainly been late and in close games when one should, it could be argued, be playing for one run--I recall several of our walk-off wins this year were set up by Sac Bs. And those bunts which do come early are usually from those with the ability to bunt for hits (Young, Lagares) and I suspect are doing so on their own (albeit with permission).



Glad to see this wasn't announced at 3 in the morning. Not sure the scribes in this town could take another one of those.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

bmfc1 wrote: I don't know who bfmc is jcl. Thanks for the data, really, but to me, he is still an over-manager. I agree w/you about making a statement and Mets management has made a statement by keeping him.

Big Fuckers Motorcycle Club. Those guys hate Terry.

[bmfc1]

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: bmfc1 wrote: I don't know who bfmc is jcl. Big Fuckers Motorcycle Club. Those guys hate Terry.

I want to join.

[ashie62]

Not terribly surprising.... I did think they might want someone younger...

[Zvon]

Glad they took care of this issue.

[Fman99]

I'm fine with this move. The issue with this team hasn't been his management, it's been other stuff.

[Guest metsguyinmichigan]

Willie's numbers were better than I expected.

[MFS62]

I'll welcome him back as long as he doesn't bring Hudgens with him.


Later

[bmfc1]

Nope... Hudgens back, everybody will be back!

[Gwreck]

metsguyinmichigan wrote: Willie's numbers were better than I expected.

Winning seasons in 2005, 2006, and 2007. Team was one game under .500 when fired in 2008.

[Guest vtmet]

metirish wrote: Not surprised I guess, I really have no idea what the expectations are with this club right now or next season.

don't know what anybody else's expectations are, but mine took a nose dive...I like Collins as a "company guy", just don't like his odd ways of managing...from the rumors of guys that could have possibly been available (LaRussa, Gardenhire, Scoscia, etc), I would have preferred to wait to see who fell off the trees...

[Guest vtmet]

MFS62 wrote: I'll welcome him back as long as he doesn't bring Hudgens with him.

Hudgens isn't one of TC's guys, he's one of Sandy's guys...and from the sounds of it, his approach is pretty much what Sandy preaches (let pitches go by until you have 2 strikes on you...and then still don't swing because the guy may throw like a little league pitcher that is more likely to throw 4 balls than 3 called strikes...this approach works great for 300 pound gorilla Lucas Duda, who sports a .385 OBP despite hitting .200 with a .300 slugging percentage with no speed on the basepath)...

[Guest vtmet]

Fman99 wrote: I'm fine with this move. The issue with this team hasn't been his management, it's been other stuff.

I really don't like the way that he uses the neophyte rookies at times; these guys should be getting significant playing time in "lost" seasons...for example:

Not saying that den Dekker is ever going to be a star, or that he wasn't struggling but...he's a September callup, who might have had more of a shot this season if it wasn't for the injury...He's had 2 starts since September 17th (Sept 21 and Sept 26) & a grand total of 11 at bats in the past 12 games...

Meanwhile, Mike Baxter (who is almost 30 and in pretty much any other organization wouldn't be on a MLB roster unless the team had a ton of injuries), has started 5 of the last 6 games...

Is there a logical reason for this? Baxter sucks, and is batting .189 with a .553 OPS for the season...at least den Dekker has an excuse, and maybe even a possible career on a MLB roster...

[Guest vtmet]

Games ... Joe Torre 709 ... Willie Randolph 555 Dallas Green 512 Terry Collins 484 Jerry Manuel 417 Wes Westrum 380 Art Howe 323 Bud Harrelson 274 George Bamberger 208 Joe Frazier 207 Jeff Torborg 200 Frank Howard 116 Roy McMillan 53 Salty Parker 11 Mike Cubbage 7

so in otherwords, in only 71 more games, he'll be #2 on the list of clueless managers in terms of games managed by the Mets...and only 226 games until he's number 1 on that list...

[G-Fafif]

Press conference tomorrow at noon. Assuming it's for this, not the picking up of Francisco's option.

[Edgy MD]

Hadn't realized Francisco had an option.

[MFS62]

vtmet wrote: MFS62 wrote: I'll welcome him back as long as he doesn't bring Hudgens with him. Hudgens isn't one of TC's guys, he's one of Sandy's guys...and from the sounds of it, his approach is pretty much what Sandy preaches (let pitches go by until you have 2 strikes on you...and then still don't swing because the guy may throw like a little league pitcher that is more likely to throw 4 balls than 3 called strikes...this approach works great for 300 pound gorilla Lucas Duda, who sports a .385 OBP despite hitting .200 with a .300 slugging percentage with no speed on the basepath)...

He has done a good job teaching the players to wait until they get a decent pitch to hit. But once they get one they should be able to handle, they don't seem to be able to get hits. Is it the technique? I don't know. But I can't think of one hitter who has gotten better under Hudgens' coaching.

Later

[Edgy MD]

Depends on what you mean by "under Hudgens' coaching," as what happens on his watch may or may not be attributable to him. But if you look hard enough, there are certainly veterans (Marlon Byrd), rookies (Juan Lagares), and players in between (Cedeno) who have defied their career trajectories offensively after joining the Mets.

[Ceetar]

MFS62 wrote: MFS62 wrote: I'll welcome him back as long as he doesn't bring Hudgens with him. Hudgens isn't one of TC's guys, he's one of Sandy's guys...and from the sounds of it, his approach is pretty much what Sandy preaches (let pitches go by until you have 2 strikes on you...and then still don't swing because the guy may throw like a little league pitcher that is more likely to throw 4 balls than 3 called strikes...this approach works great for 300 pound gorilla Lucas Duda, who sports a .385 OBP despite hitting .200 with a .300 slugging percentage with no speed on the basepath)... He has done a good job teaching the players to wait until they get a decent pitch to hit. But once they get one they should be able to handle, they don't seem to be able to get hits. Is it the technique? I don't know. But I can't think of one hitter who has gotten better under Hudgens' coaching. Later

Well, Duda depending on how you look at it. Eric Young Jr. Ronny Cedeno. David Wright, as compared to immediately before.

Ike both did and didn't. he had two really bad halves and two really good ones. seems like Hudgens should either get both credit and blame, or none of it.

none of it's where I lean. Most of these players are bad. Maybe this philosophy didn't jive with some guys that will never be good at pitch recognition (Nieuwenhuis, Lagares, Murphy?) and are better served expanding the strike zone and just doing what they do. Murphy's got great contact skills, so he manages, but the other two might just not be major league hitters.

[Guest d'Kong76]

I'm cool with him, good luck!

[Edgy MD]

I tend to disagree with the notion that Hudgens is an Alderson hire that doesn't have the support of Terry Collins. For one, he pre-dates Alderson's tenure. For two, Terry worked with him in the minors. Lastly, the team has let go of coaches (Oberkfell, Wilson, Debus) during Terry's tenure. It would make little sense that the team would resign him to a fourth and fifth season and still be foisting a batting coach on him that he doesn't stand by. If they are divided all this time, Alderson could have easily resolved that by not renewing Collins' contract yesterday.

[Edgy MD]

Rising Apple reporting from the news conference.

Main takeaways:

• Alderson sees going .500 over the last 100 games as meaningful.
  
• End of season and the commitments it represents is a "significant demarcation" for Sandy.
  
• Offensively, the team hasn't done the things they've philosophically committed to. Not enough, anyhow.
  
• Terry: "We cannot possibly lead the National League in strikeouts without having power�we�ve got some challenges ahead, we know that." (Reality is harsh.)
  
• Sandy: Terry had team playing hard through adversity and high turnover.