You're The General Manager

[Centerfield]

Anyway, moving on from this fucktardish season...

If I'm the GM I do the following:

1. Fire Jerry. Hire Bobbby V.

2. Bring back Benny Agbayani as strength and conditioning coach. Or head of player development. Something. We need Benny.

3. Ask Jeff Wilpon to increase payroll by $40-$50 million. If he says anything but yes (including "I can't make such a decision unilaterally") I go to the press and say Jeff Wilpon is not committed to winning and won't give me the resources I need to build a winner. I'm either immediately fired, or I now have some payroll flexibility.

4. I sign Matt Holliday and John Lackey. Sure, they look like the Carlos Lee and Kevin Appier of this year's weak free agent crop, but what the hell...I have extra money.

5. Trade Niese, Fartinez, Murphy and Maine for Adrian Gonzalez.

6. Two words: Bullpen Car

7. Trade Luis Castillo and Jeff Franceour to the Astros for Carlos Lee. I take the Lee contract (which is getting worse and worse by the year) off their hands. I convince them to take Franceour by hiding his statistics and using terms like "toolsy" and "raw ability". Sure, we end up with two awful outfielders, both of whom have no business in the field at all, much less in the cavernous rightfield of Citi, but what the hell. Outfield defense shmoutfield shmeefense.

8. Remove the orange dot from the blue hat.

9. Sign Orlando Hudson.

10. Re-sign JJ Putz to an incentive-laden deal.

11. Remove that ridiculous fence and replace it with a uniform, 8 foot tall wall. Get rid of that "Mo's Zone" little alcove thingy.

[u:34viur01]Lineup[/u:34viur01]:
1. Reyes SS
2. Hudson 2B
3. Wright 3B
4. Gonzalez 1B
5. Beltran CF
6. Holliday RF
7. Lee LF
8. Thole/Santos C

[u:34viur01]Rotation[/u:34viur01]:
Santana
Lackey
Pelfrey
Perez
Redding/Nieve/Some scrub

[u:34viur01]Bullpen[/u:34viur01]:
Rodriguez
Stokes
Putz
Feliciano
Misch
Redding/Nieve

[u:34viur01]Bench[/u:34viur01]:
Whoever. I don't care. Not Marlon Anderson

[MFS62]

Ashie62 wrote: Beyond that Marcus Scaturo is available, albeit off a career year

Scutaro has had a career career.
We keep looking for the decline,but he has remained pretty good at what he does.
Later

[MFS62]

Jason Marquis wants to be a Met.
http://m.nypost.com/ms/p/nyp/nyp/ssFG2yMVxgm9OI7nF8dg6uA/view.m?id=23105&storyid=4.0.1945274983&team=mets&name=Mets

Whaddaya' think?
I say yes, if the price is right.
Later

[smg58]

Marquis' ERA+ has hung around 100 for most of his career (last year was an outlier, but not by that much). That would correspond to a 4.10 ERA here. Not bad, but not open-your-wallet good either. I think he's worth 2 years and $15M, but I'll be surprised if that gets it done.

[ashie62]

MFS62 wrote: Jason Marquis wants to be a Met. http://m.nypost.com/ms/p/nyp/nyp/ssFG2yMVxgm9OI7nF8dg6uA/view.m?id=23105&storyid=4.0.1945274983&team=mets&name=Mets Whaddaya' think? I say yes, if the price is right. Later

He wants roughly 21 for 3..I'll pass...I've soured on all Free Agent pitching signings. I think KFraud sent me over the edge

[TransMonk]

I like Marquis if it's in addition to a legit #2. Hopefully, it would not be Marquis as a #2.

Marquis would be the new Traschel...which is great as long as he is not expected to carry the team.

[ashie62]

Marquis would be 2 unless you see Pelfrey as a 2. So..I guess Lackey would be needed also

[TransMonk]

Ashie62 wrote: ..I guess Lackey would be needed also

Yup.

[ashie62]

You could go after Marquis and Lackey, lowball LF, and hope the healthy recover...on time

Texas is parting ways with CF Marlon Bryd.

Holliday and Bay are looking more like they are staying put.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Think hitting, hitting, hitting, and then hitting.

[metirish]

I've had time to think about this and as the new GM I am convinced this team needs a top class pitcher like Lackey to pair with Santana.......we have enough middle of the road guys to fill out the rotation.


Santana/Lackey
Lee/Hamels

[Guest Edgy DC]

My thinking is that almost every free-agent starting pitcher is middle-of-the-road guy. And thinking that Lackey or some other Benson-buncher is an ace and paying him like one won't make him one.

Dude's three years removed from his peak season and it's looking more and more like an outlier. If my confidence in him isn't quite comparable to my confidence in Oliver Perez, it's probably where my confidence in Perez was a year ago.

Moreover, I think the Mets think this way, that none of them are gamebreakers any more than the guys they have now. And if the Mets really want one of those, I think they'll be more interested in doing a trade-and-extension deal for Roy Halladay, as they did with Santana.

I think we might get the opposite of what the papers are saying. Rather than the Mets going cheap and half-hearted this year, I think we may learn that the Mets and Yankees are the main teams looking to spend money, but maybe not on MLB free agents.

I think the international free agents will be possiblities to bolster the rotation. And then they'll look to possible trade-and-sign dealies.

I'm not sure why I think this.

[MFS62]

Sign Chone Figgins. He is one of the few players who has increased his OBP dramatically since he's been in the majors - he led the Al in BB last year. He would be the second baseman.
Trade Jose Reyes* (that is NOT a misprint), John Maine, Brad Holt and John Neise to Toronto for Roy Halliday and Vernon Wells for left. Toronto is dying to rid themselves of Wells' contract, he fills the need for a righty hitting outfielder, and can play center should Beltran get injured again. If they would take Ollie Perez instead of Maine, that's even better. If they want Murphy so they can unload Overbay's contract, so much the better. Add/subtract other piece parts as needed without losing any key minor leaguers.
Bring up minor league SS prospect Tejada. He can field at least as well as, if not better,as any of the FA shortstops available.
Resign Tatis.
Sign Rod Barajas.
See what it would take to get Jeff Keppinger to play short to back up Tejada and /or replace Cora.
Make Jason Marquis happy by offering him a 3 yr, $16 million contract. If he balks, go after Randy Wolfe for the same money.
Find a doctor who could give Angel Pagan a brain transplant.

Then, figure out what to do with Luis Castillo and adding to the bullpen.

Later

* = I don't care if he would become another Lou Brock - Halliday will be better than Ernie Broglio. This team needs a shakeup.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

Edgy DC wrote: My thinking is that almost every free-agent starting pitcher is middle-of-the-road guy. And thinking that Lackey or some other Benson-buncher is an ace and paying him like one won't make him one.

Fair enough.

Edgy DC wrote: Dude's three years removed from his peak season and it's looking more and more like an outlier. If my confidence in him isn't quite comparable to my confidence in Oliver Perez, it's probably where my confidence in Perez was a year ago.

I'm not sure I'm quite THERE with you-- we were having the good-or-terrible argument last year with Perez, where the Lackey dilemma is much more good-or-great. Put another way, Lackey's likely floor-- he seems like a 175-200 innings guy, with a high-3s ERA, 7.2 K/9, 2.5 BB/9 and mid-1.20s WHIP-- seems pretty solid. It ain't the mineshaft Ollie presented.

Edgy DC wrote: Moreover, I think the Mets think this way, that none of them are gamebreakers any more than the guys they have now. And if the Mets really want one of those, I think they'll be more interested in doing a trade-and-extension deal for Roy Halladay, as they did with Santana.

It would probably be a better bet than the last time we went multi-year on a recently-dominant pitcher in his mid-30s. After all, Halladay's shown no signs of diminishment over the last couple of years.

On the other hand, even Johan's shown some signs of breakdown since we got him.

Edgy DC wrote: I think we might get the opposite of what the papers are saying. Rather than the Mets going cheap and half-hearted this year, I think we may learn that the Mets and Yankees are the main teams looking to spend money, but maybe not on MLB free agents. I think the international free agents will be possiblities to bolster the rotation. And then they'll look to possible trade-and-sign dealies. I'm not sure why I think this.

Yeah, that's curious. They've already disavowed any continuing interest in Chapman... who else were you thinking?

[Guest Edgy DC]

I don't really know. Maybe Hisanori Takahashi. I just think they do their best not to stick their necks out with pitchers, but realize they have to a little.

My thinking is always for more arms, not necessarily more expensive ones.

Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold.

[smg58]

Somebody told me that Mike Francesa suggested that the Mets wouldn't have to give up anybody of consequence to get Halladay if they also took Wells. The catch, of course, is that Wells is owed a ridiculous $107M over the next five years and rivals Ollie with his inconsistency.

[metirish]

smg58 wrote: Somebody told me that Mike Francesa suggested that the Mets wouldn't have to give up anybody of consequence to get Halladay if they also took Wells. The catch, of course, is that Wells is owed a ridiculous $107M over the next five years and rivals Ollie with his inconsistency.

So coupled with an extension for Halladay it would cost $200 to $250 million for that deal......

[Guest Edgy DC]

I'm ag'in' the idea of shakeups and the notion that they break those left behind out of an alleged sense of complacency. I think they rather just fulfill an organization or fanbase's desire for retribution.

[seawolf17]

metirish wrote: smg58 wrote: Somebody told me that Mike Francesa suggested that the Mets wouldn't have to give up anybody of consequence to get Halladay if they also took Wells. The catch, of course, is that Wells is owed a ridiculous $107M over the next five years and rivals Ollie with his inconsistency. So coupled with an extension for Halladay it would cost $200 to $250 million for that deal......

Which is why you can't give up anything of substance in a Halladay/Wells deal. I'd be very tempted to take Wells back, but that money starting in 2011 is onerous for a guy who kinda sucks now.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

Sucks, is a bad fielder, and is frequently injured.

There's a possibility I suppose his recent surgery (he had a bad wrist) helps his batting improve again but that's a big chance to take for that much $$.

[Guest Vince Coleman Firecracker]

I should really be working right now, but I like that less than posting on the CPF.

My plan assumes the team's payroll is near the threshold of how much the Wilpons are willing to spend. I think finding cheap production should be a priority this season (as opposed to, um, all the seasons it isnt' (?)). Anyhoo:

1) Give Reyes a five-year extension. Start around 50 million. Buy low!
2) I really think first base can be covered from within the organization. Nick Evans vs the lefties and some combination of Murphy/Carter/Davis vs the righties will most likely get you somewhere within sneezing distance of league average production for first at league minimum salaries.
3) Ramon Castro for catcher. When he gets hurt, let's see Thole. I don't think Santos is a terrible backup.
4) Trade for a starting pitcher. He doesn't have to be a world beater. Maybe someone coming off a bad season. Sonnastine? Eveland? Guthrie? Failing that, see if there's a free agent that'll take a reasonable contract. Maybe Davis, maybe Harden... this is going to be the toughest spot to fill, but something can be found that won't break the bank.
5) Holliday for left. Save money elsewhere to spend it here.

[Guest Edgy DC]

I'm having trouble getting around (3).

[Guest Vince Coleman Firecracker]

Edgy DC wrote: I'm having trouble getting around (3).

Well, he'll be cheap and he can hit as well as, say, Pudge Rodriguez.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

I don't think the Mets have any faith in Castro being reliable enough to stick out there more than a few times a week, and sure didn't seem like he got along with Jerry, or somebody, so I'd be surprised if he ever came back. Maybe Rod Barajas is our man, I dunno. Maybe Torrealba!

My radical twist is to make John Maine the new JJ Putz. Sure making a starter with 4 pitches and swing-and-miss stuff into a reliever seems like a a waste but Maine hasn't been reliable enough health wise to count on and I think he just might adapt to the role. My plan also calls for Pelfrey and Perez to have huge rebound seasons (I think both can do better and should if they're healthy). I am very impressed with what Piniero did last year and not too jazzed about Lackey or Marquis, but I'd also look into trades -- Harang?

[ashie62]

Edgy DC wrote: I'm ag'in' the idea of shakeups and the notion that they break those left behind out of an alleged sense of complacency. I think they rather just fulfill an organization or fanbase's desire for retribution.

I see your point, but isn't it ultimately about the fans.

I agree with MFS62...I don't think there is a snowballs chance it will happen.

I believe we'll sign an outlier SP, LF, C...The 2010 Mets may very well resemble the 2008, 2009 Mets...

I could almost stand that if I didn't have to look at Manuel and Minaya

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

Ashie62 wrote: I see your point, but isn't it ultimately about the fans.

You're speaking ironically, of course, right?

MFS62 wrote: Sign Chone Figgins. He is one of the few players who has increased his OBP dramatically since he's been in the majors - he led the Al in BB last year. He would be the second baseman.

Which he hasn't been that often, and not semi-regularly in 5 years (42 games out of 158). This would be rather Steve Phillipsy of Omar. I don't mean that as a compliment.

And how, exactly, would getting an iffy defensive 2B who gets on base a good amount, steals 30 bases a year or so, and has little-to-no power be any sort of significant improvement on Luis Castillo? 'Cause he's slightly younger, and would cost more?

Trade Jose Reyes* (that is NOT a misprint)

That's unfortunate.

... John Maine, Brad Holt and John Neise to Toronto for Roy Halliday and Vernon Wells for left. Toronto is dying to rid themselves of Wells' contract, he fills the need for a righty hitting outfielder, and can play center should Beltran get injured again.

As several others below have noted, Wells is owed a lot-- A LOT-- of money, and is not just unworthy of said money but is team-killingly so. During his last two full seasons-- 2008 was 2/3 of one-- he OPS+ed 85 and 88... in essence, a below-average major league starter-- not outfielder, but PLAYER-- with the bat. With the glove, he's arguably worse. Taking on his contract would mean that we are lashed to this mess like Ahab to the Pequod, with similar results.

If they would take Ollie Perez instead of Maine, that's even better. If they want Murphy so they can unload Overbay's contract, so much the better. Add/subtract other piece parts as needed without losing any key minor leaguers.

And if Toronto wants Reyes for Halladay, you're damn well sure they're taking Ollie. At least.

Overbay IS Future Murphy, with worse platoon splits. Also, as you pointed out, he's more expensive.

Bring up minor league SS prospect Tejada. He can field at least as well as, if not better,as any of the FA shortstops available.

And he hits at least as well as Berroa. I don't mean this as a compliment, either.

Resign Tatis.

I could see doing this. For very little.

Sign Rod Barajas.

This, not so much.

See what it would take to get Jeff Keppinger to play short to back up Tejada and /or replace Cora.

This, I could see.

Make Jason Marquis happy by offering him a 3 yr, $16 million contract. If he balks, go after Randy Wolfe for the same money.

Marquis MAY be worth this much per year. I'm pretty sure Wolf isn't taking this little. (Wolf's the better pitcher.)

Find a doctor who could give Angel Pagan a brain transplant.

This could be fun. And, considering the Mets' medical track record, it's guaranteed to go well.

Then, figure out what to do with Luis Castillo and adding to the bullpen. Keep him unless you get an offer for something better that fits the team needs? I like the overall gumption, MFS, but... yoy. And minus a few healthy years, Reyes-- a SS with about 5 times the power that LF Lou Brock ever had-- is already close to as valuable as Brock ever was.

Ashie62 Nov 19 2009 04:46 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Lou Brock is in the hall of Fame...Jose Reyes is a pimple on his ass for now

Edgy DC Nov 19 2009 06:42 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Ashie62 wrote: I see your point, but isn't it ultimately about the fans. It's not about giving them blood nor instant gratification. A five-game winning streak and they'll get over the bloodlust. It's ultimately about putting on a good successful performance. There's always a market for that.

Edgy DC Nov 19 2009 08:18 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Ashie62 wrote: Lou Brock is in the hall of Fame...Jose Reyes is a pimple on his ass for now Lou Brock is also 70. (Holy shit! 70!) I don't think he's going to win that one. I don't know what makes Reyes a pimple, but I've got to wonder why you so often want to get rid of everyone.

Ashie62 Nov 19 2009 09:04 PM Re: You're The General Manager

LWFS Says Reyes is as valuable as Brock was ? Is that a joke. Right now Brock could take him in the 40 As far as getting rid of people I did post the 2010 Mets will likely resemble the 2008-2009 team. Yes, I would like to see Manuel & Minaya gone based on performance...

RealityChuck Nov 19 2009 09:12 PM Re: You're The General Manager

MFS62 wrote: * = I don't care if he would become another Lou Brock - Halliday will be better than Ernie Broglio. This team needs a shakeup. People always seem to think the trade was a bad idea, but really, the Cubs were correct in trading Brock. People forget Brock was a terrible fielder (you can argue the importance of fielding average, but I don't think anyone would argue that an outfielder like Brock who fielded .959 is a good fielder -- and other fielding statistics confirm this). The only position he was able to play was LF -- and the Cubs had arguably a better player there (lifetime .OPS 100 points better; OPS+ of 133 vs. Brock's 109). Brock was traded mostly because there was no place to play him, not because he was great (or even potentially great) at his position. Broglio OTOH won 18 games the year before the trade and had a lifetime ERA+ up to that point of 120. No way anyone would have predicted he'd fall apart in Chicago. The moral: a perfectly reasonable trade (like the ones people are suggesting here) can look pretty terrible years later. If we were Cubs fans back in 1963, we'd be thinking that this was a steal.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Nov 19 2009 11:04 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Ashie62 wrote: LWFS Says Reyes is as valuable as Brock was ? Is that a joke. Brock was a mildly-overrated offensive player-- the speed and baserunning ability were superlative, but he didn't hit much, get on that much and appears from all sides-- see RealityChuck's bit-- to have been a terrible defender, speed inclusive. And this has been covered elsewhere much better, but the Hall gatesmen haven't always done the best job sifting "great" from "pretty good for a while." Even leaving out the VC choices-- chock full of Rizzutos and Schoendiensts and Everses and Maranvilles-- you've got Aparicios and Suttons and Perezes to deal with.

Edgy DC Nov 20 2009 07:04 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Brock stayed healthy, played a long time, got 3,000 hits, and retired (and came before the Hall of Fame) with two high-profile records. It's a shame that his thread is becoming about him, because whether or not Reyes is traded shouldn't really be a based on whether or not he is better 'n' Lou Brock. We're going to fall into tangents on peak value and career value and league context and how many different contexts Lou's career spanned and whatnot. A healthy Reyes is a valuable thing --- not to mention signed through 2011 --- and not something to be dealt lightly. I'd be particularly wary of trading him after an injury-shattered year. If his legs come out healthy during the first half, I might get to work on an extension. I'd really like to see him dropped a bit in the order, because he has to look seriously at embracing the point in his career where his legs are not his bread and butter, but his skillz.

batmagadanleadoff Nov 20 2009 08:28 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Lou Brock is a deserving Hall of Famer � but an overrated Hall of Famer. And more than mildly so. In fact, if Lou Brock were active today, and the same age as Jose Reyes, I�d rather have Reyes on my team instead of Brock if forced to choose between one of the two without the benefit of knowing Brock�s future performance beyond Reyes� present chronological age, but mainly because Brock ain�t no shortstop. And speaking of Reyes and leadoff-hitters, I might as well segue into the theme of this thread with my one move, which would be to keep Luis Castillo and move him into the leadoff spot in the batting order. Castillo, as flawed as he is, is still the best damn leadoff hitter the Mets have had in the last ten years ever since Rickey Henderson�s 1999 season: he�s certainly a more qualified leadoff hitter than Reyes. Reyes,�my proposed number two hitter who draws less walks than Castillo but drives the ball better than Luis - would be able to move Castillo around the bases far more efficiently than Castillo ever advanced Reyes. I have zero expectations of the Mets ever making this move even though, to my thinking, it�s unquestionably the right move. I�m becoming resigned to the fact that the Mets are run by a bunch off nincompoops who probably care more about the marketing of Jose Reyes and his image as a stolen base guy than actual production and that those two reasons alone will keep Reyes in the leadoff spot. Plus, one added benefit of having Castillo bat leadoff is that you�ll almost never ever see Castillo squaring around to bunt about 45 seconds before the pitcher goes into his windup anymore. I suppose that nobody, not even the Mets, not even Wee Willie Small Ball�s Mets would ask their leadoff hitter to sac bunt with nobody out and nobody on base.

metirish Nov 20 2009 08:30 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Jesus , Mary and Chirst look what the cat dragged in.

Frayed Knot Nov 20 2009 08:34 AM Re: You're The General Manager

And speaking of Reyes and leadoff-hitters, I might as well segue into the theme of this thread with my one move, which would be to keep Luis Castillo and move him into the leadoff spot in the batting order. Castillo, as flawed as he is, is still the best damn leadoff hitter the Mets have had in the last ten years ever since Rickey Henderson�s 1999 season: he�s certainly a more qualified leadoff hitter than Reyes. Reyes,�my proposed number two hitter who draws less walks than Castillo but drives the ball better than Luis - would be able to move Castillo around the bases far more efficiently than Castillo ever advanced Reyes. I have zero expectations of the Mets ever making this move even though, to my thinking, it�s unquestionably the right move. I�m becoming resigned to the fact that the Mets are run by a bunch off nincompoops who probably care more about the marketing of Jose Reyes and his image as a stolen base guy than actual production and that those two reasons alone will keep Reyes in the leadoff spot. Plus, one added benefit of having Castillo bat leadoff is that you�ll almost never ever see Castillo squaring around to bunt about 45 seconds before the pitcher goes into his windup anymore. I suppose that nobody, not even the Mets, not even Wee Willie Small Ball�s Mets would ask their leadoff hitter to sac bunt with nobody out and nobody on base. All that, of course, is on the manager and not the general manager. One of the saddest episodes of last season was that after Jerry openly toyed with the idea of batting Castillo leadoff during ST (to the howls of the closed-minded everywhere) he not only turned away from the idea but did so even after Reyes went down.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Nov 20 2009 08:48 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Yes, that was a shame, and I do believe it has much to do with the Mets making an effort to build an identity around the idea of Reyes as their leadoff hitter. I have to say, as abhorrent as I find the MFYs and their marketing, their strategy of using the organization itself as the selling point -- and not necessarily the individuals comprising it -- probably holds less downside. For the Mets I think this effort has tended to interfere with strategic decisions (like shifting Reyes in the order) and to an extent dictating the moves of the front office (the mets as a "superstar" driven team, cannot almost by definition shop for a relief pitcher without being obligated to pay top retail for the biggest name with the most saves, for example). It handicaps them.

Edgy DC Nov 20 2009 08:50 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Welcome backman, BML.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Nov 20 2009 09:26 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Edgy DC wrote: It's a shame that his thread is becoming about him, because whether or not Reyes is traded shouldn't really be a based on whether or not he is better 'n' Lou Brock. They started it. Now... are we gonna move Murphy or not? He's living on borrowed time over at 1B, seems better suited for a league with a DH option, and Lord knows he's not turning into Tony Perez any time soon. (And holy hell, BML... good to "see" you.)

batmagadanleadoff Nov 20 2009 09:31 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Frayed Knot wrote: All that, of course, is on the manager and not the general manager.. I'm not so sure. After reading Moneyball, I'm convinced that Billy Beane might've fired Willie Randolph on the spot right in the middle of a game after watching some of his shenanigans ... like, as one example, sac bunting in the first inning of a game being played in Denver, Colorado where Reyes had already reached second base before the first out was ever made and Wright, Beltran, and Delgado due up and poised to bring in the big innning. If nothing else, Moneyball illustrates that the GM does have a say into field strategy. And given the consistently questionable field strategy of the New SNY Mets, I wonder if Minaya is as much to blame, if not more so, than the field managers. If I was the GM, I'd ring the top of Citi Field with S.W.A.T. sharpshooters trained to shoot any Met between the eyeballs if that batter so much as half- squared around to bunt in the first inning of any game. Second inning, too.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Nov 20 2009 09:39 AM Re: You're The General Manager

batmagadanleadoff wrote: If nothing else, Moneyball illustrates that the GM does have a say into field strategy. And given the consistently questionable field strategy of the New SNY Mets, I wonder if Minaya is as much to blame, if not more so, than the field managers. This is a conversation unto itself. Let's just say that this seems to vary widely-- WIDELY-- from clubhouse to clubhouse. The manager's primary JOB is organizing field strategy, and very few successfully-run businesses I know-- sports-related or otherwise-- opt for management doing the jobs of their subordinates. batmagadanleadoff wrote: If I was the GM, I'd ring the top of Citi Field with S.W.A.T. sharpshooters trained to shoot any Met between the eyeballs if that batter so much as half- squared around to bunt in the first inning of any game. Second inning, too. You training them to distinguish between drag and sac bunts?

Edgy DC Nov 20 2009 09:43 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Watch them make the fans pay for the sharpshooters.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Nov 20 2009 09:49 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Mets spokesman David Howard said, "It's very consistent with what we said in the beginning. Obviously, the 'average' means there is some people paying a higher 'security tax' and some lower, but the average sharpshooter fee is no more than 5 percent. For most. We haven't heard any outrage about this, and that has nothing to do with the fact that the snipers calibrate their sights by training their rifles on the crowd."

Frayed Knot Nov 20 2009 10:39 AM Re: You're The General Manager

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Yes, that was a shame, and I do believe it has much to do with the Mets making an effort to build an identity around the idea of Reyes as their leadoff hitter. I have to say, as abhorrent as I find the MFYs and their marketing, their strategy of using the organization itself as the selling point -- and not necessarily the individuals comprising it -- probably holds less downside. For the Mets I think this effort has tended to interfere with strategic decisions (like shifting Reyes in the order) and to an extent dictating the moves of the front office (the mets as a "superstar" driven team, cannot almost by definition shop for a relief pitcher without being obligated to pay top retail for the biggest name with the most saves, for example). It handicaps them. Partly illustrated by the (IMO) over-the-top on-field celebrations for Franco's 400th save and Lenny Harris's PH record. Not that those were mgmt-directed necessarily or mattered in the outcome of a game or season, but both (and other examples) could be seen as the result of a climate that prefers to trumpet certain individuals or accomplishments rather than the overall brand.

Frayed Knot Nov 20 2009 10:55 AM Re: You're The General Manager

batmagadanleadoff wrote: Frayed Knot wrote: All that, of course, is on the manager and not the general manager.. I'm not so sure. After reading Moneyball, I'm convinced that Billy Beane might've fired Willie Randolph on the spot right in the middle of a game after watching some of his shenanigans ... like, as one example, sac bunting in the first inning of a game being played in Denver, Colorado where Reyes had already reached second base before the first out was ever made and Wright, Beltran, and Delgado due up and poised to bring in the big innning. If nothing else, Moneyball illustrates that the GM does have a say into field strategy. And given the consistently questionable field strategy of the New SNY Mets, I wonder if Minaya is as much to blame, if not more so, than the field managers. GMs have a say in strategy to the extent that they should be hiring folks who have a philosophy that they agree with. So, no, I don't think Minaya et al are upstairs calling for specific in-game strategies; I suspect it's probably more a case where the front office is more or less indifferent (or at least neutral) to the idea that one concept is so much better than the other to the point where they're also not insisting on the converse. But I've seen Oakland teams do enough 'non-Moneyball' things also and Beane, to my knowledge, has never replaced a manager in-season or at anytime other than at the end of contract time. Maybe that's as much a case of not being able to eat the dollars as anything else but it also shows he's not dictating in-game decisions. In the end, the batting order and dugout calls are up to Jerry.

Ashie62 Nov 20 2009 11:53 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Edgy DC wrote: Watch them make the fans pay for the sharpshooters. I'm available..

Ashie62 Nov 20 2009 11:59 AM Re: You're The General Manager

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: Ashie62 wrote: LWFS Says Reyes is as valuable as Brock was ? Is that a joke. Brock was a mildly-overrated offensive player-- the speed and baserunning ability were superlative, but he didn't hit much, get on that much and appears from all sides-- see RealityChuck's bit-- to have been a terrible defender, speed inclusive. And this has been covered elsewhere much better, but the Hall gatesmen haven't always done the best job sifting "great" from "pretty good for a while." Even leaving out the VC choices-- chock full of Rizzutos and Schoendiensts and Everses and Maranvilles-- you've got Aparicios and Suttons and Perezes to deal with. When Reyes gets to 1000 hits let me know. I still believe comparing Reyes to Brock is a true slap to Brock and thats all I've got. The greater issue of healthy Reyes legs early next year?....I would trade him. Murphy..He will be the 1B in 2010 barring a Carlos Delgado Festivus miracle

Edgy DC Nov 20 2009 12:23 PM Re: You're The General Manager

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: Now... are we gonna move Murphy or not? He's living on borrowed time over at 1B, seems better suited for a league with a DH option, and Lord knows he's not turning into Tony Perez any time soon. But he certainly could still turn into Dave Magadan, and that's not a bad thing to be (bat him leadoff!). He's survived a year of adversity, finished kinda strong, did well at first, and probably should've been in AAA.

Frayed Knot Nov 20 2009 02:23 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Ashie62 wrote: When Reyes gets to 1000 hits let me know. I still believe comparing Reyes to Brock is a true slap to Brock and thats all I've got. You do realize the ridiculousness of comparing the totality of Brock's career to Reyes thru age 26, right? Brock's most similar player thru age 26 = Coco Crisp

Edgy DC Nov 20 2009 02:36 PM Re: You're The General Manager

And Reyes' most similar batter is Ryne Sandberg, MVP, Hall of Famer. Followed by 2. Jimmy Rollins, MVP 3. Larry Doyle, MVP 4. Paul Molitor, Hall of Famer 5. Alan Trammell, six-time All-Star

metsmarathon Nov 20 2009 02:44 PM Re: You're The General Manager

brock's most similar batters after coco crisp, defiinitely not a hall of famer.... 2. george wood, neither mvp nor hofer, he predated any manner of all star game by decades, but did lead the NL in saves in 1888 with two! 3. jimmy welsh, still not an all star 4. bernie williams, five-time all-star, fringe mvp candidate (0.51 mvp-shares in his career), and just shy of the hall of fame unless you're talking to a yldb 5. marquis grissom, two time all-star, fringe mvp candidate (0.45 mvp-shares in his career, and surely not a hall of famer. i should point out unless doc is lurking out there somewhere, that similarity scores do not allow for projecting a players' future endeavors, but are handy in providing comparative context for their past accomplishments.

Edgy DC Nov 20 2009 04:55 PM Re: You're The General Manager

I wish similarity scores were calculated on an era-neutral basis.

Edgy DC Nov 20 2009 05:03 PM Re: You're The General Manager

By the way, checking out Lube Rock, I looked at 1974 MVP voting. What a bunch of crap. Bench, Mike Marshall, Schmidt, the Toy Cannon, Joe Morgan. How are these guys (maybe more) not more valuable than Steve Garvey? Was square-jawiness a legitimate voting criterion then?

Ashie62 Nov 20 2009 05:40 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Frayed Knot wrote: Ashie62 wrote: When Reyes gets to 1000 hits let me know. I still believe comparing Reyes to Brock is a true slap to Brock and thats all I've got. You do realize the ridiculousness of comparing the totality of Brock's career to Reyes thru age 26, right? Brock's most similar player thru age 26 = Coco Crisp Do you realize the ridiculousness of comparing a player known mostly for getting hurt and choking in September to someone who had 3000 hits. We may not agree some some in the HOF but it is for the very very great, not the very very good. Will Jose Reyes get there? He's not even on the path Yes, this won't be played out for quite some time but lay off the Reyes-Kool-Aid

Benjamin Grimm Nov 20 2009 06:25 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Calling Reyes a future Hall of Famer is certainly very premature. But calling him a pimple is the other extreme. He's been a very good player, one of the best non-pitchers the Mets have ever had.

Ashie62 Nov 20 2009 06:33 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Calling Reyes a future Hall of Famer is certainly very premature. But calling him a pimple is the other extreme. He's been a very good player, one of the best non-pitchers the Mets have ever had. agreed

Edgy DC Nov 20 2009 08:45 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Reyes is not "known mostly for getting hurt and choking in September." And he's not comparing them. MFS62 was.

Frayed Knot Nov 21 2009 05:54 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Ashie62 wrote: Ashie62 wrote: When Reyes gets to 1000 hits let me know. I still believe comparing Reyes to Brock is a true slap to Brock and thats all I've got. You do realize the ridiculousness of comparing the totality of Brock's career to Reyes thru age 26, right? Brock's most similar player thru age 26 = Coco Crisp Do you realize the ridiculousness of comparing a player known mostly for getting hurt and choking in September to someone who had 3000 hits. We may not agree some some in the HOF but it is for the very very great, not the very very good. Will Jose Reyes get there? He's not even on the path Yes, this won't be played out for quite some time but lay off the Reyes-Kool-Aid At this point I've started to lose track of how and why this comparison even started, but it seems to me that YOU are the only one comparing the accomplishments of a still-young player to the entirety of another player's career and acting as if you've found something profound when the two don't match. And you might want to check on the comparisons at similar points in their respective careers before you decide that he's "not even on the path". Reyes compares favorably across the board - including being significantly better in both SBs & SB%. Yes the different eras skews things in Jose's favor but one of those guys is a good SS while the other a below-average LFer.

batmagadanleadoff Nov 21 2009 07:50 AM Re: You're The General Manager

metirish wrote: Jesus , Mary and Chirst look what the cat dragged in. Must be the same cat that�s had my tongue for the past few months. Meow. Edgy DC wrote: Welcome backman, BML. (And holy hell, BML... good to "see" you.) Thanks, guys. If nothing else, Moneyball illustrates that the GM does have a say into field strategy. And given the consistently questionable field strategy of the New SNY Mets, I wonder if Minaya is as much to blame, if not more so, than the field managers. This is a conversation unto itself. Let's just say that this seems to vary widely-- WIDELY-- from clubhouse to clubhouse. The manager's primary JOB is organizing field strategy, and very few successfully-run businesses I know-- sports-related or otherwise-- opt for management doing the jobs of their subordinates. And most businesses --sports related or otherwise�fail when lower management can�t do its� job. What�s good for Billy Beane should be good for the Mets. [You training them to distinguish between drag and sac bunts? Let�s just say that the bunter better be safe at first. Edgy DC wrote: But [Daniel Murphy] certainly could still turn into Dave Magadan, and that's not a bad thing to be (bat him leadoff!). Hey! I thought that David Wright is now the new David Magadan.

batmagadanleadoff Nov 21 2009 07:59 AM Re: You're The General Manager

By the way, checking out Lube Rock, I looked at 1974 MVP voting. What a bunch of crap. Bench, Mike Marshall, Schmidt, the Toy Cannon, Joe Morgan. How are these guys (maybe more) not more valuable than Steve Garvey? Was square-jawiness a legitimate voting criterion then? The 1974 NL MVP is one of my least favorites. In a perfect world, 1974 NL MVP Steve Garvey wouldn't have received a single vote: the voters can only select their top 10 candidates and in 1974, there were at least 15 NL'ers who had a better season than Garvey. Therefore, if Garvey wasn't one of the leagues 10 best players, he shouldn't have appeared on any voter's ballot. Garvey wasn't even the best player on his own team in 1974. The Dodgers best player that season was 1974 SI cover boy and the perenially screwed over in MVP voting guy -- Jimmy Wynn. I would have given the '74 MVP to Joe ("how can such a smart baseball player be so stupid otherwise?") Morgan, thus eventually giving Morgan a run of three consecutive MVP's.

Edgy DC Nov 21 2009 08:32 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Mike Marshall, though, with 200 innings out of the pen... hard to pass up.

batmagadanleadoff Nov 21 2009 08:54 AM Re: You're The General Manager

That would render Garvey no better than the third best 1974 Dodger. Did we miss any other '74 Dodgers better than Garvey? (covering a copy of SI in 1974 not required)

Ashie62 Nov 21 2009 09:10 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Edgy DC wrote: Reyes is not "known mostly for getting hurt and choking in September." And he's not comparing them. MFS62 was. Reyes is not mostly known for getting hurt and choking in September? Do you watch the games? Do you live to be "correct" to validate yourself or do you just take special pleasure in busting my azz

HahnSolo Nov 21 2009 09:29 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Andy Messersmith: 20-6, 2.59 (132 ERA+), 292 IP (!), 1.09 WHIP, 13 CG, 221 Ks.

Ashie62 Nov 21 2009 09:53 AM Re: You're The General Manager

It's official Shelly Duncan is an FA....LF option? just kidding On the not kidding front the Dodgers are in the Halladay derby

Vince Coleman Firecracker Nov 21 2009 10:54 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Ashie62 wrote: Reyes is not mostly known for getting hurt and choking in September? No, he's not. He's mostly known for being an absolute stud shortstop, probably the second best in the league over the course of his young career. And while it's premature to put him in the HoF, it's not premature to look at him and realize that if he keeps up what he's doing for long enough, he will be a hall of famer. According to B-R's HoF stats, he's about a third of the way there already. 2006, 2007 and 2008 are three hall-caliber seasons. Will he need five or six more? Sure, but he's only going into his age-27 season; and while no one can accurately project any player ten years ahead, I think there's more than an outside chance that when you watch Reyes play, you're watching a future hall of famer entering his peak.

Edgy DC Nov 21 2009 12:37 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Ashie62 wrote: Edgy DC wrote: Reyes is not "known mostly for getting hurt and choking in September." And he's not comparing them. MFS62 was. Reyes is not mostly known for getting hurt and choking in September? Do you watch the games? Do you live to be "correct" to validate yourself or do you just take special pleasure in busting my azz Yeah, I watch the games. Let's deal with the facts instead of my issues. Reyes is not known mostly for getting hurt and choking in September.

metsmarathon Nov 21 2009 01:40 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Edgy DC wrote: Edgy DC wrote: Reyes is not "known mostly for getting hurt and choking in September." And he's not comparing them. MFS62 was. Reyes is not mostly known for getting hurt and choking in September? Do you watch the games? Do you live to be "correct" to validate yourself or do you just take special pleasure in busting my azz Yeah, I watch the games. Let's deal with the facts instead of my issues. Reyes is not known mostly for getting hurt and choking in September. i think right now, he's known for being hurt. but until this year, he was known for handshakes, dances, and being one of the most electrifying and exciting players in the league.

Ashie62 Nov 21 2009 09:51 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Reyes is most recently known for being injured and choking in September 2007 & 2008 I disagree with you 100 percent. Nice we live in a semi-free country

Edgy DC Nov 22 2009 05:52 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Yeah, nice to blow everything out of proportion and insinutate that to disagree with you is to somehow oppress you. First it's that I have issues, now you're decrying impositions on your freedom. Is this how you intend to press your point?

metsmarathon Nov 22 2009 09:11 AM Re: You're The General Manager

if you think living in a free country means that nobody will argue with you when you're wrong wrong wrong, you've gotta get a new dictionary.

MFS62 Nov 23 2009 06:55 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Russell Martin, C, Dodgers: With nine arb-eligible players, plus an owner embroiled in a messy divorce, LA is looking to cut costs. Though Martin is only 26, his stats have been trending downward for two seasons. He made $3.9 million this year and had just 26 extra-base hits, so his 2010 salary could outweigh his production. That's from Buster Olney's blog this weekend. I'd definitely jump on getting him even if it means he'll be making about $6 million. If we're spending that much on a catcher, rather it be on him than Molina. Like Buster said, he's 26 and I just think he had a down year. And this opens up a spot for Figgins (see my post). So, add Castillo for Martin to my GM moves. And delete signing Barajas. Later

Edgy DC Nov 23 2009 07:26 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Yes. It's disgraceful how long it's been since the Mets have suited up a Canadian. The last one, if my history is correct, was punchless third-string shortstop Brian Ostrosser in 1973. It's strange. The Mets always seem to have their share of Canadian prospects, but none of them ever seem to blossom. We can sit around forever waiting for Jean-Luc Blaquiere (.238 in Savannah this year) or we can be pro-active and correct this injustice.

metirish Nov 23 2009 07:36 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Hold on while I go and look for MFS62's previous posts.......you're asking alot there mate

metirish Nov 23 2009 08:13 AM Re: You're The General Manager Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Nov 23 2009 08:24 AM

Bill Jmaes rates Martin as one of the players that will do better next season in his Strong Seasons Leading Index with a score of 24.... A score of 24 or higher indicates a better-than 50% chance the player will sustain or improve the following season http://waswatching.com/2009/11/20/thtjames-posada-not-to-match-09-in-10/ I got this form a Davidoff article so thanks Ken Strong Seasons Leading Index It incorporates 1) age, 2) 2009 OPS compared to career OPS; 3) something he calls "Adjusted Ball in Play average," which is like BABIP but gives extra credit to power hitters (since they hit the ball harder, their BABIP is less likely to vary - a pretty cool tweak); 4) comparing a player's 2009 runs scored and RBI to the '08 totals; 5) a player's strikeout/walk ratio in '09; 6) speed, utilizing a formula he designed; and 7) a basic premise that all players' numbers gravitate toward the league average.

Benjamin Grimm Nov 23 2009 08:23 AM Re: You're The General Manager

I see that the Mets don't anyone in either category, most likely to improve or least likely to improve. (I was afraid we'd see David Wright in that latter category.)

MFS62 Nov 24 2009 10:16 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Benjamin Grimm wrote: I see that the Mets don't anyone in either category, most likely to improve or least likely to improve. (I was afraid we'd see David Wright in that latter category.) Speaking of improvement, check out some of the similar players baseball-reference lists for Daniel Murphy: http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/m/murphda08.shtml Adam Lind and Lee May.(and even Norm Siebern) The guy had 54 XB hits last year. I think playing the outfield messed with his head. After moving to first base permanently, he settled down, and so did his swing. I don't understand the crying need (callers and hosts on NY sportstalk radio) for an upgrade there as opposed to addressing other needs first. Just sayin'. Later

Ashie62 Nov 24 2009 10:23 AM Re: You're The General Manager

metsmarathon wrote: if you think living in a free country means that nobody will argue with you when you're wrong wrong wrong, you've gotta get a new dictionary. I don't believe I'm wrong, I was ending my participation in the discussion.

Ashie62 Nov 25 2009 01:34 PM Re: You're The General Manager

And Adam Rubin has Fernando Martinez on the waiting to be traded line If true, I'm thinking established corner outfielder

smg58 Nov 25 2009 02:01 PM Re: You're The General Manager

He's capable of helping next year's team, and I'm worried that because he had a bad first month in the majors and then got hurt we'd be selling low. I'd be careful with him.

Ashie62 Nov 28 2009 03:12 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Ashie62 wrote: And Adam Rubin has Fernando Martinez on the waiting to be traded line If true, I'm thinking established corner outfielder or maybe Josh Johnson?

batmagadanleadoff Aug 02 2010 12:54 AM Re: You're The General Manager

That would render Garvey no better than the third best 1974 Dodger. Did we miss any other '74 Dodgers better than Garvey? (covering a copy of SI in 1974 not required) Apropos to last Fall's discussion of the wretched 1974 MVP ballot won by Steve Garvey, here are the Baseball Reference WAR ratings for the top 10 ranking 1974 Dodgers. According to the BR notes for its WAR formula, a score of 8 or higher is indicative of an MVP caliber season; a score of 5 or more is all-star quality. 1. Jimmy Wynn -------8.6 2. Andy Messersmith--6.6 3. Ron Cey ------------5.2 4. Steve Garvey-------5.1------NL MVP 5. Willie Crawford ----4.1 6. Davey Lopes ------4.0 7. Joe Ferguson -----3.9 8. Bill Buckner--------3.7 9. Bill Russell ---------3.2 10. Mike Marshall-----3.1 -----NL CY YOUNG AWARD WINNER I was reminded of this old thread while reviewing Jon Matlack�s 1974 season. Matlack�s '74 W-L record was a disappointing 13-15 mark that did not reflect his pitching excellence that season. It would be expecting too much from a mid-�70�s voting pool to look beyond Matlack�s subpar won-loss record in order to account for the awful run support that plagued Matlack all season long .... especially a voting pool with the collective mindset to award the 20th or so best player in the league with the MVP. Not surprisingly, Matlack didn�t receive a single vote in that season�s Cy Young Award balloting. He should have. Matlack might�ve been the NL�s best pitcher that season. He wasn�t any worse than third or fourth, and unquestionably superior to CY winner Mike Marshall. Here are some selected 1974 stats for Matlack: WAR---------------8.6(MVP RANGE)-----------------1st among NL pitchers ERA----------------2.41------------------------------------3RD ADJ ERA----------149-------------------------------------3RD K�s------------------195--------------------------------------4TH (TIE) SHUTOUTS------7------------------------------------------1st WHIP---------------1.12--------------------------------------3rd (The top 3 pitchers were separated by 2/100 of a point) ADJ PITCHING WINS ------3.9---------------------------2nd

Edgy DC Aug 02 2010 05:31 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Not to disagree, but a lot of value scoring systems convert runs (created of saved) into wins, which is grossly unfair to top relief pitchers, because the runs they save tend to be difference-makers.

batmagadanleadoff Aug 02 2010 09:46 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Edgy DC wrote: Not to disagree, but a lot of value scoring systems convert runs (created of saved) into wins, which is grossly unfair to top relief pitchers, because the runs they save tend to be difference-makers. You can disagree. Disagreeing is more fun than agreeing. So was it fair to Matlack when he gave up one earned run in a 10 inning complete game outing on closing day and took the loss? http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/NYN/NYN197410020.shtml Or when he limited the division winning Pirates to two runs in eight innings in his previous start, but took the loss because the Mets scored just one? http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/NYN/NYN197409270.shtml Or a 7 inn/1 run no decision on 4/14/74? Or 8 inn/2 runs against the World Champ Dodgers featuring MVP Steve Garvey, the 25th best player in the league on 6/14/74?

Edgy DC Aug 02 2010 11:16 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Oh, I really don't disagreee. I just think Marshall was better relative to his teammates than he appears in that list. I'm not sure how win shares are calculated by BB-R.com, but I find relievers to be disproportionately scrod in many "win shares" systems. To review: Marshall was more valuable than Bill Buckner, to my thinking, but not Matlack.

metsmarathon Aug 02 2010 11:23 AM Re: You're The General Manager

baseballreference has mike marshall at a 0.3 WPA for 1974. he went 21-12 in save opps, with 9 holds. so, basically, with the game on the line and a small lead, he went 30-12, a horrible success rate if you relate it to relievers of today. sure, there were prolly a lot more 1-run save and hold opportunities than we see today, but still, that's not terribly good. also, given 75 inherited runners, he allowed 31 to score, a 41% IS rate. (league average in 74 was 37%; in 2010, league average is 32%)

batmagadanleadoff Aug 04 2010 10:38 PM Re: You're The General Manager

The top 20 WAR's for NL pitchers (1970-present) Matlack has the highest rated WAR season for a pitcher with a losing record. He deserved to win at least 20 games in '74. Wherever a pitcher scored the highest WAR in a particular season but did not win the Cy Young Award, the actual winner is noted. 1. Steve Carlton/PHI ---------12.2--1972 2. Dwight Gooden/NYM-------11.7--1985 3. Tom Seaver/NYM------------9.5--1973 4. Steve Carlton/PHI-----------9.4--1980 5. Fergie Jenkins/CHI----------9.2--1971 6. Tom Seaver/NYM------------9.2--1971 7. Phil Niekro/ATL--------------9.1--1978---(Gaylord Perry/SD 4.7 WAR -- failed to crack top 10 -- ERA champ Craig Swan ranked 4th) 8. Randy Johnson/ARI---------8.8--2002 9. Greg Maddux/ATL-----------8.8--1995 10. Rick Reuschel/CHI----------8.7--1977---(Steve Carlton/PHI 5.8 WAR, 6th) 11. Bob Gibson/STL-------------8.7--1970 12. Jose Rijo/CIN----------------8.6--1993---(Greg Maddux/ATL 6.2 WAR, 2nd place) 13. Jon Matlack/NYM------------8.6--1974---(Mike Marshall/LA 3.1 WAR)-------(WL 13-15) 14. Phil Niekro/ATL--------------8.5--1977-------(WL 16-20) 15. Dave Roberts/SD------------8.5--1971-------(WL 14-17) 16. Randy Johnson/ARI---------8.4--2001 17. Kevin Brown/SD-------------8.4--1998---(Tom Glavine/ATL 5.6 WAR 5th) 18. Greg Maddux/CHI-----------8.4--1992 19. Steve Rogers/MON----------8.4--1982---(Steve Carlton/PHI 5.7 WAR, 5th) 20. Randy Johnson/ARI---------8.2--1999

Edgy DC Aug 05 2010 07:18 AM Re: You're The General Manager

metsmarathon wrote: baseballreference has mike marshall at a 0.3 WPA for 1974. he went 21-12 in save opps, with 9 holds. so, basically, with the game on the line and a small lead, he went 30-12, a horrible success rate if you relate it to relievers of today. sure, there were prolly a lot more 1-run save and hold opportunities than we see today, but still, that's not terribly good. also, given 75 inherited runners, he allowed 31 to score, a 41% IS rate. (league average in 74 was 37%; in 2010, league average is 32%) I'm just going to go with the guess that he was put in a lot more difficult situation with less of a net. It's very usage-dependent. In 2010, If a guy comes in with one out and a runner on first, he may get one out but allow the runner to third, before getting replaced and the next releiver, who allows that runner to score. If Mike Marshall comes in with the same situation, he stays in for the duration of the inning with the same events transipiring. He has yielded 100% of his runners to score while the 2010 pair of guys have yeilded only 50%, because one of the guys got out of there without coughing up a run. Right? As for saves, well, yeah, failing in 28.6% of your save situations is bad, but he's a guy pitching 1.96 innings per appearance (and perhaps more in his save and hold situations) while Mariano Rivera 2010 pitched 0.99 innings. And of course, we're talking about carrying almost three times as many innings for your team.

batmagadanleadoff Aug 05 2010 11:21 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Here are the 1974 NL pitching leaders for WPA. If Mike Marshall comes in with the same situation, he stays in for the duration of the inning with the same events transipiring. He has yielded 100% of his runners to score while the 2010 pair of guys have yeilded only 50%, because one of the guys got out of there without coughing up a run. Right? How does WPA account for inherited runners? If Marshall enters with an inherited runner on second base and two outs, and then immediately gives up a run scoring double, is Marshall debited with the entire run scoring event ... or is the prior reliever also charged with a portion of the run scoring event? Whatever it is, I'm guessing that the disparity between Marshall's 0.3 and the leaders' scores is too large to rack it up to unfairness.

batmagadanleadoff Aug 05 2010 11:36 AM Re: You're The General Manager

batmagadanleadoff wrote: Here are the 1974 NL pitching leaders for WPA. If Mike Marshall comes in with the same situation, he stays in for the duration of the inning with the same events transipiring. He has yielded 100% of his runners to score while the 2010 pair of guys have yeilded only 50%, because one of the guys got out of there without coughing up a run. Right? How does WPA account for inherited runners? If Marshall enters with an inherited runner on second base and two outs, and then immediately gives up a run scoring double, is Marshall debited with the entire run scoring event ... or is the prior reliever also charged with a portion of the run scoring event? Whatever it is, I'm guessing that the disparity between Marshall's 0.3 and the leaders' scores is too large to rack it up to unfairness. I haven't bothered to look to see how BR calculates WPA, and how the formula accounts for inherited runners. But I'm wondering if defending Marshall's WPA on the supposed unfairness of a reliever entering mid-inning to strand some other pitcher's runners is much ado about nothing. Even if the WPA penalizes a reliever who allows inherited runners to score, this should be offset by the higher score a reliever will earn when he does strand inherited runners.

Edgy DC Aug 05 2010 11:52 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Well, I was defending it only because that was brought up. I mostly defend relievers based on the tendency to turn runs (and runs prevented) into wins, based on the notion that X Runs = 1 win. I don't think that's fair to releivers, because they are brought in to prevent specific runs based on the leverage those runs mean toward the game. Basically you don't have to believe in and reward batters and pitchers for an ability to perform in the clutch, but when relievers (and pinch hitters) have nearly 100% of their success (and failure) occur in the clutch, I think that performance should be appropriately wieghted and measured as such. Niekro has be one of the most screwed pithers in terms of Cy Young support.

batmagadanleadoff Aug 05 2010 12:26 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Edgy DC wrote: Niekro has be one of the most screwed pithers in terms of Cy Young support. For sure. His peak years were the mid-70's, when the Braves sucked and 80% of the typical voter's effort consisted of looking at a pitcher's W-L record. He was quite the dominant pitcher for a while.

batmagadanleadoff Aug 05 2010 12:36 PM Re: You're The General Manager

batmagadanleadoff wrote: Edgy DC wrote: Niekro has be one of the most screwed pithers in terms of Cy Young support. For sure. His peak years were the mid-70's, when the Braves sucked and 80% of the typical voter's effort consisted of looking at a pitcher's W-L record. He was quite the dominant pitcher for a while. Niekro also led the NL in ERA in '67, but didn't get a single vote in the CY voting.

batmagadanleadoff Aug 05 2010 09:52 PM Re: You're The General Manager

The top 25 WAR seasons for NL pitchers over the last 50 years. Matlack's '74 (ranked 23rd) doesn't get bumped off. This means that a season as good as Matlack's comes along less than once every two years. According to WAR, anyways. Three seasons from 1969 make the list: but not The Franchise's '69. Rank Pitcher/Team WAR YEAR Cy Young Award Winner/WAR Rank 1 Steve Carlton/PHI 12.2 1972 2 Bob Gibson/STL 11.9 1968 3 Dwight Gooden/NYM 11.7 1985 4 Bob Gibson/STL 11.0 1969 Tom Seaver/NYM/7.6/6th 5 Sandy Koufax/LA 10.8 1966 6 Sandy Koufax/LA 10.8 1963 7 Dick Ellsworth/CHI 10.3 1963 8 Tom Seaver/NYM 9.5 1973 9 Steve Carlton/PHI 9.4 1980 10 Fergie Jenkins/CHI 9.2 1971 11 Tom Seaver/NYM 9.2 1971 12 Juan Marichal/SF 9.2 1965 Sandy Koufax/LA/8.2/3rd 13 Phil Niekro/ATL 9.1 1978 Gaylord Perry/SD/4.7/11th 14 Larry Dierker/HOU 9.0 1969 15 Juan Marichal/SF 9.0 1966 16 Randy Johnson/ARI 8.8 2002 17 Greg Maddux/ATL 8.8 1995 18 Bill Hands/CHI 8.8 1969 19 Rick Reuschel/CHI 8.7 1977 Steve Carlton/PHI/5.8/6th 20 Bob Gibson/STL 8.7 1970 21 Jim Bunning/PHI 8.7 1966 22 Jose Rijo/CIN 8.6 1993 Greg Maddux/ATL/6.2/2nd 23 Jon Matlack/NYM 8.6 1974 Mike Marshall/LA/3.1/19th 24 Phil Niekro/ATL 8.5 1977 25 Dave Roberts/SD 8.5 1971

batmagadanleadoff Aug 06 2010 10:51 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Some more WAR mongering: Trivia: Seven pitchers account for the Mets all time top 15 WAR for pitcher seasons. Name them. Rules: You must name all seven pitchers in one post. I will post the list of top Mets pitcher WAR seasons as soon as someone correctly posts all seven pitchers or at the beginning of tonight's game -- whichever comes first. I'm not going to give hints or point out which portion of someone's guess is wrong and which portion is right. Ready? Set? Go.

DocTee Aug 06 2010 10:55 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Koosman. Gooden Seaver Darling Fernandez Cone Santana

Benjamin Grimm Aug 06 2010 10:56 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Seaver, Koosman, Gooden, Cone, Viola, Santana, Matlack

Edgy DC Aug 06 2010 11:02 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Seaver Gooden Koosman [crossout:2cndi9v4]Saberhagen[/crossout:2cndi9v4]Cone Leiter Matlack Sabe's best steason was strike-shortened. And since this is a cumulative figure, I'll say Swan instead.

batmagadanleadoff Aug 06 2010 11:03 AM Re: You're The General Manager

No winners yet. Doc hasn't been paying attention to some stuff.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 06 2010 11:08 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Seaver, Gooden, Martinez, Cone, Matlack, Leiter, Koosman

batmagadanleadoff Aug 06 2010 11:11 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Still no winners.

batmagadanleadoff Aug 06 2010 11:15 AM Re: You're The General Manager

OK. Here's a hint that I promised I wouldn't give. One poster almost got it right. His one mistake was picking a Met whose best WAR season was the team's 16th all-time best.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 06 2010 11:17 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Seaver, Gooden, Koosman, Matlack, Cone, Viola, Fernandez

John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 06 2010 11:25 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Seaver, Gooden, Martinez, Cone, Matlack, [crossout:rsansxoo]Leiter[/crossout:rsansxoo], Koosman, Santana

batmagadanleadoff Aug 06 2010 11:29 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Still no winners. For extra credit, only one Casey Stengel managed pitcher/season cracked the Mets top 50 for WAR. Name the pitcher and year.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 06 2010 11:30 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Edit never mind

batmagadanleadoff Aug 06 2010 11:33 AM Re: You're The General Manager

In other words, which Casey Stengel managed Met had the highest pitcher WAR season? (Pitcher and year, please)

DocTee Aug 06 2010 11:44 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Matlack Seaver Gooden Cone Fernandez Darling Santana

batmagadanleadoff Aug 06 2010 11:49 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Still no winners. Hint: Only one poster got six out of seven correct pitchers.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 06 2010 11:52 AM Re: You're The General Manager Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Aug 06 2010 11:54 AM

Seaver, Gooden, Koosman, Matlack, Cone, Viola,[crossout:3v0uduax]Fernandez[/crossout:3v0uduax] Santana OE: Just peeked. I'm out. And this ain't it. (I don't think.)

batmagadanleadoff Aug 06 2010 11:53 AM Re: You're The General Manager

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: Seaver, Gooden, Koosman, Matlack, Cone, Viola,[crossout]Fernandez[/crossout] Santana This list can't be right because it's the same seven pitchers that Grimm guessed.

batmagadanleadoff Aug 06 2010 12:55 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Last call. I said I'd post the answers at the start of tonight's game but something suddenly came up and so I'll post 'em in 5 minutes. Thanks for playing.

Ashie62 Aug 06 2010 01:04 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Carl Wiley 1963

batmagadanleadoff Aug 06 2010 01:08 PM Re: You're The General Manager

The seven Mets pitchers are Seaver, Gooden, Matlack, Koosman, Leiter, Santana and Viola. David Cone, whose best Met WAR season, ranked 16th all-time, was the pitcher that threw everyone off. Grimm, and then LWFS, came the closest, guessing 6 out of 7, but incorrectly guessing Cone instead of Leiter. Below is a chart of the top 25 Mets WAR pitcher seasons. Seaver's first 10 seasons(1967-1976) are all on the list. The fabulous and tragic Carlton Willey, who pitched four complete game shutouts for Casey's '63 squad is the extra credit answer. Why is there so much space between this paragraph and the chart that follows? Rank Pitcher WAR YEAR 1 Dwight Gooden 11.7 1985 2 Tom Seaver 9.5 1973 3 Tom Seaver 9.2 1971 4 Jon Matlack 8.6 1974 5 Tom Seaver 7.7 1975 6 Tom Seaver 7.6 1969 7 Tom Seaver 7.5 1968 8 Jerry Koosman 6.8 1968 9 Jon Matlack 6.7 1972 10 Jerry Koosman 6.7 1969 11 Al Leiter 6.5 1998 12 Johan Santana 6.4 2008 13 Tom Seaver 6.4 1967 14 Frank Viola 6.3 1990 15 Tom Seaver 6.0 1970 16 David Cone 5.8 1988 17 Tom Seaver 5.8 1972 18 Craig Swan 5.7 1978 19 Tom Seaver 5.7 1976 20 Tom Seaver 5.7 1974 21 Jerry Koosman 5.7 1973 22 Pedro Martinez 5.5 2005 23 Sid Fernandez 5.5 1992 24 Dwight Gooden 5.4 1984 25 Bret Saberhagen 5.2 1994

Edgy DC Aug 06 2010 01:21 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Fixed. I feel good about being the first to come up with Leiter '98, anyhow.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 06 2010 01:22 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Sabes really was in line for one of the all-time great Met pitching seasons, wasn't he? He and the 'spos should form a support group.

Benjamin Grimm Aug 06 2010 01:28 PM Re: You're The General Manager

batmagadanleadoff wrote: OK. Here's a hint that I promised I wouldn't give. One poster almost got it right. His one mistake was picking a Met whose best WAR season was the team's 16th all-time best. It looks like that was me! (I had Viola instead of Leiter.) I'll take that as a moral victory. That Marcia Brady sure was groovy, wasn't she? I think she was the grooviest girl in the whole school!

Ashie62 Aug 06 2010 07:00 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Benjamin Grimm wrote: batmagadanleadoff wrote: OK. Here's a hint that I promised I wouldn't give. One poster almost got it right. His one mistake was picking a Met whose best WAR season was the team's 16th all-time best. It looks like that was me! (I had Viola instead of Leiter.) I'll take that as a moral victory. That Marcia Brady sure was groovy, wasn't she? I think she was the grooviest girl in the whole school! And Johnny Bravo was the coolest guy.

batmagadanleadoff Aug 07 2010 03:33 AM Re: You're The General Manager Edited 3 time(s), most recently on Aug 08 2010 10:22 PM

Best Mets Pitching WAR seasons #26-50: (But first ... lotsa blank lines that appear before my chart for reasons that I don't know why) Rank Pitcher/Team WAR YEAR 26 Jerry Koosman 5.1 1974 27 Al Leiter 4.7 2000 28 Bob Ojeda 4.7 1986 29 Mike Hampton 4.6 2000 30 Ron Darling 4.6 1986 31 Craig Swan 4.6 1979 32 Jerry Koosman 4.6 1976 33 Jon Matlack 4.6 1973 34 Dwight Gooden 4.4 1986 35 Ron Darling 4.4 1985 36 Al Leiter 4.2 2004 37 David Cone 4.2 1991 38 Rick Reed 4.1 1998 39 Rick Reed 4.1 1997 40 Jon Matlack 4.1 1976 41 Tug McGraw 4.0 1971 42 Carl Willey 4.0 1963 43 Tug McGraw 3.9 1972 44 Dwight Gooden 3.8 1987 45 Jim McAndrew 3.8 1972 46 Steve Trachsel 3.7 2003 47 Dwight Gooden 3.7 1993 48 David Cone 3.7 1990 49 Sid Fernandez 3.7 1985 50 Johan Santana 3.6 2009

batmagadanleadoff Aug 07 2010 04:38 AM Re: You're The General Manager Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Aug 08 2010 10:28 PM

2010 NL Pitcher WAR leaders, to date, (BR). R.A. Dickey is 6th in IP/WAR and is on pace to knock Johan/2009 off of the Mets top #50 (see post above) Johan/2010 might also knock Johan/2009 off of the top 50. But first, some blank lines. WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 5.7 25.79 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 5.6 31.79 3 Adam Wainwright/STL 4.8 33.40 4 Tim Hudson/ATL 4.6 32.32 4 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 4.6 32.25 6 Brett Myers/HOU 3.6 41.94 6 Livan Hernandez/WAS 3.6 40.09 8 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.5 46.86 9 Johan Santana/NYM 3.3 46.87 10 Tim Lincecum/SF 3.2 47.40 11 Matt Cain/SF 3.2 47.19 12 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 3.1 40.75 13 Clayton Kershaw/LA 3.0 45.89 14 Mat Latos/SD 2.9 42.64 15 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 2.8 50.48 16 Barry Zito/SF 2.7 53.21 17 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.6 38.08 18 Jaime Garcia/STL 2.6 46.54 19 Cole Hamels/PHI 2.5 55.60 20 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.4 51.67

Benjamin Grimm Aug 07 2010 05:07 AM Re: You're The General Manager

batmagadanleadoff wrote: (But first ... lotsa blank lines that appear before my chart for reasons that I don't know why) Try removing the line feeds from your BBCode. Make it look like one big fat paragraph.

Edgy DC Aug 07 2010 06:30 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Yeah, I jumped in there and fixed it for you, but removing the line breaks is the key.

batmagadanleadoff Aug 09 2010 07:00 PM Re: You're The General Manager

batmagadanleadoff wrote: 2010 NL Pitcher WAR leaders, to date, (BR). R.A. Dickey is 6th in IP/WAR and is on pace to knock Johan/2009 off of the Mets top #50 (see post above) Johan/2010 might also knock Johan/2009 off of the top 50. But first, some blank lines. WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 5.7 25.79 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 5.6 31.79 3 Adam Wainwright/STL 4.8 33.40 4 Tim Hudson/ATL 4.6 32.32 4 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 4.6 32.25 6 Brett Myers/HOU 3.6 41.94 6 Livan Hernandez/WAS 3.6 40.09 8 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.5 46.86 9 Johan Santana/NYM 3.3 46.87 10 Tim Lincecum/SF 3.2 47.40 11 Matt Cain/SF 3.2 47.19 12 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 3.1 40.75 13 Clayton Kershaw/LA 3.0 45.89 14 Mat Latos/SD 2.9 42.64 15 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 2.8 50.48 16 Barry Zito/SF 2.7 53.21 17 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.6 38.08 18 Jaime Garcia/STL 2.6 46.54 19 Cole Hamels/PHI 2.5 55.60 20 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.4 51.67 Updated. Johan Santana makes the biggest gain on the WAR chart, moving up two places and reducing his IP/WAR by about four innings. As of now, Santana's 2010 season ranks as the 44th all time best Mets pitcher WAR season. Teammate R.A. Dickey takes the worst hit in the NL pitcher WAR rankings, (2.6 to 2.1) dropping out of the top 20 and falling to 25th place. Dickey's IP/WAR increases by 10 innings. WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.1 25.41 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 5.5 33.64 3 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.2 32.56 4 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.0 31.33 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 4.6 32.25 6 Livan Hernandez/WAS 3.9 38.80 7 Johan Santana/NYM 3.8 42.63 8 Brett Myers/HOU 3.6 43.61 9 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.4 48.24 10 Matt Cain/SF 3.2 48.75 11 Tim Lincecum/SF 3.2 47.40 12 Mat Latos/SD 3.2 40.52 13 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 3.0 44.11 14 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 2.9 48.74 15 Barry Zito/SF 2.9 51.95 16 Cole Hamels/PHI 2.8 52.14 17 Clayton Kershaw/LA 2.6 55.26 18 Jaime Garcia/STL 2.6 46.54 19 Ted Lilly/CHIC/LAD 2.4 54.17 20 Johnny Cueto/CIN 2.4 56.67 . 25 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.1 48.57

batmagadanleadoff Aug 09 2010 07:39 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Mets all time pitcher WAR seasons 26-60, up to date, including Johan's 2010 season (#44). Pound per pound per WAR, the Mets all time best pitching season might be Armando Benitez's 1999; he racked up a 3.5 WAR score in just 78 innings. Armando's dominant IP/WAR in 1999 was 22.29. Seaver (1967) is not the only Wes Westrum managed pitcher to crack the top 60. Rank Pitcher/Team WAR YEAR 26 Jerry Koosman 5.1 1974 27 Al Leiter 4.7 2000 28 Bob Ojeda 4.7 1986 29 Mike Hampton 4.6 2000 30 Ron Darling 4.6 1986 31 Craig Swan 4.6 1979 32 Jerry Koosman 4.6 1976 33 Jon Matlack 4.6 1973 34 Dwight Gooden 4.4 1986 35 Ron Darling 4.4 1985 36 Al Leiter 4.2 2004 37 David Cone 4.2 1991 38 Rick Reed 4.1 1998 39 Rick Reed 4.1 1997 40 Jon Matlack 4.1 1976 41 Tug McGraw 4.0 1971 42 Carl Willey 4.0 1963 43 Tug McGraw 3.9 1972 44 Johan Santana 3.8 2010 45 Dwight Gooden 3.8 1987 46 Jim McAndrew 3.8 1972 47 Steve Trachsel 3.7 2003 48 Dwight Gooden 3.7 1993 49 David Cone 3.7 1990 50 Sid Fernandez 3.7 1985 51 Johan Santana 3.6 2009 52 Jesse Orosco 3.6 1983 53 Armando Benitez 3.5 1999 54 Nino Espinosa 3.5 1977 55 Dennis Ribant 3.5 1966 56 Kevin Appier 3.4 2001 57 Jerry Koosman 3.4 1970 58 Roger Craig 3.4 1962 59 David Cone 3.3 1992 60 Dwight Gooden 3.3 1988

batmagadanleadoff Aug 09 2010 09:30 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Top 60 Mets pitcher WAR seasons in chronological order. Bonus: no superfluous blank lines preceding the chart below. If I didn't already post this chart, I'd ask the forum to guess the only Met season that would feature four top-60 Met pitcher WAR seasons. You can still guess before you look, below. Rank Pitcher/Team WAR YEAR 58 Roger Craig 3.4 1962 42 Carl Willey 4.0 1963 55 Dennis Ribant 3.5 1966 13 Tom Seaver 6.4 1967 7 Tom Seaver 7.5 1968 8 Jerry Koosman 6.8 1968 6 Tom Seaver 7.6 1969 10 Jerry Koosman 6.7 1969 15 Tom Seaver 6.0 1970 57 Jerry Koosman 3.4 1970 3 Tom Seaver 9.2 1971 41 Tug McGraw 4.0 1971 9 Jon Matlack 6.7 1972 17 Tom Seaver 5.8 1972 43 Tug McGraw 3.9 1972 46 Jim McAndrew 3.8 1972 2 Tom Seaver 9.5 1973 21 Jerry Koosman 5.7 1973 33 Jon Matlack 4.6 1973 4 Jon Matlack 8.6 1974 20 Tom Seaver 5.7 1974 26 Jerry Koosman 5.1 1974 5 Tom Seaver 7.7 1975 19 Tom Seaver 5.7 1976 32 Jerry Koosman 4.6 1976 40 Jon Matlack 4.1 1976 54 Nino Espinosa 3.5 1977 18 Craig Swan 5.7 1978 31 Craig Swan 4.6 1979 52 Jesse Orosco 3.6 1983 24 Dwight Gooden 5.4 1984 1 Dwight Gooden 11.7 1985 35 Ron Darling 4.4 1985 50 Sid Fernandez 3.7 1985 28 Bob Ojeda 4.7 1986 30 Ron Darling 4.6 1986 34 Dwight Gooden 4.4 1986 45 Dwight Gooden 3.8 1987 16 David Cone 5.8 1988 60 Dwight Gooden 3.3 1988 14 Frank Viola 6.3 1990 49 David Cone 3.7 1990 37 David Cone 4.2 1991 23 Sid Fernandez 5.5 1992 59 David Cone 3.3 1992 48 Dwight Gooden 3.7 1993 25 Bret Saberhagen 5.2 1994 39 Rick Reed 4.1 1997 11 Al Leiter 6.5 1998 38 Rick Reed 4.1 1998 53 Armando Benitez 3.5 1999 27 Al Leiter 4.7 2000 29 Mike Hampton 4.6 2000 56 Kevin Appier 3.4 2001 47 Steve Trachsel 3.7 2003 36 Al Leiter 4.2 2004 22 Pedro Martinez 5.5 2005 12 Johan Santana 6.4 2008 51 Johan Santana 3.6 2009 44 Johan Santana 3.8 2010

batmagadanleadoff Aug 10 2010 10:09 AM Re: You're The General Manager

So look at who's 26th in WAR with the 2d best IP/WAR rate on the chart..... WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.1 25.41 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 5.5 33.64 3 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.2 32.56 4 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.0 31.33 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 4.6 32.25 6 Livan Hernandez/WAS 3.9 38.80 7 Johan Santana/NYM 3.8 42.63 8 Brett Myers/HOU 3.6 43.61 9 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.4 48.24 10 Matt Cain/SF 3.2 48.75 11 Tim Lincecum/SF 3.2 47.40 12 Mat Latos/SD 3.2 40.52 13 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 3.0 44.11 14 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 2.9 48.74 15 Barry Zito/SF 2.9 51.95 16 Cole Hamels/PHI 2.8 52.14 17 Clayton Kershaw/LA 2.6 55.26 18 Jaime Garcia/STL 2.6 46.54 19 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.4 54.17 20 Johnny Cueto/CIN 2.4 56.67 . 25 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.1 48.57 26 Francisco Rodriguez/NYM 2.0 27.67

batmagadanleadoff Aug 10 2010 09:38 PM Re: You're The General Manager

The top 100 Mets pitcher WAR seasons, then ranked according to IP/WAR. Or ... which Mets pitcher seasons might've generated the best Strat-O-Matic cards. An IP/WAR of 40 begins to approach dominance. Not surprisingly, seven of the top 10 IP/WAR seasons were turned in by relief pitchers, who generally pitch at a more intense pace than starters, given that they're not expected to throw more than 30-40 pitches per appearance, if even that many. IP/WAR Rank WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR YEAR IP/WAR 1 53 Armando Benitez 3.5 1999 22.29 2 1 Dwight Gooden 11.7 1985 23.65 3 90 Randy Myers 2.6 1988 26.15 4 43 Tug McGraw 3.9 1972 27.18 5 41 Tug McGraw 4.0 1971 27.75 6 11 Al Leiter 6.5 1998 29.69 7 83 Bob Apodaca 2.8 1975 30.24 8 95 Armando Benitez 2.5 2000 30.40 9 2 Tom Seaver 9.5 1973 30.53 10 52 Jesse Orosco 3.6 1983 30.56 11 4 Jon Matlack 8.6 1974 30.85 12 3 Tom Seaver 9.2 1971 31.12 13 79 Jason Isringhausen 2.9 1995 32.07 14 97 Jesse Orosco 2.5 1986 32.40 15 25 Bret Saberhagen 5.2 1994 34.10 16 6 Tom Seaver 7.6 1969 35.96 17 10 Jerry Koosman 6.7 1969 35.97 18 18 Craig Swan 5.7 1978 36.37 19 5 Tom Seaver 7.7 1975 36.41 20 9 Jon Matlack 6.7 1972 36.42 21 12 Johan Santana 6.4 2008 36.61 22 7 Tom Seaver 7.5 1968 37.07 23 89 Tug McGraw 2.7 1969 37.16 24 8 Jerry Koosman 6.8 1968 38.77 25 23 Sid Fernandez 5.5 1992 39.03 26 13 Tom Seaver 6.4 1967 39.22 27 22 Pedro Martinez 5.5 2005 39.45 28 14 Frank Viola 6.3 1990 39.63 29 16 David Cone 5.8 1988 39.89 30 70 Sid Fernandez 3.0 1993 39.89 31 24 Dwight Gooden 5.4 1984 40.37 32 36 Al Leiter 4.2 2004 41.35 33 20 Tom Seaver 5.7 1974 41.40 34 46 Jim McAndrew 3.8 1972 42.28 35 44 Johan Santana 3.8 2010 42.63 36 27 Al Leiter 4.7 2000 44.26 37 17 Tom Seaver 5.8 1972 45.17 38 42 Carl Willey 4.0 1963 45.75 39 50 Sid Fernandez 3.7 1985 46.04 40 21 Jerry Koosman 5.7 1973 46.14 41 28 Bob Ojeda 4.7 1986 46.24 42 51 Johan Santana 3.6 2009 46.30 43 45 Dwight Gooden 3.8 1987 47.28 44 29 Mike Hampton 4.6 2000 47.32 45 19 Tom Seaver 5.7 1976 47.54 46 67 George Stone 3.1 1973 47.74 47 15 Tom Seaver 6.0 1970 48.44 48 81 Bret Saberhagen 2.8 1993 49.76 49 84 Rick Reed 2.7 2001 49.88 50 39 Rick Reed 4.1 1997 50.81 51 30 Ron Darling 4.6 1986 51.52 52 38 Rick Reed 4.1 1998 51.79 53 26 Jerry Koosman 5.1 1974 51.96 54 33 Jon Matlack 4.6 1973 52.61 55 66 Craig Swan 3.1 1982 53.66 56 32 Jerry Koosman 4.6 1976 53.77 57 55 Dennis Ribant 3.5 1966 53.81 58 31 Craig Swan 4.6 1979 54.64 59 72 Pat Zachry 3.0 1980 54.89 60 47 Steve Trachsel 3.7 2003 55.32 61 37 David Cone 4.2 1991 55.40 62 99 Ed Lynch 2.5 1982 55.73 63 80 Ray Sadecki 2.9 1971 56.32 64 35 Ron Darling 4.4 1985 56.36 65 48 Dwight Gooden 3.7 1993 56.40 66 62 Al Leiter 3.2 2003 56.46 67 34 Dwight Gooden 4.4 1986 56.82 68 54 Nino Espinosa 3.5 1977 57.14 69 49 David Cone 3.7 1990 57.21 70 59 David Cone 3.3 1992 59.60 71 56 Kevin Appier 3.4 2001 60.78 72 64 Dwight Gooden 3.1 1991 61.29 73 71 Sid Fernandez 3.0 1998 62.33 74 57 Jerry Koosman 3.4 1970 62.35 75 91 Jerry Koosman 2.6 1971 63.72 76 74 Galen Cisco 3.0 1964 63.89 77 40 Jon Matlack 4.1 1976 63.90 78 77 Al Leiter 2.9 2001 64.60 79 61 Tom Glavine 3.2 2004 66.35 80 78 Bobby Jones 2.9 1998 67.36 81 63 Sid Fernandez 3.2 1989 68.54 82 58 Roger Craig 3.4 1962 68.63 83 75 Mike Pelfrey 2.9 2008 69.20 84 87 Bob Ojeda 2.7 1988 70.49 85 92 Jim McAndrew 2.6 1970 70.90 86 76 Tom Glavine 2.9 2005 72.87 87 69 Al Jackson 3.1 1962 74.62 88 60 Dwight Gooden 3.3 1988 75.25 89 94 Jae Seo 2.5 2003 75.33 90 68 Gary Gentry 3.1 1969 75.38 91 88 Sid Fernandez 2.7 1986 75.68 92 96 Glendon Rusch 2.5 2000 76.27 93 73 Jack Fisher 3.0 1966 76.67 94 65 Ron Darling 3.1 1988 77.63 95 82 Jerry Koosman 2.8 1977 80.95 96 85 Frank Viola 2.7 1991 85.68 97 86 Dwight Gooden 2.7 1990 86.17 98 93 Roger Craig 2.6 1963 90.77 99 98 Tom Seaver 2.5 1983 92.40 100 100 Jack Fisher 2.5 1965 101.47

batmagadanleadoff Aug 11 2010 09:30 AM Re: You're The General Manager

batmagadanleadoff wrote: The top 100 Mets pitcher WAR seasons, then ranked according to IP/WAR. Or ... which Mets pitcher seasons might've generated the best Strat-O-Matic cards. An IP/WAR of 40 begins to approach dominance. Not surprisingly, seven of the top 10 IP/WAR seasons were turned in by relief pitchers, who generally pitch at a more intense pace than starters, given that they're not expected to throw more than 30-40 pitches per appearance, if even that many. IP/WAR Rank WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR YEAR IP/WAR 1 53 Armando Benitez 3.5 1999 22.29 2 1 Dwight Gooden 11.7 1985 23.65 3 90 Randy Myers 2.6 1988 26.15 4 43 Tug McGraw 3.9 1972 27.18 5 41 Tug McGraw 4.0 1971 27.75 6 11 Al Leiter 6.5 1998 29.69 7 83 Bob Apodaca 2.8 1975 30.24 8 95 Armando Benitez 2.5 2000 30.40 9 2 Tom Seaver 9.5 1973 30.53 10 52 Jesse Orosco 3.6 1983 30.56 11 4 Jon Matlack 8.6 1974 30.85 12 3 Tom Seaver 9.2 1971 31.12 13 79 Jason Isringhausen 2.9 1995 32.07 14 97 Jesse Orosco 2.5 1986 32.40 15 25 Bret Saberhagen 5.2 1994 34.10 16 6 Tom Seaver 7.6 1969 35.96 17 10 Jerry Koosman 6.7 1969 35.97 18 18 Craig Swan 5.7 1978 36.37 19 5 Tom Seaver 7.7 1975 36.41 20 9 Jon Matlack 6.7 1972 36.42 21 12 Johan Santana 6.4 2008 36.61 22 7 Tom Seaver 7.5 1968 37.07 23 89 Tug McGraw 2.7 1969 37.16 24 8 Jerry Koosman 6.8 1968 38.77 25 23 Sid Fernandez 5.5 1992 39.03 26 13 Tom Seaver 6.4 1967 39.22 27 22 Pedro Martinez 5.5 2005 39.45 28 14 Frank Viola 6.3 1990 39.63 29 16 David Cone 5.8 1988 39.89 30 70 Sid Fernandez 3.0 1993 39.89 31 24 Dwight Gooden 5.4 1984 40.37 32 36 Al Leiter 4.2 2004 41.35 33 20 Tom Seaver 5.7 1974 41.40 34 46 Jim McAndrew 3.8 1972 42.28 35 44 Johan Santana 3.8 2010 42.63 36 27 Al Leiter 4.7 2000 44.26 37 17 Tom Seaver 5.8 1972 45.17 38 42 Carl Willey 4.0 1963 45.75 39 50 Sid Fernandez 3.7 1985 46.04 40 21 Jerry Koosman 5.7 1973 46.14 41 28 Bob Ojeda 4.7 1986 46.24 42 51 Johan Santana 3.6 2009 46.30 43 45 Dwight Gooden 3.8 1987 47.28 44 29 Mike Hampton 4.6 2000 47.32 45 19 Tom Seaver 5.7 1976 47.54 46 67 George Stone 3.1 1973 47.74 47 15 Tom Seaver 6.0 1970 48.44 48 81 Bret Saberhagen 2.8 1993 49.76 49 84 Rick Reed 2.7 2001 49.88 50 39 Rick Reed 4.1 1997 50.81 51 30 Ron Darling 4.6 1986 51.52 52 38 Rick Reed 4.1 1998 51.79 53 26 Jerry Koosman 5.1 1974 51.96 54 33 Jon Matlack 4.6 1973 52.61 55 66 Craig Swan 3.1 1982 53.66 56 32 Jerry Koosman 4.6 1976 53.77 57 55 Dennis Ribant 3.5 1966 53.81 58 31 Craig Swan 4.6 1979 54.64 59 72 Pat Zachry 3.0 1980 54.89 60 47 Steve Trachsel 3.7 2003 55.32 61 37 David Cone 4.2 1991 55.40 62 99 Ed Lynch 2.5 1982 55.73 63 80 Ray Sadecki 2.9 1971 56.32 64 35 Ron Darling 4.4 1985 56.36 65 48 Dwight Gooden 3.7 1993 56.40 66 62 Al Leiter 3.2 2003 56.46 67 34 Dwight Gooden 4.4 1986 56.82 68 54 Nino Espinosa 3.5 1977 57.14 69 49 David Cone 3.7 1990 57.21 70 59 David Cone 3.3 1992 59.60 71 56 Kevin Appier 3.4 2001 60.78 72 64 Dwight Gooden 3.1 1991 61.29 73 71 Sid Fernandez 3.0 1998 62.33 74 57 Jerry Koosman 3.4 1970 62.35 75 91 Jerry Koosman 2.6 1971 63.72 76 74 Galen Cisco 3.0 1964 63.89 77 40 Jon Matlack 4.1 1976 63.90 78 77 Al Leiter 2.9 2001 64.60 79 61 Tom Glavine 3.2 2004 66.35 80 78 Bobby Jones 2.9 1998 67.36 81 63 Sid Fernandez 3.2 1989 68.54 82 58 Roger Craig 3.4 1962 68.63 83 75 Mike Pelfrey 2.9 2008 69.20 84 87 Bob Ojeda 2.7 1988 70.49 85 92 Jim McAndrew 2.6 1970 70.90 86 76 Tom Glavine 2.9 2005 72.87 87 69 Al Jackson 3.1 1962 74.62 88 60 Dwight Gooden 3.3 1988 75.25 89 94 Jae Seo 2.5 2003 75.33 90 68 Gary Gentry 3.1 1969 75.38 91 88 Sid Fernandez 2.7 1986 75.68 92 96 Glendon Rusch 2.5 2000 76.27 93 73 Jack Fisher 3.0 1966 76.67 94 65 Ron Darling 3.1 1988 77.63 95 82 Jerry Koosman 2.8 1977 80.95 96 85 Frank Viola 2.7 1991 85.68 97 86 Dwight Gooden 2.7 1990 86.17 98 93 Roger Craig 2.6 1963 90.77 99 98 Tom Seaver 2.5 1983 92.40 100 100 Jack Fisher 2.5 1965 101.47 The top 100 Mets pitcher WAR seasons, in chronological order. IP/WAR Rank WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR YEAR IP/WAR 82 58 Roger Craig 3.4 1962 68.63 87 69 Al Jackson 3.1 1962 74.62 38 42 Carl Willey 4.0 1963 45.75 98 93 Roger Craig 2.6 1963 90.77 76 74 Galen Cisco 3.0 1964 63.89 100 100 Jack Fisher 2.5 1965 101.47 57 55 Dennis Ribant 3.5 1966 53.81 93 73 Jack Fisher 3.0 1966 76.67 26 13 Tom Seaver 6.4 1967 39.22 22 7 Tom Seaver 7.5 1968 37.07 24 8 Jerry Koosman 6.8 1968 38.77 16 6 Tom Seaver 7.6 1969 35.96 17 10 Jerry Koosman 6.7 1969 35.97 90 68 Gary Gentry 3.1 1969 75.38 23 89 Tug McGraw 2.7 1969 37.16 IP/WAR Rank WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR YEAR IP/WAR 47 15 Tom Seaver 6.0 1970 48.44 74 57 Jerry Koosman 3.4 1970 62.35 85 92 Jim McAndrew 2.6 1970 70.90 12 3 Tom Seaver 9.2 1971 31.12 5 41 Tug McGraw 4.0 1971 27.75 63 80 Ray Sadecki 2.9 1971 56.32 75 91 Jerry Koosman 2.6 1971 63.72 20 9 Jon Matlack 6.7 1972 36.42 37 17 Tom Seaver 5.8 1972 45.17 IP/WAR Rank WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR YEAR IP/WAR 4 43 Tug McGraw 3.9 1972 27.18 34 46 Jim McAndrew 3.8 1972 42.28 9 2 Tom Seaver 9.5 1973 30.53 40 21 Jerry Koosman 5.7 1973 46.14 54 33 Jon Matlack 4.6 1973 52.61 46 67 George Stone 3.1 1973 47.74 11 4 Jon Matlack 8.6 1974 30.85 33 20 Tom Seaver 5.7 1974 41.40 53 26 Jerry Koosman 5.1 1974 51.96 19 5 Tom Seaver 7.7 1975 36.41 7 83 Bob Apodaca 2.8 1975 30.24 45 19 Tom Seaver 5.7 1976 47.54 56 32 Jerry Koosman 4.6 1976 53.77 77 40 Jon Matlack 4.1 1976 63.90 68 54 Nino Espinosa 3.5 1977 57.14 95 82 Jerry Koosman 2.8 1977 80.95 18 18 Craig Swan 5.7 1978 36.37 58 31 Craig Swan 4.6 1979 54.64 59 72 Pat Zachry 3.0 1980 54.89 55 66 Craig Swan 3.1 1982 53.66 62 99 Ed Lynch 2.5 1982 55.73 10 52 Jesse Orosco 3.6 1983 30.56 99 98 Tom Seaver 2.5 1983 92.40 31 24 Dwight Gooden 5.4 1984 40.37 2 1 Dwight Gooden 11.7 1985 23.65 64 35 Ron Darling 4.4 1985 56.36 IP/WAR Rank WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR YEAR IP/WAR 39 50 Sid Fernandez 3.7 1985 46.04 41 28 Bob Ojeda 4.7 1986 46.24 51 30 Ron Darling 4.6 1986 51.52 67 34 Dwight Gooden 4.4 1986 56.82 91 88 Sid Fernandez 2.7 1986 75.68 14 97 Jesse Orosco 2.5 1986 32.40 43 45 Dwight Gooden 3.8 1987 47.28 29 16 David Cone 5.8 1988 39.89 88 60 Dwight Gooden 3.3 1988 75.25 94 65 Ron Darling 3.1 1988 77.63 73 71 Sid Fernandez 3.0 1988 62.33 84 87 Bob Ojeda 2.7 1988 70.49 3 90 Randy Myers 2.6 1988 26.15 81 63 Sid Fernandez 3.2 1989 68.54 28 14 Frank Viola 6.3 1990 39.63 69 49 David Cone 3.7 1990 57.21 97 86 Dwight Gooden 2.7 1990 86.17 61 37 David Cone 4.2 1991 55.40 72 64 Dwight Gooden 3.1 1991 61.29 96 85 Frank Viola 2.7 1991 85.68 25 23 Sid Fernandez 5.5 1992 39.03 70 59 David Cone 3.3 1992 59.60 65 48 Dwight Gooden 3.7 1993 56.40 30 70 Sid Fernandez 3.0 1993 39.89 48 81 Bret Saberhagen 2.8 1993 49.76 15 25 Bret Saberhagen 5.2 1994 34.10 13 79 Jason Isringhausen 2.9 1995 32.07 50 39 Rick Reed 4.1 1997 50.81 6 11 Al Leiter 6.5 1998 29.69 52 38 Rick Reed 4.1 1998 51.79 80 78 Bobby Jones 2.9 1998 67.36 1 53 Armando Benitez 3.5 1999 22.29 IP/WAR Rank WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR YEAR IP/WAR 36 27 Al Leiter 4.7 2000 44.26 44 29 Mike Hampton 4.6 2000 47.32 8 95 Armando Benitez 2.5 2000 30.40 92 96 Glendon Rusch 2.5 2000 76.27 71 56 Kevin Appier 3.4 2001 60.78 78 77 Al Leiter 2.9 2001 64.60 49 84 Rick Reed 2.7 2001 49.88 60 47 Steve Trachsel 3.7 2003 55.32 66 62 Al Leiter 3.2 2003 56.46 89 94 Jae Seo 2.5 2003 75.33 32 36 Al Leiter 4.2 2004 41.35 79 61 Tom Glavine 3.22 2004 66.35 27 22 Pedro Martinez 5.5 2005 39.45 86 76 Tom Glavine 2.9 2005 72.87 21 12 Johan Santana 6.4 2008 36.61 83 75 Mike Pelfrey 2.9 2008 69.20 42 51 Johan Santana 3.6 2009 46.30 35 44 Johan Santana 3.8 2010 42.63

batmagadanleadoff Aug 11 2010 10:09 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Who is the only Met pitcher to have pitched two of the 20 all time worst Met pitcher WAR seasons?

Edgy DC Aug 12 2010 07:14 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Jay Hook.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 12 2010 07:48 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Craig Anderson

batmagadanleadoff Aug 12 2010 10:58 AM Re: You're The General Manager

The answer is Oliver Perez. Rank Pitcher WAR YEAR 1 Paul Wilson -2.8 1996 2 Craig Anderson -2.0 1962 3 Randy Jones -1.8 1981 4 Doug Sisk -1.7 1985 5 Jim McAndrew -1.7 1973 6 Aaron Heilman -1.5 2003 7 Cal Koonce -1.5 1969 8 Pete Schourek -1.5 1993 9 Jay Hook -1.5 1963 10 Oliver Perez -1.4 2009 11 Doug Henry -1.4 1996 12 Mike Bruhert -1.4 1978 13 Mike Scott -1.4 1982 14 Chuck Estrada -1.3 1967 15 Calvin Schiraldi -1.3 1985 16 Jason Isringhausen -1.3 1997 17 Rich Rodriguez -1.3 2000 18 Larry Bearnarth -1.3 1965 19 George Stone -1.3 1974 20 Oliver Perez -1.2 2010 21 Jose Lima -1.2 2006 22 Gordon Richardson -1.2 1966 23 Jorge Sosa -1.2 2008 24 Bruce Berenyi -1.2 1986 25 Phil Hennigan -1.2 1973 26 Ray Daviault -1.2 1962 27 Dock Ellis -1.2 1979

Edgy DC Aug 12 2010 11:00 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Looks like Ollie could still get off of that hook.

batmagadanleadoff Aug 13 2010 11:56 AM Re: You're The General Manager

batmagadanleadoff wrote: So look at who's 26th in WAR with the 2d best IP/WAR rate on the chart..... WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.1 25.41 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 5.5 33.64 3 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.2 32.56 4 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.0 31.33 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 4.6 32.25 6 Livan Hernandez/WAS 3.9 38.80 7 Johan Santana/NYM 3.8 42.63 8 Brett Myers/HOU 3.6 43.61 9 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.4 48.24 10 Matt Cain/SF 3.2 48.75 11 Tim Lincecum/SF 3.2 47.40 12 Mat Latos/SD 3.2 40.52 13 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 3.0 44.11 14 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 2.9 48.74 15 Barry Zito/SF 2.9 51.95 16 Cole Hamels/PHI 2.8 52.14 17 Clayton Kershaw/LA 2.6 55.26 18 Jaime Garcia/STL 2.6 46.54 19 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.4 54.17 20 Johnny Cueto/CIN 2.4 56.67 . 25 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.1 48.57 26 Francisco Rodriguez/NYM 2.0 27.67 Johan Santana's making his move on this year's elite pitchers .... Ryan Dempster cracks the top 20 ...... K-Rod still packs a mean wallop WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.1 25.41 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 5.7 32.46 3 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.6 31.49 4 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.0 31.07 5 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.0 31.33 6 Johan Santana/NYM 4.4 38.86 7 Livan Hernandez/WAS 4.0 39.42 8 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.6 47.5 9 Brett Myers/HOU 3.5 44.86 10 Matt Cain/SF 3.4 47.65 11 Mat Latos/SD 3.2 40.52 12 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.2 46.35 13 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 3.0 44.11 14 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.0 48.67 15 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.9 53.68 16 Barry Zito/SF 2.9 54.14 17 Clayton Kershaw/LA 2.8 53.69 18 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.5 52.00 19 Ryan Dempster/CHI 2.5 62.93 20 Jaime Garcia/STL 2.4 52.64 . 26 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 26.83 . 28 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.1 48.57

batmagadanleadoff Aug 14 2010 12:08 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Johan Santana's making his move on this year's elite pitchers .... Ryan Dempster cracks the top 20 ...... K-Rod still packs a mean wallop WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.1 25.41 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 5.7 32.46 3 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.6 31.49 4 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.0 31.07 5 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.0 31.33 6 Johan Santana/NYM 4.4 38.86 7 Livan Hernandez/WAS 4.0 39.42 8 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.6 47.5 9 Brett Myers/HOU 3.5 44.86 10 Matt Cain/SF 3.4 47.65 11 Mat Latos/SD 3.2 40.52 12 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.2 46.35 13 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 3.0 44.11 14 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.0 48.67 15 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.9 53.68 16 Barry Zito/SF 2.9 54.14 17 Clayton Kershaw/LA 2.8 53.69 18 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.5 52.00 19 Ryan Dempster/CHI 2.5 62.93 20 Jaime Garcia/STL 2.4 52.64 . 26 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 26.83 . 28 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.1 48.57 updated through last night: WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 5.7 27.85 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 5.7 32.46 3 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.5 29.94 4 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.5 32.06 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.0 31.07 6 Johan Santana/NYM 4.4 38.86 7 Livan Hernandez/WAS 4.0 39.42 8 Brett Myers/HOU 3.8 43.16 9 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.5 48.86 10 Matt Cain/SF 3.3 49.09 11 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.3 46.67 12 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.2 46.35 13 Mat Latos/SD 3.1 41.83 14 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 3.0 46.44 15 Barry Zito/SF 3.0 52.33 16 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.9 53.68 17 Clayton Kershaw/LA 2.8 53.69 18 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.6 42.69 19 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.5 52.00 20 Ryan Dempster/CHI 2.5 62.93 . 27 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 26.83

batmagadanleadoff Aug 14 2010 10:54 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Mets top 10 ERA+ seasons - starting pitchers only: Rank Pitcher ERA+ YEAR 1 Dwight Gooden 229 1985 2 Tom Seaver 194 1971 3 Tom Seaver 175 1973 4 Al Leiter 170 1998 5 Johan Santana 166 2008 6 R.A. Dickey 166 2010 7 Tom Seaver 165 1969 8 Jerry Koosman 160 1969 9 Bret Saberhagen 153 1994 10 Jon Matlack 149 1974

batmagadanleadoff Aug 19 2010 11:12 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Johan Santana's making his move on this year's elite pitchers .... Ryan Dempster cracks the top 20 ...... K-Rod still packs a mean wallop WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.1 25.41 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 5.7 32.46 3 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.6 31.49 4 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.0 31.07 5 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.0 31.33 6 Johan Santana/NYM 4.4 38.86 7 Livan Hernandez/WAS 4.0 39.42 8 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.6 47.5 9 Brett Myers/HOU 3.5 44.86 10 Matt Cain/SF 3.4 47.65 11 Mat Latos/SD 3.2 40.52 12 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.2 46.35 13 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 3.0 44.11 14 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.0 48.67 15 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.9 53.68 16 Barry Zito/SF 2.9 54.14 17 Clayton Kershaw/LA 2.8 53.69 18 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.5 52.00 19 Ryan Dempster/CHI 2.5 62.93 20 Jaime Garcia/STL 2.4 52.64 . 26 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 26.83 . 28 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.1 48.57 updated through last night: WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 5.7 27.85 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 5.7 32.46 3 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.5 29.94 4 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.5 32.06 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.0 31.07 6 Johan Santana/NYM 4.4 38.86 7 Livan Hernandez/WAS 4.0 39.42 8 Brett Myers/HOU 3.8 43.16 9 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.5 48.86 10 Matt Cain/SF 3.3 49.09 11 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.3 46.67 12 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.2 46.35 13 Mat Latos/SD 3.1 41.83 14 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 3.0 46.44 15 Barry Zito/SF 3.0 52.33 16 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.9 53.68 17 Clayton Kershaw/LA 2.8 53.69 18 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.6 42.69 19 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.5 52.00 20 Ryan Dempster/CHI 2.5 62.93 . 27 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 26.83 Updated through 8/18. No changes in the top 20. Santana drops to 7th. Lincecum clings. WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.0 27.78 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 6.0 32.17 3 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.6 30.65 4 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.6 32.74 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.2 31.41 6 Livan Hernandez/WAS 4.3 38.29 7 Johan Santana/NYM 4.2 42.62 8 Brett Myers/HOU 3.9 43.85 9 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.4 52.06 10 Mat Latos/SD 3.3 41.11 11 Clayton Kershaw/LA 3.3 47.68 12 Matt Cain/SF 3.3 50.91 13 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.2 48.13 14 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.2 48.54 15 Barry Zito/SF 3.0 54.00 16 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.9 46.90 17 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 2.9 48.05 18 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.8 42.62 19 Ryan Dempster/CHI 2.7 60.74 20 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.5 63.73 . 27 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 27.30 . 37 Jonathon Niese/NYM 1.8 73.89

batmagadanleadoff Aug 25 2010 12:41 PM Re: You're The General Manager

.

batmagadanleadoff Aug 25 2010 12:58 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Johan Santana's making his move on this year's elite pitchers .... Ryan Dempster cracks the top 20 ...... K-Rod still packs a mean wallop WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.1 25.41 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 5.7 32.46 3 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.6 31.49 4 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.0 31.07 5 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.0 31.33 6 Johan Santana/NYM 4.4 38.86 7 Livan Hernandez/WAS 4.0 39.42 8 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.6 47.5 9 Brett Myers/HOU 3.5 44.86 10 Matt Cain/SF 3.4 47.65 11 Mat Latos/SD 3.2 40.52 12 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.2 46.35 13 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 3.0 44.11 14 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.0 48.67 15 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.9 53.68 16 Barry Zito/SF 2.9 54.14 17 Clayton Kershaw/LA 2.8 53.69 18 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.5 52.00 19 Ryan Dempster/CHI 2.5 62.93 20 Jaime Garcia/STL 2.4 52.64 . 26 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 26.83 . 28 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.1 48.57 updated through last night: WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 5.7 27.85 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 5.7 32.46 3 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.5 29.94 4 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.5 32.06 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.0 31.07 6 Johan Santana/NYM 4.4 38.86 7 Livan Hernandez/WAS 4.0 39.42 8 Brett Myers/HOU 3.8 43.16 9 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.5 48.86 10 Matt Cain/SF 3.3 49.09 11 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.3 46.67 12 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.2 46.35 13 Mat Latos/SD 3.1 41.83 14 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 3.0 46.44 15 Barry Zito/SF 3.0 52.33 16 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.9 53.68 17 Clayton Kershaw/LA 2.8 53.69 18 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.6 42.69 19 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.5 52.00 20 Ryan Dempster/CHI 2.5 62.93 . 27 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 26.83 Updated through 8/18. No changes in the top 20. Santana drops to 7th. Lincecum clings. WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.0 27.78 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 6.0 32.17 3 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.6 30.65 4 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.6 32.74 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.2 31.41 6 Livan Hernandez/WAS 4.3 38.29 7 Johan Santana/NYM 4.2 42.62 8 Brett Myers/HOU 3.9 43.85 9 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.4 52.06 10 Mat Latos/SD 3.3 41.11 11 Clayton Kershaw/LA 3.3 47.68 12 Matt Cain/SF 3.3 50.91 13 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.2 48.13 14 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.2 48.54 15 Barry Zito/SF 3.0 54.00 16 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.9 46.90 17 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 2.9 48.05 18 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.8 42.62 19 Ryan Dempster/CHI 2.7 60.74 20 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.5 63.73 . 27 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 27.30 . 37 Jonathon Niese/NYM 1.8 73.89 Updated through games of 8/24. The riveting news: Lincecum and Gallardo are out of the top 20; Jaime Garcia and Fla's Anibal Sanchez are in. Memorize the chart. Quiz tomorrow. WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Roy Halladay/PHI 6.6 30.30 2 Josh Johnson/FLA 5.8 29.60 3 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.5 32.30 4 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.5 34.61 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.2 32.56 6 Johan Santana/NYM 4.3 43.49 7 Brett Myers/HOU 4.2 42.38 8 Livan Hernandez/WAS 3.8 44.47 9 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.7 49.82 10 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.6 45.09 11 Matt Cain/SF 3.6 48.89 12 Mat Latos/SD 3.5 40.76 13 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 3.5 43.24 14 Clayton Kershaw/LA 3.4 48.33 15 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.2 51.88 16 Ryan Dempster/CHI 3.0 57.33 17 Jaime Garcia/STL 2.9 48.74 18 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.7 46.79 19 Anibal Sanchez/FLA 2.7 54.94 20 Barry Zito/SF 2.6 63.72 . 27 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 27.30 . 36 Jonathon Niese/NYM 1.9 72.63 . 44 Mike Pelfrey/NYM 1.7 89.22 . 48 Stephen Strasburg/WASH 1.6 42.50

batmagadanleadoff Aug 30 2010 11:34 AM Re: You're The General Manager

Johan Santana's making his move on this year's elite pitchers .... Ryan Dempster cracks the top 20 ...... K-Rod still packs a mean wallop WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.1 25.41 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 5.7 32.46 3 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.6 31.49 4 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.0 31.07 5 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.0 31.33 6 Johan Santana/NYM 4.4 38.86 7 Livan Hernandez/WAS 4.0 39.42 8 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.6 47.5 9 Brett Myers/HOU 3.5 44.86 10 Matt Cain/SF 3.4 47.65 11 Mat Latos/SD 3.2 40.52 12 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.2 46.35 13 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 3.0 44.11 14 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.0 48.67 15 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.9 53.68 16 Barry Zito/SF 2.9 54.14 17 Clayton Kershaw/LA 2.8 53.69 18 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.5 52.00 19 Ryan Dempster/CHI 2.5 62.93 20 Jaime Garcia/STL 2.4 52.64 . 26 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 26.83 . 28 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.1 48.57 updated through last night: WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 5.7 27.85 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 5.7 32.46 3 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.5 29.94 4 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.5 32.06 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.0 31.07 6 Johan Santana/NYM 4.4 38.86 7 Livan Hernandez/WAS 4.0 39.42 8 Brett Myers/HOU 3.8 43.16 9 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.5 48.86 10 Matt Cain/SF 3.3 49.09 11 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.3 46.67 12 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.2 46.35 13 Mat Latos/SD 3.1 41.83 14 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 3.0 46.44 15 Barry Zito/SF 3.0 52.33 16 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.9 53.68 17 Clayton Kershaw/LA 2.8 53.69 18 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.6 42.69 19 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.5 52.00 20 Ryan Dempster/CHI 2.5 62.93 . 27 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 26.83 Updated through 8/18. No changes in the top 20. Santana drops to 7th. Lincecum clings. WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.0 27.78 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 6.0 32.17 3 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.6 30.65 4 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.6 32.74 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.2 31.41 6 Livan Hernandez/WAS 4.3 38.29 7 Johan Santana/NYM 4.2 42.62 8 Brett Myers/HOU 3.9 43.85 9 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.4 52.06 10 Mat Latos/SD 3.3 41.11 11 Clayton Kershaw/LA 3.3 47.68 12 Matt Cain/SF 3.3 50.91 13 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.2 48.13 14 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.2 48.54 15 Barry Zito/SF 3.0 54.00 16 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.9 46.90 17 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 2.9 48.05 18 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.8 42.62 19 Ryan Dempster/CHI 2.7 60.74 20 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.5 63.73 . 27 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 27.30 . 37 Jonathon Niese/NYM 1.8 73.89 Updated through games of 8/24. The riveting news: Lincecum and Gallardo are out of the top 20; Jaime Garcia and Fla's Anibal Sanchez are in. Memorize the chart. Quiz tomorrow. WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Roy Halladay/PHI 6.6 30.30 2 Josh Johnson/FLA 5.8 29.60 3 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.5 32.30 4 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.5 34.61 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.2 32.56 6 Johan Santana/NYM 4.3 43.49 7 Brett Myers/HOU 4.2 42.38 8 Livan Hernandez/WAS 3.8 44.47 9 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.7 49.82 10 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.6 45.09 11 Matt Cain/SF 3.6 48.89 12 Mat Latos/SD 3.5 40.76 13 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 3.5 43.24 14 Clayton Kershaw/LA 3.4 48.33 15 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.2 51.88 16 Ryan Dempster/CHI 3.0 57.33 17 Jaime Garcia/STL 2.9 48.74 18 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.7 46.79 19 Anibal Sanchez/FLA 2.7 54.94 20 Barry Zito/SF 2.6 63.72 . 27 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 27.30 . 36 Jonathon Niese/NYM 1.9 72.63 . 44 Mike Pelfrey/NYM 1.7 89.22 . 48 Stephen Strasburg/WASH 1.6 42.50 Back by popular demand. (through 8/29) Zito the Giant is out; Wilson the Giant is in. Pelfrey moves up 16 spots. WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Roy Halladay/PHI 6.5 31.85 2 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.1 29.13 3 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.9 31.30 4 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.5 35.52 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.4 32.65 6 Brett Myers/HOU 4.5 41.11 7 Johan Santana/NYM 4.3 45.12 8 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.9 43.68 9 Matt Cain/SF 3.9 46.75 10 Mat Latos/SD 3.8 39.39 11 Clayton Kershaw/LA 3.6 47.31 12 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.6 48.33 13 Livan Hernandez/WAS 3.6 48.70 14 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.6 52.87 15 Ryan Dempster/CHI 3.5 51.14 16 Jaime Garcia/STL 3.3 44.44 17 R.A. Dickey/NYM 3.0 44.44 18 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 3.0 51.78 19 Brian Wilson/SF 2.6 22.05 20 Anibal Sanchez/FLA 2.6 58.97 . 27 K-Rod/NYM 2.2 26.06 28 Mike Pelfrey/NYM 2.2 72.58 . 49 Jonathon Niese/NYM 1.6 89.79 . 54 Stephen Strasburg/WASH 1.5 45.33

batmagadanleadoff Sep 04 2010 10:50 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Johan Santana's making his move on this year's elite pitchers .... Ryan Dempster cracks the top 20 ...... K-Rod still packs a mean wallop WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.1 25.41 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 5.7 32.46 3 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.6 31.49 4 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.0 31.07 5 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.0 31.33 6 Johan Santana/NYM 4.4 38.86 7 Livan Hernandez/WAS 4.0 39.42 8 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.6 47.5 9 Brett Myers/HOU 3.5 44.86 10 Matt Cain/SF 3.4 47.65 11 Mat Latos/SD 3.2 40.52 12 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.2 46.35 13 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 3.0 44.11 14 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.0 48.67 15 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.9 53.68 16 Barry Zito/SF 2.9 54.14 17 Clayton Kershaw/LA 2.8 53.69 18 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.5 52.00 19 Ryan Dempster/CHI 2.5 62.93 20 Jaime Garcia/STL 2.4 52.64 . 26 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 26.83 . 28 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.1 48.57 updated through last night: WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 5.7 27.85 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 5.7 32.46 3 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.5 29.94 4 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.5 32.06 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.0 31.07 6 Johan Santana/NYM 4.4 38.86 7 Livan Hernandez/WAS 4.0 39.42 8 Brett Myers/HOU 3.8 43.16 9 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.5 48.86 10 Matt Cain/SF 3.3 49.09 11 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.3 46.67 12 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.2 46.35 13 Mat Latos/SD 3.1 41.83 14 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 3.0 46.44 15 Barry Zito/SF 3.0 52.33 16 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.9 53.68 17 Clayton Kershaw/LA 2.8 53.69 18 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.6 42.69 19 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.5 52.00 20 Ryan Dempster/CHI 2.5 62.93 . 27 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 26.83 Updated through 8/18. No changes in the top 20. Santana drops to 7th. Lincecum clings. WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.0 27.78 2 Roy Halladay/PHI 6.0 32.17 3 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.6 30.65 4 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.6 32.74 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.2 31.41 6 Livan Hernandez/WAS 4.3 38.29 7 Johan Santana/NYM 4.2 42.62 8 Brett Myers/HOU 3.9 43.85 9 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.4 52.06 10 Mat Latos/SD 3.3 41.11 11 Clayton Kershaw/LA 3.3 47.68 12 Matt Cain/SF 3.3 50.91 13 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.2 48.13 14 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.2 48.54 15 Barry Zito/SF 3.0 54.00 16 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 2.9 46.90 17 Yovani Gallardo/MIL 2.9 48.05 18 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.8 42.62 19 Ryan Dempster/CHI 2.7 60.74 20 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.5 63.73 . 27 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 27.30 . 37 Jonathon Niese/NYM 1.8 73.89 Updated through games of 8/24. The riveting news: Lincecum and Gallardo are out of the top 20; Jaime Garcia and Fla's Anibal Sanchez are in. Memorize the chart. Quiz tomorrow. WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Roy Halladay/PHI 6.6 30.30 2 Josh Johnson/FLA 5.8 29.60 3 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.5 32.30 4 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.5 34.61 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.2 32.56 6 Johan Santana/NYM 4.3 43.49 7 Brett Myers/HOU 4.2 42.38 8 Livan Hernandez/WAS 3.8 44.47 9 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.7 49.82 10 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.6 45.09 11 Matt Cain/SF 3.6 48.89 12 Mat Latos/SD 3.5 40.76 13 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 3.5 43.24 14 Clayton Kershaw/LA 3.4 48.33 15 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.2 51.88 16 Ryan Dempster/CHI 3.0 57.33 17 Jaime Garcia/STL 2.9 48.74 18 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.7 46.79 19 Anibal Sanchez/FLA 2.7 54.94 20 Barry Zito/SF 2.6 63.72 . 27 K-Rod/NYM 2.1 27.30 . 36 Jonathon Niese/NYM 1.9 72.63 . 44 Mike Pelfrey/NYM 1.7 89.22 . 48 Stephen Strasburg/WASH 1.6 42.50 Back by popular demand. (through 8/29) Zito the Giant is out; Wilson the Giant is in. Pelfrey moves up 16 spots. WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Roy Halladay/PHI 6.5 31.85 2 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.1 29.13 3 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.9 31.30 4 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.5 35.52 5 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.4 32.65 6 Brett Myers/HOU 4.5 41.11 7 Johan Santana/NYM 4.3 45.12 8 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 3.9 43.68 9 Matt Cain/SF 3.9 46.75 10 Mat Latos/SD 3.8 39.39 11 Clayton Kershaw/LA 3.6 47.31 12 Cole Hamels/PHI 3.6 48.33 13 Livan Hernandez/WAS 3.6 48.70 14 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.6 52.87 15 Ryan Dempster/CHI 3.5 51.14 16 Jaime Garcia/STL 3.3 44.44 17 R.A. Dickey/NYM 3.0 44.44 18 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 3.0 51.78 19 Brian Wilson/SF 2.6 22.05 20 Anibal Sanchez/FLA 2.6 58.97 . 27 K-Rod/NYM 2.2 26.06 28 Mike Pelfrey/NYM 2.2 72.58 . 49 Jonathon Niese/NYM 1.6 89.79 . 54 Stephen Strasburg/WASH 1.5 45.33 Updated through games of 9/3/10. Lincecum rejoins the top 20 at the expense of our own R.A. Dickey, whose last start was his worst in more than two years and easily, Dickey's worst start as a knuckleballer and as a Met. Johan regains the 6th spot with a strong though injury shortened outing. Still, the gap between Santana and this year's elite NL pitchers is considerable, if not mathematically insurmountable. WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Roy Halladay/PHI 6.6 32.42 2 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.1 29.13 3 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.8 33.05 4 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.7 32.34 5 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.5 35.52 6 Johan Santana/NYM 4.6 43.26 7 Brett Myers/HOU 4.5 42.44 8 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 4.3 41.08 9 Cole Hamels/PHI 4.1 44.15 10 Mat Latos/SD 4.0 38.92 11 Matt Cain/SF 4.0 47.98 12 Clayton Kershaw/LA 3.7 47.66 13 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.6 54.81 14 Jaime Garcia/STL 3.5 43.81 15 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 3.1 50.11 16 Livan Hernandez/WAS 3.1 57.96 17 Anibal Sanchez/FLA 3.0 53.44 18 Ryan Dempster/CHI 3.0 60.67 19 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.8 63.81 20 Brian Wilson/SF 2.7 22.35 . 23 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.6 53.59 . 31 K-Rod/NYM 2.2 26.06 . 35 Mike Pelfrey/NYM 2.1 78.41 . 40 Heath Bell/SD 1.8 30.93 . 65 Nelson Figueroa/HOU 1.2 50.28 . 68 Aaron Heilman/ARI 1.1 56.67 . 71 Jonathon Niese/NYM 1.1 134.85

batmagadanleadoff Sep 04 2010 11:01 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Looks like Ollie could still get off of that hook. He might. But over the past three weeks, Ollie has solidified his status as the lone Met pitcher who owns two of the 20 worst WAR seasons in Mets history. His 2010 season is now the 18th worst, up (or down) from 20th worst. Ollie's current contract has to be in the running for worst ever given to a Met: Rank Pitcher WAR YEAR IP/WAR 1 Paul Wilson -2.8 1996 -53.21 2 Craig Anderson -2.0 1962 -65.67 3 Randy Jones -1.8 1981 -32.96 4 Doug Sisk -1.7 1985 -42.94 5 Jim McAndrew -1.7 1973 -47.25 6 Aaron Heilman -1.5 2003 -43.55 7 Cal Koonce -1.5 1969 -55.33 8 Pete Schourek -1.5 1993 -85.55 9 Jay Hook -1.5 1963 -101.78 10 Oliver Perez -1.4 2009 -47.14 11 Doug Henry -1.4 1996 -53.57 12 Mike Bruhert -1.4 1978 -95.48 13 Mike Scott -1.4 1982 -105.00 14 Chuck Estrada -1.3 1967 -16.92 15 Calvin Schiraldi -1.3 1985 -20.26 16 Jason Isringhausen -1.3 1997 -22.82 17 Rich Rodriguez -1.3 2000 -28.46 18 Oliver Perez -1.3 2010 -33.85 19 Larry Bearnarth -1.3 1965 -46.67 20 George Stone -1.3 1974 -59.23

MFS62 Sep 05 2010 08:24 AM Re: You're The General Manager

There must be a lot of work going into those charts. But, how is all that information about players, and years, long past going to help me as General Magager (the title of the thread)? But wasn't this thread was going to be about what we would do to make the club better? Later

batmagadanleadoff Sep 06 2010 01:25 PM Re: You're The General Manager

MFS62 wrote: There must be a lot of work going into those charts. But, how is all that information about players, and years, long past going to help me as General Magager (the title of the thread)? But wasn't this thread was going to be about what we would do to make the club better? Later The original charts took some time. The updates aren't nearly as time-consuming as you suspect. I wrote the code in MS Word and saved it. I also saved any entries for pitchers that dropped out of the top 20 (e.g. Yovani Gallardo), should they drop back in. So updating the charts is simply a matter of shuffling the order of the entries and updating some stats. I don't need to write any more code.

batmagadanleadoff Sep 09 2010 01:31 PM Re: You're The General Manager

WAR Rank Pitcher/Team WAR IP/WAR 1 Roy Halladay/PHI 6.7 32.99 2 Josh Johnson/FLA 6.3 29.15 3 Tim Hudson/ATL 5.7 34.74 4 Ubaldo Jimenez/COL 5.6 33.99 5 Adam Wainwright/STL 5.3 37.80 6 Brett Myers/HOU 4.8 41.25 7 Cole Hamels/PHI 4.6 40.87 8 Johan Santana/NYM 4.6 43.26 9 Mat Latos/SD 4.4 36.97 10 Roy Oswalt/HOU-PHI 4.2 43.73 11 Clayton Kershaw/LA 3.9 47.01 12 Chris Carpenter/STL 3.9 52.48 13 Matt Cain/SF 3.7 51.17 14 Ted Lilly/CHIC-LAD 3.3 49.19 15 Livan Hernandez/WAS 3.2 58.13 16 Jaime Garcia/STL 3.1 50.75 17 Brian Wilson/SF 2.9 21.84 18 R.A. Dickey/NYM 2.8 51.90 19 Jonathan Sanchez/SF 2.8 58.81 20 Tim Lincecum/SF 2.8 66.19 21 Johnny Cueto/CIN 2.7 60.86 22 Ian Kennedy/ARI 2.7 64.08 23 Claudio Guzman/LA 2.7 66.81 24 Anibal Sanchez/FLA 2.6 63.21 27 Billy Wagner/ATL 2.3 25.22 30 K-Rod/NYM 2.2 26.06 34 Heath Bell/SD 2.1 27.78 40 Brandon Lyon/HOU 1.9 35.26 41 Ross Ohlendorf/PITT 1.9 57.02 42 Barry Zito/SF 1.9 94.91 43 Chico Mecoatl/PRP 1.8 99.93 52 Stephen Strasburg/WASH 1.5 45.33 57 Mike Pelfrey/NYM 1.6 105.21 59 Madison Bumgarner/SF 1.5 57.56 65 Nelson Figueroa/HOU 1.3 50.26 79 Hisanori Takahashi/NYM 1.0 110.00 80 Jonathon Niese/NYM 1.0 154.33

John Cougar Lunchbucket Sep 09 2010 01:35 PM Re: You're The General Manager

I'm glad I drafted CHICO MECOATL of the Puerto Rico Pisstakers for my fantasy team.

batmagadanleadoff Sep 09 2010 01:36 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Just checking to see if anybody here actually reads this thread anymore. That's the Port Ruppert Mundys, though.

batmagadanleadoff Sep 09 2010 07:23 PM Re: You're The General Manager

Eeeeep.

batmagadanleadoff Oct 03 2010 09:52 PM Re: You're The General Manager

The top 50 Mets pitching WAR seasons, all-time, in chronological order. Despite missing the last month of this season, Johan's 2010 ranks as 34th best Met season ever, displacing Jesse Orosco's fabulous 1983 campaign from the Mets top 50. R.A. Dickey misses the top 50 by a few knuckles, checking in at 56th all time best Met pitching WAR. Rank Pitcher/Team WAR YEAR IP/WAR 43 Carl Willey 4.0 1963 45.75 13 Tom Seaver 6.4 1967 39.22 7 Tom Seaver 7.5 1968 37.07 8 Jerry Koosman 6.8 1968 38.77 6 Tom Seaver 7.6 1969 35.96 9 Jerry Koosman 6.7 1969 35.97 15 Tom Seaver 6.0 1970 48.44 3 Tom Seaver 9.2 1971 31.12 42 Tug McGraw 4.0 1971 27.75 10 Jon Matlack 6.7 1972 36.42 17 Tom Seaver 5.8 1972 45.17 44 Tug McGraw 3.9 1972 27.18 45 Jim McAndrew 3.8 1972 42.28 2 Tom Seaver 9.5 1973 30.53 20 Jerry Koosman 5.7 1973 46.14 31 Jon Matlack 4.6 1973 52.61 4 Jon Matlack 8.6 1974 30.85 19 Tom Seaver 5.7 1974 41.40 26 Jerry Koosman 5.1 1974 51.96 5 Tom Seaver 7.7 1975 36.41 21 Tom Seaver 5.7 1976 48.39 32 Jerry Koosman 4.6 1976 53.77 41 Jon Matlack 4.1 1976 63.90 18 Craig Swan 5.7 1978 36.37 33 Craig Swan 4.6 1979 54.64 24 Dwight Gooden 5.4 1984 40.37 1 Dwight Gooden 11.7 1985 23.65 35 Ron Darling 4.4 1985 56.36 47 Sid Fernandez 3.7 1985 46.04 28 Bob Ojeda 4.7 1986 46.24 30 Ron Darling 4.6 1986 51.52 36 Dwight Gooden 4.4 1986 56.82 46 Dwight Gooden 3.8 1987 47.28 16 David Cone 5.8 1988 39.89 14 Frank Viola 6.3 1990 39.63 50 David Cone 3.7 1990 57.21 38 David Cone 4.2 1991 55.40 22 Sid Fernandez 5.5 1992 39.03 49 Dwight Gooden 3.7 1993 56.40 25 Bret Saberhagen 5.2 1994 34.10 39 Rick Reed 4.1 1997 50.81 11 Al Leiter 6.5 1998 29.69 40 Rick Reed 4.1 1998 51.79 27 Al Leiter 4.7 2000 44.26 29 Mike Hampton 4.6 2000 47.32 48 Steve Trachsel 3.7 2003 55.32 37 Al Leiter 4.2 2004 41.35 23 Pedro Martinez 5.5 2005 39.45 12 Johan Santana 6.4 2008 36.61 34 Johan Santana 4.4 2010 45.23 �. 56 R.A. Dickey 3.4 2010 51.27

[ashie62]

Lou Brock is in the hall of Fame...Jose Reyes is a pimple on his ass for now

[Guest Edgy DC]

Ashie62 wrote: I see your point, but isn't it ultimately about the fans.

It's not about giving them blood nor instant gratification. A five-game winning streak and they'll get over the bloodlust.

It's ultimately about putting on a good successful performance. There's always a market for that.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Ashie62 wrote: Lou Brock is in the hall of Fame...Jose Reyes is a pimple on his ass for now

Lou Brock is also 70. (Holy shit! 70!) I don't think he's going to win that one.

I don't know what makes Reyes a pimple, but I've got to wonder why you so often want to get rid of everyone.

[ashie62]

LWFS Says Reyes is as valuable as Brock was ? Is that a joke.

Right now Brock could take him in the 40

As far as getting rid of people I did post the 2010 Mets will likely resemble the 2008-2009 team.

Yes, I would like to see Manuel & Minaya gone based on performance...