FAKE NEWS - Payroll 2018

[Centerfield]

I think the article accomplished a lot.

Sure, there is plenty of offseason left and there are plenty of good options still on the board. But that's why the article needed to come when it did. To have any chance to spur activity. It may not amount to anything, but at least he (and we) tried.

You may not have learned much, but at least the message is out there. The Wilpons are at fault. It's something we all knew, but it's different to put that message out there in black and white. It also served to show who supports that message, and who elects to turn a blind eye. It was, by far, the single most popular Mets column written this post season. And it wasn't even close. You either rallied around it, or ignored it.

There are so many guys out there that purport to be the voice of the Mets fan. Metsblog. The 7 Line Army. All the beat writers. After Carig's article, if a reporter/blogger/fan group leader ignores this, it's intentional. And we learn something about that individual.

It's just one article and by itself it won't accomplish anything. But maybe it spurs another article, or a movement on Twitter, with more voices joining in. And maybe those voices become a chorus, and maybe that chorus becomes deafening until MLB has no choice but to do something.

Who knows. But I have to try.

[G-Fafif]

Darren Meenan, not endeavoring to be the Voice of the Fan:

https://the7line.com/blogs/the-7-line/im-not-the-voice-of-mets-fans-root-how-you-want-to

Nor would anybody in his Wright mind. Rooting for the same team does not (as we continually and colorfully remind one another here) confer agreement on its details.

[nymr83]

I agree 1000% with Darren's sentiments.

[Centerfield]

G-Fafif wrote: Darren Meenan, not endeavoring to be the Voice of the Fan: https://the7line.com/blogs/the-7-line/im-not-the-voice-of-mets-fans-root-how-you-want-to Nor would anybody in his Wright mind. Rooting for the same team does not (as we continually and colorfully remind one another here) confer agreement on its details.

Their motto is "For the Fans, By the Fans". They sell merchandise under the premises that they are not MLB, or the Wilpons, but rather, one of us. The fans. And whether you think the Wilpons are right, or wrong, the payroll issue is front and center to this team. When they ignore it, it's no accident. Have an issue with the Wilpons? Say so! Think the Wilpons are totally justified? Happy to hear them explain why. But ignore the issue completely because they get a nice little kiosk in CitiField? Sure, no one can tell them what to do with their blog or their business. But just as they are not obligated to do anything they don't think is appropriate, I am free to draw conclusions about them.

And no, no one has to address any one particular issue, no matter how pervasive. But they danced ever so close with the Brian Erni "I'm frustrated" article last week. He vented his frustration and directed it at Alderson. The name "Wilpon" never showed up. That was intentional, and self-serving.

Personally, I think they should change their motto to "For the Fans, By Fans Who Have a Financial Interest in Staying in the Good Graces of Ownership"

[Benjamin Grimm]

I don't really pay any attention to them. Have they never made a shirt that's at all snarky or sarcastic about the Mets? I'm guessing they haven't.

[Centerfield]

Benjamin Grimm wrote: I don't really pay any attention to them. Have they never made a shirt that's at all snarky or sarcastic about the Mets? I'm guessing they haven't.

It's funny you should ask. Way back in 2011, before their nice cozy deal with the Mets, the 7 Line became famous for this t-shirt.



I'm sure it's just a coincidence that they are fine with the Wilpons now.

[Benjamin Grimm]

And six years later, that sentiment is as valid as ever.

[Guest 41Forever]

Centerfield wrote: I think the article accomplished a lot. Sure, there is plenty of offseason left and there are plenty of good options still on the board. But that's why the article needed to come when it did. To have any chance to spur activity. It may not amount to anything, but at least he (and we) tried. You may not have learned much, but at least the message is out there. The Wilpons are at fault. It's something we all knew, but it's different to put that message out there in black and white. It also served to show who supports that message, and who elects to turn a blind eye. It was, by far, the single most popular Mets column written this post season. And it wasn't even close. You either rallied around it, or ignored it. There are so many guys out there that purport to be the voice of the Mets fan. Metsblog. The 7 Line Army. All the beat writers. After Carig's article, if a reporter/blogger/fan group leader ignores this, it's intentional. And we learn something about that individual. It's just one article and by itself it won't accomplish anything. But maybe it spurs another article, or a movement on Twitter, with more voices joining in. And maybe those voices become a chorus, and maybe that chorus becomes deafening until MLB has no choice but to do something. Who knows. But I have to try.

I would think there is zero chance that MLB will do something, especially to a club that has just been to the postseason in two of the last three years and was devastated by injuries last season. If the league isn't stepping in as Jeter is destroying what is left of the Marlins' fan base, it's not stepping in because Mets fans are disgruntled with ownership for not being active enough.

What I do see as a glaring problem with the Mets is the team's communications efforts. I have no idea who is advising the team in this area, or if there is an overall strategy or whether Sandy is just out there winging it. I think the last time Fred spoke to the media, he stepped in it a couple times -- David Wright isn't a superstar, Reyes not going to get Carl Crawford money -- and is probably gun shy or thinks he doesn't need the headache.

If I were advising them, I'd make Jeff available to a couple of the higher-profile writers. Not a press conference where you get pounded by reporters trying to outdo each other, but a sit-down with some of the big guys. Work with him to stay positive but also humanize himself a little. Speak from the heart. Tell us why the team means something to him and why he has the best job in the nation. Teach him to pivot of the questions go to places where you don't want to go.

It's OK to say that they'll never spend like the Yankees because no one can spend like the Yankees. There are a ton of reasons for him to speak optimistically. The team has two stud starters, very exciting young players in Conforto and Rosario, a colorful slugger in Cespedes, a new, young manager who is excited to be here, and a nice stadium that is still less than 10 years old. This is not the Mets of 1978. That was despair!

What they don't seem to understand is that saying nothing is rarely the best option. Stuff is going to be written whether you speak to the media or not. And, as we are seeing, the stuff that gets written when you are not communicating is not the stuff you want to see. So you might as well be out there a bit.

Show your customers that you care -- even though the roster in April is what we care about, not the roster in December.

Edited December 18, 2017 by Guest

[Guest d'Kong76]

41Forever wrote: If I were advising them, I'd make Jeff available to a couple of the higher-profile writers.

Not sure, but I think I just had one of those aneurysm things.

[Centerfield]

Benjamin Grimm wrote: And six years later, that sentiment is as valid as ever.

Not if your Darren Meenan. Today, he feels like this is an issue that should be decided by the voters of Alabama.

[Guest 41Forever]

d'Kong76 wrote: 41Forever wrote: If I were advising them, I'd make Jeff available to a couple of the higher-profile writers. Not sure, but I think I just had one of those aneurysm things.

Not saying it would be easy. But if he's going to be the guy running the team, he should be out there a little.

When the Cubs had a new owner -- and his name escapes me -- and the team was still awful, the new owner walked around the upper deck talking to fans and handing kids little spongy baseballs. I spoke to him briefly and he was nice. Certainly gives the fans a nice impression.

It wouldn't hurt the Mets to have the Wilpons do something along those lines. Have Jeff sit with the Seven Line for an inning. Shake hands and pose for some selfies at the old Home Run Apple. Anything that shows the fans that the owners are listening.

M. Donald Grant supposedly once said something like, "They players aren't the Mets. Mrs. Payson and I are the Mets." The Wilpons need to show that they aren't the current version of M. Donald Grant, who didn't realize that the game had long passed him by.

[Centerfield]

41Forever wrote: 41Forever wrote: If I were advising them, I'd make Jeff available to a couple of the higher-profile writers. Not sure, but I think I just had one of those aneurysm things. Not saying it would be easy. But if he's going to be the guy running the team, he should be out there a little. When the Cubs had a new owner -- and his name escapes me -- and the team was still awful, the new owner walked around the upper deck talking to fans and handing kids little spongy baseballs. I spoke to him briefly and he was nice. Certainly gives the fans a nice impression. It wouldn't hurt the Mets to have the Wilpons do something along those lines. Have Jeff sit with the Seven Line for an inning. Shake hands and pose for some selfies at the old Home Run Apple. Anything that shows the fans that the owners are listening. M. Donald Grant supposedly once said something like, "They players aren't the Mets. Mrs. Payson and I are the Mets." The Wilpons need to show that they aren't the current version of M. Donald Grant, who didn't realize that the game had long passed him by.

I feel like this is a very Republican approach to a real problem. Do nothing to solve the problem, but engage in some PR to make it seem like you care.

Appease them a bit. The public is too dumb to notice that nothing changed.

[Guest d'Kong76]

The very notion that Jeff is running things has been the worst-case-
scenario nightmare for seemingly two decades. Now you want him
to speak? I need to call 911...

[Guest 41Forever]

Centerfield wrote: 41Forever wrote: 41Forever wrote: If I were advising them, I'd make Jeff available to a couple of the higher-profile writers. Not sure, but I think I just had one of those aneurysm things. Not saying it would be easy. But if he's going to be the guy running the team, he should be out there a little. When the Cubs had a new owner -- and his name escapes me -- and the team was still awful, the new owner walked around the upper deck talking to fans and handing kids little spongy baseballs. I spoke to him briefly and he was nice. Certainly gives the fans a nice impression. It wouldn't hurt the Mets to have the Wilpons do something along those lines. Have Jeff sit with the Seven Line for an inning. Shake hands and pose for some selfies at the old Home Run Apple. Anything that shows the fans that the owners are listening. M. Donald Grant supposedly once said something like, "They players aren't the Mets. Mrs. Payson and I are the Mets." The Wilpons need to show that they aren't the current version of M. Donald Grant, who didn't realize that the game had long passed him by. I feel like this is a very Republican approach to a real problem. Do nothing to solve the problem, but engage in some PR to make it seem like you care. Appease them a bit. The public is too dumb to notice that nothing changed.

I thought you were saying that the problem was that the team wasn't transparent enough. I was focusing on the communication problem. Just my 2 cents. Feel free to disagree.

And I know you have to throw the elbow in there, but trust me, both sides of the aisle have communications teams to handle public relations.

[Guest 41Forever]

d'Kong76 wrote: The very notion that Jeff is running things has been the worst-case- scenario nightmare for seemingly two decades. Now you want him to speak? I need to call 911...

Well, Jeff or whomever is running the show. Someone needs to be talking.

[Centerfield]

Statements like this are really what I'm alluding to:

41Forever wrote: Teach him to pivot if the questions go to places where you don't want to go. Have Jeff sit with the Seven Line for an inning. Shake hands and pose for some selfies at the old Home Run Apple. Anything that shows the fans that the owners are listening.

Never do you say that Jeff Wilpon should address the payroll. Explain why the Mets are hamstrung. Be honest, and provide the fans with an X year plan out of this mess.

Pivot off the tough questions. Kiss a few babies and shake a few hands. That should appease the unwashed masses. They won't even notice Jose Reyes starting at 2B.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

The Wilpons have proven over and over again that taking "their side of the story" to the media only serves to expose them for the vapid ignoramuses they are. They don't how to talk to fans, they're afraid of alienating the masses by playing to the hardcores, and if they're honest to what *they* believe they'll say they think they know what they're doing and understand the fan base and that has no chance of ringing true with the JC Lunchbuckets out there.

They should answer questions from veteran reporters though but I think fans expecting to hear anything more than "It's a private process we address on a case-by-case basis" are fooling themselves.

Their sin is not transparency or cheapness. It's incompetence!

[Guest d'Kong76]

41Forever wrote: Someone needs to be talking.

No, someone needs to be spending.

[Guest 41Forever]

Centerfield wrote: Statements like this are really what I'm alluding to: 41Forever wrote: Teach him to pivot if the questions go to places where you don't want to go. Have Jeff sit with the Seven Line for an inning. Shake hands and pose for some selfies at the old Home Run Apple. Anything that shows the fans that the owners are listening. Never do you say that Jeff Wilpon should address the payroll. Explain why the Mets are hamstrung. Be honest, and provide the fans with an X year plan out of this mess. Pivot off the tough questions. Kiss a few babies and shake a few hands. That should appease the unwashed masses. They won't even notice Jose Reyes starting at 2B.

You misunderstood and maybe I wasn’t clear. You have to address fair questions. You pivot from bad questions, not bad topics. He should explain the payroll and the team’s challenges.

[Guest d'Kong76]

They're not running for office or reporting to their constituency! They're in for life.

[batmagadanleadoff]

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: The Wilpons ... don't how to talk to fans .... Their sin is not transparency or cheapness. It's incompetence!

It's both. The Wilpons probably secretly loathe us, hold us in contempt. We're just peasants to them with some money for them to separate from us. Just dig out that video of Jeff in perpetual sourpuss face telling the media that it's none of their business because the Mets are a privately held company. Real smooth move there. Guanranteed to endear himself to us paupers.

Centerfield wrote: Benjamin Grimm wrote: And six years later, that sentiment is as valid as ever. Not if your Darren Meenan. Today, he feels like this is an issue that should be decided by the voters of Alabama.

Yeah, that 7Line statement was utter bullshit. If you know that the Mets are permitting him to use their logos and trademarks, and that the Mets could probably take back those rights on a whim, then you know he's not gonna bite the hand that feeds him. He's just threading the needle.

41Forever wrote: If I were advising them, I'd make Jeff available to a couple of the higher-profile writers.... Teach him to pivot [if] the questions go to places where you don't want to go. It's OK to say that they'll never spend like the Yankees because no one can spend like the Yankees.

Spoken like a sleazy politician. Teach Jeff to pivot, i.e., to change the topic, to engage in conversationalist sleight of hand, to bullshit. Because the fans are as dumb as those goobers who're still waiting for their old $50/hr. factory jobs to come back. They'll believe anything. And why can't the Mets spend like the Yankees without incurring any blame for that shortcoming? What? Is Betsy Devos donating hundreds of millions of dollars to the Yankees, too? Not only do the Mets not spend like the Yankees, they're barely outspending the Mariners and the Royals. The Royals, ferchrissakes!

Edited December 18, 2017 by Guest

[Guest 41Forever]

d'Kong76 wrote: They're not running for office or reporting to their constituency! They're in for life.

But it’s a business and they should be trying to keep their customers reasonably happy. That's what M Donald Grant learned the hard way.

I’m just saying that if I were working for them, i’d Suggest a different approach.

[Gwreck]

This is the fourth consecutive offseason in which the Mets have enough pitching to legitimately compete but have failed to upgrade offense.

The last time the Mets signed a free agent to upgrade offense was Curtis. Note that the Cespedes signings were not upgrades. They were retaining an existing asset.

The Mets haven’t ranked as one of the top 5 offenses in the National League since 2006-08 - not coincidentally the best 3 consecutive seasons the team has had this millennium.

Now, they have dirt cheap starting pitching up the wazoo (yes, with obvious health caveats) and they are running the risk of a fourth consecutive offseason in which no offensive upgrades have been made.

My take is that Alderson does the best he can but nothing gets better without new ownership.

[batmagadanleadoff]

Gwreck wrote: My take is that Alderson does the best he can but nothing gets better without new ownership.

I think this is obvious. Alderson is a great GM who enters every off-season with both hands tied behind his back, and having to take most of the considerable heat because he has to provide cover for the fucking incompetent Wilpons, while a good chunk of whatever revenue there is, not that we know how much there is, pays back the Madoff debt. Even Howie Megdal gave up.

[Guest d'Kong76]

41Forever wrote: they should be trying to keep their customers reasonably happy.

Having Jeff meet with a few reporters isn't going to make anyone happy.

[Edgy MD]

Gwreck wrote: \The last time the Mets signed a free agent to upgrade offense was Curtis. Note that the Cespedes signings were not upgrades. They were retaining an existing asset.

That's one way to look at it. But I would add Asdrubal Cabrera and Michael Cuddyer at least, though the latter was unsuccessful.

As for needing a guy to direct them on media relations, they got one. He's kinda old and flies with Lefty Specialist and likes to dial with his butt.

[ashie62]

Centerfield wrote: Benjamin Grimm wrote: I don't really pay any attention to them. Have they never made a shirt that's at all snarky or sarcastic about the Mets? I'm guessing they haven't. It's funny you should ask. Way back in 2011, before their nice cozy deal with the Mets, the 7 Line became famous for this t-shirt. I'm sure it's just a coincidence that they are fine with the Wilpons now.

I don't give a rat about the 7-Line. I and many here precede them.

At this point I'd say they have a conflict of interest.. They are serving two masters. It dont work. Bollocks.

NOW GET YELICH!

[Guest cooby]

It's both. The Wilpons probably secretly loathe us, hold us in contempt. We're just peasants to them with some money for them to separate from us. Just dig out that video of Jeff in perpetual sourpuss face telling the media that it's none of their business because the Mets are a privately held company. Real smooth move there. Guanranteed to endear himself to us paupers.

Sourpuss mode is right!! BS they are private!

We need an insurrection!

[nymr83]

Ashie62 wrote: Centerfield wrote: Benjamin Grimm wrote: I don't really pay any attention to them. Have they never made a shirt that's at all snarky or sarcastic about the Mets? I'm guessing they haven't. It's funny you should ask. Way back in 2011, before their nice cozy deal with the Mets, the 7 Line became famous for this t-shirt. I'm sure it's just a coincidence that they are fine with the Wilpons now. I don't give a rat about the 7-Line. I and many here precede them. At this point I'd say they have a conflict of interest.. They are serving two masters. It dont work. Bollocks. NOW GET YELICH!

yeah, go give up lots of talent in a trade to get a player at the only positions (either corner outfield spot) where the Mets are pretty much set. that'll solve something.

[Centerfield]

Doesn’t he play CF? Did I make that up?