Trade Jay Bruce

[Centerfield]

Make your best offer for Jay Bruce. Act now! Supplies will not last!

[Benjamin Grimm]

There were those rumors a while back that the Blue Jays were interested (possibly because his name is Jay) but never anything that I saw about what Toronto would offer.

I'd like to see them get someone who'll help in 2017, but a decent prospect would be okay too. I just hope it's a package at least as good as Max Wotell and Dilson Herrera.

[Frayed Knot]

Both Bruce & Grandy are on one-year contracts at this point and are kinda/sorta the same player, giving Sandy the luxury of going to the winter meetings next week and fielding offers for either one of them.

And if the meetings get delayed on account of the CBA negotiations breaking down then he could just put an ad in CraigsList:

Have two (2) 30+ corner OFs who can play some CF in a pinch -- LH stick -- good power/low-BA -- not GG material but not terrible fielders either
Interesting trades considered. Will accept best offer for either/or.
Call 617-I AM-Mets and ask for Sandy or leave message with John R. (but if 'Jeff' answers, hang up)

[nymr83]

Frayed Knot wrote: (but if 'Jeff' answers, hang up)

ha!

[ashie62]

Pitching, pitching and more pitching please!

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

This is one of those situations where I'm already convinced the guy we don't trade will either suck, get badly hurt, or both next year.

[Centerfield]

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: This is one of those situations where I'm already convinced the guy we don't trade will either suck, get badly hurt, or both next year.

You called the right guy on Duda/Davis. I think you should make this call as well.

[Frayed Knot]

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: This is one of those situations where I'm already convinced the guy we don't trade will either suck, get badly hurt, or both next year.

Then we better trade the other one.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

Centerfield wrote: John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: This is one of those situations where I'm already convinced the guy we don't trade will either suck, get badly hurt, or both next year. You called the right guy on Duda/Davis. I think you should make this call as well.

I think Grandy's a better player, a little, but see Bruce as potentially more useful if we lost Doodoo again since I think he's also a first baseman.

In the WAPT thread I had an idea for a homecoming for Grandy

[Ceetar]

Well Granderson has 43.9 career fWAR to Bruce's 17.5. Granderson's career wRC+ is 118, Bruce's is 107.

If you don't believe in Conforto you can make the case that Bruce should play over him, but not over Granderson under any circumstances. There is literally no place for Bruce on this team that helps them.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

Of course I wasn't comparing their whole careers, just what can be expected next year, and that ought to be a much closer race.

Perhaps the CBA includes a surprise provision for NL DHs starting immediately. That would be a good situation for us.

[Guest d'Kong76]

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Perhaps the CBA includes a surprise provision for NL DHs starting immediately.

shudder

[Frayed Knot]

Ceetar wrote: Well Granderson has 43.9 career fWAR to Bruce's 17.5. Granderson's career wRC+ is 118, Bruce's is 107.

Granderson is also six years older with 2,000 more ML PAs in his rearview.

[Ceetar]

Frayed Knot wrote: Ceetar wrote: Well Granderson has 43.9 career fWAR to Bruce's 17.5. Granderson's career wRC+ is 118, Bruce's is 107. Granderson is also six years older with 2,000 more ML PAs in his rearview.

bet he has more in his front view too.

Curtis was worth almost 2 fWAR more last year, and it was only close offensively because he had a down year and Bruce had an up year.

They're not in the same class, not even with the age factored in.

[Benjamin Grimm]

I do think that Jay Bruce probably has more production ahead of him than Granderson does, but we're not talking about the remainder of their careers, just about 2017, and I think I'd rather have Granderson in 2017 than Bruce.

And Bruce, as the younger player, may conceivably have more trade value (depending on the perspective of the trading partner), but that's just speculation.

[Vic Sage]

Granderson is NOT coming off a down year, nor Bruce off an up year. Granderson was at or above his average Mets production in most categories, with the most HRs he's hit since he played for the Yankmees. While Bruce's year was better than his previous 2 seasons (due to a good first 1/2), it was significantly less productive than his prior 4 years. Plus Granderson will be 36 and Bruce 30.

That being said, i'd rather keep Grandy.

[Elster88]

Can we keep both in case one gets hurt and/or sucks?

Downsides of that idea could be: too much money, blocks a younger player, the guy assigned to the bench gets annoyed, something else?

[Frayed Knot]

Well the idea is that while you don't HAVE to trade either one, the fact that the two are somewhat redundant means either/or could be trade bait in an attempt to fill a hole elsewhere.
And if we're all convinced that Granderson is going to be the better player next year well then that also makes him the more valuable chip.


The Puma chimes in from the Post : The Mets continue to listen to offers for Bruce, whose $13 million option for 2017 was picked up largely as an insurance policy against Cespedes’ departure. But the Mets also haven’t ruled out the possibility of keeping Bruce and trading Curtis Granderson to create outfield space.

[bmfc1]

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/lets-fix-the-mets-outfield/
Interesting column suggesting trading Conforto rather than Bruce.

[Guest d'Kong76]

They can't trade Conforto... he's gonna be huge. Huge, I tell ya.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

The only thing Jay Bruce does that's of any value to a baseball team is hit home runs, throw half-decently (though that's fading, quickly) and wear a glove (though he doesn't wield it especially well).

Granderson does all that, walks, and plays some center. And he actually provides SOME marginal value when not hitting. They are NOT the same player.

[Frayed Knot]

Taking the 'same player' label a bit too literally perhaps? ... especially considering that they're both LH-hitting mostly corner OFs with power, low-BAs, and high K-rates.

2013 - 2016 stats:
BA: CG - .240, JB = .240
OBA: CG = .339 OBA; JB = .305 -- So, yeah, Grandy walks significantly more although maybe that's partly due to his leadoff role w/NYM
XBHs/IsoP: CG = 193 / .193 IsoP; JB = 245 / .210 -- Bruce had about 300 more ABs (due to Grandy missing a chunk of 2013) but his power rate is higher too

Grandy runs better, Bruce throws MUCH better, and I'd call the gloves a wash unless they're planning on using Grandy in CF

I'm not going to argue against those who prefer Granderson, I just don't the gap is that huge and I think we may be a bit jaded by JB's bad first impression as if that's all he's ever been/ever will be.
Tack onto the equation about whether the 36 y/o or the 30 y/o is more likely to see a decline and it melts away even more.

I'm just saying that they're so much like the same player that it makes sense not to keep both. I don't care which they deal, but it makes sense to dangle both to see who bites.
And, like I said, if Granderson truly is the better player than he'd likely get the better player back in a trade too.

[Edgy MD]

Both Bruce & Grandy are on one-year contracts at this point and are kinda/sorta the same player, giving Sandy the luxury of going to the winter meetings next week and fielding offers for either one of them. And if the meetings get delayed on account of the CBA negotiations breaking down then he could just put an ad in CraigsList: Have two (2) 30+ corner OFs who can play some CF in a pinch -- LH stick -- good power/low-BA -- not GG material but not terrible fielders either Interesting trades considered. Will accept best offer for either/or. Call 617-I AM-Mets and ask for Sandy or leave message with John R. (but if 'Jeff' answers, hang up)

I have no doubt that there's a heavily secured MLB GM forum site where executives do this exact sort of bidding.

Need: LH relievers (seriously!)
Have: Surplus of secondbasemen

Hit me up! Let's make a deal!

And it will be hacked in the next year or two. Heck, Snowden probably already has.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

What I'm saying is, Bruce gives you so little else outside of DONGERSDINGERSDONGERS that even in a 40-HR year, he's barely worth starting. For serious! (AND his arm's kinda shit now, too. For seriouser! Check )

Granderson and Bruce are similar at a glance, but Granderson always has been a better baseball player, in almost every way. (AND he's always walked more, which is pretty damn valuable, regardless of whether he's leading off.) If you can get someone to pay you anything remotely interesting for Country Strong, you do it. Never mind Grandy-- half-healthy DUDA's better AND cheaper.

[Guest Mets Guy in Michigan]

Should we be considering trading BOTH Bruce and Grandy?

You have the $29 million man in left, Lagares in center (unless you think Granderson can play that for a full season) and then a three-headed monster in right with Conforto, Bruce and Grandy.

I don't think we want Conforto to be a fourth outfielder. Or is he going to get a good look in center in the spring, leaving Lagares to be the fourth/late-inning defense guy?

[Edgy MD]

I'm guessing that, if Granderson or Bruce go, the Mets open the season with a Conforto/Lagares platoon in center.

[Centerfield]

I think they will try to trade Bruce now. Mainly to dump money, but also to get some talent back.

I think this will leave them with Granderson/Lagares in CF and Conforto in RF.

I think that they would only also look to trade Granderson if they were to sign Dexter Fowler, which I think is not very likely. But I think they should kick the tires. The Cubs are out on Dexter having signed John Jay.

[Frayed Knot]

Then there's that other CF platoon possibility: Jose Bernabe Reyes

[Ceetar]

Centerfield wrote: I think they will try to trade Bruce now. Mainly to dump money, but also to get some talent back. I think this will leave them with Granderson/Lagares in CF and Conforto in RF. I think that they would only also look to trade Granderson if they were to sign Dexter Fowler, which I think is not very likely. But I think they should kick the tires. The Cubs are out on Dexter having signed John Jay.

I think they only optioned Bruce because they knew he still had some value and it'd be better to have the piece than just cut it. I don't know if they can recoup $13 million of value though. ON the other hand, but keeping Bruce and taking another OFer off the market, they're cornering the market a little bit.


You can't hand Conforto anything after last year. I'm not sure you can hand Lagares anything either, though his defense is MUCH needed. If they're really planning on Conforto and/or Granderson (or Yo) in CF ever, they need to sign more K pitchers (and close with Reed if Familia is still active)

Or more GB pitchers over fly ball guys.

[Benjamin Grimm]

My guess is that part of the deal with Cespedes was a promise to not have him play center field.

I agree with being cautious about counting too much on Conforto. They should give him every opportunity to have a great year, but have a ready backup plan in case his 2017 turns out like his 2016 did, which is, unfortunately, a very real possibility.