It's 2021 and Jacob deGrom still deserves his own thread.

Ceetar · June 14, 2021

another spray chart from baseball savant. There's no legend, but I think darker is frequency, blue is out red is hit?

[attachment=0]spray.png[/attachment]

batmagadanleadoff · June 14, 2021

it's absolutely a cat and mouse game, shifting, and on so many levels. guys try to make adjustments, swing later, etc. Or the league selects for power, which I guess ties into some of the arguments. I know some are always like "hit/bunt it the other way! Or have more players that use the whole field!" instead baseball selected for guys that hit it OVER the shift, because that value is much greater, and if converting more soft hits to outs than before, it makes the difference between putting the ball in play and striking out even smaller.

Arguably some of the solution is to have 4 outfielders.

Austin Meadows hits it in the air 56.5% of the time. I bet you could cover most of the spots on the infield he's gonna hit it with 3 guys.

As for deGrom. The Mets are clearly shifting more in general. They've shifted on 82/111 lefty PA and 37/112 righty ones. They're looking at _something_.

[FIMG=444]http://phpbb3.leaptoad.com/mets/download/file.php?id=4[/FIMG]

This is 2019-2021. There's no reason to ever play deGrom up the middle.

These charts don't advance this conversation much. Youse are forgetting that shifts are determined on a case by case basis ... on a batter by batter basis ... not based on how the league as a whole hits against a certain pitcher. Teams will shift against a batter because he tends to hit a disproportionately high number of batted balls to a concentrated area. It's easier to predict where that kind of batter will hit the ball so it makes sense to shift more fielders where his batted balls tend to go.

Edgy MD · June 14, 2021

Sure, but it's a two-factor question. Where the ball is likely to go is a product of both the batter and the pitcher.

batmagadanleadoff · June 15, 2021

Given 'his stats are beyond amazing,' New York Mets ace Jacob deGrom becomes betting favorite to win NL MVP award

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/31631796/given-stats-amazing-new-york-mets-ace-jacob-degrom-becomes-betting-favorite-win-nl-mvphttps://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/31631796/given-stats-amazing-new-york-mets-ace-jacob-degrom-becomes-betting-favorite-win-nl-mvp

Ceetar · June 15, 2021

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/hitters-shouldnt-swing-against-jacob-degrom/Hitters Shouldn't Swing Against Jacob deGrom

batmagadanleadoff · June 16, 2021

Jacob deGrom “Pretty Confident” He Avoided Serious Injury

By Anthony Franco | June 16, 2021 at 9:30pm CDT

9:30 pm: deGrom met with reporters (including Deesha Thosar of the New York Daily News) after the game and downplayed the current issue. While he admitted he's frustrated with the series of developments, deGrom suggested he didn't believe the three health problems were related and, more importantly, sounded confident he'd avoided any serious injury. “I think it's three separate issues. I think the lat was something to do with the swing. The elbow I didn't think too much of, like I said I was pretty confident that that was nothing. And I'm pretty confident that this is nothing.” Manager Luis Rojas said deGrom's prognosis will become clearer after he undergoes further testing tomorrow, but that the initial report was “encouraging” (via Tim Britton of the Athletic).

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2021/06/jacob-degrom-leaves-early-with-right-shoulder-soreness.htmlhttps://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2021/06/jacob-degrom-leaves-early-with-right-shoulder-soreness.html

___________

New York Mets ace Jacob deGrom exits with shoulder soreness, 'confident that this is nothing'

New York Mets ace Jacob deGrom will get an MRI on his right shoulder on Thursday after leaving Wednesday's start against the visiting Chicago Cubs because of soreness.

"I felt good warming up, felt really good in the first and second innings, then there in the third my shoulder was sore," deGrom said after the Mets' 6-3 win. "This is getting old. I want to be out there competing instead of coming out of these games with these little [things]."

[***]

After the game, deGrom did get some encouraging news; tests on his right shoulder showed no decline in strength when compared to his left one.

"I think it's three separate issues," deGrom said of his injuries this season. "I think the lat was something to do with the swing. The elbow I didn't think too much of...I was pretty confident that that was nothing. And I'm pretty confident that this is nothing. We did some tests and ruled out anything serious."

Mets manager Luis Rojas added: "During the game I got a report. We can call it an encouraging report."

DeGrom was asked if he thought his uptick in velocity this season has anything to do with his nagging ailments.

"I don't know," he answered. "I don't know the answer to that....I don't know where to place the blame."

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/31647632/new-york-mets-ace-jacob-degrom-exits-start-early-shoulder-sorenesshttps://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/31647632/new-york-mets-ace-jacob-degrom-exits-start-early-shoulder-soreness

TBD

Meanwhile, deGrom faced the minimum possible 27 batters over his last nine innings pitched, allowing just one slow ground-ball single, while walking none and striking out 18.

dinosaur jesus · June 16, 2021

Christ, man. Something's breaking down. Maybe figure it out before you go out there again and strain some other part of your body?

smg58 · June 17, 2021

I'd have been far more impressed with 230 IP than I am with 100 mph. Now he'll be lucky to get half that. The MVP talk stops now.

Ceetar · June 17, 2021

Maybe he's right, he's been right pretty much every time so far, but I don't see how you just let him make his next start like this. Presumably it'd be Monday vs the Braves. I dunno. He hasn't thrown more than 85 pitches in a game since April, so it 's not like it's a workload thing. But that was two starts ago and then he had problems. Could he be building up too fast? If he wakes up feeling fine again, throws a fine bullpen, can you just let him throw 5 innings and like 60 pitches against the Braves and come out early? What if he's 2 IP from a "no hitter"?

pitching is rough.

But he's still 7th in Ks with like no innings and first in rWAR. Obviously he won't be the MVP if he gets IL'd again, but if he pitches 160+ innings like he's roughly on pace for, like this? it'll be no doubt.

Lefty Specialist · June 17, 2021

Humans are not designed to throw baseballs at 100 mph over and over in the course of three hours. While he says the problems are not related, I think they're all related to this fact.

Ceetar · June 17, 2021

Lefty Specialist wrote:

Humans are not designed to throw baseballs at 100 mph over and over in the course of three hours. While he says the problems are not related, I think they're all related to this fact.

pitching is harsh on the body. it's not like there's speed regulators in the arm, it's the throwing fastballs thing, not that it's 101 instead of 98 or 95. There hasn't really been any conclusive science that really consistently shows what is or isn't causing injuries.

Centerfield · June 17, 2021

It's 10:38 a.m. I'm not one to criticize doctors, but what the fuck could the radiologist have had on his plate that's more important than deGrom's shoulder?!!?!?!?

"Doc, I might have a tumor"

I'm sorry to hear that. Can you just wait over there for a bit? We have some magazines, and help yourself to the water cooler.

Fman99 · June 17, 2021

Seriously, right? You may be dying, but you can't even hit 80 MPH on a radar gun. So go over there and eat some shit till I call you.

Edgy MD · June 17, 2021

I've upped my standards in recent years. I refuse to patronize any doctor that keeps a bowl of shit next to the water cooler.

Ceetar · June 17, 2021

I haven't been in a doctor's office in quite a while. Do they even have any of that now? water coolers, magazines, bowls of shit?

G-Fafif · June 17, 2021

Edgy MD · June 17, 2021

It would be more enjoyable, I think, if we can take it one day at a time, one batter at a time, and save the MVP calls for further down the line.

dinosaur jesus · June 17, 2021

If there seems to be something wrong with me, and the doctor says he can't find anything, I don't get much relief from that. I want the doctor to tell me what's wrong, and whether it's serious or not. This is the fourth time this year doctors have said he's fine.

Benjamin Grimm · June 17, 2021

Edgy MD wrote:

It would be more enjoyable, I think, if we can take it one day at a time, one batter at a time, and save the MVP calls for further down the line.

I agree. He's not going to be an MVP or a Cy Young if he only ends up pitching 80 innings.

batmagadanleadoff · June 17, 2021

https://twitter.com/jonheyman/status/1405590122175864840

What do the Mets mean by "second opinion ": a second MRI or a second opinion of the first MRI?

batmagadanleadoff · June 17, 2021

dinosaur jesus wrote:

If there seems to be something wrong with me, and the doctor says he can't find anything, I don't get much relief from that. I want the doctor to tell me what's wrong, and whether it's serious or not. This is the fourth time this year doctors have said he's fine.

I wonder if there are some pitcher injuries that, though they are festering inside of the pitcher's body, can't be diagnosed until they get to the point where they are so severe that the pitcher has to be IL'ed.

G-Fafif · June 17, 2021

Find something, just not anything wrong.

Edgy MD · June 17, 2021

dinosaur jesus wrote:

If there seems to be something wrong with me, and the doctor says he can't find anything, I don't get much relief from that. I want the doctor to tell me what's wrong, and whether it's serious or not. This is the fourth time this year doctors have said he's fine.

I wonder if there are some pitcher injuries that, though they are festering inside of the pitcher's body, can't be diagnosed until they get to the point where they are so severe that the pitcher has to be IL'ed.

Intuitively, I'd say sure.

I mean, that pain following a game isn't just fatigue and swelling. It's an uncountable numbers of micro-tears and micro-strains. We ask all of them to heal in between starts while knowing that they never quite due. The not-quite-healed ones accumulate and compound and you hope to get to the end of the season before they accumulate and compound into something that can't heal on it's own. Eventually, though, you don't.

It is true, as said above, that we just aren't engineered for this activity. Maybe somebody will create a surgery someday that inverts the shoulder to point upwards. Until then, teach your kids to sidearm, or better yet, to submarine.

Frayed Knot · June 17, 2021

What do the Mets mean by "second opinion ": a second MRI or a second opinion of the first MRI?

Rodney Dangerfield: I went to the doctor and he told me I was fat.

I told him I wanted a second opinion so he said, 'OK, you're ugly too'

batmagadanleadoff · June 17, 2021

Second Opinion

The skinny:

-deGrom's MRI is normal

-Mets will take it one day at a time

-deGrom won't be IL'ed, barring a change in circumstances

-deGrom "played catch" today - everything normal and unenventful

-deGrom's next start TBD

Jacob deGrom's MRI clean; New York Mets taking 'day-by-day approach'

An MRI performed on New York Mets ace Jacob deGrom's right shoulder came back clean, manager Luis Rojas said Thursday. The results were examined by two doctors.

"We had an MRI taken on him and ran it through two doctors just to have a second opinion, as well, and both doctors had the same prognosis from the imaging: It just shows as a normal shoulder a pitcher would have and there's no concern," Rojas said, adding that deGrom played catch Thursday.

Rojas said that the team plans to take "a day-by-day approach" with deGrom and that there are no plans right now to place him on the injured list. The Mets also aren't sure when he'll make his next start.

Editor's Picks

"I don't see how it would change today, doing an IL stint," Rojas said. "It's going to be a normal shoulder in 10 days. I'm less concerned [because] he's playing catch today."

DeGrom left Wednesday night's start against the Chicago Cubs with shoulder soreness. It marked the third time he has left a start with an injury this season, including Friday against the San Diego Padres with elbow soreness and May 9 against the Arizona Diamondbacks after five innings with right side tightness.

Rojas said Thursday that none of deGrom's injuries are connected.

"This is an isolated thing from the right forearm or the flexor tendinitis," Rojas reiterated. "It's something that happened yesterday. We checked him after the game and checked him today, and everything is normal."

DeGrom, 32, struck out eight of the nine batters he faced over three innings, and he drove in a run with an RBI single in the second inning. The Mets aren't ruling anything out in terms of what caused his latest ailment, including even the possibility of it happening on a swing at the plate or simply because of how hard he throws. DeGrom has the highest average fastball velocity (99.2 mph) of anyone in baseball.

"We want to pay attention to this thing, on a day-by-day approach," Rojas said.

DeGrom's three shutout innings Wednesday lowered his ERA to 0.54 -- he has given up only four earned runs all year -- while his RBI gave him six on the season. He has 111 strikeouts in 67 innings.

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/31654059/jacob-degrom-mri-clean-new-york-mets-taking-day-dayhttps://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/31654059/jacob-degrom-mri-clean-new-york-mets-taking-day-day

Ceetar · June 17, 2021

"it just shows as a normal shoulder a pitcher would have and there's no concern,"

those two things are mutually exclusive and you absolutely won't phrase it that way if it was "nothing", it certainly wasn't "no issues" as Heyman editorializes.

Benjamin Grimm · June 18, 2021

Edgy MD · June 18, 2021

I'm not sure how to read it, but there's both an interesting narrative in that folder of yours, and perhaps an illuminating health history file.

MFS62 · June 18, 2021

Illuminating for sure.

Those tests have used up enough electricity to light up CitiField.

Later

bmfc1 · June 18, 2021

If it wasn't for the facial hair, those covers could have been interchangeable--unfortunately.

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It's 2021 and Jacob deGrom still deserves his own thread.

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