Frayed Knot

Fair deal all around I think. Already 31 y/o (in April) and still two years away from being a FA, it gives him a big payday rather than risking trying to go that route on the cusp of turning 33. And the club's not locked into a lengthy or huge-bucks deal for a guy with strengths and versatility but also a lower ceiling than true superstars.

I thought in your lifetime it was Eddie Collins The very tiny bit I saw of MLBN last night included showing where Rolen's career WAR set him among all 3rd basemen (9th I think it was, or maybe higher) and then show the guys who were at the same level for career WAR at each of the other positions. Every one of the others was a HoF'er

=metirish post_id=117258 time=1674651347 user_id=72] I guess I'm curious how Helton didn't get in but Rolen did ? Anyway he's probably a lock next year..

=roger_that post_id=117246 time=1674609830 user_id=128] Rolen, Rolen, Rolen, Keep those doggies movin' Rawhide!

SCOTT ROLEN !!!! Todd Helton was 2nd but just a few ticks shy for induction.

=bmfc1 post_id=117209 time=1674577366 user_id=73] Per Marchand, Brooklyn Cyclones voice Keith Raad is the choice to join Howie in the Mets radio booth. This isn't official as the Mets must approve Audacy's choice and it's also pending a physical

Squirrel and the Garbageman, wasn't that the mock-Springsteen song the Traveling Wilburys did a bunch of years back? Squirrel and the Garbageman were hard up for cash They stayed up all night selling cocaine and hash...

My thoughts on the trade at that time as best as I can remember them: - I regretted the loss of McDowell more than I did Dykstra; Lenny was never a fave of mine. - a game where he faced Frankie V. shortly after the trade. Viola, as I'm sure most here remember, was dominant for a season or two during his early years as a NYM and I was convinced the crafty lefty was going to make Lenny look stupid (I now, not hard, right?). But as the AB unfolded Dykstra started fouling off borderline outside change-ups down the LF line. Either totally frustrated or thinking he had him set up, Viola eventually came in with an inside fastball and I watched slack-jawed as Lenny jumped all over it and yanked it hard into RF. 'Who are you', I thought after the AB, 'and what have you done with Lenny Dykstra?' He had somehow transformed himself, seemingly overnight, into a different animal than he was as a Met. And though he's still as dumb as a doorknob, he wasn't when it came to baseball IQ as Billy Beane wrote* in MONEYBALL. Beane had the size, the talent, and athleticism all over his minor league teammate, plus a scholarship offer to Stanford, but not, as it turned out, in baseball smarts or especially the temperament to deal with baseball's failures and still think you're the best hitter on the field. In Lenny's five-plus years with the Mets he had a more than respectable .350 OBA. In seven with the Phils (not including that first half season) he never had an OBA as low as .350 and peaked at a stunning .420 in his very first full season. Samuel's lone season in Queens, meanwhile, was the worst of his career to the point where I think Darrin Ruf says to him, "Man you sucked as a Met". In retrospect it's odd that Davey, the math maven who was into statistics before almost anyone, would dismiss those .300-ish OBAs of Samuel's as a counterpoint to his "impact". *I know Beane didn't write the book but I said that anyway just in case Joe Morgan is reading this

We've been talking Al Jackson ever since the fire went out

Salvatore Leonard Bando, b. Cleveland, OH From 1968 - 1978, never played fewer than 148 games in a season.

Looks like Aroldis Chapman will be a KCR for the coming season.

The judges also would have accepted Pham-Tastic or We Are Pham-i-lee

The 2011 Philly season ended with 1 - 0 loss to StL in the first round of the playoffs with Howard grounding out to end the game/series. In trying to get out of the box he collapsed in a big heap and needed to have his huge self carried of the field. I can't remember now the specific injury -- Achilles tear maybe? -- but he took all winter and half the next season to heal (July 6th was his first 2012 game). Never real mobile to begin with, he became increasingly Mo Vaughn-ish after that.

Certainly. I focused on those two because they represent two opposite ends of action taken by their clubs: - Philly opting to effectively make the 30+ Howard a Phil-for-life, perhaps against better judgement - Atlanta choosing the more unsentimental and unpopular route of pivoting to another choice as soon as they realized that they couldn't keep the guy who had been a favorite in their system for 14 years within the terms they set. Neither approach is necessarily right or wrong, just examples of two potential paths involving big Pete

The idea that we're going to sign him at some price and length is certainly reasonable but the presumed inevitability of it begs the question of, then why not now or even why hasn't it already happened. And it of course still could. Just because they hit an arb number doesn't mean they can't come up with something longer that we'll hear about between now and opening day. But if nothing happens prior to the end of the '23 season then Pete is looking at complete free agency just a year away which provides all kinds of reasons for a player to NOT sign a L-T deal while also giving the team a slightly larger disincentive to commit a player will have already hit 30 y/o, especially one who is limited to the one position on the field (two if you want to treat 1B & DH as interchangeable) where it's easiest to find a bat. Another potential comp is Freddie Freeman whom the Braves famously allowed to walk away despite coming off four straight top-10 MVP seasons (including one 1st) and a WS title. Now he was turning 32 as he hit FA-gency, not 30, so the comp isn't exact and Atlanta had already squeezed 11 full seasons plus a cup of coffee year (he debuted in late 2010 a few days prior to turning 21) out of him to that point. His new deal with LA will still have a few years left by the time Pete can leave on his own so we likely won't know by then if Freddie turns out to be a good long term signing by the Dodgers or more a wishful thinking one.

I remember the existance of that thread but in re-reading it it was better than i remember. Frank was, in the view of most of us certainly, an old man at the time of it (six months older than my father) and yet managed to tack on another 17 years since. Nice run.

Yup. You draft/sign amateur players for their perceived talent and future projections, not for how their position fits into the current roster.

Just to stipulate, the 'Pete Alonso Conundrum' is neither a lost Robert Ludlum book, nor is it the band that opened for BTO on their western Canada tour back in the '80s The question, of course, is when/whether the team should stop paying him year by year and plunge into a long term contract. The comp that keeps popping into my head, maybe because it serves as the cautionary tale, is Ryan Howard. Both are large, slugging 1st baseman who reached the majors in their mid-20s Pete did get a slight jump on Howard by playing a full season at age 24 where RH was just getting his feet wet (39 ML ABs) but Howard quickly jumped to higher peak seasons. [td]AGE[/td] [td]Ryan Howard[/td] [td]OPS+[/td] [td]Pete Alsonso[/td] [td]OPS+[/td] [td]24[/td] [td]39 ABs[/td] [td]122[/td] [td]ROY-1, MVP-7[/td] [td]147[/td] [td]25[/td] [td]88 G, ROY-1[/td] [td]133[/td] [td]Covid Season[/td] [td]122[/td] [td]26[/td] [td]MVP-1[/td] [td]167[/td] [td][/td] [td]133[/td] [td]27[/td] [td]MVP-5[/td] [td]145[/td] [td]MVP-8[/td] [td]146[/td] [td]28[/td] [td]MVP-2[/td] [td]125[/td] [td]MVP-17[/td] [td]124[/td] [td]29[/td] [td]MVP-3[/td] [td]141[/td] [td]-----[/td] [td]---[/td] [td]30[/td] [td]MVP-10[/td] [td]127[/td] [td]-----[/td] [td]---[/td] [td]31[/td] [td]MVP-10[/td] [td]126[/td] [td]-----[/td] [td]---[/td] [td]32[/td] [td]71 G[/td] [td]91[/td] [td]-----[/td] [td]---[/td] [td]33[/td] [td]80 G[/td] [td]115[/td] [td]-----[/td] [td]---[/td] [td]34[/td] [td]153 G[/td] [td]92[/td] [td]-----[/td] [td]---[/td] [td]35[/td] [td]129 G[/td] [td]96[/td] [td]-----[/td] [td]---[/td] [td]36[/td] [td]112 G[/td] [td]85[/td] [td]-----[/td] [td]---[/td] The mistake the Phillies made, and I remember thinking this at the time, is that by the time they signed Howard to a multi-year deal he was already into his early 30s and in what turned out to be the start to a significant decline in both output and availability. Had he been with the Braves (then or now) they would have wished him well and immediately set off looking for a replacement. Of course had Pete come up with the Braves they probably would have signed him long-term coming off his rookie season (or maybe while still in the middle of it) but the Mets haven't shown that they buy into that philosophy and certainly weren't going to do it in the midst of the Wilpon/Cohen transitional mess. Alonso becomes a FA the winter he'll turn 30 following the '24 season. Given the length of contracts now in vogue it'll be tough NOT to sign him into his late '30s and we know that the track record of aging sluggers in the steroid testing era, even among the elites (Pujols, Cabrera) isn't a pretty one. If you want to pick another slugging comp, Judge, with an MVP plus two other top fives under his belt, just signed for 9 years starting at age 31. Be interesting to see how that one turns out. So I guess what I'm asking here is, what's your plan Stan?

Yes, there's definitely pressure from the union to sign for the biggest bucccs so that the next guy can benefit. This is the concept that the NFLPA never got. The system they agreed to which allows teams to designate FAs with 'Franchise' and 'Transitional' tags (a system the players LOVED when it was implemented) raises a FA's salary towards the upper end of the positional pay scale but specifically leaves it below the top (average of top five at your position I believe). And now that that system is in there they can't get rid of it. Agents, btw, who need to be certified by the MLBPA, also get that pressure - not that they don't already have their own incentives to push things to the max. The other thing is that salary becomes another way for players to keep score. In a business where you want to make the most where you can and while you can, having the highest salary on your team or for your position or in the entire sport itself is a way of validating your career at that moment while hoarding a few bragging rights among your peers at the same time. The original ARod contract w/Texas was for $252 mil which was no accident as it was exactly double the total value of the one the NBA's Kevin Garnett had recently signed which was, at the time, the biggest in American pro sports. That specific number became a goal for Rodriguez/Boras.

Benjamin Grimm wrote: "Assistant Major League Coach"? Is this something new? aka: Bench coach We'll be very Barnes-centric this year.

=Centerfield post_id=116570 time=1673463602 user_id=65] Can't blame Correa if the Mets insisted on yearly physicals following the 6 year guaranteed portion.

I like that they didn't simply plow ahead with a 12 year deal either because they figured that, hell, we've come this far (Kazmir for Zambrano anyone?) or from a fear of looking weak by backing out after getting additional info that perhaps it would be a bad risk. And maybe it also shows that Cohen will listen to his front office folks if and when they tell him that a deal he made on a whim needs to be reigned in.

He better hope that neither his agent nor union reps hear that.

So since I just heard today that Carlos Correa is a Twin maybe we should try to sign his brother. He could be exactly the same only without the ankle injury.

He was considered a pretty good prospect coming up so his debut stuck in my head (though I had to confirm the details). The answer is that not only did he HR in his 1st ML AB but twice in his 1st game. Threw in a 1B & 2B for good measure, finally making his first out in his 5th AB. Never got a chance for his 6th AB of the game as the Blue Jays were ahead 17 - 11 at home and so didn't batted need to bat in the 9.