Re-Sign Cespedes

[Centerfield]

I encourage Sandy to get creative and fill our #3 and #4 spots with better options if he has them. But the more I think about it, I think they have to bring back Yoenis. No other options really fit well with what the Mets already have.

I get it, his career numbers are much lower than what he did this year (.805 OPS), and he has some Cliff Floyd to him. And he may even be older than what they say he is. But he will likely be an elite player for the next three years. Which coincides with the years that this pitching staff will be together.

He can play CF for 2 years, then slot over to a corner OF position after Granderson is done.

Sure, he might suck for the last 2 years of his contract, but the Mets might be rebuilding then anyway. With 3 World Championships in hand. Plus, you never know if someone desperate will take that contract off of your hands.

I'm open to other suggestions as well. But this is how I would attack this offseason.

[Guest El Segundo Escupidor]

I think NYC FC will trump anything the Mets can offer.

(More seriously, I can see Cespedes getting Bonilla-esque hate in 6 months when he reverts to his normal career numbers.)

[TransMonk]

I worry about his streaky nature, his defense and the back-end of his contract. His career stats are nowhere near what he was giving in August.

Also, what do we do with Cuddyer and Lagares? Hard to see the Mets being OK with that kind of dollar commitment riding the bench for the majority of a full season.

I have NO problem letting Cespedes walk. Someone else will overpay for him.

[Guest d'Kong76]

I don't have a player in mind right this second but I'm more of the
mindset of who are we going to replace him with... someone really
solid. I think Cuddster and Laggy are bench players for the most part.

I'd listen to 2 year deals for Cespedes, but why would he do that....

[Centerfield]

TransMonk wrote: I worry about his streaky nature, his defense and the back-end of his contract. His career stats are nowhere near what he was giving in August. Also, what do we do with Cuddyer and Lagares? Hard to see the Mets being OK with that kind of dollar commitment riding the bench for the majority of a full season. I have NO problem letting Cespedes walk. Someone else will overpay for him.

Definitely all legit concerns. But who do you bring in to be your #3 and #4 then? I'm looking at the options out there and don't see anything close to what Cespedes offers. Plus he won't cost you a draft pick.

[Ceetar]

TransMonk wrote: I worry about his streaky nature, his defense and the back-end of his contract. His career stats are nowhere near what he was giving in August. Also, what do we do with Cuddyer and Lagares? Hard to see the Mets being OK with that kind of dollar commitment riding the bench for the majority of a full season. I have NO problem letting Cespedes walk. Someone else will overpay for him.

Cespedes is a solid overall player and a nice player and kinda fun too. But I'm not overpaying for that. 3 years is probably the max I'd go with, but there are various other factors here.

Lagares: Will he be ready for Opening Day (presuming he does actually have arm surgery)? Lagares played pretty well down the stretch and in the playoffs. If his defense/arm is back then he's a really nice piece to mix in there, but you start getting a little bit of crunch problem.

Conforto: Granted, he hit a couple of bombs in game 4, but he was pretty bad for most of the postseason and was pretty iffy in September too. Excited for him, but he's not a lock for Opening Day.

Cuddyer: I know 90% of Mets fans think he's done, but that seems unlikely to me. Had some decent second half stretches post-DL. If he's healthy I suspect he'll play and I suspect he'll be alright too if he does play.

Granderson is obviously a lock, so that's already 4 guys vying for time in two spots, while we have holes in the middle infield offensively.

I really like Curtis, but you could make a strong case for trying to sell high on him, especially if you keep Cespedes.

[metsmarathon]

the "what do we do with cuddyer" question should be the least of the reasons not to resign cespedes. we do with cuddyer what we should do with him no matter who we bring in. he sits. i mean, we're not moving conforto, or grandy into centerfield are we? so since he's going to be a corner outfielder bench player, and reserve 1b, no matter what happens, it should have no bearing on wether we bring back cespedes or any other potential centerfielder.

at least lagares can bring plus-level defense once he gets his arm fixed up.

[Centerfield]

Conforto? "Iffy in September"? If .813 OPS means iffy, I'll sign on for iffy.

[metirish]

What's his name from KC is a FA?....Cespedes was great and lifted the whole org, looked like he was playing hurt in the post season, who wasn't I suppose. I too would hate to overpay in years , Rubin says "sources" say Mets won't bite

[Lefty Specialist]

No, no, no.

We saw what non-peak Cespedes looks like, and it's not pretty. Pass. He'll want a long deal that will just get uglier as time passes.

Murphy, it was fine while it lasted, but we have options at second.

I have a different take, though.

Yes, they have to replace 3 and 4 in the order. Well, I'm comfortable with Conforto as my 3. He did pretty well this year and he'll only get better playing every day. One of those homers he hit was off a lefty, too. I like his makeup and Keith likes his swing.

As for a 4 hitter, well this is where Sandy gets creative. There are many things that he can package. They need a Paul Goldschmidt type at first. They also need a shortstop who can both hit and field in the same body.

They need a Juan Uribe type (or even Juan Uribe himself) who can spell David at times or replace him if/when he's injured. This is a very important thing, as David is probably a 120-game guy now.

Wouldn't surprise me if Lagares has surgery planned, so Sandy better be looking for a ballhawk for center.

And they need middle relief. That was made pretty obvious this past week. But middle relievers are a crapshoot. I think Robles and Reed are keepers, Familia is obvious, after that it's sayonara.

They have pieces to trade. Here's where Sandy earns his money.

[Ceetar]

Centerfield wrote: Conforto? "Iffy in September"? If .813 OPS means iffy, I'll sign on for iffy.

.250/278/.478 for a .757 in nearly 100 Sept/Oct plate appearances. And that's a very slugging-heavy OPS which isn't as ideal. That's still somehow a 108 wRC+ though, which is surprising to me. There was always talk about sending him back down it just never materialized. I don't think anything that's happened has ruled out him starting in Vegas.

[Edgy MD]

The Mets were reportedly highly motivated to sign Cespedes when they realized how willing he was to patrol center. Now that that willingness has to be understood in the context of (1) some questionable instincts and (2) perhaps some damaged health, they clearly are going to reassess. Which doesn't mean they'll pull out, but it changes the calculations.

I'm not necessarily concerned with what's out there. At least right now. There are alternatives on the trade market and the international market and such. We'll see how things unfold.

We have this exclusive period to work with. But right now, Cespedes is golfer with a bum shoulder and a swollen knee.

[Centerfield]

Edgy MD wrote: The Mets were reportedly highly motivated to sign Cespedes when they realized how willing he was to patrol center. Now that that willingness has to be understood in the context of (1) some questionable instincts and (2) perhaps some damaged health, they clearly are going to reassess. Which doesn't mean they'll pull out, but it changes the calculations. I'm not necessarily concerned with what's out there. At least right now. There are alternatives on the trade market and the international market and such. We'll see how things unfold. We have this exclusive period to work with. But right now, Cespedes is golfer with a bum shoulder and a swollen knee.

I hope that what you say is true. Because that would mean that there is money to spend for the right player. And that is important.

Agreed that those things change calculations. Hopefully they change it for all teams, and so the Mets will be right in the center of things.

(this part is meant to address LS post above)
Bringing in 1B and RF into the equation is interesting. It certainly does open up a lot more options (and makes our offseason much more complex) if you bring those two positions into the mix. In the past I have not seen Sandy willing to shake things up that much. It will be interesting to see what he elects to do this winter.

Edited November 2, 2015 by Guest

[Frayed Knot]

metirish wrote: What's his name from KC is a FA?

Alex Gordon.

[Lefty Specialist]

Zobrist is a FA, just a rental by the Royals. But he's not the droid we're looking for.

[Ceetar]

Lefty Specialist wrote: Zobrist is a FA, just a rental by the Royals. But he's not the droid we're looking for.

I like Zobrist as a nice multi-use guy, probably probably not a great fit

plus his habit of bouncing up and down before the pitch got on my nerves.

[ashie62]

Ceetar wrote: Centerfield wrote: Conforto? "Iffy in September"? If .813 OPS means iffy, I'll sign on for iffy. .250/278/.478 for a .757 in nearly 100 Sept/Oct plate appearances. And that's a very slugging-heavy OPS which isn't as ideal. That's still somehow a 108 wRC+ though, which is surprising to me. There was always talk about sending him back down it just never materialized. I don't think anything that's happened has ruled out him starting in Vegas.

No chance.

[Guest d'Kong76]

Ceetar wrote: .250/278/.478 for a .757 in nearly 100 Sept/Oct plate appearances. And that's a very slugging-heavy OPS which isn't as ideal. That's still somehow a 108 wRC+ though, which is surprising to me. There was always talk about sending him back down it just never materialized. I don't think anything that's happened has ruled out him starting in Vegas.

Sometimes I don't know how your ying and yang doesn't make
your head explode. Always talk? Always? If he's not the starting
left fielder next year it will be because he was part of a big trade.

[Guest El Segundo Escupidor]

Frayed Knot wrote: metirish wrote: What's his name from KC is a FA? Alex Gordon.

Gordon is heading to Chi-town, has stated he wants to play there and both the Cubs and the Sox are rumored to be interested.

[Ceetar]

d'Kong76 wrote: Ceetar wrote: .250/278/.478 for a .757 in nearly 100 Sept/Oct plate appearances. And that's a very slugging-heavy OPS which isn't as ideal. That's still somehow a 108 wRC+ though, which is surprising to me. There was always talk about sending him back down it just never materialized. I don't think anything that's happened has ruled out him starting in Vegas. Sometimes I don't know how your ying and yang doesn't make your head explode. Always talk? Always? If he's not the starting left fielder next year it will be because he was part of a big trade.

You could go back to every roster move that happened in August and find a reference to Conforto being sent back down. (and in fact he was for Cespedes) He avoided it by actually hitting in August, something that he didn't do in September or October.

[Lefty Specialist]

Absolutely zero chance Conforto stars in Vegas. You're set in left and right (unless Grandy gets traded). Lagares is a question mark with his elbow.

I think Duda needs to be replaced with someone more reliable. We need more consistent production out of first base. So if there's a trade that can be made, they should do it.

I'd like to see Dilson Herrera at second and leave him there. He's done all he can do at Vegas.

Wilmer Flores is not a shortstop. No more fitting square pegs into round holes. Trade him (but dear god, not to Milwaukee)- won't see him cry in the offseason. Has value, but he vanished offensively down the stretch and in the playoffs.

Tejada's a good backup but they need a real full-time shortstop with range and the skills to lead off. Tall order, but that's why Sandy gets the big money.

Middle relief is needed, but that's always a matter of finding diamonds in the rough. The variability from season to season means it's always a crap shoot. One of the best relievers for KC was Ryan Freaking Madsen, who was completely out of baseball for 2 years. So there's no perfect formula.

First four starters are Harvey/deGrom/Syndergaard/Matz. I hear these guys are pretty good. Niese is your number 5, and Wheeler comes back in the second half. If Niese can be traded (and he should), you can either give the job to Logan Verrett or sign Colon cheaply. Montero is still out there, too, if he can ever get his act together. So there are options.

Lotta work to do.

[Centerfield]

Lefty Specialist wrote: Absolutely zero chance Conforto stars in Vegas. You're set in left and right (unless Grandy gets traded). Lagares is a question mark with his elbow. I think Duda needs to be replaced with someone more reliable. We need more consistent production out of first base. So if there's a trade that can be made, they should do it. I'd like to see Dilson Herrera at second and leave him there. He's done all he can do at Vegas. Wilmer Flores is not a shortstop. No more fitting square pegs into round holes. Trade him (but dear god, not to Milwaukee)- won't see him cry in the offseason. Has value, but he vanished offensively down the stretch and in the playoffs. Tejada's a good backup but they need a real full-time shortstop with range and the skills to lead off. Tall order, but that's why Sandy gets the big money. Middle relief is needed, but that's always a matter of finding diamonds in the rough. The variability from season to season means it's always a crap shoot. One of the best relievers for KC was Ryan Freaking Madsen, who was completely out of baseball for 2 years. So there's no perfect formula. First four starters are Harvey/deGrom/Syndergaard/Matz. I hear these guys are pretty good. Niese is your number 5, and Wheeler comes back in the second half. If Niese can be traded (and he should), you can either give the job to Logan Verrett or sign Colon cheaply. Montero is still out there, too, if he can ever get his act together. So there are options. Lotta work to do.

Who is your replacement for Cespedes in this scenario? Still need a middle-of-the-order guy.

[Centerfield]

I thought about it some more. If Sandy is wary of signing Cespedes to a long-term deal (and I readily admit the drawbacks there), I think he could go another route:

1. Sign Justin Upton
2. Trade Granderson at the peak of his value. (Does someone take on that salary for the last 2 years?)
3. Go for Colby Rasmus (or maybe trade for Gomez?) for CF

This is a lot more shakeup than just re-signing Cespedes, and a lot of things have to fall in place for something like this to happen. But it's an idea. Especially if you think Granderson is not likely to repeat his great 2015.

Like LS said. Lots of work to do.

[Guest d'Kong76]

I can't see trading Granderson. I think he'd be hard to move and really
I think he's a big part of this teams personality and clubhouse.

[Edgy MD]

He is. And I really appreciated how he assumed many of Wright's "face o' the franchise duties" while Wright was away from the team.

But people get dealt. And the river rolls on.

[Guest d'Kong76]

Ya need a couple of older players like that. Similarly, Bartolo is
everyone's favorite uncle to a lot of the younger players.

[TransMonk]

I, too, worry about power. It will be hard to rely on Wright for more than 15-ish HRs (essentially replacing what will be lost when Murphy leaves). Duda's consistency is also a big question mark for me.

It seems like power is going to have to potentially come from a new center fielder or middle infielder...which is not where one traditionally finds a lot of pop.

A full year from d'Arnaud would help...but I've never seen one of those before.

It's very early in the off-season, but I'm on the Colby Rasmus bandwagon.

[Centerfield]

Which is the difficulty of this off-season.

We need a middle of the order guy. But our corner OF and corner IF positions are all accounted for.

[Edgy MD]

TransMonk wrote: I, too, worry about power. It will be hard to rely on Wright for more than 15-ish HRs (essentially replacing what will be lost when Murphy leaves). Duda's consistency is also a big question mark for me. It seems like power is going to have to potentially come from a new center fielder or middle infielder...which is not where one traditionally finds a lot of pop. A full year from d'Arnaud would help...but I've never seen one of those before. It's very early in the off-season, but I'm on the Colby Rasmus bandwagon.

Well, it's good to see that we don't have to buy into the rebuild-like-KC-with-high-contact-high-batting-average line.

Obviously, we can't "rely" on anybody for anything, but Wright is a good bet to provide more than he (and Campbell) did last year. And we can reasonably expect more power to come organically from catcher and left field.

[Centerfield]

Edgy MD wrote: TransMonk wrote: I, too, worry about power. It will be hard to rely on Wright for more than 15-ish HRs (essentially replacing what will be lost when Murphy leaves). Duda's consistency is also a big question mark for me. It seems like power is going to have to potentially come from a new center fielder or middle infielder...which is not where one traditionally finds a lot of pop. A full year from d'Arnaud would help...but I've never seen one of those before. It's very early in the off-season, but I'm on the Colby Rasmus bandwagon. Well, it's good to see that we don't have to buy into the rebuild-like-KC-with-high-contact-high-batting-average line. Obviously, we can't "rely" on anybody for anything, but Wright is a good bet to provide more than he (and Campbell) did last year. And we can reasonably expect more power to come organically from catcher and left field.

I hope to god that we do not hear these types of statements from Sandy at the end of the off-season trying to justify another winter of futility. They just went to the World Series. The goal should be to build a championship caliber team.

If they lose Cespedes and Murphy and do dick again this offseason, the offense will be terrible. Just like it was before the trade deadline. And the Mets will revert to mediocrity.

The goal for this winter is exactly the same as it was last winter. Find a middle of the order bat (or two). They failed miserably at that last winter. They were lucky to be able to correct that mistake at the trade deadline this year in time to make the playoffs. They may not be so lucky next year. Don't take chances. Get it done this winter.