Mets uniforms (split from MBTN book thread)

[soupcan]

So let me ask Oh Grand Poobah of Everything Mets Uniform-ish -

How do we really start a movement to get rid of the god-awful black uniforms, drop-shadows, accents, hats, etc.?

Who makes those decisions and how do we get them to listen and be swayed??

[Benjamin Grimm]

You don't like accents? You sound like Paul Lo Duca.

I don't think there's a way to eliminate black uniforms and caps. Alternate choices mean more merchandise sales. I think a more realistic goal would be to get them to seriously reduce the in-game usage of the black.

If the black jersey is still used in games, even as little as once a week, then they can still sell them as "authentic" in the gift shops. But we won't have to see them as often.

My proposal:

Black jerseys and all black caps on Sunday night games and weekday day games.

All white jerseys and blue/black caps on Saturday home games.

For all other games, grey jerseys and blue caps on the road, pinstripes and blue caps at home.

There! Problem solved!

[Guest Edgy DC]

I think there is a way. Many brand icons have shown that one way to increase your brand's viability is to raise it's authenticity by limiting its exploitation.

Krispy Kreme has a limited number of donuts that bear the imprint. Rover has a restricted line of cars, and the Yankees seem to know enough to only wear two different uniforms in real games, but are still able to sell 35 different mutations to their fans.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

I don't believe any amount of fan sentiment would get them to drop black, except for a reduction in the amount or % growth of merchandise $$. The Mets have acknowledged the black was based on research on what would sell (and 8 years into it, I guess it has sold). I don't think there's any question that black has run its course as a uni-fashion must have, but it's not like people who shop at Modell's are on top of the trends and that's who's buying all them black jerseys.

The other thing is, the league for whatever reason requires a lot of advance notice and approval of uniform changes, so these things are like turning around an aircraft carrier. The Mets however have hinted there will be a change in the uni for the 2009 season, so there prolly will be something floating around out there this summer.

[soupcan]

Edgy DC wrote: ...Yankees seem to know enough to only wear two different uniforms in real games, but are still able to sell 35 different mutations to their fans.

EXACTLY! The Yankees get away with it. No reason the Mets can't sell clown uniforms in the gift shops and not have to wear them on the field.

See Jessica Simpson wearing a pink Cowboys jersey the othe other day? Tony Romo sure wasn't sporting it.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

The Mets sell pink jerseys too, but I suspect the black's implied authenticity as a result of the play uni's sell better. I'm sure the MFYs see better performance of stuff in official colors.

[Benjamin Grimm]

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: The Mets however have hinted there will be a change in the uni for the 2009 season, so there prolly will be something floating around out there this summer.

Should we treat this news with anticipation or dread?

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

I suspect it's good. Here's the article:

]October 8, 2006 Flushing At Shea, the Name of the Game Is Color War By JOHN FREEMAN GILL When the New York Mets took the field at Shea Stadium on Wednesday for Game 1 of the National League Division Series, Paul Lukas, an ardent lifelong fan, was in the loge, wearing a blue Mr. Met cap and cheering the players on. It was a beautiful afternoon for baseball, with red, white and blue bunting fringing the green grass beneath a deep blue sky. But amid all the color and pageantry, Mr. Lukas could not help feeling rankled by the inclusion of one nontraditional hue in the team�s uniforms: black, the dominant color in the Mets� caps. �It�s the home opener, they�ve got the bunting up, and the blue cap is their official home cap as stated in the Major League Baseball Style Guide,� said Mr. Lukas, the editor of Uni Watch blog, a Web log devoted to sports uniforms. �They�ve got all this tradition going on, and they can�t even honor their own tradition.� When the Mets began play in 1962, the fifth season after the Brooklyn Dodgers� and New York Giants� much-lamented departures for California, their uniform incorporated blue and orange as a respectful nod to those two franchises. But in 1998, the Mets began including black in the team�s home and away uniforms, in various combinations. �The black was added as a style element based on some degree of research of fans in terms of what was popular in the marketplace,� Dave Howard, the Mets� executive vice president of business operations, said on Thursday. �At the time, our traditional hats and uniforms were selling hardly at all.� But to Mr. Lukas, the change bordered on sartorial sacrilege. �It would be like if in Washington they decided that the red, white and blue is a little outdated, and maybe we should change the red to a burgundy,� he said. Consequently, as the team charged toward the high-visibility postseason, Mr. Lukas launched a playful but heartfelt campaign calling on the Mets to banish black from their uniforms and �reinstate blue to its place of chromatic supremacy in the team�s color scheme.� So far, more than 800 fans have signed on to his petition, at www.ditchtheblack.com. Mr. Howard said that the Mets� uniforms would remain the same through 2007 but that the team might revisit the issue for the opening of the club�s new ballpark in 2009. Still, he said, �if you look around the building, you�re seeing a lot of the black, so it�s clear fans vote most effectively with their pocketbook.� In Shea�s loge, opinions on the question were mixed. �They�ve had a lot of losing in the past, so it�s cool they have something newer, to start a new tradition,� said Derik Aasan, a 28-year-old beer sales representative. Joe Campbell, a 50-year-old database administrator, disagreed. �For a lot of people, blue and orange is what they grew up with, and a change from that is a change from tradition, so it doesn�t appeal,� he said. Why, then, was Mr. Campbell wearing a predominantly black Mets jersey? �It was the only one I could get,� he said ruefully.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

and this from uniwatch:

]Metscetera: Very promising developments in Flushing, where the Mets have been resplendent in their blue caps and blue sleeves for two consecutive games (Sunday and Tuesday), both of which were played on cool, brisk evenings. The significance there is that aesthetically challenged equipment manager Charlie Samuels, who has ruinously been entrusted with the task of deciding what the team wears each day, has previously said that he thinks the blue cap clashes with the club�s black dugout jacket, and has therefore idiotically refused to break out the blue gear except on very warm afternoons when he expects nobody to wear a jacket. The fact that the team�s worn blue on consecutive jacket-friendly evenings suggests that Samuels might finally be getting a clue, and not a moment too soon.

[seawolf17]

]Mr. Howard said that the Mets� uniforms would remain the same through 2007 but that the team might revisit the issue for the opening of the club�s new ballpark in 2009. Still, he said, �if you look around the building, you�re seeing a lot of the black, so it�s clear fans vote most effectively with their pocketbook.�

Because you can't buy anything other than black in the stores, retard.

[metirish]

I don't mind the black but agree that it should be worn a lot less, the black is popular in a lot of sports these day,Manchester United's third strip in black and is a huge seller for them.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

That was weird. I was just remarking how the Royals dropped their black alternates for this year and are bringing back the powder-blues. The Blue Jays are also using a powder blue "throwback" as an alternate jersey in 07.

I wonder if the Meets will follow that lead and bring back the racing stripes as part of a retro-alternate look.

[Guest Edgy DC]

I mind. I mind more than I should.

Wolf is correct that Howard overlooks thre relative availability of black as influencing the relative appearance of black. I don't think Howard is a retard, though.

Derik Aasan is dead wrong and is a fool if he thinks a slight change is going to disguise the fact that he's Don Aase's son.

Good split by the new admin.

[Benjamin Grimm]

I'm afraid it was one of the old admins who did the split.

Back to black: both of my kids have black Mets t-shirts. I have to admit that t-shirts look better in black than they do with white and pinstripes.

Jerseys worn on the field in a regulation game are an entirely different story.

[Gwreck]

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: I wonder if the Meets will follow that lead and bring back the racing stripes as part of a retro-alternate look.

Let's hope not.

[Benjamin Grimm]

I fear that they'll replace black with the new hot color du jour.

In 2009 we may see the Mets in brick red and sandstone.

[G-Fafif]

After a while, everything new is nostalgia. The first sign of the black shirts last April gave me a jolt back to the glory days of '99 and '00, which I'm sure was never the idea behind those hip, contemporary duds. We don't really need 'em but they've kind of become, to my mind anyway, The New Throwbacks (maybe by 2011 they'll be tagged as such in one of the many fine Citi Retail Environments).

[Guest Edgy DC]

I agree. Your kids may well look better in black. I look better in sea green. My girlifriend looks better in pink.

David Wright looks better in home whites and José Reyes looks better in road grays.

[soupcan]

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: I wonder if the Meets will follow that lead and bring back the racing stripes as part of a retro-alternate look.

I wouldn't be thrilled with that but I'd take it. Ideally I'd like a '69 era uni, albeit in white as opposed to the yellowish hue of those togs. The grey unis and black hat/blue brim for the road.

="Benjamin Grimm"]I'm afraid it was one of the old admins who did the split. Back to black: both of my kids have black Mets t-shirts. I have to admit that t-shirts look better in black than they do with white and pinstripes. Jerseys worn on the field in a regulation game are an entirely different story.

Again - I completely agree. I've got no problem with the Rainbow Coalition Mets as long as they are sitting in the stands.

[Fman99]

Fifty years from now, when they're all wearing their quasi-futuristic Mercury Mets uniforms, you will all miss the black hats and jerseys. Trust me!

[Benjamin Grimm]

Fifty years from now I'll be 94 years old.

I'm not sure that I want to stick around that long.

[soupcan]

Yeah well, fortunately I don't plan on being around in fifty years.

I'm miserable now. Can't imagine how surly I'd be at 93. No thank you.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Oprah? Is that you?

[G-Fafif]

Fman99 wrote: Fifty years from now, when they're all wearing their quasi-futuristic Mercury Mets uniforms, you will all miss the black hats and jerseys. Trust me!

Joke would be on us if we found the Mercury Mets fabric contains special longevity fibers.

[HahnSolo]

]But in 1998, the Mets began including black in the team�s home and away uniforms, in various combinations. �The black was added as a style element based on some degree of research of fans in terms of what was popular in the marketplace,� Dave Howard, the Mets� executive vice president of business operations, said on Thursday.

A good 7-8 years after the White Sox initially made it popular. Way to keep up that market research up with the times, Dave. What's up for 2009? Segways to bring relievers in from the bullpen?

]Mr. Howard said that the Mets� uniforms would remain the same through 2007 but that the team might revisit the issue for the opening of the club�s new ballpark in 2009. Still, he said, �if you look around the building, you�re seeing a lot of the black, so it�s clear fans vote most effectively with their pocketbook.� Why, then, was Mr. Campbell wearing a predominantly black Mets jersey? �It was the only one I could get,� he said ruefully.

That bothers me most. The inability to get reasonably priced Mets clothing that is not in black.

[G-Fafif]

HahnSolo wrote: ]But in 1998, the Mets began including black in the team�s home and away uniforms, in various combinations. �The black was added as a style element based on some degree of research of fans in terms of what was popular in the marketplace,� Dave Howard, the Mets� executive vice president of business operations, said on Thursday. A good 7-8 years after the White Sox initially made it popular. Way to keep up that market research up with the times, Dave. What's up for 2009? Segways to bring relievers in from the bullpen?

Good one!

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

That would be awesome. You're hired.

Signed,
Dave Howard

[Benjamin Grimm]

I don't know if this is anything new, or if it's significant in any way, but...

This morning I got a promotional e-mail from MLB.com Shop about their Cooperstown Collection. I clicked on the link, clicked around, and landed on the Mets caps section.

The blue cap is listed as the "home cap."

The black cap with the blue brim is listed as the "road cap."

And the all-black cap is the "alternate cap."

Have they always had these designations, in name if not in practice? Or might this be an indicator of how the caps will be used in 2008?

[G-Fafif]

Benjamin Grimm wrote: I don't know if this is anything new, or if it's significant in any way, but... This morning I got a promotional e-mail from MLB.com Shop about their Cooperstown Collection. I clicked on the link, clicked around, and landed on the Mets caps section. The blue cap is listed as the "home cap." The black cap with the blue brim is listed as the "road cap." And the all-black cap is the "alternate cap." Have they always had these designations, in name if not in practice? Or might this be an indicator of how the caps will be used in 2008?

The Mets have stuck to these as their default settings on caps all along, even as real-life experience has indicated otherwise.

[Benjamin Grimm]

The only thing true in those descriptions is that the blue cap is used exclusively at home.

The other two caps appear both at home and on the road.

I wonder, when was the last time the Mets wore a blue cap in a road game? I'm guessing it was 1997.