Frayed Knot

dgwphotography wrote: This franchise has become such an embarrassment. Would this be a story with any other team? Sure it would. Whether it would get played up as much with some other team is questionable, but there's nothing about the circumstances of this story which make it unique to the Mets. Insurance plans for players with expensive and long term contracts are common.

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Fman99 wrote: Joel Sherman should hang himself with a noose made out of flaccid dicks. Where would he get such a thing? There's an app for that.

-- I've already heard this discussed in 'wave of the future' terms but I think that's a bit premature. Maybe one day 5-man rotations will seem as antiquated as the 4-man does today, but I don't think those days are quite around the corner yet. -- I'm predicting this doesn't last more than three or four times through. Someone will get hurt or suck and a trade has got to happen at some point. Colon's hot start seems to have taken him off the trade block (in people's minds anyway) after being at the head of it virtually from the moment he was signed (Francesa was campaigning for him to be re-signed for next year ... good influence on the young guys, etc.) but he'd still be attractive to some pennant/WC dreaming team. -- The Nats had no problem relegating Tanner Roark to the pen even coming on the heels of his 15-10/2.85 season in 2014 (a better season than either Strasberg or Gonzalez). But now Fister in on the shelf so he slides right back into the rotation and pitched quite well his first time out. It can be done.

Colon - 2.6 ATorres - 0.6 Familia - 0.5 Robles - 0.3 Flores - 2.6 Duda - 1.4 Granderson - 1.0 Murphy - 1.0

Flores - 1.5 Murphy - 0.5 Tejada - 0.5

Murphy - 2.0 Tejada - 1.0

Syndergaard - 2.0 Goeddel - 1.0 Plawecki - 0.5

d'Kong76 wrote: Stuff out there that Kirk is going to Angels... but that's all I got so far. In exchange for Trout, right? OK, Kirk plus Matz for Trout but the Angels have to eat some salary.

ZvHQiLLn1rc This is the one I thought about. We were going so poorly at the time that, even though I was aware that a big fly would win the game, it never once entered my mind that such a thing could possibly occur. When it actually did happen it was such a bolt out of the blue that it brought me both out of my chair and out of my funk. I generally retained some hope for Kirk even though his minor league career never really profiled him as anything beyond a 3rd/4th outfielder who might start on a bad team or back up on a better one. Would show flashes of raw talent but then inevitably mixed in too many flailing Ks and ineptness vs LHPs. Hoped he'd clear waivers and get stashed at Vegas for a future role, or at least bring back something other than a suitcase of cash in return but, seeing as how Syndergaard has already out-hit and out-HR'd him this season, it wasn't looking good. I blame his oversized spring beard.

Centerfield wrote: Is Julio Franco retired? Someone should see what he's been up to. I heard something just recently that he was coaching but had also gotten into some games. Might have been in east Asia somewhere, or maybe Senegal, I dunno. But it's worth a shot ... he won't turn 57 until later this year!

Tough to know what to make of Grandy's "surge" lately. Last season he OPS'd 468 in April, then jumped to 838 & 933 in May & June, kind of split the difference in July with a 753 before plummeting to 415 in August, then back up to 918 in September So while I'd love to say that he's figured something out and is in for a lengthy streak, we've seen this movie before and it adds up to lots of movement but nothing resembling a trend.

And the frustrating part is that it didn't look like this going in. They started off with a crew plus some backups who had some combination of either finishing up strong last season (Nieuwenhuis), or had really good springs (Nieuy again, plus Muno, Mondell, Castellanos), or had a track record of ML success in specific role situations (Mayberry vs LHP, Nieuwy vs RHP) and yet ALL of them have thus far failed miserably and then the ones brought in to replace the initial washouts are now washing out.

Murphy - 1.5 Cuddyer - 0.5 Leathersich - 0.25 Gilmartin - 0.25

Zvon wrote: Hey, maybe I should be using RBIs instead of homers to decide Flores fate in my imaginary Mets world (where I possibly replace him at the ASB). And of course he should have more RBIs than errors at that point. So how should that go? Over 40 RBI by the ASbreak? I say homers cause that's how they are trying to sell him, and he's hitting his fair share, but I really don't care how he contributes offensively as long as he does. Like I said, I don't see him hitting for average. He's got 21 ribbys. It won't be easy. But that's what we really need from him. Jeeze, that's what we need from all of 'em. The thing is if you erase all the HRs with guys on you really don't have much with Flores. So to do that I imagine he would have to continue hitting the big homer from time to time. So he really should accomplish both. Would going by RBIs be fairer? Or maybe -- just a wild suggestion here -- you can judge him on the totality of his game without resorting to the need to invent some sort of pass/fail threshold based solely on using a couple of completely unrelated stats. And, while doing so, do keep in mind that he's a 23 y/o with less than a full season's worth of ML ABs to his name spread over parts of three seasons. Also, while we're on the subject, your whole premise here seems to be hanging on two "facts" which I don't see as facts at all. 1) that he, more than most other players, deserves to have these arbitrary standards put on him because he's already cast in stone as a low-avg/high-power hitter. But his minor league stats don't indicate anything like that (near .300 BA across 3,000 ABs but never as many as 20 HRs in a season) in fact the biggest question surrounding him as he came up concerned his power. Reports I read on him were, at best, mixed on how much he'd display which, when combined with the uncertainty about where he's fit on the field, is what kept him from the upper reaches of the prospect lists. 2) that the team has somehow "sold you on" him as a power hitter ... something I don't get at all. They obviously know he's not twinkletoes out there but they're hoping that his offense will more than make up for whatever else he lacks. I don't remember a word specifically about his power although if they were depending on it it seems to have worked seeing a how he's leading all of baseball in HRs by a SS (tied w/Peralta though in 25 fewer ABs) and 4th in RBIs. So how 'bout we see how his entire game, and the team's for that matter, all works out before jumping to conclusion by the AS break of his first full year based on nothing more than some arbitrary statistical coincidences?

But it wasn't a homer and that's what he was brought in to do ... or so I heard. I never said he was brought in for anything. I never put it that way. Yeah, you pretty much did: [from the 'Unsucking' thread] "I mean, what he's there for. To hit homers."

Familia gets through the inning even though retiring only one batter. Someone now needs to take advantage of that.

But it wasn't a homer and that's what he was brought in to do ... or so I heard.

Between deGrom's hitting skills (good) and his bunting skills (horrid) he should never bunt again.

Zvon wrote: Frayed Knot wrote: "But he has to keep the HRs above the errors through out the second half. If he makes it past the ASG it shouldn't be too hard to meet my expectations. I'm not asking too much from the guy." -- Judged by the history of the position, this is virtually the definition of asking too much from him. In the case of Flores I think it's a pretty fair measuring stick. I mean, what he's there for. To hit homers. If he can't do it, and he can't field at least average, he shouldn't be there in the first place. But Sandy made his choice. I'm for giving Flores the time he needs to succeed. And that would be early July. I don't understand a single bit of the logic being used here. Not the initial part behind this arbitrary linkage between HRs & errors; not why you seem to think that it should apply to Flores in particular; not how he, presumably more than others, was brought it "to hit homers"; not why his inevitable replacement, almost certainly to fall short of the same standard, wouldn't be subject to the same rigor.

"This isn't an evaluation of the average shortstop." -- No, it's an evaluation of a SS in the first quarter of his first full season in MLB. "This is "The Flores Power Vs. Fielding Chart". Alls he has to do is have more home runs than errors at the ASbreak and he can continue on at short." -- Even though his replacement will also most likely fail to make that same standard? And then how quickly does that guy get axed when the numbers don't add up? "But he has to keep the HRs above the errors through out the second half. If he makes it past the ASG it shouldn't be too hard to meet my expectations. I'm not asking too much from the guy." -- Judged by the history of the position, this is virtually the definition of asking too much from him.

So lets see where we're at with Flores. Games: 40 Homeruns: 7 RBI: 19 Errors: 9 Until he has more homers than errors he's on my shit list. What percentage of everyday shortstops do you suppose out-homer their error total in a given year? ... I don't know either, but I'd venture a guess that it's decidedly in the minority, both now and in the history of the game.

Errors committed at SS this season: Marcus Semien (OAK) - 17 ... SEVEN-FRICKIN'-TEEN!?! Ian Desmond (WAS) - 12 Danny Santana (MIN) - 10 Elvis Andrus (TEX) - 10 Starlin Castro (CHC) - 9 Wilmer Flores (NYM) - 9 And, yes, errors don't tell the whole story. But SSs (and/or 3Bmen) almost always have the highest number of errors on the team so comparing Wilmer's errors to someone else not at that position is totally meaningless. 20+, if he continues the pace he's at for the majority of the season, would be high but not absurdly so (50+ for Semien on the other hand ... ) and it's not like we'd have ZERO errors at SS with someone else out there. He seems to be getting a bit more comfortable out there (maybe wishful thinking) and I think a lot of the criticism came from the timing of some of his early miscues (flubbed GiDPs, etc.).

Weren't the prettiest game in the history of baseball, but I'll take it.

Ceetar wrote: I'm not suggesting the Mets should necessarily deal Matz, i'm just theorizing on the price for an above average hitter for a long time who can play many positions and it's still May. Obviously it depends on Billy Beane too. Maybe Matz is too close to the majors, but it's probably right around what the As ask for. And what they'd promptly get hung up on for. Again, Zobrist was just traded and it was with a legit ML SS and what Tampa got back was a 30 y/o part-time Catcher/DH plus Oakland's recent (2012) 20th & 34th round drafts picks* neither of whom had passed A-ball. And that was all before Zobrist tore his knee and when he still had a full season left as opposed to < 3/4 of one. He's essentially a more versatile version of Murphy right down to them both being short-term rentals and that neither one of them is bringing back an almost ripe, top ten LHP prospect cuz, if they could, they would have been traded last week along with whatever else the trading team wanted. * one of which is oddly named Boog Powell. Now how does a kid named Herschel born in California in the '90s acquire the nickname 'Boog', especially one that's listed at all of 5' 10" - 185? If I were the original Boog I'd sue.

I suppose I sometimes fall into the trap of not making enough of a distinction between Adam Sandler movies and movies with Adam Sandler in them.