Trade Season Opens

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

Cubs swap RHP Scott Feldman & C Steve Clevenger to O's for Jake Arrieta, RP Pedro Strop.

TiTTs for the O's. Arrieta is supposed to be good but has struggled. Feldman, we saw just recently, is pretty good in a Traschelian way.

[seawolf17]

Every time I see Strop's name, I want it to be a palindrome. It's not.

[RealityChuck]

His nickname is "Ports," though.

[Frayed Knot]

Ricky Nolasco goes to the Dodgers for three minor leaguers--pitchers Josh Wall, Steven Ames and Angel Sanchez.
Remember in ST when the Dodgers had too much starting pitching?

Earlier this week, the same LA Dodgers acquired released Cubs reliever Carlos Marmol.

[bmfc1]

Scott Hairston to the Nationals. The Cubs get an "unnamed Class A pitcher." Who knew that you could trade Scott Hairston mid-season?

[smg58]

And when he's not hitting at all, to boot.

[smg58]

The Cubs received Ivan Pineyro, who just made the jump to high A.

http://www.milb.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?sid=milb&t=p_pbp&pid=606335

Not bad peripherals, and his second start at high A was much better than the first. There are obviously no guarantees, but he has at least a realistic chance of being a useful player and Hairston is hitting .172.

[Guest Swan Swan H]

Both teams are getting an additional player, per MLB Trade Rumors.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

So... Byrd would bring back, like, a really-High-A pitcher?

[Edgy MD]

You trade Byrd, you better have an answer who is playing right for the Mets this October.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

[Guest Swan Swan H]

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: So... Byrd would bring back, like, a really-High-A pitcher?

Yeah, like Dock Ellis no-hitter high.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

Edgy MD wrote: You trade Byrd, you better have an answer who is playing right for the Mets this October.

Like, in Arizona?

[seawolf17]

James Brown is dead.

(And still a better hitter than Ike Davis!)
--zing--

[smg58]

Edgy MD wrote: You trade Byrd, you better have an answer who is playing right for the Mets this October.

Well Satin does have to play somewhere.

[Guest Swan Swan H]

smg58 wrote: Edgy MD wrote: You trade Byrd, you better have an answer who is playing right for the Mets this October. Well Satin does have to play somewhere.

Not there.

The Mets floundered while playing the statue of Paul Bunyan in left field and converted infielders and various other midgets in center field. Once they began playing real outfielders in the outfield the whole thing stabilized. Duda's move to 1B (and then to the DL) almost exactly coincides with their recent good play - his last game in left was the Nooey walk-off slam game.

Please don't put a guy who runs like he's trying to sneak into the house without waking his wife in right field. I expect we'll have Duda back in left before long, and the sound of balls crashing into the gaps will keep me awake at night.

[Ceetar]

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: So... Byrd would bring back, like, a really-High-A pitcher?

Maybe. If someone's desperate. I think you trade him for a _good_ High-A prospect, not for middling gut-shot stuff. Doesn't have to be as good as Synagaard, but at least a plus pitch or something.

[metirish]

There is the Hairston contract too.....$2.5 million this season and next....one would assume that factored in to what they got back?

[Edgy MD]

I just don't want to watch this trade-Byrd campaign to turn into another hate campaign if they don't.

[Benjamin Grimm]

You'd better avert your eyes then.

[Guest Swan Swan H]

Edgy MD wrote: I just don't want to watch this trade-Byrd campaign to turn into another hate campaign if they don't.

It's already started.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

Ceetar wrote: LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: So... Byrd would bring back, like, a really-High-A pitcher? Maybe. If someone's desperate. I think you trade him for a _good_ High-A prospect, not for middling gut-shot stuff. Doesn't have to be as good as Synagaard, but at least a plus pitch or something.

Granted. Something with some potential.

[Edgy MD]

And the problem remains that, and this is awesomely jumping between two threads, if nobody judged to be of appealing potential is offered, we have to live in the assumption that something was, because we're Met fans.

Bitter, bitter Met fans.

[Vic Sage]

Or maybe just cynical, cynical Mets fans who think that management is loathe to trade in a single win in a losing season for even the prospect of an increased talent pool a few years down the road. And surely Sandy will be gone by then, if he doesn't start winning more now, so what does he care about the long-term?

It's my fear (and that of some other fans) that the Mets engage in this type of short term thinking. It's not that we think Sandy must have been offered something better for Hairston but he turned it down because Mets are stupid/cheap/evil, etc., but when Sandy says he didn't trade Hairston last year because what he was offered was duplicative of what they already had, either he's stupid or thinks we are. Redundancy is essential, particularly at the lower levels of the minors. And Since Sandy obviously knows that, the only reasonable inference is that he chose to have Hairston on the roster to finish out the year, so they could possibly win a few more games... not because they were in a pennant race (god forbid), but because they wanted to sell a few more tickets, parking spaces, overpriced beers, and hotdogs, and hats. Now whether that was his choice (to increase job security) or a directive from above (to increase profitability), we cannot know, but i certainly have my suspicions, based on my respect for Sandy's baseball acumen.

And if they pull the same shit with Byrd this year, many will feel that it'll be for the same bullshit reasons and yes, the hate will ensue... and will have been earned, in my view.

[Edgy MD]

Sure sounds nitpickingly bitter to me.

I mean, oh fudge, we might have had --- checking paper --- the likes of Ivan Pineyro. Or maybe not. Who's Ivan Pineyro? I don't know, but I'm going to spend years bemoaning his loss under the notion that he was a bird in hand even though we have no idea whatsoever.

[Vic Sage]

potato, potahto...

[batmagadanleadoff]

Vic Sage wrote: Now whether that was [sandy's] choice (to increase job security) or a directive from above (to increase profitability), we cannot know, but i certainly have my suspicions, based on my respect for Sandy's baseball acumen. And if they pull the same shit with Byrd this year, many will feel that it'll be for the same bullshit reasons and yes, the hate will ensue... and will have been earned, in my view.

Oh c'mon. Just say it already. Not everyone's against you on this point. OK I'll say it. Its that mutt, eff Wilpon. What are they gonna do to you. Urge you to say nice things about eff? And Jeff?

[Vic Sage]

i wasn't trying to be coy about it. I'm just not as certain as you are where its all coming from. Sandy might be a reluctant captain following orders, or he might be directing this himself. Do i think its Fred? Actually, i'm starting to think Jeff has more control over things these days. But either way, it was some bad decision-making last year with Hairston and, if they repeat that process this year with Byrd, it'll be equally wrongheaded.

[batmagadanleadoff]

Vic Sage wrote: i wasn't trying to be coy about it.

I know. I just needed the thinnest of premises to write "eff Wilpon". It rhymes with Jeff, you know. I can't believe that Megdal's getting crucified here for advocating a trade of Byrd. Byrd's had a decent last month, month and a half and we're supposed to act like he's Hank Fucking Aaron.

[Vic Sage]

Sure sounds nitpickingly bitter to me. I mean, oh fudge, we might have had --- checking paper --- the likes of Ivan Pineyro. Or maybe not. Who's Ivan Pineyro? I don't know, but I'm going to spend years bemoaning his loss under the notion that he was a bird in hand even though we have no idea whatsoever.

Anger at how the franchise makes decisions about building its team and replenishing its system is "nitpicking"? That is some huge fucking nit, my friend. That is the Godzilla of nits.

As to who Ivan Pineyro is, check here:
http://metsmerizedonline.com/2013/07/nationals-acquire-scott-hairston-from-the-cubs.html
where it says: "Pineyro, 21, is 6-3 with a 3.24 ERA in 15 starts at Class-A and was named to this year�s South Atlantic League All Star Team. Going into this season, Hagerstown pitching coach told MLB.com, that if Pineyro continues to pitch the way he has been, he will be a big league pitcher."

But that's not the point. the point is this is the value in the market for Hairston when he's making a few million this year AND next year, while hitting .170. So what was his value to pennant-contenders going down the stretch LAST year, when he was hitting well, and unencumbered by future contractual obligations? Do you seriously think it was LESS than this A-Ball all-star arm? That's the floor. How much more he was worth is anybody's guess, and only Sandy knows what he was offered. Although he's been quoted as saying he rejected offers because they matched what they already had in the system. Do you really think redundancy is a valid reason not to swap out such players? Well you don't think ANY trade is appropriate, but i mean from the team's viewpoint. Redundancy is essential, and you have posted as much on more than one occasion.

So whether Pineyro becomes anything or not, at least the Cubs have a chance that he will... while we do not. Lets not make the same mistake AGAIN, is all i'm saying.