Who Didn't Juice?

[Valadius]

If you had to guess, which great players from the Era of Steroids chose not to partake in them?

My first guess would be Ken Griffey Jr. He was just too naturally talented, in my opinion, and had a good head on his shoulders. I just can't see him cheating.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

Juicers didn;t juice to cheat; they juiced to keep up.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Eh.

I didn't juice.

[nymr83]

Ripken and Gwynn would be my top choices, but its hard to say than anyone is above suspicion

[Guest Mendoza Line]

="Edgy DC"]Eh. I didn't juice.

Your post count went way up after age 40. I'm not convinced.

It's impossible to prove that someone didn't juice. But Frank Thomas was no huger at 35 than he was at 25, and he didn't have any weird spikes in his numbers as he aged. So I've always mentally given him the award of Least Likely Juicer Among Steroid-Era Sluggers.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

I juiced once.

Pulp got all over the place, and it got sticky fast.

[Guest Vince Coleman Firecracker]

There are tons of different steroids and other performance enhancers out there that all serve different purposes. If you want to bulk up like Barry Bonds, there are steroids for that. If you want to get lean and trim like Ken Griffey Jr, there are steroids for that. There's no single body type out of all the exposed steroids users that allow anyone to guess based on what they see.

Also, the idea that users will have changed body types at some point is flawed, since steroids are readily available to high school aged players.

There's no way to know how many people juiced and are juicing right now (since the "steroid era" is not over, despite what might be spun from major media outlets). We can only tell who's been caught, which probably doesn't give us an accurate picture of PED use as a whole.

[metirish]

All the players I think as nice guys didn't juice , like Thome , Piazza....and the guys I think are dicks did juice.....

[Guest Edgy DC]

I imagine the correlation between nice-guyness and juiciness isn't nearly as strong a correlation as we'd like it to be.

[metirish]

="Edgy DC":1eop5802]I imagine the correlation between nice-guyness and juiciness isn't nearly as strong a correlation as we'd like it to be.[/quote:1eop5802] exactly , which is one reason I don't like to dwell on it for too long.

metsguyinmichigan Jul 29 2009 11:55 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jul 29 2009 02:02 PM

I'd say no Mets, and most, if not all, of the Yankees. Especially Jeter, who took the one that bulks up the hype and reduces range.

SteveJRogers Jul 29 2009 12:00 PM

="metirish"]All the players I think as nice guys didn't juice , like Thome , Piazza....and the guys I think are dicks did juice..... To be fair, I've heard a smattering of "Piazza is a dick" stories. Again, they aren't as plentiful as say Seaver is a dick, Bonds is a dick or so on. And yes of course the stories tend to boil down to a few seconds of interaction between someone acting like a fanboy and a famous person who just might not be in the proper frame of mind to be gladhanding or whatever, but the point is you can't cherry pick "nice guy" and "dick" like that and judge if someone did something illegal based off of it.

Edgy DC Jul 29 2009 12:02 PM

Exactly nobody is doing that. This is all speculative and we're grown up enough to realize that.

seawolf17 Jul 29 2009 12:05 PM

I think Irish was taking the piss here, folks. Relax. I, personally, completely agree with MGIM.

metirish Jul 29 2009 12:08 PM

="SteveJRogers"] ="metirish"]All the players I think as nice guys didn't juice , like Thome , Piazza....and the guys I think are dicks did juice..... To be fair, I've heard a smattering of "Piazza is a dick" stories. Again, they aren't as plentiful as say Seaver is a dick, Bonds is a dick or so on. And yes of course the stories tend to boil down to a few seconds of interaction between someone acting like a fanboy and a famous person who just might not be in the proper frame of mind to be gladhanding or whatever, but the point is you can't cherry pick "nice guy" and "dick" like that and judge if someone did something illegal based off of it. suffice it to say I am of the belief that Rogers has and continues to use steroids.

SteveJRogers Jul 29 2009 12:21 PM

Easy there you piss taker you...

metsguyinmichigan Jul 29 2009 02:12 PM

Steve opined: "To be fair, I've heard a smattering of "Piazza is a dick" stories. Again, they aren't as plentiful as say Seaver is a dick, Bonds is a dick or so on." -- I've met Seaver three times, and each time he was very friendly -- and one time exceedingly so. Granted, all three times were at card shows, where he fully expects to be interacting with fans and is getting paid to do so. Maybe if we went up to him in a restaurant when he and Nancy were enjoying dinner and I was being annoying, he'd be less so. The most recent time was at a card show in Chicago and near the end of his signing time and there was no one left on line. I had my young son with me, and didn't want to pay the steep fee -- luckily, I had a number of things signed back in the 1980s when such things were still reasonable -- and asked if I could just go up and shake hands. I explained that I grew up in New York in the 1970s thanked him for being a good role model at the time -- my parents were always grateful that Seaver never grew his hair long -- and introduced him to my son. He was gracious, chatting for a little whole, and we were sure not to overstay our welcome. So Steve, hands off Seaver!

Farmer Ted Jul 30 2009 11:26 AM

Big Papi, c'mon down. You're the newest to be accused through media leaks.

seawolf17 Jul 30 2009 11:30 AM

Papi's one of those guys I kinda assumed, all things considered. Not terribly surprising.

smg58 Jul 30 2009 11:48 AM

Leak every name from that 2003 list or no name. One or two names at a time is just bullshit.

Valadius Jul 30 2009 02:24 PM

I agree with smg. There's no independent verification for this, so every time a "leak" occurs, I have to assume it's a load of crap. It's guilt without evidence.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jul 30 2009 02:55 PM

="smg58":yxi25atc]Leak every name from that 2003 list or no name. One or two names at a time is just bullshit.[/quote:yxi25atc] If they can pin down the leak, one or two names at a time is actionable (as it should be).

[Guest metsguyinmichigan]

I'd say no Mets, and most, if not all, of the Yankees. Especially Jeter, who took the one that bulks up the hype and reduces range.

[stevejrogers]

="metirish"]All the players I think as nice guys didn't juice , like Thome , Piazza....and the guys I think are dicks did juice.....

To be fair, I've heard a smattering of "Piazza is a dick" stories.

Again, they aren't as plentiful as say Seaver is a dick, Bonds is a dick or so on. And yes of course the stories tend to boil down to a few seconds of interaction between someone acting like a fanboy and a famous person who just might not be in the proper frame of mind to be gladhanding or whatever, but the point is you can't cherry pick "nice guy" and "dick" like that and judge if someone did something illegal based off of it.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Exactly nobody is doing that.

This is all speculative and we're grown up enough to realize that.

[seawolf17]

I think Irish was taking the piss here, folks. Relax.

I, personally, completely agree with MGIM.

[metirish]

="SteveJRogers"] ="metirish"]All the players I think as nice guys didn't juice , like Thome , Piazza....and the guys I think are dicks did juice..... To be fair, I've heard a smattering of "Piazza is a dick" stories. Again, they aren't as plentiful as say Seaver is a dick, Bonds is a dick or so on. And yes of course the stories tend to boil down to a few seconds of interaction between someone acting like a fanboy and a famous person who just might not be in the proper frame of mind to be gladhanding or whatever, but the point is you can't cherry pick "nice guy" and "dick" like that and judge if someone did something illegal based off of it.

suffice it to say I am of the belief that Rogers has and continues to use steroids.

[stevejrogers]

Easy there you piss taker you...

[Guest metsguyinmichigan]

Steve opined:

"To be fair, I've heard a smattering of "Piazza is a dick" stories.

Again, they aren't as plentiful as say Seaver is a dick, Bonds is a dick or so on."

-- I've met Seaver three times, and each time he was very friendly -- and one time exceedingly so.
Granted, all three times were at card shows, where he fully expects to be interacting with fans and is getting paid to do so. Maybe if we went up to him in a restaurant when he and Nancy were enjoying dinner and I was being annoying, he'd be less so.
The most recent time was at a card show in Chicago and near the end of his signing time and there was no one left on line. I had my young son with me, and didn't want to pay the steep fee -- luckily, I had a number of things signed back in the 1980s when such things were still reasonable -- and asked if I could just go up and shake hands.
I explained that I grew up in New York in the 1970s thanked him for being a good role model at the time -- my parents were always grateful that Seaver never grew his hair long -- and introduced him to my son.
He was gracious, chatting for a little whole, and we were sure not to overstay our welcome.

So Steve, hands off Seaver!

[Farmer Ted]

Big Papi, c'mon down. You're the newest to be accused through media leaks.

[seawolf17]

Papi's one of those guys I kinda assumed, all things considered. Not terribly surprising.

[smg58]

Leak every name from that 2003 list or no name. One or two names at a time is just bullshit.

[Valadius]

I agree with smg. There's no independent verification for this, so every time a "leak" occurs, I have to assume it's a load of crap. It's guilt without evidence.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

="smg58":yxi25atc]Leak every name from that 2003 list or no name. One or two names at a time is just bullshit.[/quote:yxi25atc] If they can pin down the leak, one or two names at a time is actionable (as it should be).