Now what

[Centerfield]

Mulder?

Tomo Ohka?

I'm open to ideas. This winter sucks.

[Guest Yancy Street Gang]

Roger Clemens?

No, just kidding. I don't expect that to happen.

I'm thinking we may already have the entire 2007 starting rotation.

This winter does suck.

[Guest Yancy Street Gang]

Steve Trachsel is still available.

[Guest attgig]

="Yancy Street Gang"]I'm thinking we may already have the entire 2007 starting rotation. This winter does suck.

I have no problems with our starting rotation the way it is.

Glavine
Duque
Maine
Perez
Pelfrey/Humber

with Pedro coming back around All Star Break

Pedro
Glavine
Duque
2 spots for the other 4 depending on how the 1st half of the season went.


none of the offenses in our division really scares me to think we absolutely need someone better than duque to hold down the #2 spot for 1/2 a season.

we'll be near top of the standings throughout the all star break, and pedro coming back healthy will bring us over the top.

[Guest Yancy Street Gang]

I have no reason to think that 2007 will go as smoothly as 2006. (That's the lesson of 1987.)

I think that rotation is way too unstable, everyone is either too old or too young. There's so much that can go wrong.


Anyway, here, according to ESPN, are the remaining free agent starting pitchers:

Aaron Sele, SP       36 Free Agent  LA Dodgers
Brian Moehler, SP    34 Free Agent  Florida
Bruce Chen, SP       29 Free Agent  Baltimore
Chan Ho Park, SP     33 Free Agent (San Diego
David Wells, SP      43 Free Agent (San Diego
Jamey Wright, SP     32 Free Agent  San Francisco
Jason Johnson, SP    33 Free Agent  Cincinnati
Jeff Weaver, SP      30 Free Agent (St. Louis
Jerome Williams, SP  25 Non-TenderedOakland
Joel Pineiro, SP     28 Non-TenderedSeattle
John Thomson, SP     33 Free Agent  Atlanta
Mark Mulder, SP      29 Free Agent (St. Louis
Mark Redman, SP      32 Free Agent  Kansas City
Ramon Ortiz, SP      33 Free Agent (Washington
Rick Helling, SP     36 Free Agent (Milwaukee
Roger Clemens, SP    44 Free Agent (Houston
Russ Ortiz, SP       32 Free Agent  Baltimore
Shawn Estes, SP      33 Free Agent  San Diego
Steve Trachsel, SP   36 Free Agent  NY Mets
Tomo Ohka, SP        30 Free Agent (Milwaukee
Tony Armas, SP       28 Free Agent  Washington
Victor Zambrano, SP  31 Non-TenderedNY Mets

[smg58]

I'm not absolutely for standing pat, but attgig makes a good point, and I'd prefer standing pat to a panic deal. This rotation, with Trachsel instead of El Duque, got us to within an inning of the World Series. We're still well ahead of the rest of the division.

[metsmarathon]

toss a year lightly at jeff weaver, perhaps?

[Guest Yancy Street Gang]

They should talk to Mulder. He's only 29; maybe he has something left. If I remember correctly, though, he's not expected to be ready to pitch in April. The Mets already have a guy like that in Pedro.

Ohka is 30. Armas is 28.

It's too bad Suppan is no longer available. Why was he in such a hurry to sign with Milwaukee? A pox on him and his stem cells!

[Guest attgig]

Yancy Street Gang wrote: I have no reason to think that 2007 will go as smoothly as 2006. (That's the lesson of 1987.) I think that rotation is way too unstable, everyone is either too old or too young. There's so much that can go wrong. Anyway, here, according to ESPN, are the remaining free agent starting pitchers:

that list gives me so little desire to go after anyone else as a replacement for our 5 man.

I would take a look at jerome williams for a minor league contract - he was supposed to be the next doc at some point of his minor league career.

Mulder - looking at his recent track record, wouldn't be high on my list unless it was an incentive-laden deal.

others just aren't really worth looking at imo.

[Guest OlerudOwned]

Persue Dan Haren, maybe.

[Guest Rotblatt]

Huh. FA pool looks better than I thought--there may be some bargains to be had.

Pineiro used to be good, and he's only 28. A reclamation project for Mr. Peterson? If looks crappy as a starter in the spring, we could move him to the pen, where he was decent last year (4.81 ERA v. 6.62 as a starter, with nearly a K/IP).

Ohka & Armas could be league average or better if healthy. If either have any options left, they'd give us some real flexibility.

Weaver's still got decent stuff, although he gives up a hell of a lot of dingers. Mulder looks like a pretty good gamble for an incentive-laden contract.

I don't think any one of them is the answer, but these guys could certainly help us build some redundancy.

[MFS62]

Random thoughts about some of the other names on that list.

John Thompson - maybe united with Peterson he can be ok. He might be a steal if obtained at a reasonable price.

Mark Redman - the poster boy for why it may not be a good idea to have every team represented on the All Star team.

Has Bruce Chen played for one team more than once in his travels? (I was only joking. Sorry if I ruined anyone's dinner by mentioning his name.)

If rabid SF fan Cris Russo says Ortiz is terrible, he must be.

Don't know where it is, but a few weeks ago, I mentioned the possibility of Traschell and Zambrano returning to the Mets staff in 2007. I hope I'm wrong on both counts.

Later

[Guest iramets]

="attgig"] ="Yancy Street Gang"]I'm thinking we may already have the entire 2007 starting rotation. This winter does suck. I have no problems with our starting rotation the way it is. Glavine Duque Maine Perez Pelfrey/Humber with Pedro coming back around All Star Break Pedro Glavine Duque 2 spots for the other 4 depending on how the 1st half of the season went. none of the offenses in our division really scares me to think we absolutely need someone better than duque to hold down the #2 spot for 1/2 a season. we'll be near top of the standings throughout the all star break, and pedro coming back healthy will bring us over the top.

Dare I suggest we maybe can get another young arm for the rotation by trading Burgos for Brian Bannister? Scrambling around for starting pitching shortly after dumping some for a long-shot with an ERA like the defense budget maybe suggests a headless chicken running amok? Maybe it's just me. We will get another starter between now and April 1, no doubt. That he will be a nickel cheaper or a tiny bit better than Bannister remains to be seen, but he's certainly not going to be both. I vote "headless chicken."

[Guest Yancy Street Gang]

To be fair, we were saying the same things about Seo and Benson last year.

[nymr83]

and Bannister is not Seo or Benson. Bannister is also not the type of pitching we are looking for, we have a half-dozen guys better than him. If we get anyone at all it needs to be a potential top of the rotation guy, Mulder fits the bill if he straightens himself out, a few of those other guys (Weaver, Piniero, Redman for me) are interesting but I'd cringe at giving them more than 1 year plus an option.

[Centerfield]

I think at this point you have to over-pay for Mulder a bit. Let the kids try out until Mulder is ready, hope that some of them pan out. If not, hope that they can stay in it until Mulder or Pedro come back. And hope that at least one of the two return to form.

And if that doesn't work, hope for a deadline deal.

[Guest iramets]

Nymr83 wrote: we have a half-dozen guys better than him.

1.
2.
3
4.
5.
6.

Go.

You have a creaky rotation, it gets creakier and has already lost parts and been depleted by injury, so your solution is: to add no one, and to trade off one of your more effective young starters? If we had a half-dozen better starters than Brian Bannister, we wouldn't be having this discussion at all, would we?

No, I'm afraid Omar swapped BB feeling cocky he'd be able to sign some #1 guy and maybe more than that. So far, he's failed and the loss of Bannister now seems a bigger mistake to me than it did a month ago, and that's saying something.

[nymr83]

Glavine, Maine, Perez, Pelfrey, Heilman, Humber are all guys I'd rather pencil in to my rotation than Bannister. At gunpoint i might rather have el-duque as well.

[Guest iramets]

Heilman? Who's your 8th inning guy, then? The fabulous Mr. Whoever?

Humber? Pelfrey? Look, I'll go along with you, but people mainly told me Bannister was expendable because he had so little MLB experience. But next to these guys he looks like Nolan Ryan.

The only way I'd rationalize going with a rotation like you suggest would be to have some real depth behind it. As far as I'm concerned, I'd want Pelfrey and Humber in AAA and call them up when (not if) some geezer pulls up lame. If they're in your rotation from day One, who are you calling up?

[Guest Johnny Dickshot]

]If we had a half-dozen better starters than Brian Bannister, we wouldn't be having this discussion at all, would we?

Seems to me we do and we are.

To be sure let's proceed to the argument of Bannister's superiority over any or all of the remaining candidates.

Fill in the blanks in the following sentence:

Bannister is better than (a-h) because _____________ .

a) Glavine
Hernandez
c) Perez
d) Maine
e) Pelfrey
f) Humber
g) Heilman
h) Williams

[Guest iramets]

You know, you're right. Eight starters plus Pedro. We should trade some more of them off. What the hell did we want Zito for anyway?

Now what? No prob. We're all set. BRING IT AWN!!

[Guest Johnny Dickshot]

Yeah, I can't do it either.

[Guest Johnny Dickshot]

I guess my concern at this point is that I'd have preferred to part with young pitchers who wouldn't make the rotation for the upgrades we might need at 2B or the outfield or catching... now we may also have to make a stressful trade for a pitcher, at least down the road a ways.

I suppose till them I'm game for a death-struggle at spring training.

[Frayed Knot]

Bannister's walk-on status in college, followed by his 7th round draft pick potential and his 6 ML starts complete with a negative K/BB ratio coupled w/a 1.47 WHiP certainly has earned him a share of admirers among a certain segment of Met fans. Or maybe it was the limp home.

By all accounts he's a smart guy and a great kid who'll likely get the most out of his talent. But I've never heard him described as having anything other than just average stuff and, while hardly ancient, will already be 26 before the season starts.

[metsmarathon]

ooh, death-struggle!

cue the vulcan music from star trek!

[smg58]

You have to start by making a realistic assessment of where Pelfrey and Humber are right now (it's pretty clear that they had already passed Bannister on the depth chart in the eyes of the Mets), and then decide if there's somebody in the FA pool who'd be an upgrade in 07 that would not require a multi-year committment. I'm not sure if there's a match, given the current market (which, as of this morning, is even more inflated than I previously thought), but there's no good reason not to look for one.

As for deals, you have to be careful. I see no point in trading Milledge for less talent in return, and dealing Humber or Pelfrey for a pitcher you'd need to re-sign next offseason could do the rotation more harm than good in the long run. I'd like a better-than-average pitcher if one is available at a reasonable price, but there might not be any.

[Guest Johnny Dickshot]

One other seeming wildcard when it comes to weighing youngsters vs. experienced guys is how hard you can afford to push them if you do keep them around.

Worrywart statheads can produce plenty of data illustrating the seeming danger of dramatic increases in workload from one season to the next with young pitchers, because MLB seasons are longer than minor or college years.I think the CW today is to gradually increase the IPs season to season, and that expecting 200 innings out of a rookie whose thrown maybe 130 max in the minors is asking for an arm surgery.

So they say. (Gary Gentry?)

[Gwreck]

I could stand taking a flier on Joel Piniero.

My prediction is that a mid-season deal is more likely. Given that we did just fine this summer with the pieced-together rotation, we might be able to win some games and worry about major acquisitions around July.

I hope the bullpen is up to the task.

[Guest cleonjones11]

Another year of creaky pitcher du jour.. Oliver Perez? cmon 5 quality starts?

Thanks Omar

zero pitching

[Guest Edgy DC]

Zero?

The Mets had the sixth best ERA in the big leagues last year. The bullpen had the second best.

Yeah, Glavine and Hernandez are old and Martinez is hard to bank on for anything this year, but there are likely as many pitchers due for a sunrise as a sunset, aren't there?