Gather the wood. . .time to fire up the Stove!!

[DocTee]

Molina would be a better option than Hernandez IMO. Both are very good defensively and Castro can provide a nice understudy to either, but Hernandez has some recent injury woes IIRC

[metirish]

From what I have seen of Molina I would love to have him on the Mets,Hernandez failed to impress during the series at Shea, but IIRC he got injured then...plus I think he would be looking for bigger money than Molina, I could be very wrong about that though.

[Frayed Knot]

]Bengie Molina headed to New York?

He's a FA catcher and the Mets are a team w/money in search of a catcher so it's inevitable that writers will connect the two even though it's nothing more than speculation at this point.
Apparently he and Castro are buddies from way back in the Puerto Rico days which only adds fuel to the fire.

One negative: he makes Jason Phillips look like a speed demon.

[Valadius]

Our 25-man roster, subtracting all potential free agents, currently consists of:

Pitchers

1. Pedro Martinez
2. Tom Glavine
3. Kris Benson
4. Jae Seo
5. Victor Zambrano
6. Aaron Heilman
7. Juan Padilla
8. Heath Bell
9. Tim Hamulack

Position Players

10. David Wright
11. Carlos Beltran
12. Jose Reyes
13. Cliff Floyd
14. Mike Cameron
15. Ramon Castro
16. Mike Jacobs
17. Kazuo Matsui
18. Victor Diaz
19. Anderson Hernandez
20. Chris Woodward

Five spots remain. We're likely to re-up Marlon Anderson, and possibly Roberto Hernandez, so that would leave three spots. They would likely go towards a catcher, a closer, and a reserve corner infielder.

P.S. I was quite surprised to see on MLB.com that Chris Woodward is not a free agent. I had assumed he was, but he's not listed as free-agent-eligible.

[MFS62]

Hadn't there been an announcement that the Mets have picked up Steve Traschel's 2006 option?

[Valadius]

I can't say I recall seeing that.

[Valadius]

This from Sportsline:

Several New York newspapers are reporting that setup man Tom Gordon will leave the Yankees because he wants to be a closer and that he could end up with the Mets.

No fucking way. Omar isn't fucking stupid. Whichever newspapers they're referring to are obviously out of their goddamn minds.

[Guest Yancy Street Gang]

From the Daily News:

]Flash ready to close door BY JULIAN GARCIA DAILY NEWS SPORTS WRITER Friday, October 14th, 2005 Tom Gordon's days as a Yankee appear to be over. That doesn't necessarily mean he is done pitching in New York. Gordon, one of four Yankees to clean out his locker yesterday at Yankee Stadium, said he would like to become a closer again. Since the Yankees already are set at that position with Mariano Rivera, it seems as though Gordon, now a free agent, has pitched his final days in pinstripes. "I'd love to close again somewhere," Gordon said. "We'll see what happens, but if it takes me somewhere else, so be it." Now that he has made it clear he wants to close, Gordon could become one of the most coveted relief pitchers on the market. And after Braden Looper's shaky, injury-filled season, it seems as though the Mets will be looking for a new closer.

[Valadius]

We're not going to make Tom Gordon our closer. We simply aren't. That's not how Omar works. Gordon's too old to be a closer.

[nymr83]

i have the feeling that if we signed Gordon he'd suddenly stink. Lets stop looking for old folk to solve our problems.

[MFS62]

Gordon has the kind of stuff (95MPH heater if you believe the tv radar guns, big breaking curve) that makes scouts drool and gets GMs fired.

Pass

Later

[Mex17]

MFS62 wrote: Gordon has the kind of stuff (95MPH heater if you believe the tv radar guns, big breaking curve) that makes scouts drool and gets GMs fired. Pass Later

AT BEST he is the third option behind Wagner and Ryan.

[smg58]

I'd give Heilman a chance first.

[Guest Johnny Dickshot]

I'm not all that jazzed about spending big for a closer, even though Omar's going to and you know it. Considering either guy will ask for 3 years, I might be inclined to go with Ryan here, but I generally get nervous about paying big $$ for a closer.

Ryan, age 30: 69 G, 70.3 IP, 100 K, 26 BB, 4 HR, 170 ERA+

Wagner, age 33: 75 G, 77.2 IP, 87 K, 20 BB, 6 HR, 300 ERA+

[smg58]

Wow, the age difference between Ryan and Wagner is a lot less than I realized. It's not an easy call; I think you have to set a value for the two of them above which you wouldn't go, and then stick to it. But Gordon just strikes me as a waste of time.

[MFS62]

Peterson will probably lobby for Ryan, because Wagner is "too small".

Later

[nymr83]

i have no problems looking at a player's size and "tools" when scouting high school players (because what do high school stats really mean) but at the major league level if a guy has proven he can get the job done who cares how big he is anymore.

[Valadius]

Yeah. Case in point: David Eckstein.

[MFS62]

83, Val,
That was an allusion to the stories we read about some of Peterson's opinions about Kasmir.

Later

[Valadius]

Ah.

Gotcha.

[nymr83]

peterson is a joke anyway, my jr high school gym teacher could have agood staff ERA with hudson, zito, and mulder. peterson has done NOTHING to earn a good reputation.

[Guest Edgy DC]

What indeed has he done to earn a repuation as a joke?

And what makes anybody so sure that none of Hudson's, Mulder's, and Zito's succcess can be attributed to him. I'm not saying he should necessarily get any credit (I don't know), but I don't know from why I've been reading statements for two years that he shouldn't get any.

(The same srgument, of course, can be applied to any co'ach or manager. If their players succeed, it was from the players abilitities, not from the coach's intervention.)

Meanwhile, two years later, people are still bitterly dogging the guy on that basis, even though Zito, Mulder, and Hudson have all backslid to a man.

And do we have any quote where he described Scott Kazmir as too small?

[Guest KC]

Polar silliness - I keep forgetting to click and not read it.

[MFS62]

Of course not. Anything he said to the GM prior to the trade was said behind closed doors.
But there were countless news stories after the deal that said he gave a lot of input to the decision.
Some said it was because Peterson thought Kasmir couldn't contribute imediately because he feels a pitcher needs 500 innings in the minors to get ready.
Some said he felt Kasmir's throwing mechanics would cause arm injuries.
Some said it was because of his size; that he wouldn't have the stamina to be an efective starter.

I'm sure you read all those stories. But this is like asking me to quote Dick Cheney when he advised dubya to invade Iraq. Actual quotes aren't available. And I'm pretty sure you knew that when you asked for a quote.

And based on those stories, it was my hyperbolic interpretation of something he might have said.

Later

[Guest KC]

Just to be clear, I was referring to Nymr as polarly silly. Making loud
internet posts saying a top paid professional has done NOTHING and
that his Jr. high school coach is just as competent is, well, silly.

[nymr83]

its not silly. Hudson, Zito, and Mulder were all well thought of coming through the minors and continued their success in the majors, there is no evidence that Peterson did anything.
Find me a trend of pitchers coming to him and doing better than expected (i can easily find such a trend for a guy like Leo Mazzone.) That is the only way to show that someone is a "good pitching coach."
But hey, lets go with your insane theory that being "top paid" automatically makes you qualified for the job you have.

[Guest KC]

>>>But hey, lets go with your insane theory that being "top paid" automatically makes you qualified for the job you have.<<<

I'm sorry, you're right. I'm insane ... the Mets should have signed your
Jr. high school coach because he's done SOMETHING and isn't a joke
like Rick Peterson.

Next.

[nymr83]

i didnt say he's done something, but neither has peterson.

but lets stop the arguing and move on to something more fun and hopefully more enlightening...
we'll start with Peterson but i'd like to do this for some other guys as well.
for each pitching coach that we want to study we'll come up with a list of pitchers who came to them from another MLB team and a list of those who left and pitched elsewhere. we'll determine, for each of these pitchers, their ERA+ before, during, and after they were under that pitching coach's tutelage, then by weighing each pitcher according to innings (or by only using those pitchers who pitched at least X innings and not weighing it) we'll be able to determine the average ERA+ of all pitchers under the coach's control and what those same pitchers did before and after (if a guy had Roger Clemens and Greg Maddux he'd obviously look good judged solely on his staff's ERA+, but how would he look when taking into account what those pitchers did before him and what they did after him)

yeah this is probably alot of work but i like research and will start on this next week after my final on monday.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Yes, let's you take a baseless potshot at somebody and put other people in the position of disproving it. That's logical.

[nymr83]

i said peterson sucks, KC is the one who made this personal, not me. and when did i put him in the "position of disproving it"? i'm offering to prove peterson's shittiness myself.
neither he nor anyome else has offered evidence, not even anecdotal evidence, that peterson is a good pitching coach