metsmarathon

shouldn't it be just % of vote per game, added up for each game? or, more simply, a count of how many times a given player wins a game? or, more complicatedly, you could set it up similar to MVP voiting, where the top getter gets, say 5 points, and the lowest gets 1, depending, of course, on if you have 5 nominees for a game. the total number of votes per game should remain a constant.

Trachsel 3 Franco 3 Delgado 3 Matsui 1

crap! i gotta submit my voted for this game! lets hope i get around to it tomorrow evening!

the padres should switch to the fancy new "digitzed" camo that the army is using now. also, i really wish my planned yuma arizona test wasn't pushed back, or i'd be at this game. sigh.

i'm not middle aged, and i'm half spanish. not that that makes me dominican or even remotely latino (or remotely not caucasian for that matter) ... i'm just sayin' is all.

oh, well, as long as they're enjoying themselves, then its perfectly ok.

="Centerfield"]An interesting development for those of you that don't read MOFO any longer... From nickstur, friend of the Compadres: You are gonna wanna read what I'm about to write: Ddoggy is a member of pedros compadres he's my friend, and I was asked to go that night but couldn't because I had work. So everybody criticizing is obviously jealous This pedros compadres generated a lot of publicity, a lot of attraction, and isn't that a good thing? PEople come to the stadium, see the comapdres, and point and smile, it's funny why is nationality such a huge idea everywhere on everything? They should've dressed as strictly Dominicans right? Let us know what we can do to dress exactly like a Dominican. Ddoggy had the idea, and it was great...sombreros look good, so do mustaches, Pedro is latino so it wasn't totally out of plcae, nobody cares what nationality anybody is, so being offended would be retarded, and compadres is a latino term so that also fit. I know that these compadres had a **** load of fun, how could they not? Jumping up and down, getting all the attention. It's a Mets game...IT'S A GAME!!, it's supposed to be fun and they had it. I hope we do it again on his next start for anybody who doesn't have a life and spends hours a day talking about pointless garbage, u can continue to criticize. Try doing something on your own time to have fun, but make sure you don't drink too much, because then omg it's offensive to irish people, because they drink alot!! that doesn't even make sense. would you dress like an italian to commemorate the accomplishments of an irishman, or a ukranian? wouldn't saying "eh, its white folk, so its all the same. irish, italian, whatever" be equally stupid, and offensive to all those with brains. because stupidity is offensive.

i certainly think that glavine earned his 6 points, if nobody else on teh team did. besides, these points are relative, not absolute. in some games, points come easier. in others, points are harder to earn.

Glavine 6 Heilman 1 Woodward 1

i'm not sure how identifying any moments of triple crappiness can bring us any joy, or greater appreciation of the mets, or even insight into the mets. at least the tripple happinesses, while not really providing insight in to the mets, can give us joy. unless there's some therapeutic benefit to triple crappiness. overall i vote nay.

Feliciano 3 Woodward 2 Julio 1

i hate that in new york, shyness, it seems, is a deep character flaw.

well, that explains the soriano trade.

yeah, i know. call it my one stupid move this season... until the next.

well, the "this second" thing was more a response to the poll, not this threa. here, i said i'd make the trade. as far as the "Good of the Game" argument as a reason not to make the trade, it really wasn't even mine to begin with. i just tried to expand on another poster's, and likely to ill effect. i mean, i think that the rich getting richer at the expense of the weak getting weaker in what seems like (but isn't necessarily) an endless feedback loop is very likely bad for the game, and may well be killing the game in small markets, and markets without major league teams. however, so long as we are among the ranks of the rich, i see no reason why we should not take advantage of the system while the system hands us these advantages. if not us, then the yankees, right? so, in conclusion, the "good of the game" was never a factor in my own decision to make the trade.

i know, i'm going to grow to regret that trade. i was thinking at the time... i should hold off, think it through a bit... but then i saw how truly poorly i was doing in wins and other pitching stats and made a rash decision. i shoulda shopped a bit, i think. oh well. we'll see how it turns out in the end.

Martinez 3 Delgado 2 Nady 2 Loduca 1 Sanchez 1 Wagner 1

="Bret Sabermetric"]I don;'t know why you would be reluctant to "get into it" with me. If you're willing to defend your statement, I'll argue it with you, or if you want to change it or retract it, I'm fine with that (as long as you acknowledge the changes and not try to tell me you were really saying something other than what you said.) "get into it" meaning arguing angrily as opposed to discussing calmly. i think i threw in an ad hominem. that's what i regret. sorry. ]Why would a Met fan say that homeboys tend to sign with their organiations? You don't remember Fonzie or Straw? Popular homegrown stars whom the fans loved, and whom the Mets organization heaped money all over? Didn't help. well, i don't think its a met fan thing specifically, but rather a baseball fan thing. i think that in general, there is an idea out there, maybe its just a hope, that by sticking with a player, he will be more likely, if not terribly much moreso, to re-sign with a given team instead of test the free agent waters. but i think i've thrown enough qualifiers in there to make certain that i have no idea how much more likely i, or other fans in general, think players are more or less likely to re-sign with their teams, and i also think that i've thrown out enough qualifiers to make it certain that the above statement is not representative of all fans or all met fans. heck, i'm not sure how much i even believe it. but i'm sure some people out there do. [qoute]Not that I'm trying to malign either of those players. But the market is what it is. One organization is likely to find Fonzie roughly as valuable as another, and he's going to want to sign the best deal he can. His agent is certainly going to push him in that direction. And the odds of positive ties to the organization seem to me about equal to having a negative history with the organization.

orel hershiser did, if that's who you're thinking of...

Beltran 1 Wright 1 Castro 1 Bradford 1 Reyes 1

Bannister 1 Nady 3 Delgado 3 Reyes 1 Loduca 1 Heilman 1

Glavine 4 Sanchez 2 Wagner 1 Nady 1 Reyes 1 LoDuca 1

GYC wrote: Is it weird that I've created a spreadsheet of my own Schaefer points? i've done the same thing, so i hope not. i also did one with my predictions, that i'm gonna update at game 16, 32, etc.

(snippy remark edited out. replaced with long topic for discussion) i hate this thread. i'm particularly hateful of my getting into it with sal, instead of sticking to the actual points i was trying to make. i probably should let this thread die, and what not. who knows. i'm still bugged by one thing. basically, one of the objections to the proposed wright trade is the ability to resign him versus the ability to resign willis and/or cabrera. i think that argument was stronger when those making it thought miggy and willis would be gone after this year, and not next. (i'm pretty sure it is next year that their free agent clocks expire after, meaning if we were to trade for them, we have them for the remainder of this season, plus 2007, before we have to worry about resigning them) and i wonder if that is more a matter of perception, or misperception, that players who comes through the farm system of a given team are more likely, or signficantly more likely, to re-sign with the team than a player brought in from another team, even if that player spends a year or more with us. i mean, sentimentality aside, that would seem to be the strongest objection to such a fanciful, unrealistic wright for cabrera/willis trade, right? personally, i'm not so sure that the mets would be any more likely to re-sign wright than they would to re-sign either cabrera or willis, despite the fact that i'd like to imagine a world where players are loyal to the teams (and fans) that brought them up and stuck with them to the point that such loyalty would make them less likely to test the free agent waters and seek the best deal out there wheresoever it may take them. so, that's about it. this is all just a likely-much-too-late attempt to bring this discourse back into the realm of baseball discussion. but have at it. any differing opinions? anyone think that teams are more likely to resign their own players than imported players? has anyone ever conducted, or dug up, some research or what-not which would lend some insight into the issue? sigh.

i'll just bang away some more on my keyboard, and have my words not be understood, and have y'all make more silly proclamations as to the nature of all mets fans based upon my typings. this'll be fun. where exactly do i say that the mets are morally superior, particularly for their losing? what i did say was that fans of most teams grow to like the players on their team, often preferring them to players on other teams who may even sometimes be superior to those players. its a natural human response. familiarity, fondness, etc. fans often like to see players they've come to like, to look forward to, etc. to stick around with their team, instead of being traded away for some other piece. (and those fans, in the wake of such a trade, may often come to like the new player even more than the old player, pending the results!) fans often tend to like continuity from one year to the next in the form of successful players returning for another year of action. fans often tend to like to see their own team develop its own star players instead of importing them via trade or free agency, despite the often lesser liklihood of doing so. (and those fans also often will tend to like those imported players too, if they're good) fans also like to see their baseball teams make player/personnel moves which will improve the team, and improve the liklihood of winning a world's championship, either in a given year, or in the forseeable future. i guess if you've not payed any attention to fans of whatever team you're a fan of these days, you'd understand a little better that humans have all sorts of motivations and rationales for their actions and decisions and interests. maybe you disagree with those people. wonderful. you can't tell me that its unfathomable that they could react that way. ... i see now that my critical mistake was in not qualifying this a bit more: ]Met fans would rather win 90 games with David Wright, than 95 games without him, because he is a Met. He's one of ours. it wasn't meant to be a blanket statement of all met fans, or even of this met fan in particular. some met fans would rather keep a star, future superstar, player that's come up through their own system, that's they've been looking forward to, that they've come to think of as one of their own, then to get rid of him coldly, even if it is for an upgrade. i admit. i am among those met fans who wish we had a superstar player developed in our own minor league farm system, and keep him long term through his free agency. however, and i'm sure i've said this before. i make the trade, loathe as i am to make it. maybe i haven't said that enough to allow y'all to not misconstrue my point. there are reasons some met fans wouldnt make the trade, and i think those reasons are legitimate. different strokes for different folks, i guess. i'd still make the trade. ... i guess chipper jones and bernie williams are no more rare commodities in baseball today than they were in the past, and i'm sure some research could lend some support to the notion, but am i crazy in saying that the general perception is that players don't stay with teh teams they came up with, as much as they used to? i feel like i hear that rather often, alongside escalating player salaries and the DH rule, as reasons for baseball's supposed decline across these great states. i guess i'm crazy for thinking that fans like to see top prospects come up through the farm system, develop into star players, and ultimately retire all for the same team. i don't know where i could possibly have gotten that from. but then, i also don't know where i ever say that teams shouldn't trade away future stars for current stars, and more of them. after all, i'd make the trade. i don't thik i ever characterize those trades as a bad thing, aside perhaps from a general "good of the game" standpoint, in which case, its reallly more the commisioner and the union who should be involved in putting together a framework whereby such trades are less necessary for the weaker teams to remain marginally profitable. if these trades are indeed a bad thing, the commish and the MLBPA should come up with a new CBA that helps the weaker teams get stronger. i don't think i ever say that the mets shouldnt make a trade that would weaken another team. that would be dumb. in fact, i imply that it would e better for baseball for miggy and dontrelle to land in flushing, compared to the alternative of them landing in the bronx. if any strong team is to benefit from a weak team, then i want it to be my strong team. because i would make the trade. ... but then, i'm not sure also where its suddenly become my cause celeb that the mets "dont trade homegrown mets" because i'd make the trade. i guess its that i feel fans like to hold onto their star players insteaed of trading them away. but that's really more a preference than hard-fast rule, and certainly i'd trade away homegrown players to make the mets better. afterall, i'd make the trade. and i don't quite know how my already stated position that i would trade david wright for miguel cabrera and dontrelle willis would really address my feelings for the building of the 1986 championship mets. i guess since i would trade david wright for miguel cabrera and dontrelle willis, then surely i would not have traded for keith hernandez or gary carter. ... i don't know why i bothered with any of this shit.