Trade Deadline 2010

[Guest Edgy DC]

Ankiel and Farnsworth to the Braves is deliciious. They were already ideal Metemies without having them in the division.

Hopefully the Braves and Phils gutted themselves muscling up for this stretch run.

[ashie62]

RealityChuck wrote: G-Fafif wrote: Mets trade any possible impulse to send Davis, Niese, Tejada, Parnell packing for patience and realization there are no short-term gains to be made. Best trade of the day. Second that. There was no one out there worth mortgaging the future for (and that includes a rental of Lee).

They should have shopped Frankir, P Feliciano and Castillo

[G-Fafif]

Ashie62 wrote: RealityChuck wrote: G-Fafif wrote: Mets trade any possible impulse to send Davis, Niese, Tejada, Parnell packing for patience and realization there are no short-term gains to be made. Best trade of the day. Second that. There was no one out there worth mortgaging the future for (and that includes a rental of Lee). They should have shopped Frankir, P Feliciano and Castillo

We don't know that they didn't, or that the shoppees didn't retort by saying, nah, no thanks, but we'll take some of those younger, inexpensive, more mobile fellows off your hands.

To get anything for Francoeur or Castillo, I imagine Omar Minaya would have to get Omar Minaya on the other end of the line.

[Guest Edgy DC]

As for not trading Barajas, he probably went down before anything was consummated.

[MFS62]

The rest of the season is going to be a war. And this is the Antebellum:


Views of future victories,
Scattered all around the floor.
Reaching for the phone but, he can't do it any more.
And I wonder if it�ll ever cross his mind.
But he�s runnin� out of time.

It's a quarter after one, Omar didn�t get it done and I�m steaming now.
The Mets won�t play this Fall, Omar dropped the ball, and I�m steaming now.
Not sure if they can compete without that trade they needed now.

Keep looking at the done deals,
Wishing there was just one more.
Omar might complete one,
just like he has done before.

And I wonder if it ever crossed his mind.
It used to happen all the time.

It's a quarter after one, I'm a little drunk, And I need one now.
The Mets won�t play this Fall, Omar dropped the ball, and I�m steaming now.
Not sure if they can compete without that trade they needed now.

It's a quarter after one, Omar didn�t get it done,and I�m steaming now.
The Mets won�t play this Fall, Omar dropped the ball,
and I�m steaming now.

Not sure if they can compete without that trade they needed now.
They just need it now.
They just need it now.

Yes I'd rather hurt than feel nothing at all.

Later

[bmfc1]

Loved that, MFS.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Really? Are you really that angry?

Phooey on deadline deals and fool's gold they promise.

[bmfc1]

I'm not angry but disappointed because I think that they still have a slight shot this year (maybe it's less than 10% but it's greater than zero). If Omar doesn't think that they do (a logical position), then he should have been able to trade to improve the team next year (G-Fafif had a good point that perhaps the only GM that would have traded for Francoeur and Castillo is Omar, but if Jacobs can be dealt then who knows?)

You're anti all trades, Edgy, citing them as "heartless." I want more than a .500 club and I'm sure that you do too but how do you do that w/o trades, FA and/or a great farm system. The Mets, by all accounts, don't have a great farm system so what then? I contend that a clever GM does that by trading overrated prospects and current expendables (e.g. Barajas). And that certainly should have been done w/o trading Thole, Ike, etc. (and it's nice to have untradables). Bottom line for me is that Omar did nothing to improve the team, either for '10 or '11.

[Guest Edgy DC]

bmfc1 wrote: I'm not angry but disappointed

I was really addressing the singer of the song, who claims to be steaming. I don't know anybody who really is, and don't really know why they'd be, except some folks maybe want to be.

If Omar doesn't think that they do (a logical position), then he should have been able to trade to improve the team next year (G-Fafif had a good point that perhaps the only GM that would have traded for Francoeur and Castillo is Omar, but if Jacobs can be dealt then who knows?)

I don't think the choice has to be between this year and next. I think you can play for now and work for the future.

I want more than a .500 club and I'm sure that you do too but how do you do that w/o trades, FA and/or a great farm system.

Maybe with two of the three. Maybe even with one of the three.

The Mets, by all accounts, don't have a great farm system so what then?

I don't think that's really true. I certainly think they have a very good farm system --- if not great --- certainly when you consider the broad balance of prospects.

I contend that a clever GM does that by trading overrated prospects and current expendables (e.g. Barajas).

Sure, but Barajas is hurt and that's that. Another more important way you build a farm system is by scouting broadly, signing aggressively, and developing carefully.

Bottom line for me is that Omar did nothing to improve the team, either for '10 or '11.

My feeling is that what a good GM does to improve his team is to grow his assets and cash them in on the field in Flushing, not dealing them away for Ted Lilly.

I'm certain he's still in the market, but I really don't think restraint represents a lack of ability or judgment or talent or decisiveness or caring or understanding of the job or all sorts of things folks might want to ascribe to him. There are perhaps dozens of choices of Omar Minaya's I disagree with, but I think the judicious exercise of restraint is a wonderful quality, and I don't think we know nearly enough to think that his restraint wasn't judicious.

Don't we all remember how the Mets were laughably out of the Johan Santana candidates because Minaya either hadn't develoed enough attractive prospects or wouldn't part with the few they had? They were languishing behind more high-profile teams. (Say it with me: Yankess, Red Sox, Phillies.) But they not only were (1) the winners there, but (2) by playing hardball got him for less than expected, and (3) signed him to a long-term deal.

Here's to restraint. Sometimes it gets you a bargain, and other times it allows you to walk away with your chips stil in your pocket. Either way you win, I think.

You don't really need to be against trading to think it still sometimes not the right time to trade. Besides, as far as i can tell, almost all trades Minaya makes are hated on the day they happen anyhow.

[MFS62]

Edgy DC wrote: Really? Are you really that angry?

Not really. I felt the muse, chanelling all the people (and hosts) talking about the lack of a deal on WFAN. (And it will probably continue tomorrow as the weekday hosts resume their tedia.)

Personally, I'm happy that Omar didn't mortgage the future for a brand name band-aid.
But there was a lot of talk a few days ago about a Peresz + Castillo deal for Carlos Zambrano. Omar even discussed the possibility in a post-deadline interview. I would have been OK if he had pulled that off.

Later

[ashie62]

I am dissapointed that the Wilpons are distracted to the point where Sterling Mets is secondary.

[Frayed Knot]

Ashie62 wrote: I am dissapointed that the Wilpons are distracted to the point where Sterling Mets is secondary.

I don't even know what that means.
Also not sure I want to.





Lost in the deadline deals was the BoSox finally landing their catcher, sending several pieces to snag the mercurial Jason Saltalamacchia. No word whether the Rangers included numerous sew-on lower-case 'a's to go along.
I guess 'Salty' gets to compete for the #1 catcher's job next season what with Victor Martinez headed for FA-gency after this year and Jason Varitek to the glue factory, but for now it gives them a third lousy defensive catcher.

They also sent reliever Ramon Ramirez - the one rumored to be available for Barajas - to SF for a AA arm. Don't know anything about the guy - Dan Turpen - but his numbers don't look all that exciting and there's a big difference between a minor league reliever and the starting, or even platoon, catcher they supposedly wanted.

[G-Fafif]

I hate the trading deadline. Not trades, just the stupid, artificial deadline. I wish the Mets had improved their club (don't ask me how -- I hate pretending to be a GM...I'll leave that to Omar Minaya) but I always wish the Mets would improve their club. I'm glad they didn't give away the farm or a farm product, but maybe if they had, it would've worked out.

Call me when a move is made, not when somebody writes about a rumor. Also, let me know when Adam LaRoche is done detonating Citi Field.

[batmagadanleadoff]

I'm not upset that the Mets kept their young 'uns. I'm annoyed that the team is essentially competing one man short, so long as Ollie Perez is on the 25 man roster. And I'm pissed that Jeff Francoeur got about 300 plate appearances by the all-star break. Because full-time-Frenchy should not be part of the plan from a mega metropolis market team that charges its fans about $200 for a good seat to one of its games. Francoeur equals bullshit. What the fuck were they thinking? That Francoeur was gonna have a Hank Aaron season because the team put him on a poster in a pre-season ad campaign?

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

Yeah I think in the end, relying as much as we did on Frenchy was a bad bet, although its conceivable that we coulda gotten away with less Frenchy had Beltran been available all year. Not to say this wasn't foreseeable (same with our getting so little offensively from the catchers).

I think they've gotta release Ollie at this point. If they're afraid to use him and he can't help stop the bleeding when down by 9, who needs him. I'd actually have more patience with him were they actually utilizing him as a starter again; at least then we'd know exactly what it is we're throwing away.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Yeah, I would too, but if Manual can't find the opportunities or the interest to get him the sort of work that might or might not help rehab him, and he's hapless the few times he is set free, what's the point?

Regarding Francoeur, I'm particuarly plussed about the volume of work he's gotten since the All Star break and since Bay got hurt. Come on. It's like Jerry's in that mode of, "I need to get him going if we're going to turn this thing around, so I'm going to keep trying to get him going even if it means driving this thing into the ground." Move on, you madman.

[Gwreck]

Edgy DC wrote: Yeah, I would too, but if Manual can't find the opportunities or the interest to get him the sort of work that might or might not help rehab him, and he's hapless the few times he is set free, what's the point?

I still can't figure out why there hasn't been any new movement on sending him to AAA. We know he has talent and they've invested the bucks; I don't understand why we can't get him down there to pitch regularly. I know he balked at the idea back in May but now that we've seen what's happened since his pseudo-DL stint is over, I think they need to take another shot at getting this done.

[Guest Edgy DC]

I suspect that there either (a) is some energy being expended in that direction, or ( will be within the next few hours. Either way, I think it's probably even money he isn't on the roster for the Braves series. Igarashi, Stoner, or Bruney --- YOU make the call.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Yeah I think in the end, relying as much as we did on Frenchy was a bad bet, although its conceivable that we coulda gotten away with less Frenchy had Beltran been available all year.

Within the realm of possibility? Sure. But not likely, I suppose. I'm thinking that Pagan would have had fewer at bats than Cora had that been the case.

I think they've gotta release Ollie at this point. If they're afraid to use him and he can't help stop the bleeding when down by 9, who needs him. I'd actually have more patience with him were they actually utilizing him as a starter again; at least then we'd know exactly what it is we're throwing away.

They booed him today as he took his warmup pitches. The atmosphere around him is beyond toxic-- it's a cancer cluster.

[Guest Edgy DC]

That sucks. He didn't dig the 10-1 hole.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

Also, his beard looked as far from laughable as I've ever seen it.

[ashie62]

Frayed Knot wrote: Ashie62 wrote: I am dissapointed that the Wilpons are distracted to the point where Sterling Mets is secondary. I don't even know what that means. Also not sure I want to. Lost in the deadline deals was the BoSox finally landing their catcher, sending several pieces to snag the mercurial Jason Saltalamacchia. No word whether the Rangers included numerous sew-on lower-case 'a's to go along. I guess 'Salty' gets to compete for the #1 catcher's job next season what with Victor Martinez headed for FA-gency after this year and Jason Varitek to the glue factory, but for now it gives them a third lousy defensive catcher. They also sent reliever Ramon Ramirez - the one rumored to be available for Barajas - to SF for a AA arm. Don't know anything about the guy - Dan Turpen - but his numbers don't look all that exciting and there's a big difference between a minor league reliever and the starting, or even platoon, catcher they supposedly wanted.

Simple, their other businesses, real estate, are in the crapper and attention to the Mets is secondary. Omar is not going to fire Jerry. Omar and Manuel can go down on the ship together if the Wilpons can them.

[ashie62]

Wilpon sued over Madoff loses. Fred may have been a bagman by accident.

http://proxy.espn.go.com/blog/new-york/mets/post/_/id/7681/fred-wilpon-sued-over-madoff-losses

[HahnSolo]

Wasn't sure if post-deadline non-Met deals merited its own thread, but the early-Aughts Cardinalization of the Reds continues, as Cincy picks up Jim Edmonds from the Brewers. Can Fernando Vina be far behind?

[Guest Edgy DC]

Great transformations in recent years.

The Redicization of the Nationals.
The Cardinalization of the Reds.
The Red Sox Nationicization of the Dodgers.

And some would say the Exposition of the Mets.

[Vic Sage]

i would certainly agree that Omar has EXPOSed the Mets... to perpetual mediocrity, a resentful fanbase and pundit ridicule.

[MFS62]

Mets fans have sensed the Evil Empiricism of the Yankees.

Later

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

Um, yay? (For as-yet-unnamed prospects, as per radio reports.)

The Atlanta Braves are on the verge of acquiring first baseman Derrek Lee from the Chicago Cubs and hope to have the deal finalized by this afternoon, according to the Chicago Tribune. The only thing holding up the deal is Lee's back problems. He had an injection in the epidural of his lower back to ease discomfort from a bulging disk on Monday and missed the last two games. Lee, in the final year of his contract, has $3.4 million remaining on his salary. The slugger is hitting .251 with 16 homers, but has had a .939 OPS since the All-Star break. Glaus, whose body has shown fatigue, has struggled with a .575 OPS the last two months. He will not be an option at third base. Lee, who can veto a trade with his 10-and-5 rights, rejected a deal to the Los Angeles Angels in July. Yet, the Braves have been told that he would approve this deal.

[metirish]

They always do a trade like this right?

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

Seems like they've swapped first basemen at the deadline three of the last four years, doesn't it?