David Wright for Miguel Cabrera & Dontrelle Willis!

[Guest mlbaseballtalk]

From the mind of a wacky idea caller on 1050 ESPN Radio and parrotted by thought to be legendary broadcaster Warner Wolf (though that reputation is being tarnished every time he takes the mic on WABC radio and 1050 ESPN Radio) as a "You HAVE to make that trade" trade!

This is amazing that the host actually agreed with a nutso caller "There are 29 GMs that would make that deal, except for the Marlins"

Steve

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

Of course you do that trade. Don't be silly.

[seawolf17]

I have a mancrush on David Wright and I'm not afraid to admit it.

I still make that trade; it's a no-brainer. But nobody, not even the Marlins, are dumb enough to make that deal.

[Guest abogdan]

The trade makes absolutely no sense from the Marlins perspective.

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

Two (impending) huge salaries lost, one impending low salary for the next two years gained. They lose Willis and Cabrera anyway to FA, so why not expedite the process and gain a few years of Wright for peanuts? He's better than any draft choices they'd be getting, and all-but-guaranteed results besides.

[Elster88]

I'd love to see Wright play here 15 years and become the best Met hitter of all time, but you have to do that trade.

Of course, we need to be guaranteed to sign them both. Without that the trade is not good for the Mets either, no?

[Guest Edgy DC]

This thread's getting more action than the IGT.

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

Well, we did get called "nutso" by someone talking a pretty nutso position. That's going to be seen as fairly provocative.

[Guest abogdan]

]Two (impending) huge salaries lost, one impending low salary for the next two years gained. They lose Willis and Cabrera anyway to FA, so why not expedite the process and gain a few years of Wright for peanuts? He's better than any draft choices they'd be getting, and all-but-guaranteed results besides.

I understand why they would be interested in trading away Willis and Cabrera, but for only one player, who is only one year further away from just as large of a payday, doesn't make sense. All of Florida's moves this off-season have brought back multiple players at different stages of their development cycle.

The only way Cabrera and Willis get dealt is if the Marlins get multiple players who they can have more than just one year of at minimum salary. For Delgado, they received three minimum wage years of Mike Jacobs and three minimum wage years of Petit. For Beckett, they got three minimum wage years of Hanley Ramirez, three minimum wage years of Anibal Sanchez, and got out of the nearly untouchable Mike Lowell contract. They shouldn't settle for just an extra minimum wage year from a stud third baseman in exchange for their own stud third baseman, and a 24-year old, left handed, 20-game winner.

[Guest KC]

I don't see it as quite the no-brainer as some of you. Trading the face of the
new Mets who doesn't make much for two guys you have to wow the crap
out of with new contracts to keep 'em? Wright likes it here, I like him here,
I want him here for the majority of his career.

[nymr83]

if The Marlins are going to lose them anyway why not keep Wright and sign Willis as a free agent?

[Guest KC]

Wright, I mean right.

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

It's a matter of allocating your resources. The Mets with Pedro and Delgado under contract are overspending for a playoff team now Not to boost your chances (while giving up very little, probably gaining a lot) in terms of your team's overall # of young stars makes it a no-brainer

Which is not to say the Marlins will offer such a deal , nor that the Mets have the kind of brainpower required to jump at it before the Marlins change their mind.

[Guest KC]

How is giving up Wright anything approaching "very little". And who's gonna
play third, trade for Ty Wigginton?

[nymr83]

Cabrera is actually playing 3B this year for the fish, we'll see how that goes...

[Guest KC]

I'm thinking outfielder, and wanted to get the Ty joke in. Sorry.

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

KC wrote: How is giving up Wright anything approaching "very little". And who's gonna play third, trade for Ty Wigginton?

Wigginton's actually off to a good start. You think maybe we could get him for Julio? That would be kinda sweet.

But I think maybe we could get this guy to try playing third. I mean, as long as we have him on the roster and everything.

OE: and to answer your question about losing very little: when you trade a 23-year old spectacular 3b man and you get a 23-year old spectacular 3b man back, and you pick up a great pitcher, most people consider that as a net gain. Of course Mets fans see that as a very even trade, but I'm not trained in analyzing the thought patterns of Mets fans,. Maybe JB could help you out there.

[Guest KC]

Oh well, here I am thinking we're talking baseball and that's nice (even though
I got a little 3B egg on my face which I apologized for) and then you gotta be a dick
again. Nice while it lasted, maybe we can try again tomorrow.

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

Well, I wrote that before I read your apology. (Is asking me a snide question about Wiggy "being nice"? I guess you have a different definition of "nice.") Here's a link for Wiggy's current stats, as a parting gift for playing the "Be Obnoxious to Sal and Get to Play the Victim Anyway" game:

http://search.espn.go.com/keyword/search?searchString=Wigginton&Find=Search&source=b_sportsindex_mlb

[Guest KC]

I was trying to be funny re: Ty. You have a long way to go before I'm going
to be nice.

You might want to change your sig line before you go pointing victim fingers.

Have a nice evening, it's really quite lovely out today.

[metsmarathon]

cabrera has all of 72 games under his belt at third, but in those 72 games, he seems to be a slightly about an average fielder.

wright has 238 games at third and also seems to be an average fielder, if not statistically slightly behind cabrera, based on baseball prospectus' estimation.

going off more traditional fielding stats, cabrera has an 0.892 f% and an 0.803 ZR, compared to wright's 0.948 f% and 0.767 ZR.

i'm surprised wright's range is so relatively small. i would have expected better based on having watched him (tho i've not really watched much cabrera against which to make a comparison)

so in a pure numbers sense, it appears that wright straight up for cabrera would be a slight upgrade.

... does cabrera have as good a reputation as a leader and potential future MVP as wright? i feel as if i've heard such things as intangibles mentioned, too? i dunno. also don't know if such a thing means all that much, or would even be based in as much reality, if it is just a function of a better PR machine...

and so, trading wright for a slight upgrade in cabrera, and getting a cy young candidate in willis, would seem to be a no brainer.

except that both teams would be trading the faces of their franchises, and fan favorites as well. the trade would likely be disastrous for the fish, and i'm sure there'd be some backlash from mets fans who'd like to see one of their own develop into an MVP, particularly for us, instead of bringing one in.

met fans are emotionally invested in wright, and i think rightfully so. for that reason, i could understand reluctance to trade him away, regardless the returns.

and i'm sure that met fans will view wright as more re-signable than willis/cabrera, wether or not that's really true, which will of course lead to complaints of trading away 15 years of the future for not more than three years of the present.

i would not want to be the met gm who is forced to make a deicison if faced with this trade proposal. in the end, i'd likely ultimately pull the trigger, and hate myself in the morning.

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

KC wrote: I was trying to be funny re: Ty. You have a long way to go before I'm going to be nice. You might want to change your sig line before you go pointing victim fingers.

You've changed your mind? Now it's okay that I spew crap from the past?

I've never seen anyone who liked being quoted in sig lines less than you.

Well, actually, I don't know how Edgy liked

"What entertains you about loudly saying hostile things that are clearly untrue when measured by any sound elementary logic?"--Big Train, 7/22/04

but I know you definitely didn't appreciate the whole "Piazza is never going to be on another postseason Mets team" thing. So that's twice I've honored you by incorporating your words of wisdom in a sig line that you didn't like it much. Can't imagine why.

Oh, don't give me that shit about trying to be funny. You weren't funny, you were just being snotty. What, you thought you'd crack us all up by forgetting Cabrera is a 3bman, so we'd have to get Wiggy? HAHAHA, I guess your lack of knowledge about Cabrera's current position is pretty funny, after all.

Disingenuous horseshit, is what you're trying to peddle. Try elsewhere.

[Guest KC]

Nope, really was just joking.

That's quite an extensive archive you have there of things you're pissed off
about. They must be neatly organized if you can whip them out so quickly.

Thanks for adding another exhibit.

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

And while you're at it, could you explain the "Ty joke" to me? What, you think we could trade Julio (and Maine) and get him back or something? Or that you were ignorant about how well he's playing, in addition to your ignorance about Cabrera, and that's somehow amusing? You think maybe the money we pissed down a rathole signing Benson last year couldn;'t be spent on a FA now if we'd kept Ty all along? I'm not even seeing what's funny, or supposed to be funny, here, even if I believe you for a second that that was your intent.

[Guest mlbaseballtalk]

Bret Sabermetric wrote: Well, we did get called "nutso" by someone talking a pretty nutso position. That's going to be seen as fairly provocative.

I'm calling the caller into the show nutso because he is treated as such on the radio stations here in NYC, They call him "Steve The Idea Man" (no relation) and usually mock whatever hairbrained "Get rich quick" style scheme he has. Steve From Staten Island has to be one of the most annoying regular callers to either WFAN or 1050 ESPN Radio

[Guest KC]

The Ty joke (attempted and clearly failed joke) was I forgot that Miguel
is not playing in the outfield and that if we traded Wright we wouldn't have
a (probably all-star) 3B in David there and I know you like Ty and I don't
think he'll really amount to much (and most baseball people don't either)
I said we could trade for him. rofl lololol.

You may not be angry, but you sound awfully angry and I think you're over-
reacting. Again.

I apologize and actually I said sorry earlier in the thread too.

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

mlbaseballtalk wrote: ="Bret Sabermetric"]Well, we did get called "nutso" by someone talking a pretty nutso position. That's going to be seen as fairly provocative. I'm calling the caller into the show nutso because he is treated as such on the radio stations here in NYC, They call him "Steve The Idea Man" (no relation) and usually mock whatever hairbrained "Get rich quick" style scheme he has. Steve From Staten Island has to be one of the most annoying regular callers to either WFAN or 1050 ESPN Radio

You weren't disagreeing with the nutty caller? I read your initial post to mean that you were saying that he (and Wolf) were obviously insane for suggesting the Mets trade Wright for Cabrera and Willis. Isn';t that what you were saying?

[Guest mlbaseballtalk]

Bret Sabermetric wrote: ="mlbaseballtalk"] Bret Sabermetric wrote: Well, we did get called "nutso" by someone talking a pretty nutso position. That's going to be seen as fairly provocative. I'm calling the caller into the show nutso because he is treated as such on the radio stations here in NYC, They call him "Steve The Idea Man" (no relation) and usually mock whatever hairbrained "Get rich quick" style scheme he has. Steve From Staten Island has to be one of the most annoying regular callers to either WFAN or 1050 ESPN Radio You weren't disagreeing with the nutty caller? I read your initial post to mean that you were saying that he (and Wolf) were obviously insane for suggesting the Mets trade Wright for Cabrera and Willis. Isn';t that what you were saying?

I actually didn't hear the entire call, maybe it made more sense I don't know, I just don't respect the knowledge of said caller and Wolf beyond the basics to talk local stars to make anything beyond the "you HAVE to make this trade" knee jerk reaction

Thinking about it, if you can gaurantee we sign both to long term deals, and Cabrera doesn't become another Bobby Bonillia, it might be crazy enough to work.

I was also coming at it from a "Can we not do what the Yankees, Knicks and Rangers have been doing" angle as well as this would be right out of that playbook of taking "home grown" stars and turning the team into a "Glorified ATM"

Baseball move, yeah its a no brainer, but there are different angles and the Mets should fall into the "We make this deal because we can" way of doing things

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

This is a silly point. Can you guarantee we'll sign Wright to a long-term deal? Of course not, and you don't even want to at this stage But you'll have exclusive negotiating rights to Dontrelle and Miguel (who's hispanic! Another giant plus!) for a while. You'd turn this deal down if you couldn't sign them up before finishing the trade? That's unbelievable.

You don't ask a lot of questions if someone puts a diamond in your hand, you just take it. Unless you're a Mets fan. Then you ask so many questions that the seller gets hinckty and you're left with flat nothing

[Elster88]

I'm a lot more confident that we'd be able to sign Wright when he hits free agency than I would be about signing BOTH Miggy and Willis if we made that deal. I think any Met fan (or any Met-news followers) would say the same. No?


And if you don't sign both then I think it's a bad trade for us.