Soriano refuses to play outfield for Nationals

[Zvon]

Soriano refuses to play outfield for Nationals

VIERA, Fla. -- Alfonso Soriano refused to play the outfield for the Washington Nationals in what was supposed to be his spring training debut Monday night, and general manager Jim Bowden said his biggest offseason acquisition will go on the disqualified list if he doesn't agree to switch positions this week.

"The player refused to take the field, which we believe is a violation of his contract," Bowden said.

Soriano, a four-time All-Star second baseman, was listed as batting leadoff and playing left field on a lineup sheet posted in the Nationals' clubhouse before Monday night's 11-5 loss to the Los Angeles Dodgers.

But when the Nationals took the field in the top of the first, Soriano wasn't out there. With play just about ready to start, left field was empty.

Confused players and fans looked toward Washington's dugout. The only person to emerge, however, was Nationals manager Frank Robinson.

He approached plate umpire Mike Estabrook and made a defensive switch, moving Ryan Church from center field to left and putting Brandon Watson in center to replace Soriano at the top of the lineup.

The Nationals already have an All-Star second baseman in Jose Vidro, so they told Soriano they want him to move to the outfield, and he indicated he doesn't want to do that. But Monday provided his most concrete -- and visible -- objection.
"I just hope they can fix the situation," Washington outfielder Jose Guillen said. "That's up to the people upstairs and Soriano. I think everybody's a grown-up man here. I just hope for the best for the team and those guys, and that they can fix the situation. But that's pretty much not my business."

When Soriano first reported to camp last month, the question of whether he would accept the switch was left open until his return from the World Baseball Classic.

Soriano played for the Dominican Republic, which was eliminated in the tournament semifinals Saturday. He joined the Nationals on Monday and worked out with teammates in the afternoon, but he wouldn't speak to reporters.

The Nationals acquired Soriano from Texas in a December trade that sent outfielders Brad Wilkerson and Terrmel Sledge and pitcher Armando Galarraga to the Rangers. After the deal, Washington made it clear that Vidro would keep his spot at second; Soriano made it clear that he wasn't happy.

Soriano lost his arbitration case this winter and is due to be paid $10 million this season, still a record for the highest salary awarded in arbitration.

The Nationals are off Tuesday, then travel to play the St. Louis Cardinals in Jupiter on Wednesday. If Soriano refuses to play in that game and again at home against the Baltimore Orioles on Thursday, the Nationals will take action.

"We told him if we get to Thursday, and he refuses to play left field, we told him at that point we will request that the commissioner's office place him on the disqualified list, at that time -- no pay, no service time," Bowden said.

"If he refuses to play and goes home, and the commissioner's office accepts our request to place him on the disqualified list, then at that point, if he were to sit out this year, he would not be a free agent, he would stay our property because his service time would stay the same."

Robinson sat down privately with Soriano for 20 minutes before the game Monday to explain the team's position.

"If he's going to play here, he's going to have to be out in left field," Robinson said. "He said he's ready to play, he needs to play, he's ready for the season, and I penciled him in the lineup in left field."

Robinson said the meeting with Soriano was civil, but the player's position was clear.

"He's very sensitive, and he has a mind-set," Robinson said. "He lets you know how he feels."

Trading Soriano, already a possibility, becomes more likely now -- with less than two weeks remaining before opening day.

"He's going to play left field. He needs to be out there now the next couple of weeks to play, and if he's not going to play for us, we need to know so we can go forward," Bowden said. "We obviously will field offers, but we're not going to give the player away. If we can make a deal that makes sense, we will."

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

read more, post less

[Zvon]

thank u-srry.
feel free to delete this edge

[Guest ABG]

Maybe worth discussion on its own merits, regardless of the effect on the Mets.

[Zvon]

ABG wrote: Maybe worth discussion on its own merits, regardless of the effect on the Mets.

Maybe....
cause the guys acting like a selfish dork, and it looks like the worst thing that will happen to him is he'll get traded.

I mean, the days of players being just thought of as mere property arent really over.
Its just that now owners have to pay millions for that property.
And if they pay you should play-wherever they put you.

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

Zvon wrote: And if they pay you should play-wherever they put you.

Well, maybe, after a couple of embossed invitations, a few Spring Trainings to learn the new position, and when you're done pursuing whatever career numbers you want at your old position.

If they ask you nicely enough, of course. Then maybe.

[metirish]

Lets say the Nationals get really desperate, I'd take Soriano if the price was right, he'd look good hitting 5 or 6 in the order....the way things look the Nationals may have a hard time trading him, very few teams could take on the money.....the next week or two should be interesting.

[nymr83]

Clemens is a great player, do we want him too?
I don't want a guy doing what Soriano is doing just on principle. Besides, his defense sucks and if Beltran "must hit 3rd" we need a 2-hitter not a guy who would bat 7th for us (and anyone who wants him ahead of Wright or Delgado is going to get hurt...)

[Zvon]

Bret Sabermetric wrote: ="Zvon"]And if they pay you should play-wherever they put you. Well, maybe, after a couple of embossed invitations, a few Spring Trainings to learn the new position, and when you're done pursuing whatever career numbers you want at your old position. If they ask you nicely enough, of course. Then maybe.

I guess Im conflicted about this, cuz i hear what your saying.
A players career is his career, and the road to the hall could very well depend on how you stack up aganst other players who played the same position. You invest time in that. It does matter.

Im not saying Soriano is headed to the hall or anything.
But it must be every players dream when they start to aspire to that, even if only as a footnote or a stat.

And Ive been against this kind of manuever when applied to other players in the past.
Maybe I just dont like Soriano.
Maybe its the $$$, cuz I dont know of any player of that value who was forced to play out of position.
More so I think its that he refused to play at all.

He makes 10 mill to play a kids game.

[Elster88]

[Guest Edgy DC]

I don't know about "forced," (or even about "out of position" when in many cases, it's unclear which positions suits a guy best, even when it's clear what suits a team best) but when I think of All-Stars who were asked to move and did because their manager explained that the team needed them to, I can think of a dozen without thinking hard.

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

Zvon wrote: i hear what your saying.

Well, thank you for responding to what I was saying, Zvon.

I think the Mets should go after Soriano hard. Getting him w/o giving Milledge should become Omar's all-consuming goal. Washington got themselves into a mess, and we can help them out it. Remember, acquiring 10+ mil players like Soriano for younger, cheaper players can be good or it can be bad --else, why didn't some club take Manny when Boston was offering him gratis? Answer: his salary seemed out of whack with his outsized talents.

If the Nationals are stuck with a Soriano problem, they might be willing to let him go for a package that doesn't include Milledge. (Prolly not, but you can try.) Offer them Nady. Offer them Diaz. Offer them Nady AND Diaz. Offer them Floyd. Offer them Floyd and Zambrano. Offer them Floyd and Glavine. Offer them Floyd and Glavine and Matsui and throw a few million into the deal. Reason with them.

None of this is very likely to work but is Omar doing anything more valuable with his time in the next few weeks than getting a productive 2b-man would be? I could certainly live with Soriano for Floyd, Glavine, Matsui and cash (and maybe some cash to buy out Matsui's NT clause.) Maybe Washington would prefer that to dealing with this ongoing mess. I know I would.

LoDuca C
Delgado 1B
Soriano 2B
Reyes SS
Wright 3B
Milledge RF
Beltran CF
Diaz/Nady LF

Pedro
Trax
Zambrano
Heilman
Bannister

I could live with that.

[Guest Rotblatt]

Mets related quotes on Soriano:

]Manager Willie Randolph, who was with Soriano in the Bronx and helped him make the transition from left field to second base, also had little to say when the subject was raised. "That's not my business," he said. "That's the Nationals problem." Asked what he thought of Sori ano's decision not to enter Monday night's game, Randolph said, "He never did that when I was (with the Yankees)." One Met said Soriano told him over the winter that he hadn't asked to be traded from Texas, where he was the second baseman, and that he wouldn't play left field for the Nationals. Jose Reyes, who was Soriano's teammate at the WBC, said he wasn't surprised by what Soriano did. "He said he wouldn't play (left field)," the Mets shortstop said. Cliff Floyd said he thought Sori ano just "lost his head." "When you move to a new situation, a new team, sometimes you lose your cool," Floyd said. "He probably just lost it for a minute. Hopefully, with the talent he has, he doesn't do anything crazy to hurt himself." Floyd was asked how the Mets players would handle it if one of their teammates declined to enter a game. "You would hope he'd take care of it," Floyd said. "That he would speak to us. If he doesn't speak to us, that would be his prerogative. But then you know what you're dealing with."

[Guest Edgy DC]

Klapisch: Being a Yankee Just Makes Folks Better People.

The funny thing is the headline reflects almost nothing in the article. My mock headline is actually more accurate.

[Frayed Knot]

From the Klapisch article:
One Yankee insider seemed to speak for the entire organization when he said, "That's definitely not the Sori that we knew. If he'd ever run into a problem like that with us, you know Joe [Torre] would've handled it. And Sori would've listened."

Except that the Yanx DID want to move him to the OF - CF in particular - and he balked then too. Granted it's a bit different in that he didn't refuse a direct assignment seeing as how the Yanx were considering moving him there as a future move to eventually replace Bernie, not an immediate one. But let's not pretend that it's a stone cold fact that 'it would have been handled' without a hitch.
Buck and the Rangers discussed displacing him also and that raised a fuss.
Geez, it sounds like this is exactly 'the Sori' that more than a few somebodies know!

[Guest ABG]

Edgy DC wrote: Klapisch: Being a Yankee Just Makes Folks Better People. The funny thing is the headline reflects almost nothing in the article. My mock headline is actually more accurate.

I couldn't disagree more with that interpretation of the article. The premise I take is "Soriano has changed," --with at least one alternate hypothesis for why he's changed (see below)--which is distinctly different than "The Yankees are 900 times more classy than anyone else in baseball and that's why Soriano would never try this crap there."

FK's quoted paragraph was really the only part--after the lede, which was really only juxtaposition, not a comment on the class of the MFYs--that even references the Yankees. I took it as almost a throwaway line.

]He'd just returned from 10 days at the World Baseball Classic, where his Dominican countrymen might've convinced Soriano the Nationals were publicly humiliating him. Maybe Soriano told Robinson and Bowden just that.

[Guest Edgy DC]

That was a pretty damn speculative, though, and not a little race-baiting. Klap should do better

There seemed to be three or four comments (which I can't specify because the article isn't loading now) suggesting that this wasn't the Soriano that was on the Yankees, and that was, to one degreee or another, because the Yankees and Torre can deal better with unhappy players.

I don't really belive my joke is a worthwhile headline, but there's not one quote representing "DC" --- the organization, the coaching staff, the season ticket holders, the people on the street, the city government, or the Feds --- much less a united DC. At least I don't think there's one quote. Again, the article won't load.

[Guest ABG]

Here ya go:

]It wasn't so long ago that Alfonso Soriano was one of the more popular figures in the Yankee clubhouse, trusting and eager to please, a Dominican prospect who played in Japan in 1997 and actually learned the language. Nice guy, teammates decided. Big swing but manageable ego. So how did Soriano become selfish enough to go on strike when the Nationals took the field on Monday, refusing to play left field? That's the question that's clogged up the industry's gossip machine, everyone wondering who'll prevail in this bizarre standoff. It comes to a head this afternoon, when the Nats face the Cardinals: Either Soriano gives up his demand to play second base or the club takes the extraordinary step of placing the slugger on the disqualified list. Everyone believes Soriano will cave -- "He has no choice," said one National League general manager -- but the Nationals will have to eventually trade him. The Mets would love to have Soriano, as stubborn and misguided as he appears to be, but can't absorb his $10 million salary. Not unless the Nats are willing to take Kaz Matsui and his $8 million annual salary in return, which they won't. Even if there was some other fit with the Nationals, the Mets would inherit the very problem that's sabotaging Frank Robinson's dugout: two expensive, front-line second basemen. "We can't pay [$18 million] for one position," is how one Mets senior official put it. In other words, forget about Soriano at Shea this year. And that's probably true for the other 28 teams, too. No one will give the Nats equal value for Soriano now, not since Monday's indefensible boycott. Shame on Soriano for not realizing how wrong he was, embarrassing his old-school manager. Robinson was made to look like some JV high school coach, scrambling to put a ninth player on the field while Soriano stared into space. No one's sure whether this work stoppage was a spontaneous act or if Soriano had plotted it during a morning meeting with Robinson and general manager Jim Bowden. Perhaps Soriano alerted his bosses that Monday would be his declaration of independence. He'd just returned from 10 days at the World Baseball Classic, where his Dominican countrymen might've convinced Soriano the Nationals were publicly humiliating him. Maybe Soriano told Robinson and Bowden just that. Who knows, maybe they got tough with him in return, pushing everyone to the brink. Obviously, Soriano didn't seek legal advice or union representation in this matter, or else he would've realized he has no say in where he plays, just as he can't tell the Nats where he'll hit in the batting order. According to the Collective Bargaining Agreement, Soriano is at the whim of the Nationals. He may not like left field -- he may actually be terrible out there -- but refusing to play stripped him of any moral or legal defense. So for the last 24 hours, Soriano has accomplished what should've been impossible: He replaced Barry Bonds as the industry's monster. One Yankee insider seemed to speak for the entire organization when he said, "That's definitely not the Sori that we knew. If he'd ever run into a problem like that with us, you know Joe [Torre] would've handled it. And Sori would've listened." But Soriano has no such rudder with the Nationals, on or off the field. He's been looking for the door ever since he was acquired in December. The Nats say he's barely spoken to his teammates in camp. What did they expect? What was Bowden thinking, trading for a player who had no desire to move to the outfield? As likeable as Soriano is -- or was -- it's obvious he's stubborn. That much can be discerned in the way he hits. Despite his coaches' best efforts, no one has been able to convince Soriano to cut down on his swing with two strikes, or to stop him from chasing down-and-away sliders, even though everyone in the ballpark knows that's what's coming after an up-and-in fastball. While it's true Soriano has been blessed with an awesome blend of power and bat speed -- he's averaged more than 35 homers and 97 RBI over the past four seasons -- he keeps swinging and missing, too. Soriano set a record by fanning 26 times in the 2003 postseason and eventually was benched by Torre in Game 5 of the World Series. On Saturday in the WBC semifinal, Soriano made the final out against Cuba by, you guessed it, fanning on a down-and-away slider. In his defense, these are all predictable surcharges for that unfiltered power. You want 30 homers a year? Then you have to accept the swing-for-the-planets mentality. But Soriano is no kid anymore. He's 30. He should have acquired a greater intelligence about his skills, just as he should understand the consequences of his actions on Monday. If he dares to sit out another game, the Nats are going to disqualify him, which is a more serious punishment than simply fining and suspending him. Being disqualified means no accrual of service time, which would deny Soriano his eligibility for 2007 free agency. Of course, the union will rush to Soriano's side. But there's not much room for interpretation on this issue. Unless Soriano can find a league where players make out their own lineups, he's stuck as a National without a friend (or a rationalization) in sight. Adios, Alfonso? Alfonso Soriano seemingly has burned his bridges in Washington. The Mets might not be the best suitors if the Nationals have to trade him: Mets: They have an opening at second base (unless you think Kaz Matsui is going to turn into Ryne Sandberg). The Mets would have to shed Matsui's salary in the deal, but that's a problem because the Nats don't need Matsui -- they already have Jose Vidro. Red Sox: Boston can afford him, but has Mark Loretta at second. Dodgers: Same as Boston, but they have Jeff Kent there. Angels: Same as L.A. and Boston, but they have Adam Kennedy there. Cubs: Soriano would be a big upgrade from the Todd Walker/Jerry Hairston platoon, but it's unlikely Chicago would cough up the money. Cardinals: Again, Soriano is better than the incumbent Junior Spivey. Again, it would come down to money.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Well, two times he distinguishes the behavior from that the Yankees got out of him, including in the lead.

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

Edgy DC wrote: Well, two times he distinguishes the behavior from that the Yankees got out of him, including in the lead.

Yet this simplistic, reductive logic is okay when applied to the Mets. If Thing A happens in the past (Soriano played Yankees w/o massive egopostional problems) then all you can say, over and over, is that Thing A happened and no one can prove that anything has changed since Thing A happened, so it's Thing A all the way. Things B, C, and M are irrelevant because they happened since Thing A happened but there's no causal relationship that's proven. Therefore Thing A could well happen again tomorrow under the right circumstances. If Sori somehow got back on Torre's team, all problems will magically disappear.

[Guest silverdsl]

I've always thought that Soriano was somewhat self-involved even when he was a Yankee. He tended to showboat on homeruns or almost homeruns even though that behavior was frowned upon and was resistant to being open to advice and help with his hitting and defense. I have no doubt he was popular in the clubhouse when he was in pinstripes but I think there were some hints all along that he was headstrong.

As for his current situation with the Nationals, word is that Soriano would agree to play the OF if the Yankees re-aquired him. If that is true then I don't think he has a leg to stand on here because then it comes down to "I don't want to!" rather than having a legit reason such as he feels it would be bad for his career or that he will make a lousy OF'er. The reality is that Soriano is a poor second baseman and IMO, he would be doing himself a big favor by at least trying the OF on a limited basis. During spring training is the time to try it when the games don't matter. Maybe he'll be horrible and the Nationals won't be able to use him out there or maybe he'll be good and find that it's not as bad as he might think it will be. But no one really knows how he will do until he gives it a shot.

[Elster88]

[Vic Sage]

No way Wilpon allows Omar to even THINK about Soriano unless he offsets alot of that $10m salary.

I'd take Soriano for 50 cents on the dollar, and the Mets would surive his defense if he goes 30/30. It's not like there's another guy in the pipeline projected to even approach Soriano's production (as flawed a player as he is).

Nady (or Diaz) + Zambrano (or J.Julio) + prospect (not top 5)
+ they either take Matsui or pay us $5m

Reyes (s)
Beltran (s)
Wright ®
Delgado (l)
Soriano ®
Floyd (l)
Diaz ®
LoDuca ®

Pedro
Glavine
Heilman
Trax
Bannister

[Vic Sage]

] If that is true then I don't think he has a leg to stand on here because then it comes down to "I don't want to!" rather than having a legit reason such as he feels it would be bad for his career or that he will make a lousy OF'er.

he doesn't have a leg to stand on in either case.

He has a contract to play baseball, not to play second base. It is up to the manager to decide when and where he plays. If a player is physically able to perform and refuses to, its the height of insubordination and a violation of the basic agreement.

What generally prevents managers from playing guys "out of position" is that its generally detrimental to the team. In this case, it would be, in the judgment of the management, helpful to the team.

All-stars have switched positions since the beginning of the game. It didn't keep guys of the HOF, like Yount or Molitor or Pete Rose ... um... well, Yount and Molitor, anyway.

[Vic Sage]

*avi*

[Willets Point]

Bret Sabermetric wrote: I could live with that.

Well since you're a Red Sox fan, of course you can live with that. The only things the Mets do that would affect you would be:

1) Get the better of the Red Sox in a transaction (not likely since Boston is run by super geniuses and the Mets by lying idiots).

2) Beat the Red Sox on the field of play (minimal affect since the teams meet so rarely)

3) Use eminent domain to demolish your house for a new ballpark (I think you're safe there)

Other than that the proposal sounds pretty good for beefing up the Mets lineup.

[Vic Sage]

As Soriano is a FA after this season, acquiring him is a "win now" move. But if you're giving up Floyd and Glavine to get him, you haven't really strengthened the team overall.

Offensively, floyd is actually BETTER than Soriano, plus we're giving up our #2 SPer. I'd rather have Floyd and Glavine and a warm body at 2b, than get Soriano, but with V.Diaz and Nady each becoming full-time OFers, and trax and Zambrano filling out the top of the rotation, with Bannister expected to give us 30 starts and 150-175 innings.

I'm not suggesting the Nats would likely pull the trigger on my proposal, but that kind of steep discount is the only kind that (in my mind) would justify taking on Soriano.

[Guest ABG]

Back to Defcon 4, national sports media.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2379788

[Guest Johnny Dickshot]

Good.

[Frayed Knot]

The last paragraph in the espn piece was the key:
General manager Jim Bowden had threatened to put Soriano on the disqualified list, which would prevent him from playing, accruing service time and receiving his $10 million salary.

So not only would he not have been getting this year's money as long as he refused, but no service time accrual means he would have pushed his FA-gency back one season and therefore missed out on the big money next year.
Principle only goes so far when there's millions of buckos on the line.