And Then There Were Thirteen...

[Elster88]

I know this happened a few days ago, and I think was mentioned in an OoTS thread. But maybe it deserves it's own?

Greg Maddux, one of the best control pitchers in history, joined the 3,000-strikeout club Tuesday night when he threw a called third strike past San Francisco's Omar Vizquel in the third inning. There are now 13 members in the club. Maddux joined Nolan Ryan, Roger Clemens, Randy Johnson, Steve Carlton, Bert Blyleven, Tom Seaver, Gaylord Perry, Don Sutton, Walter Johnson, Phil Niekro, Ferguson Jenkins and Bob Gibson.

[MFS62]

That is a perfect example of what makes baseball so intriguing. Those pitchers had such totally different styles yet achieved similar results.

Maddux is the perfect example on why you can't just look at radar gun speeds when scouting a pitcher.

Later

[metirish]

And in recent years Maddux has been mostly a 6 ining pitcher,someone should look up how many complete games Maddux pitched and how many some of the other 12 pitched.

I might just go and do that.

[metirish]

Maddux to my surprise has entering ther 2005 season 105 complete games in 604 started.

Maddux - 604 GS - 105 CG - SO - 2916 - 19+ years( does not include 05)

Clemens - 639 - GS - 117 - CG -SO - 4317 - 21+ years(does not include 05)

R Johnson - 489 - GS - 92 - CG -SO - 4161 - 17+ years( does not include 05)

Sutton - 604 - GS - 105 - CG - SO - 3574 - 19 years

Seaver - 756 - GS - 178 - CG -SO - 3640 - 20 years

Ryan - 773 - GS - 222 - CG - SO - 5714 - 27 years

Carlton - 709 - GS - 254 - CG -SO - 4136 - 24 years

Blyleven - 685 - GS - 242 - SO - 3701 - 22 years

Perry - 690 - GS - 303 - CG -SO - 3534 - 22 years

Niekro - 716 - GS - 245 - CG -SO - 3342 - 24 years

Jenkins - 594 - GS - 267 - CG - SO - 3192 - 19 years

Gibson - 482 - GS - 255 - CG -SO -3117 - 17 years

Walter Johnson - 666 - GS - 531 - CG -SO -3509 - 21 years.

can someone make a table out of that?

[Vic Sage]

]can someone make a table out of that?

no, but how about a nice hat, or a broach?

[Guest ScarletKnight41]

Or a pteradactyl?

[seawolf17]

ScarletKnight41 wrote: Or a pteradactyl?

Classic.

[DocTee]

Even more astonishing than his complete games, Maddux NEVER had a season in which he had more than 200 strikeouts.

Talk about consistency.

[nymr83]

maddux used to complete his games, i'd bet he has very few in the past 3-5 years.

[DocTee]

Of his 105 CG, 99 came before 2001. And mea culpa, Maddux once had a 204 K campaign.

[seawolf17]

FWIW, the next two guys to join the 3000 K Club:

Pedro Martinez - 2800 K - 44 CG
Curt Schilling - 2776 K - 82 CG

Pedro is far and a way the low man on the CG totem pole.

[Elster88]

I'd guess that both are a product of the times though, as are Maddux and Glavine to a lesser extent.

[Guest Edgy DC]

After that, it could be a long time before we see another 3,000, despite this being a high-strikeout era. Looking at the active list coming into this season:

1. Roger Clemens (41) 4317 R IN
2. Randy Johnson* (40) 4161 L IN
3. Greg Maddux (38) 2916 R JUST IN
4. Curt Schilling (37) 2745 R SHOULD MAKE IT
5. Pedro Martinez (32) 2653 R SHOULD MAKE IT
6. John Smoltz (37) 2398 R =blue]POSSIBLE BUT UNLIKELY
7. Kevin Brown (39) 2347 R =VIOLET]HIGHLY UNLIKELY
8. Mike Mussina (35) 2258 R =indigo]POSSIBLE
9. Tom Glavine* (38) 2245 L =VIOLET]HIGHLY UNLIKELY
10. Kevin Appier (36) 1994 R =red]NO WAY (actually retired)
11. David Wells* (41) 1974 L =red]NO WAY
12. Al Leiter* (38) 1877 L =red]NO WAY
13. Hideo Nomo (35) 1856 R =red]NO WAY
14. Jamie Moyer* (41) 1782 L =red]NO WAY
15. Tom Gordon (36) 1733 R =red]NO WAY
16. Kenny Rogers* (39) 1664 L =red]NO WAY
17. Jeff Fassero* (41) 1576 L =red]NO WAY
18. Pedro Astacio (34) 1544 R =red]NO WAY
19. Tim Wakefield (37) 1439 R =red]NO WAY
20. Steve Trachsel (33) 1416 R =red]NO WAY
21. Shane Reynolds (36) 1403 R =red]NO WAY
22. Dave Burba (37) 1398 R =red]NO WAY
23. Jason Schmidt (31) 1383 R =blue]POSSIBLE BUT UNLIKELY
24. Andy Pettitte* (32) 1354 L =VIOLET]HIGHLY UNLIKELY
25. Wilson Alvarez* (34) 1314 L =red]NO WAY
26. Terry Mulholland* (41) 1306 L =red]NO WAY
27. Chan Ho Park (31) 1298 R =VIOLET]HIGHLY UNLIKELY
28. Pat Hentgen (35) 1290 R =red]NO WAY
29. Bartolo Colon (31) 1278 R =blue]POSSIBLE BUT UNLIKELY
30. Aaron Sele (34) 1268 R =red]NO WAY

[Elster88]

I think Sele deserves a NO WAY.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Yeah, you got me there.

[MFS62]

Interesting that Tom Gordon has so many strikeouts, since he has been mostly a reliever during his career.
And Smoltz lost a lot of Ks by going to the bullpen for a while.

Edit: And I shudder to think of how many pitches it took to those 1877 batters for Leiter to strike them out. Probably a five digit number.

Later

[seawolf17]

MFS62 wrote: Interesting that Tom Gordon has so many strikeouts, since he has been mostly a reliever during his career.

Actually, Flash has started 203 of his 671 games entering 2005. Except for 1992, in every year between 1989 and 1997, he made at least 14 starts and threw at least 155 innings. Four times (1990, 1994, 1995, 1996) he didn't make any relief appearances at all.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Kerry Wood, meanwhile, is already up to 1,269, while still looking like a Rickey Schroeder character.

He could possibly be next after Pedro and Schilling.

[Guest Rotblatt]

Not if he's coming out of the pen for the rest of his career . . . Word on the street is that Wood will be used in relief after he gets (relatively) healthy again.

Probably smart. I wonder if Baker fucked him up or if it's just his mechanics.

[MFS62]

]Flash has started 203 of his 671 games

By my math book, that still means that over two-thirds of his appearences were in relief. I guess that qualifies as "mostly".

Later