Major League Baseball, players union reach tentative agreement to salvage 2020 season

[Frayed Knot]

=Ceetar post_id=38489 time=1591756212 user_id=102]
sure but they have to walk past each other. at best it'd be row per group and then skip a row.

[Frayed Knot]

Overnight the players responded to the latest owner proposals by countering with 89 games and, of course, full pro-rated salaries.

So the pattern continues: the owners say that, with no live gate, they'll be losing money with each game so they either need a shorter schedule or a reduction in the

pay rate, at which point the players respond with: 'OK, how 'bout a longer season and the idea of a reduction beyond pro-rated isn't even a topic for discussion'.



At this point I think we're down to two choices: a very short season or no season.

But at least the rancor generated by this whole mess brings next season into question as well.

[Ceetar]

it's not so much the point of sale as having a handful of the workers themselves together in the tighter quarters.



other stores/locations aren't all exiting at once. I guess it could work if you only use the field level and only use the rotunda for an exit, where there's no looping in staircases. There's still likely cramping as you exit seating sections and outside bathrooms and the like. There are probably minimal risks overall, but they are risks.

[Benjamin Grimm]

People can be ushered out of the stadium one section at a time for each exit. Hopefully the fans would cooperate.

[Frayed Knot]

=Ceetar post_id=38504 time=1591792976 user_id=102]There are probably minimal risks overall, but [there] are risks.

[Ceetar]

Frayed Knot wrote: There are probably minimal risks overall, but [there] are risks. As there are anytime one walks out their front door.

not even close to the point.

Benjamin Grimm wrote: People can be ushered out of the stadium one section at a time for each exit. Hopefully the fans would cooperate.

Then you need additional ushers, crowd control. These things add more employees, and the more people you add to a situation, the riskier it becomes.





I guess it doesn't really matter, as season ticket holders are going to demand first rights, and they're going to demand the riff raff not be allowed in their section, and teams will go with that. Which means you need to keep the ushers at each section or a non-elite person might wander down into a season ticket holder's seat! So you could probably repurpose those ushers into some measure of crowd control/direction for exiting.



I'm not real hopeful they will do this right, or if they'll even try though. They'll probably just take 25% opening to mean let 10k people in and have like Alonso film a "wear your mask!" thing for the scoreboard.

[Guest 41Forever]

I guess it doesn't really matter, as season ticket holders are going to demand first rights, and they're going to demand the riff raff not be allowed in their section, and teams will go with that. Which means you need to keep the ushers at each section or a non-elite person might wander down into a season ticket holder's seat! So you could probably repurpose those ushers into some measure of crowd control/direction for exiting.

Every game I've been to is the last couple of years has had ushers at the top of each section in the lower levels. I don't think it has anything to do with “elites.”

[kcmets]

[YOUTUBE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErXbMB9R5-0https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErXbMB9R5-0[/YOUTUBE]

[Ceetar]

=41Forever post_id=38508 time=1591797431 user_id=69]

I guess it doesn't really matter, as season ticket holders are going to demand first rights, and they're going to demand the riff raff not be allowed in their section, and teams will go with that. Which means you need to keep the ushers at each section or a non-elite person might wander down into a season ticket holder's seat! So you could probably repurpose those ushers into some measure of crowd control/direction for exiting.

Every game I've been to is the last couple of years has had ushers at the top of each section in the lower levels. I don't think it has anything to do with “elites.”

[Benjamin Grimm]

=Ceetar post_id=38510 time=1591798439 user_id=102]
it has everything to do with the people that are sitting in that section not wanting people that didn't spend as much money as them to sit in that section.

[Guest 41Forever]

Benjamin Grimm wrote: =Ceetar post_id=38510 time=1591798439 user_id=102] it has everything to do with the people that are sitting in that section not wanting people that didn't spend as much money as them to sit in that section.

Well, that's part of it, sure, but the primary reason is that teams don't want fans to be able to buy a $40 ticket and sit in $300 seats.

[Frayed Knot]

Frayed Knot wrote: =Ceetar post_id=38504 time=1591792976 user_id=102]There are probably minimal risks overall, but [there] are risks. As there are anytime one walks out their front door.

not even close to the point.

[Ceetar]

i mean, baseball _probably_ shouldn't open up, from a safety standpoint, and just to add fans to that (nothing will change from now until then, virus wise) is only going to be riskier. Even countries that have handled this not-horribly aren't seemingly sure about fans. KBO still playing with mannequins right?



Going to a baseball game is a risk totally separate from the grocery store, running errands, moving around. We've botched this terribly and it's hard to see a way in which we execute fans in stadiums even with just slightly elevated risk.

[Fman99]

"You take a risk getting up in the morning, crossing the street, or sticking your face in a fan." -- Frank Drebin

[Frayed Knot]

=Ceetar post_id=38514 time=1591803434 user_id=102]Going to a baseball game is a risk totally separate from the grocery store, running errands, moving around.

[Ceetar]

well, it's not the planted a safe distance away that's the issue, it's when everyone's camped around the bathroom, or crammed into the stairwell breathing at each other. That doesn't happen at the store. Transmission isn't really happening by breathing while walking by someone in a store.



And I certainly don't need food at a game enough to make the (probably under-compensated and under-trained) workers to cram into one of those booth in close quarters cooking hot dogs for me. But that extends to whether I can expect 30 guys to cram* into a clubhouse for my entertainment either. Some of this could happen with better testing and tracing, but it doesn't seem like we're really going that route.



I'm okay with risk here and there, but so much of it's happening so carelessly.





tl:dr I think there's a reasonable risk level that would allow some fans at some games, I don't believe that the US/MLB will be able to minimize risk to a reasonable level.

[ashie62]

Baseball should be so lucky to have to manage "fans in the stands"

[MFS62]

Rob Manfried just announced that there WILL be baseball this year (as per WABC). They are down to two alternatives, one a 48 game season he can unilaterally impose and one with more games. The decision on which alternative will be in one or two days.

Later

[Ceetar]

the season will not be extended in any way though, past the end of September, because the networks don't want to move playoff game dates.

[Frayed Knot]

And the league doesn't want to risk losing playoff games in case cooler autumn weather re-jump-starts Covid causing them to re-cancel things again.

Because if the playoffs do get canceled then the teams lose not only their regular season gate money but then the TV playoff cash on top of that.

[Ceetar]

playoffs are currently canceled if they don't restart. Could just as easily be through the 'second wave' by the time mid-October/November rolls around as have it start then. Also cases are still kinda rising _right now_ so any sort of "gotta rush this season to make sure playoffs happen on the same timeline" is just random guesswork.

[ashie62]

=MFS62 post_id=38539 time=1591828683 user_id=60]
Rob Manfried just announced that there WILL be baseball this year (as per WABC). They are down to two alternatives, one a 48 game season he can unilaterally impose and one with more games. The decision on which alternative will be in one or two days.

Later

[Ceetar]

scarlett johannsen

[MFS62]

=Ceetar post_id=38579 time=1591898535 user_id=102]
scarlett johannsen

[ashie62]

New deadline tomorrow by MLB



76 Games at pro-rated pay. Of that number the owners are at 80% which is 20% off the pro-rated numbers agreed to in March



My solution. Take the 20% and defer it into an annuity or such. The each side gets back 5%. Take the remaining 10% and donate it to Covid Relief, Racial issues, farmers and so on. This is doable

[Ceetar]

but, it's not doable, MLB literally offering the same money each time, just demanding various amounts of work for it, and not negotiating in good faith.

[Edgy MD]

It seems like an independent arbitrator trying to make both sides equally miserable is the only way there is going to be anything like a season.

[ashie62]

Can a mediator do this in like a week



If...MLB has no 2020 season the NFL will totally rule the sports industrial complex. They do not need fans in the stands



Would it be so bad to say see you all in February 2021. As of now 1. The logistics are horrid, and should be worked out by now 2. No fans in stands 3. Acrimony amongst Players owners and fans 5. Unknown health risks and adinfinitum.



Dang, the NBA, which largely wants to play is going to take two months to be up and running, despite what Neturd Kyrie Irving says

[batmagadanleadoff]

Is there a clause in MLB's CBA for an arbitrator to issue a binding ruling on what, if any, kind of season there's gonna be in 2020?



I could be wrong, but I think that the parties are on their own here, and for a binding arbitrator to step in and sort things out, with actual authority, both sides would have to agree for that to happen.

[Benjamin Grimm]

I believe that's the case.



I'm pretty sure there will be a season, unless the players can successfully challenge Manfred's unilateral implementation of a shorter season.



If he does do that, I'd like to see him go for 70 games instead of 50. Yes, it would cost the owners more money, but it might head off some contention as they go into the next CBA. (I know what's important for the owners, though. It will be 50 games.)