Cespedes needs surgery

[Ceetar]

batmagadanleadoff wrote: Ashie62 wrote: He'd be 34 2020 will be Yoenis's 35 year old season, the way these things are calculated. And that's if he didn't pull the Cuban baseball scam about lying about his age. Plus he'll have missed most of the last three seasons due to major surgery. That's like 75 in baseball years.

this is his age 32 season.

he'll be back for the second half of his age 33 season, under contract through his 34th.

He literally just hit a home run in the majors, and mashed this year before the aches caught up to him. So he'll be off for roughly a year, I wouldn't expect a huge dropoff.

It's a fairly straight-forward surgery, as these things go.

[batmagadanleadoff]

Ceetar wrote: batmagadanleadoff wrote: Ashie62 wrote: He'd be 34 2020 will be Yoenis's 35 year old season, the way these things are calculated. And that's if he didn't pull the Cuban baseball scam about lying about his age. Plus he'll have missed most of the last three seasons due to major surgery. That's like 75 in baseball years. this is his age 32 season. he'll be back for the second half of his age 33 season, under contract through his 34th. He literally just hit a home run in the majors, and mashed this year before the aches caught up to him. So he'll be off for roughly a year, I wouldn't expect a huge dropoff. It's a fairly straight-forward surgery, as these things go.

Sure. That's if everything goes right and Yoenis and the Mets get the best possible result. Which is what you always take for granted is going to happen. You left out the part where next year, 11 Mets are gonna have the career seasons of their lifetimes.

[Ceetar]

batmagadanleadoff wrote: Sure. That's if everything goes right and Yoenis and the Mets get the best possible result. Which is what you always take for granted is going to happen. You left out the part where next year, 11 Mets are gonna have the career seasons of their lifetimes.

If everything goes right, it's closer to the 8 in the "8-10" projected window and he gets about 3 weeks of rehab/spring games he could be back by Opening Day/early April. If it's 10, that's June 1st. So I'm literally suggesting we estimate nearly 2 more months.

If you're going to add on at least 2-3 more, I suggest you cite something other than 'LOLMets' for that reasoning.

[batmagadanleadoff]

Ceetar wrote: batmagadanleadoff wrote: Sure. That's if everything goes right and Yoenis and the Mets get the best possible result. Which is what you always take for granted is going to happen. You left out the part where next year, 11 Mets are gonna have the career seasons of their lifetimes. If everything goes right, it's closer to the 8 in the "8-10" projected window and he gets about 3 weeks of rehab/spring games he could be back by Opening Day/early April. If it's 10, that's June 1st. So I'm literally suggesting we estimate nearly 2 more months. If you're going to add on at least 2-3 more, I suggest you cite something other than 'LOLMets' for that reasoning.

I wasnt the one who said 2020. I said that if it's 2020, he's probably done.

[Ceetar]

I'd imagine it depends on what the setback was that pushed him to 2020. Is it spinal stenosis? Did his foot fall off? is he dead?

Anyway, how soon until he can play golf again?

[ashie62]

More like a degenerative chronic illness

[Guest Rockin' Doc]

According to the article released regarding Cespedes' upcoming surgery, he will have surgery on one heel and then 2-3 months later he will undergo surgery on the second heel. So assuming the 1st surgery was to take place on August 1st, the second surgery would then take place at the earliest (using the mentioned 2-3 months delay between operations) on October 1st. Now, if we assume Cespedes takes the expected 8-10 months to heal, he would not be ready to start any rehab assignment until 8 months later (June 1st) at the earliest or 10 months later (August 1st) on the back end of the expected healing. Assuming he needs, 2-3 weeks of baseball rehab in the minors, then Cespedes isn't likely to make an appearance in a Mets uniform until this time next season if all goes ideally. I suspect that scenario is unlikely. At best, I expect Cespedes may make it back with the September call ups. Therefore, I believe the Mets would be best served by preparing for the 2019 season as if Cespedes will be out for the year (which is highly probable).

I sincerely wish all the best for Cespedes regarding his pending surgeries and recovery. I hope he gets relief from the pain and discomfort his condition has caused him.

[Centerfield]

Is it 8-10 months in the aggregate? Or for both?

Why can’t he operate on both at once?

[Guest d'Kong76]

It's hard to go the driving range in a wheel chair.
I'M JOKING!

[Guest Rockin' Doc]

The reports have not been clear regarding whether the healing time is 8-10 months following surgery or if he is expected to be out a total of 8-10 months with the proposed surgical plan.

They apparently plan to operate on the two heels seperately so Cespedes avoids having to be in a wheelchair during his recovery.

[Centerfield]

d'Kong76 wrote: batmagadanleadoff wrote: Any second now, I'm gonna read here how great the Wilpons are and some ridiculous idea about how the Mets dont need to spend at luxury tax levels even though they play in the nation's largest market. Why paint us here like that? It's mean, inaccurate and insulting.

I wholeheartedly disagree with this. I mean, no one here actually posts that the Wilpons are great. But stretching and twisting to defend their actions? Absolutely. I can tell you one thing. When I get into these discussions, I'm not arguing against myself.

And the Wilpon Apologists are not shy about being judgmental either. As if criticizing the owners of the team somehow make me less of fan, or less die-hard.

And that's the way it usually goes. One of us criticizes the Wilpons. Someone else criticizes us.

[Guest d'Kong76]

Centerfield wrote: I wholeheartedly disagree with this. I mean, no one here actually posts that the Wilpons are great. But stretching and twisting to defend their actions? Absolutely. I can tell you one thing. When I get into these discussions, I'm not arguing against myself.

It's some of the posters, part of our community. My beef with batmag's tone
is that the board is full of Pollyanna-pro-Wilpon apologists and that's simply not
the case. If one has an issue with a poster here, keep to the poster. Don't lump
everyone in and call it here was all I was saying.

[Guest d'Kong76]

And it is a community, one that has stood the test of time for nearly two decades.
Most who stay enjoy it, one poster disparages it time and time again.

[Centerfield]

Got it. Yes. Those opinions are certainly the minority.

[Guest 41Forever]

There are Wilpon apologists among us?

[batmagadanleadoff]

Mets need to get it through their heads: Yoenis Cespedes is done

By Kevin Kernan

This Yoenis Cespedes charade is everything that's wrong with Mets The Mets' one last chance at dignity is here No Yo. It’s over. Probably for the 2019 season, too. The biggest mistake the Mets can make, now that Yoenis Cespedes is going to have staggered surgery on both heels, is to think he will be a functioning, powerful Met once again. No more pipe dreams. There is no way the Mets can count on Cespedes being able to carry a team. With his leg injuries he can’t carry himself, much less a team. The Mets need to deal in reality and move forward. They can’t make the same David Wright mistake with Cespedes. They can’t wait on Yo. It’s Yo-ver. If Cespedes comes back in any way, shape or form, that is a bonus. Baseball in 2018 has taught us that old and injured players get old faster nowadays than ever before. This game is too fast, too powerful, too much velocity for old, injured players to bounce back strong. Cespedes will be 33 the next time he takes the field for the Mets. If all goes right. There is no bigger if in sports than an “if’’ attached to the Mets. Cespedes cannot be counted on in any way for next year or the future. Deal with it. This is no longer Yo’s team in any way. That is the first thing the Mets and their fans have to get through their heads. The highlight of the Mets’ Yo Era was the 2015 World Series run. That’s it. The reality is that at the age of 32 and facing not one but two brutal heel surgeries — the second one can’t take place until two to three months after the first, and then there is an eight- to 10-month rehab period followed by having to work his way back from nowhere back into game shape — even if everything goes right, Cespedes would not be ready until around August 2019. That’s if everything goes right. This is the Mets; everything does not go right in the Mets’ world. Cespedes was hoping he would not need double heel surgery until after he retired, but the pain became too much. “Yo worked his butt off to try to come back,’’ said one of his close friends Wednesday before the Mets beat the Padres, 6-4, at Citi Field. “It just couldn’t be done.’’ Reality hit Cespedes on Friday night, when it took him so long to walk 90 feet back to the dugout at Yankee Stadium following his two-out ground out in the eighth. After talking to numerous Mets sources Wednesday, the plan is to go ahead and still build around the starting rotation of Jacob deGrom, Noah Syndergaard, Zack Wheeler and Steven Matz unless they are blown away by a trade proposal. The way teams overvalue prospects, that is not likely to happen. Clearly the Mets will have to upgrade the defense and improve the offense. For all those crying to blow it up and trade deGrom and start from scratch, not happening now. There is no more Yo, so pitching and defense become that much more important. “I don’t think we are going to make any radical changes based on this information in the next few days,’’ assistant GM John Ricco said as a somber Cespedes sat beside him. “Certainly in the offseason we have to take this into consideration, but I don’t really see anything changing in the next few days.’ Yoenis Cespedes isn't only Met feeling the pain: 'It sucks' Michael Conforto is the Mets’ left fielder now and into the future. Conforto is going to have to be more of a leader in that clubhouse, and he told The Post on Wednesday he is ready for such a challenge. But he is going to have to have help. The Mets will need to reinvest the Cespedes insurance money on his $110 million contract that runs through 2020 back into new deals. That is a must. They have to hit the free-agent market. They still have to find a new baseball head of operations, who today has a much blanker slate with Cespedes on the shelf for such an extended period of time. It’s a whole new No Yo world. The stumbling Mets once again have so much work to do.

https://nypost.com/2018/07/25/mets-need-to-get-it-through-their-heads-yoenis-cespedes-is-done/

[Ceetar]

Gonna need clarity on this 8-10 month window, but it has to be from the first surgery right? It makes zero sense to ever float a timeline that's 2-3 months short of the truth?

Apparently this must be different than what Tulowitski had. He seemingly had both heel spur surgeries at once. The initial reports say 8 weeks. This was roughly 4/2 and he hasn't done anything yet though.

Anyway, a lot of editorializing in that Kernan article. 'brutal heel surgery'? sources? research?

A lot of LOLMets with no facts. "Everything does not go right in the Mets' world" "No bigger if than one attached to the Mets" dude, this is just crass.

The crux of it is true. The Mets can hope that Cespedes is available for the second half, but you don't plan on that. I don't know why they would. Hell, I don't think they would've signed Jay Bruce if Conforto was healthy, and he was only slated to miss a month.

Also pushes the dumb narrative that the Mets were "Cespedes' team" and that "he carried them in 2015 (and 2016?)" when that's pretty much never true in baseball. team game.

Whatever. So many players have injuries, big ones, big surgeries, and come back, even at 34. To assert that the game is faster and aging is harder and that a Met having surgery will basically just be dead to baseball forever is unrealistic and stupid. Maybe Cespedes is diminished and is only 15% better than average instead of 35 or 40? Maybe he's merely average? That's still valuable.

[batmagadanleadoff]

Kernan is calculating 8-10 months after the surgery is completed. If the surgery is staggered (one heel at a time), that puts Cespedes's return at August of 2019. And that's an absolute best case scenario, timewise, let alone what condition he's gonna be in. Best case scenarios are unlikely, both logically, and statistically. Because they're best case scenarios. And that's my beef with your post and your analysis on pretty much everything. It's always an absolute best case scenario, it's always gonna be the player's best season ever. Every player. All the time.

Even if he's back next year August, (and I doubt it because injury return predictions are historically wildly optimistic) he'll have missed most of the last three seasons. The actuarial tables aren't on his side.

[Centerfield]

It’s ridiculous that no reporter sought clarity on the time frame. It is the first thing everyone asks.

Just goes to show you there are no Einsteins on this beat.

[Ceetar]

batmagadanleadoff wrote: Kernan is calculating 8-10 months after the surgery is completed. If the surgery is staggered (one heel at a time), that puts Cespedes's return at August of 2019. And that's an absolute best case scenario, timewise, let alone what condition he's gonna be in. Best case scenarios are unlikely, both logically, and statistically. Because they're best case scenarios. And that's my beef with your post and your analysis on pretty much everything. It's always an absolute best case scenario, it's always gonna be the player's best season ever. Every player. All the time. Even if he's back next year August, (and I doubt it because injury return predictions are historically wildly optimistic) he'll have missed most of the last three seasons. The actuarial tables aren't on his side.

I've already cited the facts as to why my post is not the best case scenario, and it's really besides the point. What does it matter if the ASB is wildly optimistic? Why does it offend you so much that I'm hopeful about some Mets things? I'm not even suggesting the Mets operate 2019 with a plan to play Cespedes 70 games post ASB. I'm merely stating I think that's the time frame we're looking at.

Were you against this contract to begin with? Because surgery or not he'd be under contract in 2019 and 2020. If you think he'll be that diminished that much by age it was clearly a bad signing. If you think this surgery, which isn't exactly cutting edge new surgery with a low rate of success, is going to ruin him, why. (don't say "because it's the Mets" that's not a reason) It's meant to clear up something that's bothering him, something that took years to degenerate. I think there's probably little risk it becomes debilitating again in a year and a half before his time with the Mets is up.

But saying, as Kernan did, that anything you get from Cespedes after and 8-10 month surgery encompassing and off-season for a player with 27 months left on his contract is just dumb.

Centerfield wrote: It’s ridiculous that no reporter sought clarity on the time frame. It is the first thing everyone asks. Just goes to show you there are no Einsteins on this beat.

I'm kinda just happy no one asked why he isn't doing both at once.

[Ceetar]

I googled a bunch, which obviously isn't the same thing as talking to doctors or knowing his charts, but it seems to me like the general guidelines are 6-12 months to a heal from that surgery, so 6-12 from 3 months from now.

Puts 2019 strongly in doubt if that's the case. He can probably start doing athletic baseball stuff in like June, but if there's any delay/setback that pushes him back into pure rehab mode, it probably puts 2019 in jeopardy. Depending where the Mets are I guess, he could sneak back in for September part-time role, or just some major league reps if they're out of it.

I wonder which foot you do first. Right cause it's the load-bearing/swing foot?

[Guest 41Forever]

I'm an optimist, but I'm starting to wonder if he's done, or at least never be the player he was.

I supported signing the contract, but this one just didn't work out. They should plan on building without him, and if does come back, it's gravy. Sucks that the last three mega contracts they signed -- Santana, Wright and now Cespedes -- had the players missing significant time because of injuries.

[Guest d'Kong76]

Ceetar wrote: I wonder which foot you do first. Right cause it's the load-bearing/swing foot?

I was wondering this to myself yesterday in a humorous kinda way, but I
suppose it's a good question. The load-bearing/swing foot makes sense un-
less the other foot is worse off and the surgery is more work?

We need to get someone here press creds. As one of our esteemed col-
leagues says it's the questions that matter not the answers. Or something.

[Ceetar]

I don't think it matters how damaged they are. I think you're basically setting them back to the same place so to speak.

[MFS62]

Surgery today:
https://sports.yahoo.com/mets-cespedes-heel-surgery-thursday-223833562--mlb.html

Later