Ceetar

Edgy DC wrote: Me, I wait years for expressions of moving substance to arise from the too often morally empty vessel of professonal sports. Again, i'm not talking about the 9..21? game. I'm talking about now, about every year. None of the players are even the same. teams are transient. These aren't the same guys. Let's throw all the other stuff out for now. I have problems with some of it, I disagree with some of it, and I don't mind or even like some of it. But that's not what this is about. And it's merely my opinion. I gave Rubin's email address and answered the question about contacting guys. I'm not trying to prevent it or think you're wrong for wanting this. I just don't. I don't think it's a moving statement, like it was then. It's a calculated forced effort. That's not Rey Ordonez trotting out to SS, it's Jose Reyes. If anything it makes it worse to me. It takes something that was moving and special in a horrible time and generalizes it. I'd prefer they wear regular caps and honor those people in other ways..which they're doing.

Edgy DC wrote: Ceetar wrote: not at all. Every single thing you mentioned happens between innings or before or after the game. I don't know how you can keep selectively reading and ignore facts to hang on to a position I don't think you're really committed to, but this is absolutely and unambiguously false. when was the last time they honored a serviceperson during the game inbetween batters? seriously, what happens on the field during the game? what am I missing?

Vic Sage wrote: Keep politics and gods out of my baseball game. Really? Well, I'm with you on this, so lets get started. In addition to baseball-only caps, we have to get rid of the pre-game "star spangled banner" and color guard, the politician throwing out a 1st pitch, the 7th inning "god bless america", as well as the flags flown around the stadium. While we're at it, lets get that "42" out of the lobby and off the walls of every park, since its a celebration of a political act (integration). and no visit to the white house for the champions, either! and make sure there are no special celebrations in any park that honors veterans, or for any charitable (i.e., political) purpose. And those cultural celebration games... nope. multi-culturalism is an inherently political issue. And all teams that use a red, white & blue color scheme in their uniforms or stadia must be altered. And make sure teams don't accept or pay anybody with money that says "in god we trust". Let me know when we can start the revolution! Secular baseball in a bubble, untouched by the world! I'm so there... oh, wait. you mean just the cap thing? that's like being one of those pro-death penalty right-to-lifers. I say in for a penny, in for a pound, idealogically speaking. not at all. Every single thing you mentioned happens between innings or before or after the game. I've accepted the gimmicky/entertainment nature of baseball and that there are going to be advertisements, sponsors, random people on the broadcast and throwing out first pitches and dunk tanks and pizza passes, 12 year old girls dancing on dugouts and mascot races. That baseball, and the individual franchises are going to use their following and viewership to promote whatever causes throw money their way or they feel is worthy. I even enjoy much of it and wait on line at Shake Shack and text my answers in for the in-game Mets trivia. But what I love is that if i want, i can usually sit there in my seat and tune the world out and watch my 27 outs and just my 27 outs and not worry about anything else.

metsguyinmichigan wrote: TransMonk wrote: Wearing those ugly caps on Memorial Day weekend AND Fourth of July weekend AND September 11th is not a tradition. It has been forced upon every team on specific weekends for the past few years and I find it to be disingenuous. I won't forget that it's Memorial Day if Jon Niese isn't wearing that red, white and blue cap that clashes with his uniform. It's been, what, four years now? It's becoming a tradition. But I agree that the clashing is bad. Would be better if they stuck to team colors. I don't mind the green caps on St. Patrick's Day, either. still looking to buy one of those for the wife. Of course, that's Spring Training, and they did look kinda silly. But at least they died my Shock Top green.

Edgy DC wrote: The National Anthem has certainly grown kinda stale. We're asked to sing. But when we do, folks look at us funny. And my wife can sing (if I can't really so much). The person at the mic, somewhere along the line, stopped being somebody who "leads us in the singing of our national anthem" and started being someone who is "performing our national anthem." But that's all part of growing toward a nation of watchers and not doers. But the star-spangled hats has wiped out a more-authentic and personal patriotic statement (and a far more deeply moving one) by the Flushing nine. And "God Bless America" imposed belief in the divine upon the growing and authentic patriotism in the country, and if we are honest about our faith in our country, our relation with the divine has to remain a private and personal choice. It was a very awkward thing to mix into the post-attack public life. And I kind of like the song. Also every singer has to personalize the song and exaggerate and elongate parts of it. (how exactly would you sing along to that anyway?) Just sing the song with no fanfare and I'll wait to clap until you're finished, not 15 seconds before you do.

G-Fafif wrote: I see Ceetar's point in the abstract -- slopes can be slippery and, to put it mildly, I've never felt comfortable being told to stand and remove whatever cap I'm wearing for "God Bless America" (I'm all for love of country; I can do without the religious pep rally aspect) -- but in New York, a decade out, for one home game in 81 I don't think it's an abstract situation. Given the choice I'd have them wear blue Mets caps, but I'm okay with it on the 10th anniversary, on this one very very specific occasion, and in a game MLB has already decided is going to be a spectacle/rememberance. I'm sure they'll talk more about the 2001 team than the 2011 team.

unrelatedly, my cousin was one of the people unrolling the giant flag this Opening Day.

TransMonk wrote: metsguyinmichigan wrote: I like the Stars and Stripes caps, though I think they should stick with the team's colors. Certainly the red didn't look that good on the Mets. Call me crazy, but I don't mind the giant flags, the singing of "God Bless America" and the other patriotic celebrations. It's one thing when it is truly spontaneous and heartfelt, i.e. the wearing of the PD and FD hats after 9/11. But, IMO, forced and uniform "patriotism" is both ugly and fake. Some people (like me) feel patriotism in other, more personal and honest ways than the stale presentation that sporting events and other large gatherings try to give it. I think that's the point i'm trying to make in the other thread. Anyway, Mets police mentioned via Uniwatch that definitely no black dropshadow for next year's throwbacks.

the difference between Pagan's fielding this year is..confusing. I don't get it.

Gwreck wrote: I'm ready to let Nick Evans start in left field at least against lefty pitching. how about at first with Duda in right. Rather see Bay than Hairston.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: You argue FOR orange shirts and near-perpetual Mercury-Metsing, and yet THIS bothers you as an unwelcome intrusion of... what, exactly? Real life? History that cataclysmically changed the team's home city and actually involved Met participation? Keep politics and gods out of my baseball game. The wearing of the hats was like that then, now it seems like (to me, this is merely my opinion and my perception of it) a political thing. It feels like that city/country wide, not just in New York. People complain things like orange uniforms make them look like a softball team, but the service hats make them look like a beer league or a little league. I was sorta tongue in cheek about the orange, but really as long as it says Mets on it (or implies it on the road via New York) I really don't care what they wear. Whatever they well promotes the brand in it's own way. It is the brand. wearing NYPD caps does not do that, and it doesn't lessen what the Mets did, or what the Mets do, in regards to respecting and honoring those people. One player visiting a fire house has more impact than 30ish guys wearing the FDNY hats.

Sure, and breast cancer is a horrible disease, and pink bats are a nice idea. The recent equalization of marriage was a huge deal. Should the Mets wear hats celebrating that on the anniversary every year? Noble cause or not, the team is being used to promote a cause. Maybe in a couple of years MLB attendance is down and the commissioner figures what's really the difference between FDNY caps and Pepsi caps? It's one thing to have a one-off remembrance as baseball returns and the city/country grieves, but life goes on. Baseball has weathered World Wars and Depression and all sorts of catastrophes. The idea of wearing the caps is to remind everyone, every second, about the event. That's not what baseball is about. Baseball is the game, it's the escape, it's the balm for the wound. You can remember, and celebrate those people. Have them on the broadcast, mention their names, put it up on the scoreboard, have them throw out the first pitch. Do the same gimmicks you do for everything else, but leave the game itself alone.

bmfc1 wrote: F. Martinez is back on the DL. Shocking! Should've brought him up, never would've happen. or something. What was it this time?

metsguyinmichigan wrote: 5. 6-3 (R) LF Bad ass! He should change his uniform number. not for nothing, but he does have an .806 OPS in the last month.

Rubin responds: Thanks for your note. I'll forward your email to David Newman, the Mets VP for marketing, who is involved in those types of decisions. Adam Now looking for Newman's email. Of course, you could've emailed Newman directly (I'd be shocked if it wasn't dnewman@nymets.com) , but probably would've gotten ignored.

Duda sounds a lot like me. Except he's about 6 inches taller and hits the ball a couple of feet farther.

Edgy DC wrote: I think anxious is a good way to define him. He's a lot like Wright in that regard. His instincts and honing serve him well. But give him time to think, and things get riskier. that time to think seems to play in in pressure situations too.

Centerfield wrote: Do I have to be on twitter for me to tweet them? yeah. Adam.Rubin@espn.com is Rubin's. Most of them are along those lines. (amartino@nydailynews.com i'd imagine, or something like that.) Steve Popper and Bobby Ojeda actually still use AOL mail. I laughed.

Edgy DC wrote: Neither are you watching the New Yorks. But I certainly applaud my team for sublimating their effort in something greater than themselves, and am disappointed when they fail to. Isn't altering hats/uniforms, even for limited occasions, affecting the brand? why do they need to go beyond recognizing the servicemen they've invited to the game and all the other _off the field_ things they do?

Edgy DC wrote: I emailed Matt Cerrone at MetsBlog. mattcerrone@metsblog.com Anyone with email addresses for Rubin, tracksuit, etc. should post them here so we can flood their inboxes. Go for their Twitter feeds. most of their email addresses are fairly easy to find. I don't like the City Agency hats though. I'm watching the Mets, not the FDNY.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: Sweet haul this year, it seems. $2.1M's not much above slot. obviously this means Sandy is a disaster right? toeing the Wilpon line? something? Looks like most of the top guys signed. they seem to have missed the 12th round pick, a lefty pitcher.

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: I was never more sure of anything in my life than to wake up to a Mets loss this morning. So much so in fact, I misread the Schaefer thread as a 5-4 loss. So good on the Mets for this one. Wayne's call of the final play (listen on Mets.com) was typically rotten. WFAN played it this morning, i believe it was something like "groundball to the Shortstop, who bobbles it, and Tejada picks it up and throws to first, in time!" (Tejada seems to bobble a billion balls..)

Could it really cost that much more than the other advertisements the Mets do? They already advertise in thet MTA stations, so they already have a relationship. the MTA is desperate.. Or is it too much "preaching to the choir" to advertise trains already going to the game? (and I don't know how easy it is to plan which 7-trains are going to be on the gameday express service though.)

batmagadanleadoff wrote: Ceetar wrote: TransMonk wrote: I'll root for any of the laundry. My only wardrobe hatred is for those stupid red, white and blue caps they wear on Memorial Day/4th of July. Thanks, Fred. I don't know if you can blame Fred for that as it appears to be MLB wide. Yeah, because they put a gun to Fred's head and threatened to pull the trigger unless he went with these blue jerseys. Fred had nothing to do wit this. Between these new blues and our ridiculous black hats (And black shirts. You need black shirts to go with the black hats, natch) the effin MFY's are laughing at us. the MFYs are laughable scum. Let them laugh. It's like Craig Carton laughing at you. or Michael Kay. They think they're better than everyone else when they're simply 1 of 30. Meanwhile other teams are donig interesting things and they're trying to find a third sponsor for the starting lineups. They preen about two uniforms and pinstripes and no names on the back of the jersey even though half the fans need those names to identify the players because if it's not Jeter or A-Rod, who is it.

Most of thse ideas are unworkable, stupid, shortsighted, garishly vainglorious, or some combination thereof. But they are all represent the energetic creativity you burn for. But creative opportinities are everywhere. But some things have been done and have been done well enough. More than well enough. The uniform, the skyline logo, the lyrics to "Meet the Mets." And well enough, if not left alone, whould be tampered with very carefully, very reluctantly, and very respectfullly. I say undoing on the work of our predecessors represents not a wealth of creativity, but a poverty of it. Certainly following a league-wide trend does, and that's what solid-color jerseys are. A lame jump on a lame bandwagon rolling through the league, picking up franchises far more desperate for a mroe meaningful identity than the Mets are. It's a bandwagon we should be embarassed to find ourselves sitting on. Yes, most of those ideas are ones that I would approve of and think would be awesome. Send the Mets your resume or something. I've been saying for years the 7 train Mets game-day express should be renamed the Jose Reyes. How more perfect could it fit? And there's plenty of precedent for it, at least inside the cars, if you've ever ridden the Times Square Shuttle. Extremely workable. Solid colors may be gaining popularity recently, but it's not the newest thing in the world either. when you're an entertainment company, sometimes you gotta go with what's popular. At least consider it.