Mex17

Assuming that the Mets make these two signings (Bay and Molina) I think that this is the best combination. It is slightly controversial, so I would appreciate thoughts. . . 1) Reyes-ss 2) Castillo-2b 3) Wright-3b 4) Beltran-CF 5) Bay-LF 6) Murphy-1b 7) Francoeur-RF 8) Molina-C 9) pitcher Why Murphy ahead of the more powerful hitters like Frenchy and Molina? Two reasons. a) In being lefthanded, he balances out the lineup better at that spot In having the better "eye" for the plate, compared particularly to the more free-swinging Francoeur, having him ahead of Frenchy potentially creates more RBI situations.

For the Mets I predict the following: Dye Harden, Marquis, or Pinero (maybe two of the three if Castillo is not traded for Millwood) Hudson (if Castillo is traded for Millwood) Branyan or Huff (to be Murphy's platoon partner for 2010) Molina or Barajas

OK, forget about Mark Cuban (from the other thread). Imagine if you will a group headed up by Dave Checketts (but sans Rush. . .unless you are talking about Geddy, Alex, and Neil as minority investors) to bail out/deliver us from the Wilpons. Good? I say yes. It could be a glorious return to the Big Stage by a guy who has proven that he could get the job done here (but was unfaily run out of town by another pairing of an over-meddlesome and not very competant father-and-son team). I doubt that Checketts would blame other team's medical staffs and scary newspaper-reporters-with-hidden-agendas-to-get-another-job for his own mistakes. MSG ran like clockwork under him. http://www.scpworldwide.net/leadership.asp

I really think that the crazy/meddling/megomaniacal gene has passed over Hal. Hank was his father's son in all ways, but I think Hal is different. This represents a fundamental change for the future, in how they operate internally and also perhaps in how they are viewed externally. Can they be detested in the same manner anymore? Not for the same reasons at least.

It's a cheap-skate, half-assed way of implementing the Carl Crawford solution without actually having to spend on the real Carl Crawford.

Check this out. . http://www.newusfl.com/ I have heard that there is the possibility of the New York team playing at Michie Stadium at West Point. It would be fitting then if they were named the Generals again. Trump helped kill the first version of this by being too agressive. The idea might have worked if they had stuck to their original business plan and tried to grow it over ten years or so.

1) Get rid of the "1988 N.L. East Champs", "1999 Wild Card Winner", and "2006 N.L. East Champs" banners in leftfield. Going forward, nothing short of winning the pennant in the traditional sense (IE: making the World Series) gets commemorated for all time. Instill a stronger organizational sense of striving for greater achievements from now on! 2) Bring in a whole new training staff and stop blaming your foul-ups on others (like the Dodgers doctors, for instance). 3) Work out a trade for Carl Crawford, who I do not think will be quite as expensive as someone else in this thread thought he would be. FMart and Pagan for sure, but let's see if we can hold onto Niece and Parnell. 4) Sign Adam LaRoche for first base. 5) Go big on John Lackey. Make this the crowning achievement of the winter 6) If there is money left, sign Aroldis Chapman. 7) Get some sort of veteran catcher to pair up with Santos while letting Thole improve his game in Buffalo. I guess that Barajas is the best of these for cheap. 8) If this team is not performing as expected by Memorial Day, do not hesitate to can Manuel and make Wally Backman the interim manager. Here's my lineup/rotation: 1) Crawford -LF 2) Castillo - 2b 3) Reyes - ss 4) Beltran - CF 5) Wright - 3b 6) LaRoche - 1b 7) Francoeur - RF 8) Barajas - C Santana Lackey Perez Pelfrey Maine/Niece/Chapman

What's the over/under on ol' Nelson rising from the ashes?

The banners HAVE been up all year (on the flagpoles on top of the Pepsi Porch). I have no problem with additional fake banners for 69/73/86/00. If they add the bullshit ones for 88/99/06 again I'll be as pissed off again as I was all those years they were up at Shea.

="metsguyinmichigan":wysemdh8]You can't blame them for Church getting a concussion from getting whacked in head with a knee[/quote:wysemdh8] No, but you can certainly blame them for making him endure multiple transcontinental flights after the incident.

Is there anywhere to find video of Piazza/Mota part deux? I have searched Youtube to no avail.

The last game before he got hurt provided a good example as to why people were beginning to get sick of him. The player has immense talent. The ability/desire to become great by means of actually thinking about what you are doing on the field as opposed to playing by the seat of your pants may or may not come. It's a tough mix to handle, you do not want to sacrfice that natural joy but you do want to see some added seasoning from him.

On the topic of an extension, a younger-than-Beltran Grady Sizemore is scheduled to be a free agent the same winter that Beltran is. Would it not behoove the Mets to at least keep their options open?

="Edgy DC":3sfnaymt]They have four more hours to spit or swallow. I don't think that's what they'll do at this time.[/quote:3sfnaymt] I was thinking more of this determination being made in the winter time. Frayed Knot Jul 31 2009 11:40 AM Carroll upddates -- after no doubt getting a boatload of mail from panicked Met fans: Let's clarify yesterday's report about Beltran. Over on Twitter, the manic Mets fans took exception to the suggestion that he was likely headed for microfracture surgery, and that it would signify what I called a "last hurrah." First, most cited a late-June visit to Dr. Richard Steadman�the inventor of the surgery and one of the top orthopedic surgeons in the world�where Steadman was quoted as saying that Beltran didn't need microfracture surgery. I say read it more closely: what Steadman said was that Beltran didn't need it now, and wouldn't as long as the bruising healed up well. It didn't, he'll play anyway, and that's what changed. Sure, a top doc said that, but as with virtually everything in the injury world, things change not just from month to month, but sometimes minute to minute. It seems many interpreted "last hurrah" as "end of career," where instead I meant it more in the sense of the Spencer Tracy classic in that things aren't what they used to be. Most also pointed to a successful microfracture surgery like the one performed on Brian Giles; he came back in about seven months, and played reasonably well with no real problems since. Giles did have something of a 2008 resurgence, especially in his fielding numbers (both Clay Davenport's and UZR), going from godawful to about average in right field, and rebounding at the plate. I'm not sure if that means it relieved his discomfort but just didn't last, or that age caught up to him. In fact, despite the similar procedure, I just don't see enough similarities between Giles and Beltran to feel comfortable saying they'll have similar recoveries. We'll see if he has it and we'll see how he does if he does, but first, we'll see if he can help the Mets. It's still scary, but he's still guessing. Edgy DC Jul 31 2009 11:53 AM He's guessing, but Met fans are manic when asking for clarification? Frayed Knot Jul 31 2009 11:55 AM Met fans are manic whether they're asking for clarification or not. metirish Jul 31 2009 12:22 PM Carroll seems like he's getting increasingly manic the more he writes on this. Ceetar Jul 31 2009 12:41 PM ="metirish":3q84hg0z]Carroll seems like he's getting increasingly manic the more he writes on this.[/quote:3q84hg0z] He's mincing words to make a story out of nothing. I feel like if there was a serious possibility that he'd need this surgery, they would've done it immediately. It wasn't like the team was cruising at the time, and the choice at that time would've been an 85% Beltran, max, for 2009, or a "fully" healed Beltran for 2010. Now it's at the point where he'll miss all of it, which would be stupid (not that discounts things aroung here..) Beltran was playing, and hitting, through it pretty well before he was actually placed on the DL. So no reason to think he won't be able to do the same now. Let him play if that's the decision, and then in November, send him down to Puerto Rico with a victory Mai Tai and have him put his leg up for 3 months. Ashie62 Jul 31 2009 12:45 PM ="Edgy DC"]He's guessing, but Met fans are manic when asking for clarification? I don't care if he's guessing or not. This is not the first time I've heard micro-fracture in reference to Beltran. Will it happen? Who the hell knows. I just remember the term being applied to Mo Vaughn once and the implication then was career ender. Beltran was talking about an extension recently, so he must not feel too bad...Just don't draft him in fantasy for steals Rockin' Doc Jul 31 2009 06:42 PM It's not an ideal situation, but if Beltran's knees will no longer allow him to play center field (or possibly even left field), then maybe the Mets should look at playing him at first base. He has the bat to play first base, and it would certainly require less running and likely put less strain on his knees than the outfield. Of course, it would depend on his ability to make the move defensively. The Mets really need to determine his future status so that they can intelligently move forward this off season. Kong76 Jul 31 2009 07:01 PM A62: Beltran was talking about an extension recently <<< Really? metirish Jul 31 2009 07:07 PM ="Kong76"]A62: Beltran was talking about an extension recently <<< Really? On his house in PR IIRC Ashie62 Jul 31 2009 07:16 PM ="Kong76"]A62: Beltran was talking about an extension recently <<< Really? On an SNY pregame a week or so ago they had updates on the wounded and mentioned that Beltran was hoping to get back soon and talk about an extension I dont have a link for proof but it caught my attention in that Carlos must be optimistic TheOldMole Aug 02 2009 07:42 AM ]It seems many interpreted "last hurrah" as "end of career," This has to be the weasel of the month. It never occurred to him that anyone would interpret "last hurrah" as "end of career"? Mex17 Aug 04 2009 04:58 AM On the topic of an extension, a younger-than-Beltran Grady Sizemore is scheduled to be a free agent the same winter that Beltran is. Would it not behoove the Mets to at least keep their options open? Nymr83 Aug 04 2009 06:51 AM ="Mex17":3vecf8c8]On the topic of an extension, a younger-than-Beltran Grady Sizemore is scheduled to be a free agent the same winter that Beltran is. Would it not behoove the Mets to at least keep their options open?[/quote:3vecf8c8] He'll be a free agent after the 2011 season, he'll turn 35 in april of 2012. It would behoove the Mets not to give an extension to a mid-30's and recently injured player who isn't a free agent for another 2 full seasons (plus the rest of this one), Sizemore isn't really a factor there. Ashie62 Aug 04 2009 12:47 PM I would love to see Sizemore as a Met. Out of Cleveland where he is held to the same standard as David Wright..less pressure and 30/30 Fuck Beltran Nymr83 Aug 04 2009 01:07 PM fuck beltran?? seriously?? do you hate Wright too since he might not be as good as Longoria? Ashie62 Aug 04 2009 01:46 PM ="Nymr83":1jwt5wy7]fuck beltran?? seriously?? do you hate Wright too since he might not be as good as Longoria?[/quote:1jwt5wy7] No, I think Beltran plays soft smg58 Aug 04 2009 01:50 PM Sizemore hasn't had a higher OPS than Beltran since 05, and he's not as good a fielder. He's also currently hitting .229. Yes he's younger, and maybe in 2011 that will be meaningful, but he has not been a better player. LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 04 2009 02:26 PM Edited 3 time(s), most recently on Aug 04 2009 02:54 PM ="Ashie62"]="Nymr83"]fuck beltran?? seriously?? do you hate Wright too since he might not be as good as Longoria? No, I think Beltran plays soft With all due respect, that's just plain goofy. Beltran has played superlative defense and offense for four years, approximately two of which have been played on painfully cartilage-free knees. He's done so at a premium defensive position and given us OPS+es of 125-130... in off years (think high-150s when he's "good"). I'll say it again-- two years out of the last four with a painful chronic condition that can never really be repaired. How does that strike you as "soft?" Is it that he doesn't make a gritty Victorino face when he makes catches up Tal's hill, or is that he doesn't pump his fist like a meth-addled masturbator as he steals second and third in a one-run game? I'm not sure I'd advocate resigning him at 35... but it damn sure isn't because he's "soft." Nymr83 Aug 04 2009 02:27 PM it was really 'soft' of him to get a concussion running into Mike Cameron to get to a ball. seawolf17 Aug 04 2009 02:45 PM Maybe his mole is soft. Centerfield Aug 04 2009 03:33 PM If Beltran plays soft, give me more soft players. My problem is Beltran playing hard (out there on a bad knee) when he should be sipping drinks on a beach until his knee is 100%. metirish Aug 04 2009 03:48 PM I'm certain there was a question about his "toughness' a few years ago and I may have even partaken in such nonsense but it's not valid talk. Nymr83 Aug 04 2009 04:43 PM ="Centerfield":3mtgukzx]If Beltran plays soft, give me more soft players. My problem is Beltran playing hard (out there on a bad knee) when he should be sipping drinks on a beach until his knee is 100%.[/quote:3mtgukzx] or until the Mets are within 10 or so net games back of the division or wildcard, or april 1st 2010. i hate that anyone is being rushed back right now. rushed might not even be the right word, i hate that anyone is even being allowed to 'resume baseball activities' at less than 100%, the team doesnt need them (because the season is o-v-e-r), the team needs them healthy next spring. the exception is delgado, since he is a free agent i'd tell him that its entirely up to him whether he wants to worry more about a) getting healthy or showcasing himself at less than 100% Ashie62 Aug 04 2009 04:48 PM The whole team, from top to bottom is soft. I hope Carlos Delgado returns so he can showcase himself or as a curtain call for Cooperstown Beltran & Reyes are excused for 2009. Personally I hope Reyes is excused for good. Frayed Knot Aug 04 2009 05:55 PM I may regret asking this, but what defines a player as "soft"? Valadius Aug 04 2009 06:12 PM You hope Reyes is excused for good? Are you dissatisfied with his work? Ashie62 Aug 04 2009 06:27 PM Excessive absenteism by a key employee is usually cause for dismissal. Beyond that, it is my feeling that Reyes will be dealing with his hammy for the rest of his baseball life. Thank you for your help Mr. Reyes you now work for ----- OlerudOwned Aug 04 2009 06:35 PM I still don't get the logic that Sizemore will be under less scrutiny moving from Cleveland to New York. Kong76 Aug 04 2009 06:37 PM A62: Excessive absenteism by a key employee is usually cause for dismissal <<< Not for medical reasons. A62: Beyond that, it is my feeling that Reyes will be dealing with his hammy for the rest of his baseball life <<< Stop the presses, Ashie62 had a feeling. Ashie62 Aug 04 2009 06:45 PM Unfortunately for a Professional athlete medical reasons count You're telling me in all seriousness Reye's problems don't concern you beyond the here & now? If not, so be it, I disagree, thats all Frayed Knot Aug 04 2009 06:51 PM And let me guess, you knew this hamstring situation was going to be a lingering problem in 2005, then would allow him to play virtually every inning of 2006, 2007, and 2008, before becoming a lingering problem again in 2009 and beyond? Kong76 Aug 04 2009 06:51 PM Being concerned doesn't have me penciling him in for never seeing another AB in a Mets' uniform. You're itchin' to go cleon or whatever ... resist the temptation. PiggiesTomatoes Aug 04 2009 08:41 PM What does leg discomfort mean? Is there a pussy factor here? Edgy DC Aug 04 2009 09:11 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Aug 04 2009 09:34 PM Oh, come on. Pussy factor? ]Unfortunately for a Professional athlete medical reasons count Just about anywhere in the civilized world, if you get injured in the line of duty, the company is responsible for you. Ashie62 Aug 04 2009 09:21 PM ="Kong76":2iq5lj0m]Being concerned doesn't have me penciling him in for never seeing another AB in a Mets' uniform. You're itchin' to go cleon or whatever ... resist the temptation.[/quote:2iq5lj0m] I don't understand the large amount of support for Reyes on this board. Yeah, he's hurt and in a couple of days we'll find out how badly. His full season numbers are impressive, but he disappeared the last 2 Septembers, and wasn't doing much til 5/21 of 09. I'm the only one on this board that would like to move him?? That surprises me. Edgy DC Aug 04 2009 09:40 PM ="Ashie62":30jtftth]I don't understand the large amount of support for Reyes on this board.[/quote:30jtftth] It's a board full of Met fans. He's easily the best shortstop that has ever worn the uniform. In almost 50 years. ="Ashie62":30jtftth]Yeah, he's hurt and in a couple of days we'll find out how badly.[/quote:30jtftth] And getting hurt is generally considered a forgiveable offense. ="Ashie62":30jtftth]His full season numbers are impressive, but he disappeared the last 2 Septembers, and wasn't doing much til 5/21 of 09.[/quote:30jtftth] That's cherry-picking and vindictive. And almost certainly counter-productive. ="Ashie62":30jtftth]I'm the only one on this board that would like to move him?? That surprises me.[/quote:30jtftth] Yet it seems true. Piggy may be leaning your way, however. You strike me, to be fair, as a fan who is usually looking over the shoulders of the current players for the next thing. Reyes is far from perfect but I can't think of anybody on this team whose performance is harder to replace. We're seeing that everyday. seawolf17 Aug 05 2009 04:53 AM Plus there's the whole "he's only 25" thing. Hell, guys get hurt; it happens. But he's still getting BETTER. Shut him down and get him ready for 2010. Moving him is asinine, especially considering that you get shit for him coming off an injury. If the Mets trade him in the offseason, then he comes back and has a typical year next year for the Brewers or whoever, then you're the first one bitching about why we traded this guy and complaining why David Fucking Eckstein is our shortstop. Mex17 Aug 05 2009 05:41 AM The last game before he got hurt provided a good example as to why people were beginning to get sick of him. The player has immense talent. The ability/desire to become great by means of actually thinking about what you are doing on the field as opposed to playing by the seat of your pants may or may not come. It's a tough mix to handle, you do not want to sacrfice that natural joy but you do want to see some added seasoning from him. Kong76 Aug 05 2009 06:16 AM A62: I don't understand the large amount of support for Reyes on this board <<< You made a delirious prediction that he'd never play another game as a Met and now it's taken longer for him to come back and I'm sick of hearing you bang your drum is what it boils down to for me. I'm not opposed to moving anyone for the right price. Including posters :-) Edgy DC Aug 05 2009 07:15 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Aug 05 2009 08:49 AM I think Reyes thinks about what he is doing on the field. And I think he has displayed more than a little seasoning. metsmarathon Aug 05 2009 08:38 AM y'know, i always thought rickey henderson had hamstring problems... also, i've noticed through my own experience that about the only muscle group that's perhaps more tricky and annoying to recover from than a hamstring is a quad. i give beltran all the credit in the world for playing as much as he had, and as well as he had, with his various quad strains. that's hardly soft in my book. Edgy DC Aug 05 2009 08:51 AM Yeah, Ricky was a lazy shiftless goodfornutttin' with the Yanks for not getting back from injuries faster and then he ends up playing 20 more years and has to be dragged from the field. Ashie62 Aug 05 2009 09:29 AM ="Kong76"]A62: I don't understand the large amount of support for Reyes on this board <<< You made a delirious prediction that he'd never play another game as a Met and now it's taken longer for him to come back and I'm sick of hearing you bang your drum is what it boils down to for me. I'm not opposed to moving anyone for the right price. Including posters :-) I wouldn't say it was a delirious prediction, but I can be traded for a poster to be named later. LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 05 2009 09:30 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Aug 05 2009 09:50 AM Does that mean we may have to put up with another 20-some-odd years of killing speed, .490 slugging and absurdly skilled defense... and attendant displays of joy that piss off opponents for whom we don't particularly care? Crap. From here on in, I may need to have a delicious beer or two per game in order to choke this possibility down, and clap until my hands hurt to drown out that awful crowing and cheering after one of those disgustingly flamboyant triples. Ashie62 Aug 05 2009 09:36 AM ="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"]Does that mean we may have to put up with another 20-some-odd years of killing speed, .490 slugging and absurdly skilled defense... andattendant displays of joy that piss off opponents for whom we don't particularly care? Crap. From here on in, I may need to have a beer or two per game in order to choke this possibility down, and clap until my hands hurt to drown out that awful crowing and cheering after one of those disgustingly flamboyant triples. Have a Schaefer on me

Radical thought. . . If Beltran is truly not available for 2010 and/or will never even really be the same again (which you cannot discount) and cannot really be replaced so easily (due to $$$ concerns plus the fact that Carlos Beltran's do not grow on trees), then maybe the rational of having the likes of Santana and K-Rod on your team is no longer tenable (Wright and Reyes are still young and cheap enough to keep and build around. . .maybe you even add Francoeur to that mix now too). So do you make the bold move and trade them both, thereby getting a bounty of young prospects in return that you can build a new team with along with Wright/Reyes/Francoeur/Pelfrey/Holt/Martinez/Mejia/whoever else for 2011 and beyond? The thought here is, without Beltran, the Mets are no longer a "win now" team. It's a tough pill to swallow, but maybe you have to take the silver lining and make that adjustment.

="MFS62":3gvohqx2]Matthews knows boxing. That's it.[/quote:3gvohqx2] And boxing is a dead sport. so that is not even anything. Matthews probably cringes over the fact that Newsday's sports editor is an MMA fan (I know this for a fact). MFS62 Jul 30 2009 10:26 AM ="Mex17":1tvxjr2y]="MFS62":1tvxjr2y]Matthews knows boxing. That's it.[/quote:1tvxjr2y] And boxing is a dead sport. so that is not even anything. Matthews probably cringes over the fact that Newsday's sports editor is an MMA fan (I know this for a fact).[/quote:1tvxjr2y] Mex, that wasn't me. It was someone else quoting me. I wouldn't give him any credit for knowing anything. If anyone should be checking out that website for a douchebag name (see other forum) it's Wally. Later

="Edgy DC":2irgauv7]As a fan, I want the organziation I support to be representing itself with it's best face. And a guy who got his job by climbing up the talent evalutation ranks but seems indifferently educated outside of baseball may not be that guy. [/quote:2irgauv7] Both of the Boston assistants that I have been touting the past few days have Master's degrees. Just sayin. Edgy DC Jul 28 2009 05:58 PM They may consider a press secretary job with the Mets --- greater team though they may be --- a step down. TheOldMole Jul 28 2009 07:40 PM Omar seems to fairly inept at firing people gracefully. This is not the worst flaw to have.

The Jays have the leverage with another year left on Halladay's deal and with the Phillies wanting to add an arm for the pennant race right now.

="Gwreck":1f4illk3]Yeah, he's gotta be fired. He either went off script on his own (totally moronic) or this was a planned attack by the Mets PR department (chances of this being the case currently estimated at .0000001%).[/quote:1f4illk3] I'd move that decimal point several increments to the right if I were you. And change "PR department" to "son of the owner". Frayed Knot Jul 28 2009 06:52 AM And you think Jeff Wilpon orchestrated this because there's actually evidence that points to it or because heaping all the blame on the owner's son is fun and easy? duan Jul 28 2009 06:59 AM listen in the meeja there's no shortage of axes being grinded. However, for Omar to suggest that Rubin was doing this as some way of getting back at the mets front office (Omar & Bernarzard) for not giving him a job he'd have to prove to me that the stories were untrue. Nobody seems to be suggesting that. Therefore, Rubin has decent sources who gave him a good (true) story that you didn't like him printing Omar. He can't be strung up for that. I don't know about firing Omar, but he's certainly on thin ice. RealityChuck Jul 28 2009 07:00 AM Yes, because we all know that the ability to build a team is far less important than avoiding saying something stupid at press conferences. We need to replace Omar with someone like Ari Fleischer. That way, we won't have to worry about angering the press and can concentrate on them, not player acquisition and development, which are only a minor part of the General Manager's role. metirish Jul 28 2009 07:15 AM I have no knowledge how these work but would the Mets PR department "coach" Minaya before a press conference?. Obviously the PR people would not have known(I hope) that Minaya was going to turn pear shaped during the conference but would they then not jump in to save the situation? Having asked all that the Mets PR department might need an overhaul. duan Jul 28 2009 07:29 AM that's why I don't necessarily think he should be fired. However, judgement is judgement and if he's capable of making such an appalling lapse of judgement in getting into his personal beef with Adam Rubin on the stage I'd question his capacity to make judgements that are way more important, y'know like who to sign to 4 year 36 million dollar contracts. duan Jul 28 2009 07:38 AM they absolutely should. He should have had a strict brief and then a list of questions which might be asked. Those questions would probably have been - Was Tony a dick? (he answered that by saying people have to work with people they don't like) Did it hurt to fire someone he hired? It always does, but baseball's a tough business Would you have fired him if this stuff hadn't come out in the media ? (this is the toughie). Listen, all organisations are constantly reviewing their operations on an ongoing basis, we all operate on the information available to us, and sometimes that doesn't flow up as seemlessly as it might - that's nobodies fault it's just human nature. We'd had some preliminary discussions about whether or not Tony's style of management was the way we wanted to continue in our player development field, but there's no doubt that when Adam Rubin published those pieces our discussions got accelerated. To some degree I blame the media for this - not for Tony's actions - but for the way the matter has had to be dealt with publicly. In an ideal world myself and the Wilpons would have had time to sit down with Tony and review the progress of the whole situation and discuss whether or not we felt the organisation was thriving as it should, we would have come up with the same answer, but it wouldn't have been as difficult for us. But the reality is we live and work in a tough uncompromising environment, baseball in New York and when we've got the expectations of such a wonderful bunch of fans in our hands it's understandable that people try and paint the biggest picture. Edgy DC Jul 28 2009 07:38 AM I don't think an Ari Fleischer should replace Minaya as GM, but it might be best if one conducted most of the press conferences. As for his current thin ice, it'd thicken a little if he made some amends. Frayed Knot Jul 28 2009 07:45 AM ="duan":34nzkxyu]listen in the meeja there's no shortage of axes being grinded. However, for Omar to suggest that Rubin was doing this as some way of getting back at the mets front office (Omar & Bernarzard) for not giving him a job he'd have to prove to me that the stories were untrue. Nobody seems to be suggesting that. Therefore, Rubin has decent sources who gave him a good (true) story that you didn't like him printing Omar. He can't be strung up for that. [/quote:34nzkxyu] I don't think Omar was implying Rubin did this to "get back" at anyone. I think the thought process was more along the lines of finding a way to explain the delay in making the decision on TB. IOW: - team knows Tony is abrasive and un-liked in circles but he's "our asshole" and therefore useful as long he doesn't go too far over the line - Rubin & NYDN print articles saying things ARE out of hand and now it's a public embarrassment - Mets want to make it look like they've not been totally clueless and only reacting to the articles so Omar partially explains the time-lag with the 'we had to consider the source' angle which, as it usually does when we try to do something purely for public relations reasons, makes the pr worse off than had you not tried it at all. Stupid? -- Yes Fireable? -- Not on its own I suspect. If his rep within the org was dimming anyway this could be a 'last straw' kind of thing but reports on that are conflicting. metsmarathon Jul 28 2009 07:53 AM y'know, i may be an unabashed kool-aid drinker, but i think i can understand what omar was trying to say there in that debacle of a press conference, and i don't find too much fault with it. basically, his point was that, as part of a thorough investigation, they should at least consider the possibility that the primary messenger might have an ulterior motive. and considering that possibility (and presumably dismissing it as a course of the investigation) is not necessarily the same as accusing adam rubin of torpedoing tony bernazard, so much as it is covering all the bases. ideally, having brought it up in the press conference, omar's next statement should've been, that, though they felt they needed to consider that possibility, there was no factual basis for any such suspicions, and that adam reported the stories accurately and fairly. i guess more ideally, it should never have been mentioned in the first place, unless specifically inquired about by another news organization. so i don;t entirely think that having mentioned that they had to consider adam rubin's potential lack of objectivity in reporting on tony bernazard's actions should be a disgraceful, shameful, and unprofessional act, it was wholly unnecessary. and certainly embarrassing in the way it was actually done, and responded to, and responded to again and again and again. why the mets can't just send out a press release to announce the firing of a guy in the organization whose actual job duties, and how those duties translate to on-the-field success, the average fan doesnt really have an adequate grasp of, i just can't fathom. fire the guy quietly, send out a paragraph, and be done with it. do they need a friggin press conference when they take a dump, too? sheesh! firing omar over this would be an example of making the right decision for the wrong reason. you don;'t fire a gm because he made a boob of himself by butchering a press conference. you do it because he makes bad moves, signing hte wrong guys to the wrong contracts. firing him over this implies that part of what they cae about for the next guy is how he conducts himself in front of hte media. and really, i don't give a rats ass about that. give me a guy who knows how to sign the right players to the right contracts, and i'll be stinkin' thrilled. Ashie62 Jul 28 2009 07:54 AM You Tube has pulled the press conference video. It will take an insane run by the Mets to get in the playoffs. The firing is part of what will the happy recap of insanity. John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 28 2009 07:55 AM Snoozeday's David Lennon seems to think Omar was on script, and that the Mets typically miscalculated how it would play. ]Adam Rubin vs. Omar Minaya: What happens now? 39 m ago By David Lennon So what happens now? How do the Mets start picking up the pieces after yesterday�s news conference went nuclear? And what effect will Omar Minaya�s bizarre accusations ultimately have on the careers of both him and Adam Rubin? I�ve covered baseball in New York since 1995, both the Yankees and Mets, and I�ve never been part of a news conference like that before. That was an all-timer. In terms of a media circus, that probably surpassed the infamous �Valentine-Stoner� event from 2003, after Newsday�s own report about recreational drug use on the Mets. To sum it up, Valentine acted as if he were batting while high, as both Wilpons and GM Steve Phillips watched in horror. Valentine was fired at the end of that season, more for the team�s woeful performance than his behavior at that news conference, as Phillips won that battle of wills. In this case, yesterday�s attack on Rubin is not going to cost Minaya his job. Not immediately anyway. And here�s why: I don�t believe COO Jeff Wilpon was upset with Minaya for what he said yesterday and I don�t believe that was a spontaneous assault on Rubin. The Mets� decision-makers certainly huddled at length before Minaya sat behind the microphone yesterday and rarely do team officials veer off the script. The GM also walked in that room with a full page of notes, so there were definitely items to cross off his agenda. It wouldn�t surprise me at all if Rubin was among those items. It�s never fun for a reporter to become the story, as Rubin was yesterday. As much as people might think it�s great to get that kind of attention, or that beat writers crave to be in the middle of that spotlight, that�s not really the case. Once we become the story, and have a personal stake in the outcome, it�s very difficult to do the job. We�re supposed to report on such conflicts, and when we become targets, it�s hard to defend yourself and also report objectively on people trying to damage our reputations. So why did Minaya take that shot at Rubin? Clearly, the GM was angry he had to fire a friend in Tony Bernazard, and Jeff Wilpon also was not thrilled by it. Both were close to Bernazard � they each admitted as much yesterday � and I think Minaya�s attack on Rubin was meant as revenge, plain and simple. Obviously, it was a blockhead move, but Minaya only half-apologized. He did not regret what he said about Rubin � only that he said it during the news conference. But again, I believe that was part of the plan. The Mets probably didn�t realize how bad it would come off � and it made them look ridiculous, broadcast live, on their own TV network. After getting battered in the media for a couple of hours, Minaya appeared with Wilpon in the back of the press box for yet another briefing, this time for the half-hearted apology. It was more spin, with Wilpon going as far to say that Rubin did ask him for career advice, adding that there is nothing wrong with that. In doing so, however, Wilpon actually pulled more at the threads that Rubin had provided earlier during his own news conference, when he talked about trying to gather information about getting into the baseball business on the development level. These things usually blow over in time, but yesterday was a fascinating � if extremely awkward � meltdown on a very public stage. Even in New York, that doesn�t happen very often. Sitting in that room yesterday, I can say the media members were stunned. It was a bona fide �Can you believe this is really happening?� moment. For the Mets� sake, they better hope there�s not any more this season. Edgy DC Jul 28 2009 08:01 AM ]�Can you believe this is really happening?� moment. As in, Can you believe the story we're getting out of this? Ashie62 Jul 28 2009 08:07 AM ="Edgy DC"]]�Can you believe this is really happening?� moment. As in, Can you believe the story we're getting out of this? Really..What a pissing contest..."Take that Rubin ya basterd, I had sex with your mother last night!" Omar, whispers Jeff, "his mother is dead" Only in NY and again, fear and consumption drive all media Nymr83 Jul 28 2009 08:20 AM ="Edgy DC":2oqf2z4n]I don't think an Ari Fleischer should replace Minaya as GM, but it might be best if one conducted most of the press conferences. [/quote:2oqf2z4n] We have one, his name is Jay Horowitz and he does just fine infront of the media. Maybe he should be in charge of all press conferences? Ashie62 Jul 28 2009 08:21 AM ="Nymr83":2m5n4mhf]="Edgy DC":2m5n4mhf]I don't think an Ari Fleischer should replace Minaya as GM, but it might be best if one conducted most of the press conferences. [/quote:2m5n4mhf] We have one, his name is Jay Horowitz and he does just fine infront of the media. Maybe he should be in charge of all press conferences?[/quote:2m5n4mhf] Perfect PiggiesTomatoes Jul 28 2009 08:40 AM Why was there even a press conference? Your player development guy gets canned. One or two paragraph press release and move on. The ultimate decision to have the press conference would have rested with sonny boy. Whether Omar went rogue with his comments or the organization miscalculated the response to rediculous statements by the GM, it never should have happened. That rests with Jeff. BTW...other than working for his dad, what has Jeff Wilpon ever done or run to warrant having such a role in a nearly billion dollar endeavor? Not that it's the bee all and end all but any formal schooling beyond high school? Any tangible business experience before being handed these responsibilities? That's where the problem is. Edgy DC Jul 28 2009 08:51 AM ="PiggiesTomatoes":nxv6ctzt]The ultimate decision to have the press conference would have rested with sonny boy.[/quote:nxv6ctzt] I wouldn't conclude that. Fman99 Jul 28 2009 08:58 AM ="PiggiesTomatoes":3a8q8lm6]Why was there even a press conference? Your player development guy gets canned. One or two paragraph press release and move on. The ultimate decision to have the press conference would have rested with sonny boy. Whether Omar went rogue with his comments or the organization miscalculated the response to rediculous statements by the GM, it never should have happened. That rests with Jeff. [/quote:3a8q8lm6] It's a good question, though. One that I was wondering about. Why not just issue a press release? Given Tony B's recent escapades, they could've issued a one paragraph blurb and they wouldn't have been met with more than a bunch of "yup's" and head nodding. Why even have the press conference, unless someone had it in mind to get into this Rubin thing? duan Jul 28 2009 09:04 AM the press conference was definitely intended to clear the air and explain why they took a few weeks to deal with this. It was supposed to be a "Look we're open and transparent" (although they've actually no need to be really). The stuff that's stupidest about the Rubin thing is the CLEAR implication of it was that if had been (say) BEN SHPIGEL from the NY Times that made the allegations it wouldn't have taken them so long to deem them true and therefore they'd have sacked him quicker. That's the biggest insult to the journalist right there. Edgy DC Jul 28 2009 09:28 AM I'm not sure there was anything clear in Omar's constructions. A Boy Named Seo Jul 28 2009 09:47 AM ="John Cougar Lunchbucket"]Snoozeday's David Lennon seems to think Omar was on script, and that the Mets typically miscalculated how it would play. ]Adam Rubin vs. Omar Minaya: What happens now? 39 m ago By David Lennon So what happens now? How do the Mets start picking up the pieces after yesterday�s news conference went nuclear? And what effect will Omar Minaya�s bizarre accusations ultimately have on the careers of both him and Adam Rubin? I�ve covered baseball in New York since 1995, both the Yankees and Mets, and I�ve never been part of a news conference like that before. That was an all-timer. In terms of a media circus, that probably surpassed the infamous �Valentine-Stoner� event from 2003, after Newsday�s own report about recreational drug use on the Mets. To sum it up, Valentine acted as if he were batting while high, as both Wilpons and GM Steve Phillips watched in horror. Valentine was fired at the end of that season, more for the team�s woeful performance than his behavior at that news conference, as Phillips won that battle of wills. In this case, yesterday�s attack on Rubin is not going to cost Minaya his job. Not immediately anyway. And here�s why: I don�t believe COO Jeff Wilpon was upset with Minaya for what he said yesterday and I don�t believe that was a spontaneous assault on Rubin. The Mets� decision-makers certainly huddled at length before Minaya sat behind the microphone yesterday and rarely do team officials veer off the script. The GM also walked in that room with a full page of notes, so there were definitely items to cross off his agenda. It wouldn�t surprise me at all if Rubin was among those items. It�s never fun for a reporter to become the story, as Rubin was yesterday. As much as people might think it�s great to get that kind of attention, or that beat writers crave to be in the middle of that spotlight, that�s not really the case. Once we become the story, and have a personal stake in the outcome, it�s very difficult to do the job. We�re supposed to report on such conflicts, and when we become targets, it�s hard to defend yourself and also report objectively on people trying to damage our reputations. So why did Minaya take that shot at Rubin? Clearly, the GM was angry he had to fire a friend in Tony Bernazard, and Jeff Wilpon also was not thrilled by it. Both were close to Bernazard � they each admitted as much yesterday � and I think Minaya�s attack on Rubin was meant as revenge, plain and simple. Obviously, it was a blockhead move, but Minaya only half-apologized. He did not regret what he said about Rubin � only that he said it during the news conference. But again, I believe that was part of the plan. The Mets probably didn�t realize how bad it would come off � and it made them look ridiculous, broadcast live, on their own TV network. After getting battered in the media for a couple of hours, Minaya appeared with Wilpon in the back of the press box for yet another briefing, this time for the half-hearted apology. It was more spin, with Wilpon going as far to say that Rubin did ask him for career advice, adding that there is nothing wrong with that. In doing so, however, Wilpon actually pulled more at the threads that Rubin had provided earlier during his own news conference, when he talked about trying to gather information about getting into the baseball business on the development level. These things usually blow over in time, but yesterday was a fascinating � if extremely awkward � meltdown on a very public stage. Even in New York, that doesn�t happen very often. Sitting in that room yesterday, I can say the media members were stunned. It was a bona fide �Can you believe this is really happening?� moment. For the Mets� sake, they better hope there�s not any more this season. I don't remember that Valentine press conference. Any of you guys? John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 28 2009 09:54 AM Oh I remember. I didn't think it was that bad, it was that Phillips and the Wilpons looked embarrassed when it happened was all. duan Jul 28 2009 10:03 AM ="Edgy DC":304opwj9]I'm not sure there was anything clear in Omar's constructions.[/quote:304opwj9] not in his bumbling sentences, but to me it was clear what he meant by "who's writing these reports" god listening to it again it's just horrible. metirish Jul 28 2009 10:09 AM ="A Boy Named Seo"]="John Cougar Lunchbucket"]Snoozeday's David Lennon seems to think Omar was on script, and that the Mets typically miscalculated how it would play. ]Adam Rubin vs. Omar Minaya: What happens now? 39 m ago By David Lennon So what happens now? How do the Mets start picking up the pieces after yesterday�s news conference went nuclear? And what effect will Omar Minaya�s bizarre accusations ultimately have on the careers of both him and Adam Rubin? I�ve covered baseball in New York since 1995, both the Yankees and Mets, and I�ve never been part of a news conference like that before. That was an all-timer. In terms of a media circus, that probably surpassed the infamous �Valentine-Stoner� event from 2003, after Newsday�s own report about recreational drug use on the Mets. To sum it up, Valentine acted as if he were batting while high, as both Wilpons and GM Steve Phillips watched in horror. Valentine was fired at the end of that season, more for the team�s woeful performance than his behavior at that news conference, as Phillips won that battle of wills. In this case, yesterday�s attack on Rubin is not going to cost Minaya his job. Not immediately anyway. And here�s why: I don�t believe COO Jeff Wilpon was upset with Minaya for what he said yesterday and I don�t believe that was a spontaneous assault on Rubin. The Mets� decision-makers certainly huddled at length before Minaya sat behind the microphone yesterday and rarely do team officials veer off the script. The GM also walked in that room with a full page of notes, so there were definitely items to cross off his agenda. It wouldn�t surprise me at all if Rubin was among those items. It�s never fun for a reporter to become the story, as Rubin was yesterday. As much as people might think it�s great to get that kind of attention, or that beat writers crave to be in the middle of that spotlight, that�s not really the case. Once we become the story, and have a personal stake in the outcome, it�s very difficult to do the job. We�re supposed to report on such conflicts, and when we become targets, it�s hard to defend yourself and also report objectively on people trying to damage our reputations. So why did Minaya take that shot at Rubin? Clearly, the GM was angry he had to fire a friend in Tony Bernazard, and Jeff Wilpon also was not thrilled by it. Both were close to Bernazard � they each admitted as much yesterday � and I think Minaya�s attack on Rubin was meant as revenge, plain and simple. Obviously, it was a blockhead move, but Minaya only half-apologized. He did not regret what he said about Rubin � only that he said it during the news conference. But again, I believe that was part of the plan. The Mets probably didn�t realize how bad it would come off � and it made them look ridiculous, broadcast live, on their own TV network. After getting battered in the media for a couple of hours, Minaya appeared with Wilpon in the back of the press box for yet another briefing, this time for the half-hearted apology. It was more spin, with Wilpon going as far to say that Rubin did ask him for career advice, adding that there is nothing wrong with that. In doing so, however, Wilpon actually pulled more at the threads that Rubin had provided earlier during his own news conference, when he talked about trying to gather information about getting into the baseball business on the development level. These things usually blow over in time, but yesterday was a fascinating � if extremely awkward � meltdown on a very public stage. Even in New York, that doesn�t happen very often. Sitting in that room yesterday, I can say the media members were stunned. It was a bona fide �Can you believe this is really happening?� moment. For the Mets� sake, they better hope there�s not any more this season. I don't remember that Valentine press conference. Any of you guys? It was classic Bobby , up at the podium head shaking , eyes wide open ,arms flailing about imitating a stoned player trying to get in the hitters box and hit. It was the Grant Roberts incident that brought it on IIRC Edgy DC Jul 28 2009 10:15 AM ="duan":2hggzf4z]="Edgy DC":2hggzf4z]I'm not sure there was anything clear in Omar's constructions.[/quote:2hggzf4z] not in his bumbling sentences, but to me it was clear what he meant by "who's writing these reports" god listening to it again it's just horrible.[/quote:2hggzf4z] Yeah, but marathon has a valid alternative motivation to character assasination here, and that's that "this is one of the things we needed to check out." His bumbling attempt to bring Rubin into it was lame, but I'm not sure how to infer a clear meaning that the Times reporter never would have come up. It does seem like Omar is immediately backpedaling as soon as he's challenged. I agree that (1) they should have written a press release, (2) Rubin's name should never have come up, and (3) most press conferences should be handled by a spokesperson. LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jul 28 2009 11:29 AM ="Frayed Knot"]And you think Jeff Wilpon orchestrated this because there's actually evidence that points to it or because heaping all the blame on the owner's son is fun and easy? In the humble opinion of my lone recent Mets connection (ex-Media Relations middle-management), on the off-off-off-off-chance that this was a calculated (if not well-calculated) move from above, it's Jeff. Of the two, Jeff's far more likely to hold a grudge. Just watched another clip. As G-FAFIF points out in today's post, the garbled-talking-points-like repeated use of "lobby" is disturbing. It's difficult to watch in a few dozen ways. metsguyinmichigan Jul 28 2009 11:41 AM ="Edgy DC":4j6lyoh5][ (3) most press conferences should be handled by a spokesperson.[/quote:4j6lyoh5] Hell no!!! You, as a fan -- and me as a reporter -- don't want to hear from Jay Horowitz in something like that. You want the spokesman to give you the stat sheet you're looking for and the game notes from last week that you can't find, or to call the Cyclones manager to set up the interview you want to do later. But you ALWAYS want to hear directly from the people in the leadership positions in a situation such as this. Doesn't mean the spokesman can't coach the snot out of the decision-maker before he goes before the cameras. But you want someone there who can answer the questions, not someone who can say, "I'll have to talk to Omar and get back to you on that point." I deal with this kind of thing a lot. You can't let them hide behind the mouthpiece. metsguyinmichigan Jul 28 2009 11:49 AM Chass says better what I was trying to say yesterday ... which is why he's at the New York Times and I'm ...... ANOTHER CONFLICT FOR THE METS � SOMEONE ELSE�S By Murray Chass July 28, 2009 The newspaper industry is dying quickly; we all know and acknowledge that. But can�t it at least die with dignity? Of course, to die with dignity you have to have lived with dignity, and not all newspapers and reporters have done that. Many certainly have acted with an absence of professionalism. Believe it or not, these thoughts in my head stem from baseball. As bad as things have gone for the Mets this season, with more injuries than a rehab center and fewer hits than Tiny Tim, they got worse on Monday. The Mets fired Tony Bernazard as their executive in charge of player development and bungled their way through a related episode. General manager Omar Minaya raised a serious, relevant issue involving a reporter for the New York Daily News at the Bernazard news conference, then reconvened reporters in the rear of the CitiField press box and apologized for bringing up the issue in the context in which he did. He was right in the first instance, wrong in the second. But in the second instance, Minaya was accompanied by Jeff Wilpon, the owner�s son and chief operating officer, which helped explain his turnabout. The Mets obviously concluded that Bernazard�s bad acts, among them challenging minor league players to a fight and screaming at the Mets� superstar closer on the team bus, compelled them to jettison the former second baseman. Minaya, following an in-house investigation, made the decision and passed on his recommendation to the Wilpons, who agreed. What Minaya didn�t mention to the Wilpons, though - and this was his mistake - was that he planned to bring up a related issue at the news conference. Adam Rubin, the Daily News reporter, who wrote the Bernazard story last week, did not have completely clean hands in his report. At the news conference Minaya disclosed that in past years Rubin had lobbied him, Bernazard and others in the Mets� organization for a job in the player development department. �When the report came it was by Adam Rubin,� Minaya said. �I had to tell myself wow.� �Are you saying,� Minaya was asked, �when he wrote the stories you were suspicious about what he was trying to do?� �No,� Minaya replied, �I�m saying I had to scuffle a lot when I made the decision because I knew the person writing this has been lobbying myself and others in the organization for a position in player development.� �Coming from Adam Rubin,� Minaya added a minute later, �you have to understand that Adam for the last couple of years has lobbied for a player development position. He has lobbied myself, he has lobbied Tony. So when these things came up I had to think about it. I said we have to find out about this.� Minaya reached that conclusion even though he was aware of Rubin�s stated interest in player development. �When the stories came out,� Minaya said, �I had to look at the stories and say look, I know who�s writing the stories, but I owe it to the organization to make an even more thorough investigation and expedite the investigation.� The Mets� human resources department, the general manager said, had begun looking into Bernazard�s behavior even before the Daily News reports. In response to a question, Minaya said he had never come across this sort of scenario in any other organization he worked for. At one point, Rubin, who was at the news conference, asked, �Are you alleging that I tried to tear Tony down so I could take his job?� �No, I�m not saying that,� Minaya said. �All I�m saying is that in the past you have lobbied for a job. You have told people in the front office that you want to work in the front office.� �Over the years,� Minaya added, �he said he would like to work in the front office, in my front office, not only me but he has asked others.� Again Rubin asked if Minaya was saying that he had a �personal stake� in what he wrote about Bernazard, and Minaya said, �I am not suggesting that.� When the news conference ended, reporters surrounded Rubin, who suggested that perhaps Bernazard had given Minaya the idea to say what he had. Is Omar lying, I asked Rubin. Anybody who says he was asking for a job is lying, Rubin said. �The most forward I think I have ever been,� Rubin began, then stopped and began again, �There may be some e-mail somewhere that they dig up, but my intention was always how do you go about doing this? That was always my intention and nothing more than that.� Explaining his desire to find out about working in baseball, Rubin said, �The way newspapers are going we all need to look out for ourselves. I�m 35 years old. I�m thinking about the next 30 years of my life. I�ve asked in the past how do you get into that.� Rubin said he had asked people from all 30 teams how one gets into the baseball business, but someone who has covered baseball for more than five years, as Rubin has, should not have to ask how. It has all been there in front of him. Much of what Rubin said sounded like good old spin. The saddest thing he said was �There is no conflict of interest.� But of course there�s a conflict of interest. I�m not suggesting that Rubin wrote the stories to undermine Bernazard, but whatever his intention was in speaking to Mets� officials about working in baseball Rubin created a situation that raised questions about his motives. That�s certainly how Minaya saw it, and he was justified in thinking that way. Rubin was wrong for not understanding it. I sent an e-mail to Leon Carter, the Daily News sports editor, asking if he thought Rubin was guilty of a conflict of interest. He did not reply. Instead I received the newspaper�s statement from the editor-in-chief, Martin Dunn. �This was a well-reported, well-researched, exclusive story, and it�s a shame that the Mets deemed fit to cast aspersions on our reporter instead of dealing with the issues at hand. We stand by Adam 1,000%.� The Mets, of course, did deal with the issues at hand. They fired Bernazard. But the Daily News editor-in-chief did not deal with the conflict of interest so I sent another e-mail on the conflict question but got no further reply. In the meantime, Minaya and Jeff Wilpon came to the press box for news conference Part II. Minaya apologized not for what he said but for when he said it. �That was not a proper forum for me to raise those issues,� he said. I disagree. That was the absolutely right forum. When else? When no one was paying attention any longer? A few years ago I defended and supported Rubin when a few of his colleagues on the Mets� beat attacked him for what they considered a soft interview with Art Howe, the team�s manager whom the other writers didn�t like. They were wrong because it was a legitimate interview. In this instance, all of the other writers and columnists are virtually certain to side with Rubin against the Mets because the way most reporters think the writer is always right and the team wrong. In my view, though, Rubin was wrong because yes, Adam, it was a conflict of interest. Edgy DC Jul 28 2009 11:52 AM As a reporter, you're right. You want the story. As a fan, I want the organziation I support to be representing itself with it's best face. And a guy who got his job by climbing up the talent evalutation ranks but seems indifferently educated outside of baseball may not be that guy. I've got a brilliant president here that we all respect, but we wince painfully when he goes off talking points. The man would have been smarter to keep suspicions about Rubin to himself and now the organziation has been ill-served. metirish Jul 28 2009 12:00 PM I do find it interesting to read what Chass and other journalists like PGIM have to say on this. Edgy DC Jul 28 2009 12:03 PM Chass certainly makes Minaya's statements a lot clearer than they came out his mouth. Gwreck Jul 28 2009 12:10 PM They're also accepted as face-value true, which I found odd. metsguyinmichigan Jul 28 2009 12:18 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jul 28 2009 12:39 PM "I've got a brilliant president here that we all respect, but we wince painfully when he goes off talking points. " I understand your point. But we LIKE when they go off the talking points because you get a better picture of what a person -- politician or baseball executive -- is really like as opposed to how he's being packaged. Omar should have known better than to have brought Rubin into it, and it was unprofessional. And Rubin should have known better than to have entered the fray. I didn't have a problem with him asking Omar to clarify what he was actually trying to accuse him of, because goodness knows it was a jumbled mess. But when Rubin tossed out the "despicable" line, he crossed the line. And that's a shame, because I think he's the best Mets beat reporter our there. He can let his opinion people use that line instead. LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jul 28 2009 12:33 PM ]Explaining his desire to find out about working in baseball, Rubin said, �The way newspapers are going we all need to look out for ourselves. I�m 35 years old. I�m thinking about the next 30 years of my life. I�ve asked in the past how do you get into that.� Kinda the dirty little secret of the sports press these days-- with major papers slouching toward obsolescence, EVERYONE who's at all savvy has to be asking themselves this, no? metirish Jul 28 2009 12:37 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jul 28 2009 12:43 PM I for one have lost respect for Rubin . I do dread a Jon Harper taking over the beat if it came to that, or a Bondy. I like Lennon more anyway but Newsday the paper is a mess to read and the website just as bad. John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 28 2009 12:42 PM "Dig up an email" doesn't sound too good. Crazy for Omar to be trying to put 2 and 2 together but I suppose Rubin did open the door for this kind of speculation as off-base and poorly-timed as it was. Here's what Marty Noble told me about Jeff Wilpon by the way. "You don't have to be his friend but you wouldn't want to be his enemy." Edgy DC Jul 28 2009 12:45 PM How hot is that next chatroom going to get? Ashie62 Jul 28 2009 03:38 PM ESPN'S PTI Kornheiser-Minaya goes Wilbon-he stays bmfc1 Jul 28 2009 03:56 PM Tweets from CF say that Jeff Wilpon apologized on behalf of the organization. So that's 2X the Mets have convened the press to discuss what they said. Well done Mets! NYPost_MetsJeff Wilpon spoke to reporters again today to give yet another Omar Minaya confidence vote: "Omar is our GM. He's going to be our GM." Mex17 Jul 28 2009 04:13 PM Edited 2 time(s), most recently on Jul 28 2009 06:51 PM ="Edgy DC":2irgauv7]As a fan, I want the organziation I support to be representing itself with it's best face. And a guy who got his job by climbing up the talent evalutation ranks but seems indifferently educated outside of baseball may not be that guy. [/quote:2irgauv7] Both of the Boston assistants that I have been touting the past few days have Master's degrees. Just sayin. Edgy DC Jul 28 2009 05:58 PM They may consider a press secretary job with the Mets --- greater team though they may be --- a step down. TheOldMole Jul 28 2009 07:40 PM Omar seems to fairly inept at firing people gracefully. This is not the worst flaw to have.

If he did this on his own (and I pray that he did. . .otherwise we have a much larger issue), then he must go. I'm telling you guys, they should hire one of the two Red Sox Assistant GM's!!!!!!

="metirish":2bhds3vd]Steveo certainly had a fun time working there , at least until he was dragged into court.[/quote:2bhds3vd] With all due respect, you're still ducking the issue. Tabloid sensationalism and personal agenas from critics notwithstanding, there is too much smoke around this front office/ownership group to ignore the presense of a fire. Kong76 Jul 26 2009 11:15 AM It's largely your issue (here), people don't need to entertain it if they don't want to. Valadius Jul 26 2009 03:09 PM I'm just scared what happens when Daddy Wilpon is no longer around and Jeffy takes total control.

He may have a point regardless. Overly-lenient parents usually result in disobedient children.

http://www.nypost.com/seven/07262009/sports/mets/amazins_next_moves_will_be_more_of_same_181474.htm?page=0

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/mets/2009/07/25/2009-07-25_wilpons_need_to_completely.html?page=0