MFS62

I dunno. How do you measure pimp? Is there an acceptable amount of pimp? A munimum or maximum amount of pimp allowed? Does that differ by circumstances? What are those circumstances? What are the penalties if you exceed the limits? Is pimp a matter of national security? Inquiring minds want to know. Later

They have some interesting criteria. Why do they consider Roger Craig to be special? Was it because he was able to teach the split fingered fastball to others? LAter

Edgy DC wrote: Yeah but DeRoulet turned over the reins to Doubleday/Wilpon before the 1980 season. Then you were correct. Aikens was pretty consistent up until '84, but Swan had some good, but also some injury-plagued stretches in the early 80's. Later

Edgy DC wrote: I think the evidence at hand suggests the Swan/Aikens non-deal would have swung the Mets way had it been consummated. I don't remamber what year that was, but the performance of both of them fell off the table pretty quickly. Aikens went from .302-23-72 in '83 to .205-11-26 in '84. Swan went from 11-7, 3.35 in '82 to 2-8, 5.51 in '83. Yes, you're right, depending on the timing, the Mets would have received a good player, but for only one additional year. Later

1B - Willie Mays Aikens (for Craig Swan. Linda DeRoulet stopped the deal because she was going to sell the club, and wanted to leave that decision to the next management team.) Later

Maybe he was thinking of running for Vice President. Later

I have one memory of him. I had bought day-of-game tickets and was sitting down the left field line, about one or two rows back. They were playing the Phillies that day and Gooden was on the mound. A Wally Backman type punch-and-judy hitter (I guess that's redundant) came to bat. Kevin was playing him straight away and deep. I yelled, "Kevin. This guy won't hit ti there. Play in and closer to the line!". He looked around, trying to figure out who was yelling to him, then moved in and toward the line. Sure enough, the batter was late on a fastball and blooped the ball down the line. Kevin only had to move in one or two steps and made an easy catch. I doubt he would have been able to get to the ball from where he was originally standing. After the catch, he looked around again. I stood up, waved, and yelled "It was me". He smiled, and tipped his cap. Later

This could be serious. Dizzy Dean suffered a career ending arm injury when he modified his pitching motion to relieve the pain from a broken toe. I'd guess that there have been major advances in Orthopedic medicine since then. But with Nike late in delivering that special shoe for Pedro, I hope he waits before trying to pitch without it. Later

HOLY COW! Can we get back to baseball? I heard someone on ESPN radio in NY interview Omar yesterday. Omar was asked if he was concerned by the lack of starting depth on the team. He said that it is a case of numbers, and he felt comfortable with pitchers like Bannister, Maine, Heilmann (why in this context?) and others ready to step in should one of the starters falter. I'm not sure whether the LIma signing was completed before or after that interview. But he is probably part of that plan. Later

In case you haven't held your futures draft yet, here is the list of top prospects, by position, from Baseball America. Only Two Mets mentioned, Millege and Pelfrey. Interesting that while they mention another starter as "Maddux-type) (as in not great fastball), Petit doesn't make their list. Later ************************************************************************** CATCHER Player, Org ETA 1. Jarrod Saltalamacchia, Braves 2007 2. Russ Martin, Dodgers 2006 3. Jeff Clement, Mariners 2008 4. Neil Walker, Pirates 2007 5. Jeff Mathis, Angels 2006 Others to consider Chris Iannetta, Rockies; Kelly Shoppach, Indians; Kenji Johjima, Mariners Sleeper J.R. Towles, Astros It's really a two-way race, and Saltalamacchia gets the edge because of his offensive potential advantage over Martin. Saltalamacchia was touted as a high school player, but he was overshadowed in the Braves organization in 2004 by Brian McCann. Nagging injuries limited Saltalamacchia's playing time and doubts about his defensive ability persisted. McCann blossomed in 2005 in the big leagues, while three levels below, Saltalamacchia did the same at high Class A Myrtle Beach. He ranked third in the high Class A Carolina League in batting, a rarity for a catcher, while posting a .519 slugging percentage and improving his strikeout-to-walk rate. It's natural for a switch-hitting catcher to get compared to Jason Varitek, but scouts say Saltalamacchia also earned those comparisons for his Varitek-like professional approach and work ethic. Martin has offensive potential but lacks Saltalamacchia's raw power, or that of Clement, for that matter. If he makes consistent enough contact, Clement could become the most prolific lefthanded-batting, power-home run-hitting catcher since Yogi Berra. Walker is the player least likely to catch on this list, more because of his high ceiling as a hitter. The Pirates may not have the patience to wait for his catching skills to catch up to his advanced bat. Two years ago, Mathis might have topped this list, but his offensive struggles at higher levels have scouts predicting an average big leaguer, rather than an exceptional one. Towles earns the sleeper tag for his athleticism and offensive potential. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- FIRST BASE Player, Org ETA 1. Prince Fielder, Brewers 2006 2. Conor Jackson, Diamondbacks 2006 3. Daric Barton, Athletics 2007 4. Justin Huber, Royals 2006 5. Wes Bankston, Devil Rays 2007 Others to consider Kendry Morales, Angels; Ryan Shealy, Rockies; Eric Duncan, Yankees Sleeper Brandon Allen, White Sox Perhaps the most disappointing position in the minor leagues, first base is not loaded with potential future stars, and that's after everyone on the list other than Fielder moved to first within the last two seasons. Fielder was pretty ready last year, and he may be the only sure bet to hit 25-30 home runs annually in this group. Jackson, a college third baseman who was an outfielder in 2004, and Barton, like Huber a former catcher, are notable more for their mature approaches and ability to draw a walk than their ability to mash home runs. Bankston moved to first out of the Devil Rays' crowded outfield picture and should benefit from the latest rebuilding movement in Tampa Bay. Morales and Duncan also were reputed to be able to play third base, but neither has shown the defensive chops for the hot corner, and scouts have questions about their bats as well. While Duncan would have been blocked at third in New York by Alex Rodriguez anyway, his fringe-average arm led many to believe he would not be able to stick there even without the presence of A-Rod. Shealy is blocked by Todd Helton in Colorado at first and has added athleticism and the ability to play outfield in the last year. James Loney (Dodgers) and Travis Ishikawa (Giants) have shown flashes and are still young, but because scouts question their bat speed, it's difficult to project either one to be an above-average offensive big leaguer. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- SECOND BASE Player, Org ETA 1. Howie Kendrick, Angels 2007 2. Marcus Sanders, Giants 2008 3. Dustin Pedroia, Red Sox 2006 4. Blake Dewitt, Dodgers 2008 5. Ian Kinsler, Rangers 2006 6. Josh Barfield, Padres 2006 7. Kevin Melillo, Athletics 2007 8. Kevin Frandsen, Giants 2006 9. Eric Patterson, Cubs 2007 10. Omar Quintanilla, Rockies 2006 Others to consider Alberto Callaspo, Angels; Etanislao Abreu, Dodgers Sleeper Martin Prado, Braves In contrast to first base, second base is deep in talented players who should be solid regulars. Kendrick could be much more, considering he's nearly a .360 hitter in the minor leagues. When a player hits .360 with authority--Kendrick is slugging .555 in his career--he doesn't need to draw a lot of walks. Sanders and DeWitt aren't second basemen yet; Sanders will be because he lacks the arm strength (due to injuries) to play short. As a second baseman, he'll be a dynamic leadoff hitter and is the best such prospect in the minors, an 80 runner with above-average instincts and, when healthy, enough power to keep pitchers honest. DeWitt likely will move to second because the Dodgers have other options at third base, and his bat should be a plus at second, rather than perhaps just average at third. Kinsler should get a shot at the everyday job with the Rangers this season, while Barfield appears ready but has more competition. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- THIRD BASE Player, Org ETA 1. Ryan Zimmerman, Nationals 2006 2. Alex Gordon, Royals 2007 3. Ian Stewart, Rockies 2007 4. Andy Marte, Indians 2006 5. Andy LaRoche, Dodgers 2007 Others to consider Matt Moses, Twins; Ryan Braun, Brewers Sleeper Van Pope, Braves While this position lacks depth, it has star power in spades, thanks in part to the three third basemen drafted among the first five picks in 2005. While the scouting consensus had Gordon ahead of Zimmerman, I went the other way because of Zimmerman's vastly superior defense and a gut feeling that his offense will be better than average. When both were with Team USA in the summer of 2004, Zimmerman was the better player in all phases, and the educated guess here is his total package will rival (though fall a bit short of) that of his former amateur teammate from Virginia’s Tidewater area, David Wright. Braun ranks behind Zimmerman and Gordon because of his lesser defensive skills and his less orthodox swing, but his amazing bat speed makes him as dangerous offensively as those ranked ahead of him. Pope has raw tools to rival any of the top five players but needs polish and patience at the plate. If he learns to control the strike zone, his ceiling is very high. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- SHORTSTOP Player, Org ETA 1. Justin Upton, Diamondbacks 2008 2. Brandon Wood, Angels 2007 3. Stephen Drew, Diamondbacks 2006 4. Troy Tulowitzki, Rockies 2007 5. Hanley Ramirez, Marlins 2006 6. Erick Aybar, Angels 2007 7. Elvis Andrus, Braves 2008 8. Cliff Pennington, Athletics 2007 9. Chin-Lung Hu, Dodgers 2007 10. Ronny Cedeno, Cubs 2006 Others to consider Joaquin Arias, Rangers; Asdrubal Cabrera, Mariners; Tony Giarratano, Tigers Sleeper Audy Ciriaco, Tigers No other position has better competition at the top; any of the first four players could be stars. Wood only had the best season of any minor leaguer in the last 50 years with more than 100 extra-base hits in the regular season and 58 homers between the regular season, Arizona Fall League and Team USA's Olympic regional qualifier. But shortstop is about athleticism, and no minor leaguer--not even older brother B.J., who has too many big league at-bats to qualify for the list but would check in at No. 2 if he were eligible--has more athletic ability than Justin Upton. The No. 1 overall pick in the 2005 draft didn't get a signing-bonus record of $6.1 million for nothing. Both Uptons are erratic with their throws from shortstop and perhaps that should give Wood the edge. But as good as Wood is offensively, both Uptons can be better. Drew had an impressive pro debut, and Tulowitzki is a more athletic player who may just fall a tick shy at the plate in comparison. Ramirez has the athleticism to rival the Uptons but lacks their offensive potential, plus makeup or work ethic. Andrus might be the biggest wild card, just 17 and yet to play above the Rookie-level Gulf Coast League, but Edgar Renteria should get to know his eventual replacement in Atlanta. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- CENTER FIELD Player, Org ETA 1. Lastings Milledge, Mets 2007 2. Chris Young, Diamondbacks 2007 3. Cameron Maybin, Tigers 2008 4. Felix Pie, Cubs 2007 5. Adam Jones, Mariners 2007 Others to consider Brian Anderson, White Sox; Javi Herrera, Athletics; Andrew McCutchen, Pirates; Denard Span, Twins Sleeper Brett Gardner, Yankees Here's another position that's top-heavy but not necessarily deep in the minors currently. Maybin's development with the bat--and whether or not he can reach the big leagues as a center fielder--is a crucial question. Early reports have been positive on both fronts for a player whose athleticism rivals that of Justin Upton. Milledge and Young are a tossup at No. 1, and Young has produced more power at higher levels. Milledge still merits an edge, though, as he's two years younger, more athletic and has the bat speed to hit more home runs if his plate discipline improves even modestly. All three are among the game's elite prospects, and Pie could be as well with more polish to his toolsy, raw game. Jones has similar tools but is still new to center field after a recent move from shortstop. Gardner has the overall package to become a top-flight leadoff man if he proves he can make the transition from metal to wood. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- CORNER OUTFIELDERS Player, Org ETA 1. Delmon Young, Devil Rays 2006 2. Jeremy Hermida, Marlins 2006 3. Billy Butler, Royals 2007 4. Nick Markakis, Orioles 2006 5. Carlos Quentin, Diamondbacks 2006 6. Carlos Gonzalez, Diamondbacks 2008 7. Joel Guzman, Dodgers 2007 8. Brad Snyder, Indians 2007 9. Jason Kubel, Twins 2006 10. Elijah Dukes, Devil Rays 2007 Others to consider Cory Hart, Brewers; Adam Lind, Blue Jays; Eddy Martinez-Esteve, Giants; Hunter Pence, Astros; Nolan Reimold, Orioles Sleeper Jose Tabata, Yankees The Minor League Player of the Year, Young is big league ready, and it's not unfair to him to throw the Albert-Belle-with-good-makeup comparison at him. He can handle it. Hermida will be an even better hitter when he learns when not to take a walk; maybe he and Young, who could use a bit more patience, should have a talk. Butler may end up at DH, and hits enough to be an asset even if he's a butcher in left. Dukes has the best tools on the list but also has the biggest red flag with his uneven temperament and repeated run-ins with umpires, managers and the law. The Yankees can't contain their excitement about Tabata, but let's wait for him to make it out of Rookie ball, just to make sure he's not Rudy Guillen. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- RIGHTHANDED STARTERS Player, Org ETA 1. Chad Billingsley, Dodgers 2006 2. Justin Verlander, Tigers 2006 3. Matt Cain, Giants 2006 4. Joel Zumaya, Tigers 2006 5. Mike Pelfrey, Mets 2007 6. Dustin McGowan, Blue Jays 2006 7. Anthony Reyes, Cardinals 2006 8. Jonathan Papelbon, Red Sox 2006 9. Anibal Sanchez, Marlins 2007 10. Phillip Hughes, Yankees 2007 11. Homer Bailey, Reds 2008 12. Mark Rogers, Brewers 2008 13. Anthony Lerew, Braves 2006 14. Adam Miller, Indians 2007 15. Jeff Niemann, Devil Rays 2006 Others to consider Collin Balester, Nationals; Clint Everts, Nationals; Jason Hammell, Devil Rays; Yovani Gallardo, Brewers; Jason Hirsh, Astros; Edison Volquez, Rangers; Jered Weaver, Angels Sleepers Wade Davis, Devil Rays; Blake Johnson, Dodgers; Justin Orenduff, Dodgers The top three arms, for me, have separated themselves from the group. Billingsley's durable body, improved command, makeup and athleticism earn the nod here. It's crucial for righthanders to have a quality breaking ball; unless they have 80 fastball command and an amazing changeup in the Pedro Martinez or Greg Maddux blueprint, they must be able to throw a swing-and-miss breaking ball. Billingsley has two, throws both with authority and maintains his stuff deep into games. Verlander has the edge in raw stuff, and the Tigers deserve kudos for unlocking his potential so quickly. The doubts scouts had about his makeup as an amateur--not that he wouldn't make it, but that he lacked the intangibles to be a No. 1 starter despite his amazing fastball and curveball--still resonate. Cain's command is a step behind Billingsley's, and his stuff is a shade behind Verlander's. The Giants will still take him. Niemann could move to the top of the list if he can stay healthy, and Rogers' raw stuff rivals that of Verlander. He's immensely athletic, but with all his gifts, he had little success in low Class A ball in 2005. Hughes is the anti-Rogers, though his stuff is far from pedestrian. A healthy season also could catapult him up the list and perhaps to an early arrival in New York. Pelfrey would rank even higher if his breaking ball were better than a third pitch, but if he proves he can pitch off his fastball like he did in college, he won't be in the minors long. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- LEFTHANDED STARTERS Player, Org ETA 1. Francisco Liriano, Twins 2006 2. Jon Lester, Red Sox 2007 3. Scott Olsen, Marlins 2006 4. Adam Loewen, Orioles 2007 5. Jeremy Sowers, Indians 2006 6. Scott Elbert, Dodgers 2008 7. Cole Hamels, Phillies 2006 8. Troy Patton, Astros 2008 9. Gio Gonzalez, Phillies 2007 10. Glenn Perkins, Twins 2006 Others to consider John Danks, Rangers; Dana Eveland, Brewers; Tom Gorzelanny, Pirates; Chuck James, Braves; Ricky Romero, Blue Jays; Chuck Tiffany, Devil Rays Sleepers Matt Harrison, Braves; Jonathan Sanchez, Giants Again, the pecking order is fairly clear at the top with Liriano and Lester, who both have plus stuff, outstanding performances at upper levels of the minors and youth on their side. Also, neither has had a major injury, though Liriano did have shoulder issues two years ago. Lester's stuff took a full-grade jump in 2005, and Boston's big league pitching depth should allow him a year to consolidate his gains. Hamels might have ranked atop this list two years ago but has had well-documented injury problems, some of them of his own making. Loewen and Sowers are a wonderful study in contrasts, a power pitcher will all the stuff who's still learning how to pitch versus a craftsman with the savvy of a big league veteran. The Braves' Harrison could be another Sowers with slightly less command but better stuff. Perkins and Eveland don't have prototypical bodies, yet both throw three-to-four pitches for strikes with some power and precision. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- RELIEVERS Player, Org ETA 1. Bobby Jenks, White Sox 2006 2. Jonathan Broxton, Dodgers 2006 3. Craig Hansen, Red Sox 2006 4. Joey Devine, Braves 2006 5. Chris Ray, Orioles 2006 Others to consider Fernando Cabrera, Indians; Santiago Casilla, Athletics; Hong Chih Kuo, Dodgers; Chad Orvella, Devil Rays; Rafael Perez, Indians Sleepers Tony Sipp, Indians Putting ETA 2006 for five players who pitched in the majors in 2005 seems, well, weird, though none of these players has fully established himself as a big leaguer. Jenks clearly arrived in the postseason, though makeup questions will follow him until he stays out of trouble for an extended period of time. Broxton has similar stuff and a similar background as a starter, but while his stuff is a full grade (or even two) below Jenks', makeup is not a question. Hansen's raw stuff might be a shade better than Broxton’s but he's a long way from St. John's. Devine will have to show he can recover from the devastating home run he gave up to Chris Burke in the playoffs, and the Braves may give him plenty of opportunities to do that in 2006 in Atlanta.

WFAN just reported that the Mets have signed pitcher (and that is debatable) Jose Lima to a minor league contract. He will be invited to training camp with the big club. Yes, that Jose Lima, the owner of one of, if not THE highest ERA of any ML starter last year. (IIRC around 7.00). Later

WOW! "Two men enter. One man leaves" Anyone have the key to the steel cage? We need some excitement while we're waiting for news from Spring Training. Go at it, guys. Later

Edgy DC wrote: Yes, I read it. Let's not scramble for credit for dropping news. I wasn't. I was lauding the addition of the picture. Was the 25 man thread not the appropriate place for my post? I always post such stuff there to give you a heads up in case you missed them. You seem to have the most up to date roster found anywhere on the web. Later

She makes my team. Edgy, I had posted this to the 25 man roster thread. But without that picture. Later

Could Rickey have taught Rey how to steal? Enjoy, Later ******************************************************* (With apologies to Marvin Gaye) Ooh, we’re one run down tonight Rey babe Shea’s hot just like an oven A steal we be lovin’ And Rey babe, Take a lead that’s much longer A first step that is stronger And then we get that feeling Of Rey’s ineffectual stealin’ Ineffectual stealin’, oh Rey babe Get on down that line If you ‘re safe it would ease my mind Ineffectual stealin’, is no good to see Ineffectual stealin’ is what your steal rate be. Get up, Get up, Get up, Get up, You were thrown out tonight Wake up, Wake up, Wake up, Wake up, Rickey’ll show you to do it right I want Effectual Stealing Effectual Stealing is good to see Makes me feel so fine, it's such a rush Helps to relieve the mind, and it's good for us Effectual Stealing, baby, is good for me Effectual Stealing is something that's good for me And it's good for me and it's good to me When I get this feeling, I need Effectual Stealing

seawolf17 wrote: Am I the only person who actually likes Zambrano? Probably. And that includes members of his immediate family. Not his fault. Sadly, its not because of who/ what he is, but because of who/ what he isn't. Later

I hope the bathrooms in the new place will be better than the infamous ones in Shea. Then Moen or American Standard will sponsor them as "The Flushing Toilets". Later

Edgy DC wrote: Oh, shit. Did I just stumble into a cap-lock battle? Where are Flatt and Scruggs when you may need them? Later

RMPL See last post in this thread; http://cybermessageboard.ehost.com/getalife/viewtopic.php?t=2303 Later

As long as the players follow "do as I say and not what I did" when it comes to baseball and his other antics, I'm ok with that. Later

Check the box score. What a really shit Mets lineup that was. And - Why didn't Pedro Borbon get a save? Were they discretionary on the part of the official scorer in those days? MAybe the scorer felt Borbon didn't gave to work too hard to protect a lead against that lineup. Later

And softball, too: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8504326/#storyContinued How do you feel about them no longer being Olympic sports? Later

With his "informal" coaching, Roger Cedeno stole at a success rate of something like 60 of 66. Who knows what he can do for Carlos Delgado? Later

When the Mets played the MFYs in the Subway Series, I had made a bet with a Yankee fan friend (yes, it is sometimes possible to be friendly with a Yankee fan) that I would write a song of tribute if the Yanks won. His screen name is TCoB (as in "Taking Care of Buisness"), so I used that song as the basis for mine. When it came to say something about Clemens, the only syntax that worked was "Fat coward, bat tossing mother-fucker". And that has been my nickname for him ever since. Later

Aside from his decisions about the bullpen, I think we'll get a clue about his willingness to change/ learn when he starts fielding his regular season lineup towards the end of Spring Training. Last year he seemed set on the idea of alternating lefty and righty batters through the batting order. If Reyes(S) is the leadoff batter, who follows him? Beltran(S) is probably a better (OBP-wise) choice than anyone else as a #2 hitter. And Wright® looks like the best #3 hitter, with Delgado(L) following him. No problem with that. But the test will be who follows Delgado. The next best hitter is probably Floyd(L). Will Willie force a righty (Diaz?) into that spot, with Floyd(L) and LoDuca® and the second baseman (?)to follow? Will he put LoDuca in the #2 hole? Or will he change what he did last year and have Floyd follow Delgado? Should be interesting. Later