Arizona Action

[Edgy MD]

Guys you send to Arizona include prospects learning a new position, guys who were injured much of the last year and need to catch up, guys who took a step forward the previous season and you need to see if it was a fluke, hitters on the fast track, and ... former Florida quarterbacks, as University of Florida's own Tim Tebow follows the path through the AFL blazed by University of Miami's Kenny Kelly.

Mets who will be dodging scorpions in the Arizona include:

Marcos Molina, top pitching prospect who was injured and never really got untracked in St. Lucie this year, going 1-5 with a 4.57 ERA in eight games (seven starts), walking 11 and striking out 36 in 41 1/3 innings.

Corey Oswalt, coming off a hot 2015 in Savannah, but missed half the year for St. Lucie, going 4-2 with a 4.12 ERA in 14 games (13 starts), walking 18 and whiffing 68 in 67 2/3 innings.

David Roseboom, a 2014 draftee and Binghamton reliever who turned his biting slider into a devastating season for Eastern League hitters, going 1-1 with a 1.87 ERA and 14 saves, throwing 57 2/3 innings, walking 18 and punching out 54. His secondary stuff is still questionable, last I czeched.

Corey Taylor, a beneficiary of the Mets' Corey Advancement program, is the proverbial hard-throwing Texas righty, who basically was for St. Lucie what Roseboom was for Bingo, going 4-5 with a 1.87 ERA and 20 saves, tossing 53 innings, walking 13 and striking out 45. Corey had a full college career at Texas Tech, but those numbers only RAISE his professional ERA after he posted a 1.50 in his first year with Brooklyn. And his drafting was dismissed by some as a wasted pick to save money.

Tomás Nido is a St. Lucie catcher who had a breakthrough year with the bat, hitting .320 with seven homers and 23 doubles in only 370 plate appearances. It's a good punt past anything he's ever done before, and he still doesn't walk much (19 on the season). But it's the kind of season that makes you want to test a player against higher competition.

Gavin Cecchini was the 2012 Mets first round pick (12th overall) who did everything you can ask offensively for Las Vegas (.325 / .390 / .448 // .838), and kept right on hitting in (very) limited September duty with the Mets, but struggled at shortstop and is expected to see more time at second going forward.

Champ Stuart is a Binghamton outfielder (called "Champ Summers" by Vic Sage) whose game is all wheels, excelling on defense and the basepaths, but posting a .525 OPS is not going to cut it in any league.

And lastly, Tim Tebow is a 29-year-old jersey-selling mesomorph, who had the grace to demur when asked if he was interested in quarterbacking for the Patriots after Jimmy Garoppolo went down with a shoulder injury. His brief results in the Instructional League were mixed, but catching up after a dozen years is no picnic. I'd've guessed he was slated for low-A Columbia this season, and most AFL prospects will have at least reached high A and many have played at the top of the minor league ladder, so he will have his work cut out for him.

Doubly lastly, managing this disparate crew for the Scottsdale Scorpions will be Mets first base coach Tom Goodwin. I expect he can give Tebow a crash course in baserunning and keep him out of any game action that he isn't yet ready for.

[MFS62]

It used to be a rule that if you played in the majors (no matter how briefly), you couldn't play in the Arizona Fall League.
Will this prevent Gavin from going there, or has the rule been changed?

Later

[Edgy MD]

I don't recall such a rule. Daniel Murphy played in the AFL back in 2008 after a 49-game debut in the majors. Kenny Kelly, as noted above, played AFL ball in 2001 after debuting briefly in the majors in 2000. So if there was such a rule, it hasn't been in place in a while.

I imagine there's some limit on big league service time, but I also guess the teams know what the league is for, and don't see any profit in parking guys with a lot of big league experience there.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

Someone on Twitter posted a lineup card for today's game that includes Met product Matt Oberst at 1B. I gotta say a couple of tbe above names have escaped my attention so far including Oswalt who is tbe starting P. both Coreys, really.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

So the Scorps won 9-6. Tebow and Obert went 0-3, but Cecchini had 2 hits including a double, a sac fly and 3 RBI.

Corey Oswalt got credit for the W despite allowing 4 runs, 4 hits, 3 walks and a homer in 2 IP

[Edgy MD]

I wanted to congratulate Tebow just for putting the ball in play three times against relatively high-level competition, but I always ned to remind myself that breaking pitches don't tend to break in Arizona.

[Edgy MD]

Whatshisname is back in the lineup today, DHing his ass off.

Whiffed in his first at bat. In fact, he's the only Scottsdale Scorp who has fanned through their first 10 plate appearances. Champ Stuart is also 0-2.

[Edgy MD]

WE HAVE A TIM TEBOW HIT IN CAPTIVITY!!

I REPEAT, TIM TEBOW HAS JUST GARNERED HIS FIRST HIT IN THE ARIZONA FALL LEAGUE OFF OF CUBS PROSPECT DUANE UNDERWOOD, JR.!!

ACTUALLY, THAT'S NOT A REPEAT, SO MUCH AS A REPHRASE WITH FURTHER CLARIFICATION!!

Underwood, for his part, was immediately removed from the game, so his teammates would not have to wait to begin mercilessly riding him.

[tweet:33bxd2sq]

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[Guest d'Kong76]

And on the seventh day, Tebow hit.

[Edgy MD]

Marcos Molina, three innings on only 35 pitches, giving up a single hit, a walk, and striking out one.

Not bad for a hittin'-happy league.

[MFS62]

Tebow got another hit(an opposite field single). He went 1-4 in the game and is now 2-20 in the Arizona Fall League season.

Later

[Edgy MD]

That was Wednesday. He's been out of the lineup the last two days, which is somewhat curious since he don't play on Saturdays and the league don't play on Sundays.

[Centerfield]

Gavin Cecchini was 3 for 5 with a HR Saturday.

I'm kind of excited over Cecchini. Maybe I'm crazy but in that small sample I saw of him he looked like he had 3 hole potential. Handles the bat well, drives the ball into gaps. He's only 22, and he's 6'2", 200 lbs, so it's possible the power might develop. He's hit well and had a strong OBP over the last two years at Bingo and LV.

Would be excited to see what he could do with regular playing time. Only problem is, Keith Law says he sucks in the field. Hopefully he can straighten that out.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

Cecchini didn't just produce in the few at-bats he was given... the approach was what impressed me. He took some great ABs in there, and if he did not seem like a scary hitter, exactly, he looked like a pain in the ass for pitchers to put away.

[MFS62]

Did anyone read what part of his defense isn't good? Speed? arm? hands?
At 6'2", he could get a righty platoon job at first base.
Or if the speed and arm are ok, the "Mickey Mantle/ Bobby Murcer/ Tom Tresh et al" move to center field.

Later

[Edgy MD]

Man, that's a lot of Yankee reference points.

[MFS62]

Edgy MD wrote: Man, that's a lot of Yankee reference points.

LOL!
I even omitted Tony Kubek for brevity.
We've discussed this before.
The skills can be transferable. Mickey Stanley moved from center to short in a World Series for Detroit, but the three I mentioned may have been the most famous moving to the outfield. And Casey Stengel has been credited with being the first manager to try it.
If Gavin has the skills, and there is a logjam in the infield, it might be worth a try if he shows he can hit at the major league level.

Later

[Frayed Knot]

I think the "bad defense" comments from the various scouts and touts are more just a way of saying that they don't think he has the tools to stay as an everyday SS at the big league level, a call that probably 75% or more amateur and/or minor league shortstops hear at some point.
But it likely does NOT mean that he has to abandon SS now and it certainly doesn't mean he can't play the infield. So before we go about redesigning the defensive alignment around him, let him stay at the position for as long as possible and then transition if and when necessary. It's always easier to move from SS and, hell, if Rosario advances in 2017 the way he did this past year that he's going to force everyone in front of him to change anyway.

[Edgy MD]

Yeah, you don't have to look far for outfielders who were signed as shortstops. Add Willie Mays and Hank Aaron to the list. Willie was permanently installed in center after leaving the Negro Leagues, with the exception of a few emergency appearances, including on in a 23-inning 1964 game against the Mets.

He got no chances, but evidence suggests he looked good out there.



Cecchini playing shortstop NOW!!!, by the way, as the Scorps are getting crushed 8-1 by Glendale. Tim Tebow is also seeing his first action since Wednesday.

[MFS62]

I agree. Keep him at short as long as possible.
Edgy reminded me of a Mets-based trivia question about Hank Aaron.
He played short in the Negro Leagues, but when he was in the minors, he was moved to second base.
Who played shortstop on that team?

Later

[Centerfield]

Per Metsblog:

"Cecchini continues to have problems throwing, even struggling on routine throws from second base," Law wrote Monday, after watching Cecchini on the right side of the infield.

Sounds like an accuracy thing more than an arm strength thing.

[Benjamin Grimm]

Maybe it's "the yips."

[Centerfield]

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: Cecchini didn't just produce in the few at-bats he was given... the approach was what impressed me. He took some great ABs in there, and if he did not seem like a scary hitter, exactly, he looked like a pain in the ass for pitchers to put away.

Right? I was thinking that too.

We should totally quit our jobs and become scouts.

[Frayed Knot]

A recent (Sept '16) review of Cecchini from John Sickels

Two years ago, Gavin Cecchini was seen as a good-field-no-hit shortstop with excellent defensive skills but questionable hitting that might preclude a regular job. That’s changed now. He’s gotten stronger over the last two years while maintaining his strike zone judgment. Although he’s never going to be a significant power hitter or stolen base threat, he has a decent chance to hit for average with some doubles and sufficient OBP to stay in the lineup. On the other hand, Cecchini’s defense has declined. His error rate has been getting worse and although his instincts are praised, his range looks increasingly stretched at shortstop. There’s a reasonable chance he’ll wind up at second base eventually. He is still rather young at age 22 and nobody questions his work ethic or hustle.

Full report: http://www.minorleagueball.com/2016/9/8/12840448/mlb-rookie-report-gavin-cecchini-ss-new-york-mets

[ashie62]

MFS62 wrote: I agree. Keep him at short as long as possible. Edgy reminded me of a Mets-based trivia question about Hank Aaron. He played short in the Negro Leagues, but when he was in the minors, he was moved to second base. Who played shortstop on that team? Later

Good old Felix Mantilla.

[Frayed Knot]

More (although a less recent) evaluation of Cecchini's defense.
This was from Baseball Prospectus prior to the 2016 season.

... He knows what he is doing out there and looks polished on the basic stuff. When the plays get harder, however, he struggles with the game speed. His hands and actions get loose, and the arm, which is already stretched at short, can get scattershot. It feels like he rushes through everything, and he doesn't have the physical tools to make it work. And Cecchini isn't even an average runner anymore, so he has to make more of those plays on the move or from tougher angles than most shortstops.
You have to excel at many different discrete skills to play a major league shortstop. You can cover for a few “just okays,” but Cecchini is fringy in too many areas here to be an asset on the left side of the infield. The profile is much less exciting at second base, but Cecchini's ability to play multiple infield positions and hit a little bit should keep him employed in the majors for a while.


What they're talking about is basically the difference between being a good amateur SS and a good professional one which is what sends most of them either to other positions or to get their real estate license as what worked for them in the lower levels just doesn't cut it in the deeper end of the pool.
The good news is that, coming off of 2015 where his offense took a step forward, he then went and tacked on a second good offensive year on top of that one. And while there's certainly no guarantee that this all repeats in the majors, two consecutive 800+ (819 & 838) OPS seasons is better evidence of it than one which is where we were a year ago at this time, and so his "less exciting" profile at 2nd base becomes easier to swallow if the bat is for real.

[Centerfield]

Maybe he became aware of his fringy arm and it went to his head and gave him the yips.

I dunno. Sounds kinda like Murphy no?

[Frayed Knot]

I certainly don't see him (small sample size alert) as Murphy. Murph was never anything other than a hitter who had to play somewhere in the field and was also goofy enough to where you never knew when a ball was hit to him whether he'd make the smart play, the wrong play, or take a knee for a touchback. Hard to say about 'the yips' and Cecchini (if that description is even accurate in the first place), I just think the lack of elite defensive tools and instincts weeds out guys as they get to higher levels to where they can no longer cut it at the toughest spots on the field.

Watching Javier Baez play 2B the last couple of weeks, for example, and you see stuff that a Murphy or say Flores just couldn't do because they'll probably have the correct first instinct on a non-routine play 60% of the time instead of 90% which in turn makes them less likely to get an out on the play both because the choice they made in that first half-second put them in a position where they got to the ball a shade later, or on an awkward bounce, or in a position where they have to make the tougher throw, and then because they also lack the raw athleticism to pull it off. It's that kind of tiny stuff that matters less in A-Ball than at the majors and also less just about anywhere other than at SS. It's what separates the almost good from the really good in the same way that most can't play CF the way Lagares does even though he's neither the fastest CF in the league nor has the strongest arm.

[MFS62]

Ashie62 wrote: MFS62 wrote: I agree. Keep him at short as long as possible. Edgy reminded me of a Mets-based trivia question about Hank Aaron. He played short in the Negro Leagues, but when he was in the minors, he was moved to second base. Who played shortstop on that team? Later Good old Felix Mantilla.

Correct.

Later

[Edgy MD]

Corey Taylor (the cuter Corey) came in the ninth today for the Scorps with a three-run lead.

[list:1qljqria][*:1qljqria]Strikeout[/*:m:1qljqria]
[*:1qljqria]Flyout to right[/*:m:1qljqria]
[*:1qljqria]Double to center (where fellow Mets prospect Champ Stuart plays)[/*:m:1qljqria]
[*:1qljqria]Another double to center, one run home[/*:m:1qljqria]
[*:1qljqria]Walks[/*:m:1qljqria]
[*:1qljqria]Error by second baseman (and Yankee prospect) Gleyber Torres, bases loaded[/*:m:1qljqria]
[*:1qljqria]Walk-off grand slam, 5-3 victory for Peoria[/*:m:1qljqria][/list:u:1qljqria]