Jim Fregosi

[Edgy MD]

Reportedly suffered a stroke while on an MLB alumni cruise. Being hospitalized in the Cayman Islands, says Adam Rubin.

He's 71.

[G-Fafif]

Jim Fregosi, 71, reported dead.

ETA: Suffered multiple strokes, taken off life support. But contrary to reports, not dead.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

too bad. I always say this, but he was the best player in the history of the California Angels, before being traded for the best player in the history of the California Angels. That's something.

As I recall, was in the big picture of candidates last few times we needed a skipper.

[G-Fafif]

Before we had any reason to think anything but, "All right, the All-Star shortstop we got from the Angels to play third." Like a few other Mets for whom the eventual results overwhelmed the initial reception, it's probably nicest at a time like this to think of him in his pristine Metsian state.

[G-Fafif]

Mike DiGiovanna, L.A. Angels beat reporter for L.A. Times who shared the news of Fregosi's death (he had it from Dennis Gilbert, Bobby Bo's agent way back when) on Twitter says, uh, never mind.

Important clarification from Dennis Gilbert: Jim Fregosi was taken off life support in Miami hospital. Thought he had died. So sorry.

Fregosi suffered multiple strokes but is still alive as of this evening. Did not die of a heart attack as was reported elsewhere.

[metirish]

On SNY right now managing the Phillies in the Cone 19 SO game......

[G-Fafif]

metirish wrote: On SNY right now managing the Phillies in the Cone 19 SO game......

Broadcasting live from Lake Eerie!

[Benjamin Grimm]

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: As I recall, was in the big picture of candidates last few times we needed a skipper.

Yes, and I was kind of rooting for him to get the gig. It would have been a nice way for him to earn some redemption; if he had managed the Mets to a championship maybe some people would have let up on the Nolan Ryan thing, at least a little bit.

[batmagadanleadoff]

http://archives.cranepoolforum.net/4300/f1_t4311.shtml

[G-Fafif]

Died overnight, son confirms.

[Edgy MD]

Very sorry to hear. Was rooting for his redemption too.

What's with the marionette?

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

Not a marionette, has him by the back of his shirt.

I do believe I've told this story before but I remember that Fregosi poster coming out of the Sunday Snooze inspired me to peel apart my Dad's Sunday Times page by page looking for other Mets cartoons. Big mistake when dad found out.

[metirish]

Sad news, watched the Cone 19 SO game yesterday, Cashen was doing color with Ralph, great stuff. Fergosi was the Phillies manager.

[batmagadanleadoff]

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Not a marionette, has him by the back of his shirt. I do believe I've told this story before but I remember that Fregosi poster coming out of the Sunday Snooze inspired me to peel apart my Dad's Sunday Times page by page looking for other Mets cartoons. Big mistake when dad found out.

Okay smartypants. Then why is Fregosi picking a batter off of third base? Why? And if that third base is such a hot corner that it's on fire, shouldn't Fregosi be picking a baseball? And why is the batter still holding a bat? Why?

[Benjamin Grimm]

If only we had asked these questions a few days ago, when Jim Fregosi was alive to answer them.

[RealityChuck]

Fregosi got a bad rap. At the time of the trade, everyone agreed that the Mets got the better of the deal: a potential hall-of-famer for a pitcher who was clearly unlikely to be any good plus a bunch of prospects.

The problem was that Ryan immediately figured out how to use his talent, something no one at the time thought possible; even using modern analysis statistics, there was absolutely no sign he wasn't regressing his way out of the game: all his statistics were getting worse every year. (Rob Neyer took Gil Hodges to task for choosing Ryan to trade over Jim McAndrew when given the two options, but at the time, by any analysis both old and new, McAndrew was clearly the more promising pitcher.)

Fregosi started out strong for the Mets but started slumping in May. Injuries then did him in.

It was probably a mistake to take the best shortstop in the AL and turn him into a third baseman, but the trade was only bad in hindsight, not because of any factor in place when it was made.

I hope that, in his honor, people won't keep talking about how terrible the trade was.

[Guest themetfairy]

Do you guys remember an episode of The Munsters that involved the Fregosi Emerald that carried the Fregosi Curse (and that wound up stuck on Herman's finger)?

I swear I was watching that on television right before learning of the trade.

But none of that was Jim's fault - RIP!

[batmagadanleadoff]

RealityChuck wrote: I hope that, in his honor, people won't keep talking about how terrible the trade was.

Okay. Then I'll wait a couple of weeks to tell you that as a Met, Whitey Herzog was about as livid as he ever was when he learned of the Ryan trade. And I'll take Whitey's opinion on anything Mets over just about anybody else's when it comes to scouting Mets players from that era. Whitey also surmised, correctly, that Fregosi was already injured when the Mets traded for him.

[Zvon]

I hope that, in his honor, people won't keep talking about how terrible the trade was. Okay. Then I'll wait a couple of weeks to tell you that as a Met, Whitey Herzog was about as livid as he ever was when he learned of the Ryan trade. And I'll take Whitey's opinion on anything Mets over just about anybody else's when it comes to scouting Mets players from that era. Whitey also surmised, correctly, that Fregosi was already injured when the Mets traded for him.

Herzog didn't think that a non-baseball guy like D.M. Grant should be GM. And he said so. That was when Whitey went looking for a door so he could walk out. Would have been interesting if he stayed in the organization.

I was working on these cards this week before the news broke.


OE: Scheffing was GM. Grant was board chairman.

[Edgy MD]

I don't think we need to validate the Fregosi/Ryan trade in order to graciously acknowledge the guy's impressive career upon his passing. He's not the one who made the deal.

[smg58]

It's definitely not fair to Fregosi. There are some interesting parallels with this year's team, though. Alderson has invested heavily in players who, like Fregosi at the time of the trade, are coming off seasons plagued by diminished performance and/or injuries. And in Ike Davis, we have a player with very obvious upside who hasn't yet shown that he gets it. Hopefully our current staff is wiser/luckier than the Mets were in 1972.

[batmagadanleadoff]

Edgy MD wrote: I don't think we need to validate the Fregosi/Ryan trade in order to graciously acknowledge the guy's impressive career upon his passing. He's not the one who made the deal.

Agreed. It's also no insult to Fregosi's memory to point out that some people in the Mets organization would've shown more patience with a pitcher in his mid 20's that could throw 100+ mph fast balls all game long.

[batmagadanleadoff]

Sometime during the 1972 baseball season, the Audio-Sports company put out a series of instructional baseball records on 45 RPM discs. In those ancient days before computers, answering machines and ubiquitous photography accessible to anyone with a smartphone (that's just about everybody), you'd put the 45 record on your record player and listen to audio recorded output -- without any accompanying pictures. No still photos. No videos. No moving pictures. Just sound. Like with today's audio books, you'd have to use your imagination to supply the visuals.

Anyways, Audio Sports put out a series of these records titled Baseball Fundamentals. Each record featured a contemporary star on the record sleeve cover. There was one record on hitting, featuring Hank Aaron on the cover of the record sleeve. There was another on outfield defense, featuring Willie Mays in a Mets uniform on the cover of the record sleeve. I vaguely recall a record about fielding first base with Wes Parker on the sleeve and another record on pitching. I say vaguely because I'm not entirely certain that these last two records actually existed. And then there was a record on fielding shortstop. And I'm certain that the player on that record sleeve was Jim Fregosi, in a Mets uniform.







[fimg=444]http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7298/12543200375_5afd5dd701_o.jpg[/fimg]

[batmagadanleadoff]

[fimg=555:2p7ts0i2]http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5541/12544388854_abe9658d2b_o.jpg[/fimg:2p7ts0i2]

Ken Boswell, Jim Fregosi and Wayne Garrett

[batmagadanleadoff]

batmagadanleadoff wrote: Sometime during the 1972 baseball season, the Audio-Sports company put out a series of instructional baseball records on 45 RPM discs. In those ancient days before computers, answering machines and ubiquitous photography accessible to anyone with a smartphone (that's just about everybody), you'd put the 45 record on your record player and listen to audio recorded output -- without any accompanying pictures. No still photos. No videos. No moving pictures. Just sound. Like with today's audio books, you'd have to use your imagination to supply the visuals. Anyways, Audio Sports put out a series of these records titled Baseball Fundamentals. Each record featured a contemporary star on the record sleeve cover. There was one record on hitting, featuring Hank Aaron on the cover of the record sleeve. There was another on outfield defense, featuring Willie Mays in a Mets uniform on the cover of the record sleeve. I vaguely recall a record about fielding first base with Wes Parker on the sleeve and another record on pitching. I say vaguely because I'm not entirely certain that these last two records actually existed. And then there was a record on fielding shortstop. And I'm certain that the player on that record sleeve was Jim Fregosi, in a Mets uniform. [fimg=444]http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7298/12543200375_5afd5dd701_o.jpg[/fimg]

I left out the Maury Wills baserunning record.

[batmagadanleadoff]

batmagadanleadoff wrote: batmagadanleadoff wrote: Sometime during the 1972 baseball season, the Audio-Sports company put out a series of instructional baseball records on 45 RPM discs. In those ancient days before computers, answering machines and ubiquitous photography accessible to anyone with a smartphone (that's just about everybody), you'd put the 45 record on your record player and listen to audio recorded output -- without any accompanying pictures. No still photos. No videos. No moving pictures. Just sound. Like with today's audio books, you'd have to use your imagination to supply the visuals. Anyways, Audio Sports put out a series of these records titled Baseball Fundamentals. Each record featured a contemporary star on the record sleeve cover. There was one record on hitting, featuring Hank Aaron on the cover of the record sleeve. There was another on outfield defense, featuring Willie Mays in a Mets uniform on the cover of the record sleeve. I vaguely recall a record about fielding first base with Wes Parker on the sleeve and another record on pitching. I say vaguely because I'm not entirely certain that these last two records actually existed. And then there was a record on fielding shortstop. And I'm certain that the player on that record sleeve was Jim Fregosi, in a Mets uniform. [fimg=444]http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7298/12543200375_5afd5dd701_o.jpg[/fimg] I left out the Maury Wills baserunning record.

Don Drysdale on the pitching sleeve - a not so contemporary star.

[batmagadanleadoff]

If I'm gonna post the Drysdale and Wills records, I might as well show the Mays record, too.

[Edgy MD]

Those look like some of the loneliest baseball players in the world. Just ask Bill Freehan.



I think we can narrow that "sometime during the 1972 season" down a little, to "after May 11."

[batmagadanleadoff]

Edgy MD wrote: Those look like some of the loneliest baseball players in the world. Just ask Bill Freehan. I think we can narrow that "sometime during the 1972 season" down a little, to "after May 11."

I don't think I ever saw the Freehan disc before. I guess there ain't no Wes Parker 1st Base record, going by the sticker on the Freehan sleeve.

These records may have been released in 1972, but judging by the baseball players on the sleeves, it seems as if the project was conceived in 1968, and the players selected to appear on the sleeves were also chosen in 1968.

[Zvon]

batmagadanleadoff wrote: If I'm gonna post the Drysdale and Wills records, I might as well show the Mays record, too.

This photo changes everything. That has to be his 73 Mets Fantazy Card! Never saw that pic before, thank you for posting it. I will have to re-proportion it.

You see a lot of Willie pics from his Met days batting, but few in the field.
Very kool pic.