All-Purpose 2006 Where Have You Gone... Former Mets Thread

[Guest Yancy Street Gang]

It says here that he was born in Peoria, IL, of "multiracial ancestry."

Did Hobie have a non-white wife? Do we have the 1962 Wifey Watch archived somewhere?

[metirish]

I found this interesting and curious, from Klap...

] NEWS ITEM: Gregg Jefferies receives Two HOF Votes; Walt Weiss receives one. Anyone who has so little respect for the Cooperstown voting process or for the Hall itself deserves to be investigated. So we called Jack O'Connell, the Baseball Writers Association of America secretary-treasurer, asking for the names of the pranksters. We knew full well that Cooperstown officials mandate a secret ballot, so O'Connell was powerless to help us. But anyone who think Jefferies and his .289 average belong in the Hall (or Weiss and his .258 mark), should be forced to justify his or her vote. As it is, the BBWAA took a public relations hit this week, electing Sutter while mindlessly turning its back on the more deserving Gossage. The votes cast for Jefferies and Weiss only deepened the scandal. The solution, of course, is to make next year's balloting public, the same way the BBWAA announces the individual voters' choices for the Cy Young Award and Most Valuable Player. Only then will the election process be taken more seriously. O'Connell does rightfully point out that, "you're allowed to vote for anyone on the ballot." Still, he said, "it raised my eyebrows" to see the boxes checked next to Jefferies' and Weiss' names. "I'm not embarrassed by the votes," O'Connell said. "But I think the individuals should be." If we're demanding full disclosure from McGwire, it should go both ways. Whoever cast those votes should step forward.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Writers bitching about the lone votes of guys on the back end of the ballot occurs every single year. It absolutely misses the point of an election in which 75% of a large electorate is needed for a successful election.

And anybody who cries over their batting average fiugres as clear disqualifiers (ironically, a stat with which Jefferies, at least, ranks quite respecibly, thank you, among Hall of Famers) has no business telling other folks how to vote.

It's column filler. And O'Connell shouldn't have played into it.

[Guest Johnny Dickshot]

In some places he's listed as James Hobart Jr., so he must be a nephew. His site also links to some Cherokee Injun stuff, maybe that's what he's talking about.

Here's a photo IDed as him & dad:



Here's a photo of grown-up Hobie from a pay-for-autograph site:

[Elster88]

I don't think it's totally missing the point. Forget batting average, who in their right mind gives Jefferies a hall of fame vote? I think the ballot should be open. They're "writers", they can take having to defend who they vote for.

There are fairly clear criteria on who deserves to be in the HOF. You're one of the few "writers" trusted to make a judgement. So how does Jefferies get a vote? Because the "writer" figured no one else would vote, so it's safe to give a guy a vote when he clearly doesn't qualify? I don't like that reasoning.

You shouldn't need to find an argument to justify NOT voting for a guy. You need to find an argument to justify voting for him.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Two guys in 520, that's who. The dogs bark but the caravan passes.

The point is to make the process fool-proof, not to hunt down the fools.

[Elster88]

Whoever voted for Jefferies obviously did so without seriously considering what constitutes a Hall of Famer. Since this is Hall of Fame voting, I dislike such behavior.

Just because the system is idiot-proofed, it doesn't mean people should act like idiots.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Hal Morris got five votes and he was rarely a full-time player

Backenders who got a tiny nod:

2005
Hal Morris 5 votes, 1.0%
Ozzie Guillen 5 votes, 1.0%
Gary Gaetti 4 votes, 0.8%
John Wetteland 4 votes, 0.8%
Rick Aguilera 3 votes, 0.6%
Doug Jones 2 votes, 0.4%
Greg Jefferies 2 votes, 0.4%
Walt Weiss 1 vote, 0.2%

2004
Jim Eisenreich 3 votes, 0.59%
Jimmy Key 3 votes, 0.59%
Doug Drabek 2 votes, 0.40%
Kevin Mitchell 2 votes, 0.40%
Juan Samuel 2 votes, 0.40%
Cecil Fielder 1 vote, 0.20%
Randy Myers 1 vote, 0.20%
Terry Pendleton 1 vote, 0.20%

2003
Vince Coleman 3 votes, 0.60%
Brett Butler 2 votes, 0.40%
Sid Fernandez 2 votes, 0.40%
Rick Honeycutt 2 votes, 0.40%
Tony Pena 2 votes, 0.40%
Darren Daulton 1 vote, 0.20%
Mark Davis 1 vote, 0.20%
Danny Tartabull 1 vote, 0.20%

2002
Mike Greenwell 2 vote, 0.42%
Frank Viola 2 vote, 0.42%
Lenny Dykstra 1 vote, 0.21%
Tim Wallach 1 vote, 0.21%

2001
Tom Henke 6 votes, 1.17%
Dave Righetti 2 votes, 0.39%
Steve Bedrosian 1 vote, 0.19%
Tom Browning 1 vote, 0.19%
Ron Darling 1 vote, 0.19%
Jim Deshaies 1 vote, 0.19%
John Kruk 1 vote, 0.19%
Jose Rijo 1 vote, 0.19%

2000
Kent Hrbek 5 votes, 1.00%
Charlie Hough 4 votes, 0.80%
Dave Henderson 2 votes, 0.40%
Steve Sax 2 votes, 0.40%
Bill Gullickson 1 vote, 0.20%
Bruce Hurst 1 vote, 0.20%
Lonnie Smith 1 vote, 0.20%
Bob Welch 1 vote, 0.20%

[Guest Yancy Street Gang]

Is the same conversation going on in two places? Maybe some of these posts should be moved to the HOF thread.

[Guest Edgy DC]

No can do.

[Guest sharpie]

In '01 Browning campaigned for someone to vote for him and someone did.

The Morris votes are the most puzzling. I'd vote for any of the other people on the mini-vote list before voting for Hal Morris. Jefferies, if I'm not mistaken, at least won a batting title one year and Weiss had some big postseason moments. In '04 Mitchell and Pendleton did win an MVP so if you voted for Roger Maris you could justify voting for those guys, I guess.

The thing is, these guys didn't get in and they're off the ballot. Writers have a ridiculous 10 names they can vote for and I think people fill out the bottom of the ballots with players who were good guys or who played well for the team they cover for a year or two. Cut the number of possible players to, say, 5 and that will be the end of the microvotes.

[Guest jlandrith]

Johnny Dickshot wrote: In some places he's listed as James Hobart Jr., so he must be a nephew.

Hobie is my third (or is it fourth cousin)? Something like that. My great-uncle worked with him together at an aerospace firm in St. Louis and he and my father partially pieced the ancestry together years ago. Several branches of the Landrith family tree (entering the U.S. in Virginia originally) split apart between the 1860s - 1880s and settled in Illinois (where I was born), Texas, California, etc. Some of those branches can be re-linked by going back about 3 - 6 generations or so. For others, there are missing records and erroneous data that makes it "fun". Then there is the variation in spelling Landreth vs. Landrith that further complicates the matter.

I haven't even tried to figure out my relation to prohibitionist Ira Landrith. I'm not sure that I want to...

Johnny Dickshot wrote: His site also links to some Cherokee Injun stuff, maybe that's what he's talking about.

That is some of it. There is also the Melungeon heritage coming in from another branch of the family tree as well.

I took some time to track down two each of most of Hobie's baseball cards for my sons and a few autographed photos via eBay for my father. In addition, Hobie signed a few baseballs with the Giants logo for my kids as well. Its family heritage - granted its a few generations distant - but still of interest. That is what prompted me to put those images up in my photo album section. Every once in a while someone emails me looking to contact Hobie or George Landrith (founder of Frontiers of Freedom http://www.ff.org and part of the Virginia branch that never left). I filter out the autograph peddlers and forward on the legitimate contacts (old friends of the family, etc.) to Hobie through a third party.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Thanks for paying us a visit, James.

[Guest Johnny Dickshot]

Wow. I hope you're not too freaked out by the attention. Pardon my geekiness regarding Mets history-- I found your site by mistake looking up info on your cousin.

Thanks for clearing it up!

[Guest Yancy Street Gang]

I guess he keeps an eye on his referrer logs.

That's the same way I found about that mention of Mackey Sasser and gay porn.

[Guest jlandrith]

Yancy Street Gang wrote: I guess he keeps an eye on his referrer logs. That's the same way I found about that mention of Mackey Sasser and gay porn.

Precisely.

[seawolf17]

You know, Yancy, you have to keep bringing that up, don't you? You'll never get him to visit that way.

[Guest Edgy DC]

"Vote like you were dyin'."

[Guest Edgy DC]

Catching up with Joe Grzenda.

Hey Joe, send Yancy a photo.

[Guest Johnny Dickshot]

I think Joe's son posted info at the site -- maybe he has one.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Go the distance, Yancy: kitsy664@cs.com.

[metirish]

Catching up with Bobby Valentine.....

] Bobby V's gamble paid off KEN DAVIDOFF STAFF CORRESPONDENT January 15, 2006 UNCASVILLE, Conn. -- Part revivalist preacher, part stand-up comedian, Bobby Valentine was on a roll here in his home state. On stage at the Mohegan Sun, the Mets' former manager bounced and knelt, joked and swore -- sometimes alternately, sometimes simultaneously -- with occasional sips from a water bottle his only respite. "I can -- -- about baseball as well as anyone out there," Valentine asserted proudly Thursday night, and none of the roughly 500 attendants at the World Baseball Coaches Convention disputed it. The schedule called for Valentine to answer questions from 10:00 to 10:30, but the session went until 11, with no shortage or range of issues to discuss. Bobby V, never at a loss for words, can dissect pitching strategy in scientific terms; he can recall his infamous "glasses and mustache" disguise from a 1999 Mets game like a master raconteur; he can lobby for industry changes as well as any politician. Versatility has always been the trademark of the former Mets and Texas Rangers manager. Which is, largely, why his current job suits him so well that he turned down two opportunities to become a big-league manager for a third time. Rather than take over the Los Angeles Dodgers or Tampa Bay Devil Rays, Valentine will return shortly to Japan to try to guide his Chiba Lotte Marines to a second straight Nippon Series title. "I feel like I am right in the middle of something very special in my life," Valentine, fired by the Mets after the 2002 season, told Newsday. "Not that managing a major league team wouldn't be special, because of course it would. But it would be something that I would begin and it would just start to be special. This is something I'm already in the middle of. And it's turning out to be what I want it to be." Valentine will enter the third year of his second stint managing the Marines; his first run, in 1995, concluded with his firing after clashes with his general manager. He returned only when he was assured full control of the club. It's a level of authority that no MLB manager even approaches. In addition to engineering all player acquisitions -- he imported former Mets Benny Agbayani and Matt Franco as well as American pitcher Dan Serafini, all key players in the Marines' shocking championship -- Valentine oversees the team's amateur draft, stadium operations and promotions. Valentine was personally involved in changing the club's theme song, and he initiated such innovations as daily autograph sessions with the players -- which helped boost the players' confidence, he believes -- on-field fan contests and kids' baserunning days, none of which existed previously in Japan. "It was an exciting atmosphere there, because he was always trying new things," said Nippon Ham Fighters manager Trey Hillman, who spent many years managing in the Yankees' minor-league system. "Some of it worked and some of it didn't, but it was evident he wasn't afraid." For his myriad efforts, Valentine became the first foreigner to win the prestigious "Shoriki Award," presented annually to a person who makes great contributions to Japanese baseball. "Because it worked, it was very meaningful," Valentine said of his all-encompassing role. "Because I'm 55 and maybe, the way things are changing, I probably won't have an opportunity like that here. I like that. I hate to say it, but I like that." After the season, Valentine agreed to manage the Marines, at $4 million a season. That obviously impacted Valentine's decision-making process. But this never escalated into an intercontinental bidding war for Valentine's services. "When I had the opportunity to talk to people from those organizations, we were in the Asian Series [which the Marines also won]," Valentine said. "When decision time was coming for those teams, without leaving them hanging, I was in a parade with my owner. It wasn't a situation I could actually remove myself from." At his question-and-answer session Thursday, a person asked Valentine whether he'd ever return to MLB. "Probably, eventually," he responded. Yet, as evidenced by his recent rejections, the offer must possess significant intrigue. "I don't think I'm ever going to have to manage, as things have turned out, for financial reasons," Valentine said. "I'm going to say as long as I'm really digging it, as I'm inspired, I'll do it." It will be a challenging title defense for the Marines. Their top slugger, Korean native Seung Yuop Lee, just signed with the Yomiuri Giants. Serafini opted to take more guaranteed money with the Orix Blue Wave than sign a more incentive-laden deal with the Marines. Asked whether he can build a Japanese dynasty, Valentine responded, "We don't have that kind of talent. But I think before everyone else's attitude catches up with , I think we can make a run where we can build on it." It has never been easy to keep up with Valentine or to anticipate his next move whether it's on stage or on a baseball diamond, no matter the hemisphere. Bobby V's Title Defense figures to be just as entertaining as every adventure leading up to it.

http://www.newsday.com/sports/baseball/ny-spbobbyv0115,0,2738787.story?coll=ny-sports-headlines

[Willets Point]

Ugh, five pages that should be in the Rico Brogna thread.

[Guest Johnny Dickshot]

Someone's gonna write a biography of Valentine someday, and it's going to be unbelieveable.

[metirish]

Yeah it will be great Dickshot...it would have to be one of the greats though, someone like David Halberstram would fit the bill...

[Guest cooby]

Knowing Bobby, he'll write it himself

[seawolf17]

Willets Point wrote: Ugh, five pages that should be in the Rico Brogna thread.

Change the title! Make it 2006! (Or else stop whining about it.)

[Guest Edgy DC]

Kane Davis, bringing it at Spencer Middle School.

Jack Lind, joining the Houston organization.

[metirish]

Klap on Wally...

] For a few precious weeks in December, Wally Backman was convinced his exile from baseball was over, and that it was his former team, the Mets, that would rescue him. Backman had had two spirited conversations with Omar Minaya about the Class AA managerial position and everything in the general manager's tone suggested to Backman the path was clear. But then came a devastating phone call from Shea. Minaya said there "wasn't a good fit" at Binghamton. Maybe at some point in the future, Backman heard the GM say, which was the corporate equivalent of a death notice. Backman hung up, wondering how much longer the blacklist will continue. His reputation has been irreparably damaged ever since the Diamondbacks, who hired the former second baseman to be their manager in 2004, discovered they were inheriting not just Backman's fiery leadership skills, but his damaged past, as well. Turned out that Backman had been arrested for drunken driving in 2000, pleaded guilty to a harassment charge involving a female friend of the family and was tarnished by allegations of spousal abuse made by his ex-wife. In a matter of four days, Backman's career in Arizona was over. The D-Backs were embarrassed for their failure to conduct a thorough background check, and were determined to wash their hands of the matter -- even as Backman accepted responsibility for the DUI and pointed out that a restraining order filed by his wife against him eventually was dismissed. Since then Backman continually has apologized, but that has yet to impress the baseball community. Backman showed up at the winter meetings in Dallas last month, hoping for a break. The Pirates seemed interested, but had no openings. Maybe next year, they said. "I'm stumped why I can't get a job, even on the minor league level," Backman said by telephone Saturday. He was speaking from his home in Pineville, Ore., where, he says without embarrassment, he spends most of his time hunting and fishing. The former second baseman, an integral part of the Mets' championship team in 1986, pays his bills with his Major League Baseball pension, which players can begin collecting at age 45. Without a cash crisis threatening him, Backman is content to wait out the blacklist, the same way Doc Gooden and Darryl Strawberry once did. Only, how long can the high-strung Backman keep fishing without eventually moving on and starting another career? It might be tempting, but to give up now, Backman says, would mean validating the Diamondbacks, who not only fired him without clemency, but didn't pay a penny of the $1 million contract that had been verbally agreed upon. "It's not like I robbed a bank or did drugs," Backman said. "The whole thing boils down to a lousy divorce and a DUI. I've paid for that mistake. The president of the United States has a DUI on his record and he's still president. I made a mistake and learned from it. I've grown up." The Mets, of all teams, might've been ready to believe Backman. He spoke to Jeff Wilpon, the COO, who offered no objection to his return. With clearance from ownership, Backman's candidacy was referred to Minaya for what Backman thought was a baseball-only evaluation. And here's where he thought he was home free. If Backman could offer the Mets anything, it was the ability to groom prospects. He twice was named by Baseball America as the magazine's best managerial prospect -- in 2002, when he was managing Class AA Birmingham in the White Sox' organization, and in 2004, after one season in the Diamondbacks' system managing Class A Lancaster. Backman made an imprint on at least one of Arizona's younger stars, first baseman Conor Jackson, who played for Backman at Lancaster. "I hope he gets back in the worst way," Jackson told the Arizona Republic in September. "He definitely had a huge impact on me. That was my first professional season and he taught me how to win, how to play hard, how to make a difference. "If anybody needs a reference, tell them to call me." Backman figured that kind of endorsement had to count for something. And it only could help him that the '86 team is, one by one, being welcomed back to the flock. Darryl Strawberry, once an untouchable in the Wilpons' eyes, is now a guest instructor in spring training. There's a similar internal movement to honor Dwight Gooden, putting he and Straw in the club's hall of fame. And just last week, Ron Darling and Keith Hernandez were named as co-color broadcasters for the Mets' SportsNet New York cable network. With that kind of momentum, Backman was more than hopeful. After all, the Mets were ready to interview him for their managerial vacancy after Art Howe was fired in 2004. He skipped the interview, though, believing he was a can't-miss in Arizona. This time, Backman wasn't asking for work at Shea, only a chance to prove himself from the bottom. "What I don't understand is how the Mets were willing to interview me for a job on the major league level, and now they won't consider me for the minor leagues," Backman said. "It's not even like I'm asking them to take a risk. I've proven myself on the minor league level. I know how to manage kids. My track record proves that." However close the Mets came to relenting, the campaign ended with that phone call from Minaya. Polite and professional, the conversation nevertheless sent Backman back into isolation, where he'll be hearing that familiar tease. Maybe next year. E-mail: klapisch@nothjersey.com

[Guest Edgy DC]

A few holes.

(1) The Mets did interview him, so it's not like he was deemed untouchable.

(2) The chronlogy is quite obviously off on

]Darryl Strawberry, once an untouchable in the Wilpons' eyes, is now a guest instructor in spring training. There's a similar internal movement to honor Dwight Gooden, putting he and Straw in the club's hall of fame. And just last week, Ron Darling and Keith Hernandez were named as co-color broadcasters for the Mets' SportsNet New York cable network. With that kind of momentum, Backman was more than hopeful.

I think, nonetheless, that it might be a smart move to offer him a job of some sort, if only a roving instructor type deal.