Who's gonna be the General Manager?

[smg58]

Centerfield wrote: Of course, if we hire Bloom, then it’s awkward when we sit down to negotiate deGrom’s extension...

It's pretty damn awkward either way.

[Benjamin Grimm]

There's been speculation that the Mets hope to make their announcement on Monday, the World Series travel day. (Of course, the Series may be concluded by then.) If so, we'll have our answer soon enough.

Bloom seems the obvious and logical choice. It's strange to hear that Brodie is the front-runner. I'm skeptical of that.

[Centerfield]

Jeff Passan also reporting through sources that say it's going to be Van Wagenen.

I guess if we've learned anything it's that we won't know anything until this is all done. But what a letdown that would be.

I will say this. It was nice to go to bed, even for just one night, optimistic that change might be coming for the Mets.

[RealityChuck]

I can't see Van Whatisname as being successful. I suspect the main reason to hire him would be to keep the triumvirate to make baseball decisions and have him negotiating contracts.

But Fred wanted a good baseball man and Jeff wanted someone versed in analytics, so they compromised and chose someone who didn't have background in either.

[metirish]

@AnthonyDiComo
According to multiple sources, the Mets expect to negotiate an offer for CAA agent Brodie Van Wagenen to become their next general manager.

It's not a done deal, but the job is Van Wagenen's if he and the Mets can come to an agreement. A final answer should come next week.


@ryan_james1992

Replying to @AnthonyDiComo
What could swing this in Bloom’s favor, if anything?


Anthony DiComo
‏
Van Wagenen saying no is the only thing that would stop it.

[Edgy MD]

I imagine VW has a tough agent to deal with.

[Guest d'Kong76]

Van Whatshisnuts©? What a fucking bizarre joke if this comes to fruition.
Give me Chaim, or give me death!

41Forever wrote: There was a wrestler -- Jeff Torborg's son, actually -- who wore Gene's makeup and wrestled under the Demon name, too!

I don't think I ever knew Torborg had a professional wrestling son. If I once
knew that, the memory resides in the fragmented portion of my noggin'.

[Benjamin Grimm]

Well, if it's Van Wagenen I'll just have to say, "I hope they know what they're doing."

That's not an especially comforting notion.

[Edgy MD]

d'Kong76 wrote: Van Whatshisnuts©? What a fucking bizarre joke if this comes to fruition. Give me Chaim, or give me death! 41Forever wrote: There was a wrestler -- Jeff Torborg's son, actually -- who wore Gene's makeup and wrestled under the Demon name, too! I don't think I ever knew Torborg had a professional wrestling son. If I once knew that, the memory resides in the fragmented portion of my noggin'.

It came up in these parts. It hurt Torborg's tenure with the Marlins, as he hired his son to be a trainer and you can imagine how that worked out, but he's stayed in the game, has been part of two championship teams, and is still the conditioning coordinator for the Chicago White Sox.

[Guest 41Forever]

Edgy MD wrote: d'Kong76 wrote: Van Whatshisnuts©? What a fucking bizarre joke if this comes to fruition. Give me Chaim, or give me death! 41Forever wrote: There was a wrestler -- Jeff Torborg's son, actually -- who wore Gene's makeup and wrestled under the Demon name, too! I don't think I ever knew Torborg had a professional wrestling son. If I once knew that, the memory resides in the fragmented portion of my noggin'. It came up in these parts. It hurt Torborg's tenure with the Marlins, as he hired his son to be a trainer and you can imagine how that worked out, but he's stayed in the game, has been part of two championship teams, and is still the conditioning coordinator for the Chicago White Sox.

Dale as Demon.



Dale as a White Sox trainer. Note the barbell cap!

[Guest 41Forever]

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Well, if it's Van Wagenen I'll just have to say, "I hope they know what they're doing." That's not an especially comforting notion.

We kind of beat them up when we think they are going the traditional route with Melvin, so I think we need to give them the opportunity to try something different and innovative.

I like his statement from the other day:

"I have regular dialogue with all 30 teams. These conversations share a central theme; how can I help make the team better?" "In my role as an agent, my solution is to create opportunities for players to be successful both on and off the field. By creating partnerships between players and teams, the interests of all parties can be aligned. If the players are able to reach their peak potential, the fans will be rewarded with a competitive team that can contend for championships year in and year out. The Clubs benefit with compelling, sustainable and profitable entertainment franchises; and the players are rewarded with a platform to realize their childhood dreams while receiving compensation consistent with their tremendous talents." "My conversations with the Mets continue to be organic. I believe baseball is better when the Mets are competitive and successful. That success is better for the fans, players, and the economy of the sport. As Jeff and Fred continue their search for a new head of baseball operations, the players, fans and entire organization will be motivated to have a leader with the skills and commitment to win. If the Wilpon's believe I am that person, we will have that conversation."

[HahnSolo]

Lot of buzzwords there. Not a lot of “this is how I will make the team better”.

[Centerfield]

41Forever wrote: We kind of beat them up when we think they are going the traditional route with Melvin, so I think we need to give them the opportunity to try something different and innovative.

So first off, "we" (inclusive of you) have never beaten them up for a thing. No matter what the Wilpons do, you stretch and justify, and twist to spin it in a positive light. You do this but still claim to be neutral on the Wilpons. The act is tired and old.

We (exclusive of you) panned them when it looked like they were going Melvin, because Melvin was nearly universally accepted across the board as a bad choice, or at least, not the best choice. That is why we (exclusive of you) celebrated when he was eliminated.

We (presumably inclusive of you) were ready to applaud them if they picked Bloom. He seems to be head and shoulders the best candidate.

And now we (exclusive of you) are wary when they try this unconventional approach. We know almost nothing about Van Wagenen. Is he versed in analytics? Does he have any experience whatsoever in scouting? Does he have any idea how to budget a team? What are his relationships with other agents? How will he resolve issues with his current clients, a few of them being very important to the Mets?

And we (exclusive of you) are right to question that when there is a clearly well-qualified candidate right there for the taking. And given their history of incompetence we (inclusive of you) can rightfully be skeptical.

41Forever wrote: I like his statement from the other day: "I have regular dialogue with all 30 teams. These conversations share a central theme; how can I help make the team better?" "In my role as an agent, my solution is to create opportunities for players to be successful both on and off the field. By creating partnerships between players and teams, the interests of all parties can be aligned. If the players are able to reach their peak potential, the fans will be rewarded with a competitive team that can contend for championships year in and year out. The Clubs benefit with compelling, sustainable and profitable entertainment franchises; and the players are rewarded with a platform to realize their childhood dreams while receiving compensation consistent with their tremendous talents." "My conversations with the Mets continue to be organic. I believe baseball is better when the Mets are competitive and successful. That success is better for the fans, players, and the economy of the sport. As Jeff and Fred continue their search for a new head of baseball operations, the players, fans and entire organization will be motivated to have a leader with the skills and commitment to win. If the Wilpon's believe I am that person, we will have that conversation."

It's a bullshit statement. I could write it in 5 minutes.

[Guest 41Forever]

Centerfield wrote: It's a bullshit statement. I could write it in 5 minutes.

You are a very talented writer.

I don't know why you continue to attack me. I'm certainly not looking for a fight. There is no reason to make these discussions personal. We can disagree and still be pleasant.

Edited October 26, 2018 by Guest

[G-Fafif]

Ari Gold left agenting to run a studio, albeit on Entourage.

[Guest sharpie]

I'm actually kind of surprised that this hasn't happened before. Agents deal with players and management on a regular basis and good ones should know the business well and at least would be concerned about players staying healthy, something the Mets have been pretty bad at in recent years. They also scout talent, albeit for different reasons.

If Van Wagenen is smart he'll hire people versed on the scouting side and get a good analytics team in place.

Agents negotiate for a living. Transferring that skill to making trades and finding the right fit on the free agent market is not impossible

I know dozens of agents. In publishing people move between agencies and the management of publishing houses all the time. Not apples to apples but there is a connection.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

yeah I'm not against Bro per se, but I'm curious as to the use case, as it were. you figure there's a financial angle, if there's a dog whistle to Fred in his statement it's when he talks about the club being profitable.

I'm sure his clients just move to CAA colleagues, no bd.

[Guest d'Kong76]

I see no attacking, still see envelopes being pushed.

Good weekend to all, Go Sawx!

[Frayed Knot]

Once again I am amazed by the fact that a NYM internal decision, made supposedly by a very narrow group of insiders (possibly as few as two) stays a secret FOR LIKE TEN FUCKING MINUTES!!!!

[MFS62]

HahnSolo wrote: Lot of buzzwords there. Not a lot of “this is how I will make the team better”.

And, there has been no mention of any (non-negotiating related) baseball skill he brings to the table. None. Not one.
Does he have any?
Player scouting?
Player evaluation?
Player development?
Building a roster?
Anything?
Buehler?

And (I think Kase brought this up) when he does negotiate with the players he has represented, won't conflict of interest issues arise with his ex-partners who will still be representing those players?

Sounds like a SNAFU waiting to happen.
Later

[Guest d'Kong76]

And (I think Kase brought this up)

Wasn't me

[MFS62]

d'Kong76 wrote: And (I think Kase brought this up) Wasn't me

Still a good point.
Later

[Centerfield]

41Forever wrote: Centerfield wrote: It's a bullshit statement. I could write it in 5 minutes. You are a very talented writer. I don't know why you continue to attack me. I'm certainly not looking for a fight. There is no reason to make these discussions personal. We can disagree and still be pleasant.

I do it because it bugs the shit out of me that someone can be so dishonest without giving it a second thought.

Go through your posts. Give me an example of you beating up the Wilpons over Melvin and I will gladly retract my statement.

[Guest 41Forever]

Centerfield wrote: Centerfield wrote: It's a bullshit statement. I could write it in 5 minutes. You are a very talented writer. I don't know why you continue to attack me. I'm certainly not looking for a fight. There is no reason to make these discussions personal. We can disagree and still be pleasant. I do it because it bugs the shit out of me that someone can be so dishonest without giving it a second thought. Go through your posts. Give me an example of you beating up the Wilpons over Melvin and I will gladly retract my statement.

Oh stop. I'm not dishonest. It was a collective "we." You know it. Just stop. This is getting creepy.

[Frayed Knot]

MFS62 wrote: HahnSolo wrote: Lot of buzzwords there. Not a lot of “this is how I will make the team better”. And, there has been no mention of any (non-negotiating related) baseball skill he brings to the table. None. Not one. Does he have any? Player scouting? Player evaluation? Player development? Building a roster? Anything? Buehler?

Don't you think that agents do their share scouting, evaluating, and analyzing players?

[Centerfield]

41Forever wrote: 41Forever wrote: It's a bullshit statement. I could write it in 5 minutes. You are a very talented writer. I don't know why you continue to attack me. I'm certainly not looking for a fight. There is no reason to make these discussions personal. We can disagree and still be pleasant. I do it because it bugs the shit out of me that someone can be so dishonest without giving it a second thought. Go through your posts. Give me an example of you beating up the Wilpons over Melvin and I will gladly retract my statement. Oh stop. I'm not dishonest. It was a collective "we." You know it. Just stop. This is getting creepy.

All “we”s are collective we’s. And all of them include the speaker. If you are not included in the group, the word you’re looking for is “you”. Not “we”.

But if you say “you” it comes across as preachy and dislikeable. So you try to soften it with “we”. Let me pretend like I’m one of this crew.

If you’re going to lecture us then fucking lecture us. Spare me the “I’m your pal” facade.

I am starting to think you have some sort of disorder. I really don’t think you have any idea how dishonest you are.

[MFS62]

Let's get back to the GM search please, and take that stuff to the red light forum.

Frayed Knot wrote: Don't you think that agents do their share scouting, evaluating, and analyzing players?

Probably. But there have been no stories about whether or not he is one of the agents who do that, or to what extent, or if he is good at one or more of them. Not even a hint.
You'd think if he were, we would have been told about it (or it would have been "leaked") in an effort of trying to sell the decision to the fans. All we've been told is that he is a good negotiator.
I want to have confidence that the next GM will lead the organization to greatness.
Its the absence of information about any other skills he possesses that troubles me.

Later

[Frayed Knot]

ALL agents either need to scout/analyze and evaluate players or need to have that done for them. You know you else does that? ... GMs!
GMs aren't out scouting players unless and until they've been recommended up the chain to them and it's time to make the final sign or trade judgement.
Agents operate the same way or else they'd be really bad agents and not the head of the entire baseball division of a representative corporation.

[Frayed Knot]

More Sherman since he's been totally on this topic from the beginning.

Van Wagenen is bright and energetic. Those who know him say he has a strong cooperative spirit and will recognize what he does not know and listen to experts. He was a college player at Stanford. He has
extensive relationships with all 30 teams. Bloom is just 35 and has worked for the small-market Rays but has worked his way up through an MLB organization and is well-regarded by other executives in the sport.
Van Wagenen is the bigger gamble. But these owners have surprised us with this process. Cardinals executive Gary Larocque was initially viewed as the favorite, then Brewers official Doug Melvin. It turns out
Fred Wilpon was not wedded to older and scouty. From a hardly textbook job search, the Mets have wound up outside the box.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

I work in restaurant kitchens. If we have an ace server or well-regarded sommelier who seems to have a gift for flavor and a talent for cooking, he/she might be given a shot on the line, walking before he can run. He/she's NOT getting made a sous chef, much less exec chef, in charge of the entire back-of-house operation, even if he/she is a precocious learner, and is universally well regarded, and has made their way to the top of the heap in their neck of the restaurant's org chart. There are things he/she must learn-- or prove he/she knows-- firsthand before the mantle of leadership is entrusted to him/her. That's just how it's done in a professional organization.

I mean, it's great that we've got a guy with the tools to do the job. But the ashheap of can't-miss-prospects-who-missed is full of toolsy guys' figurative remains, innit? I mean, just because you have a talented guy who wants to make a career left turn interested in your job-- however translatable his skill set may be-- doesn't mean he merits the top job in your organization, does it? (At least not over a younger, similarly-talented guy who's, y'know, DONE the job.)