Edgy MD

Claire Smith wrote: I have not yet been convinced on several levels. It's delicate, but every decision on each candidate is, and should be. Some candidates are slam dunks. Others need to be weighed over time periods that might not satisfy fans, but have to satisfy the voter that he or she has reached an educated, learned conclusion. I have time. So does Mike. Cy Young wasn't elected right away. A lot of the greats did not get in til after 10 years of eligibility. Firstly, every decision being delicate and "Some candidates are slam dunks" are contradictory positions. Secondly, Cy Young didn't get in because there was a 19th Century Committee and a 20th Century Committee, and neither committee was certain whether Young was fully theirs to consider, and whether they were to consider the whole of his career. It was a failure of process to the extent that it was a failure. But it was the first year of elections, and he was running against every player who ever played the game ever. This is tr�s different. In general, I guess I get the "I don't want to look stupid if something comes up later." But do your own investigation. That's how things come up.

Heyman can be a frustrating figure, but I don't think it's anti-Met bias that makes him so. He sure was a stubborn and zealous warrior in the Armando Wars, though. Verducci hitched his wagon to the myth of the Torre/Jeter-era Yankees, but that too doesn't necessarily equate to anti-Met. Anti-human, maybe, but not necessarily anti-Met. But it's about being provocateurs. Mets management is easy to dump on these days and it's a good target for lazy writers, but that doesn't mean they vote against Piazza or Pedro or Delgado because of their uniform.

I have quibbles with everybody, as individuals, but I tend to think that the quirks of individuals are largely canceled out in the body at large. And the process has, more or less, worked. Four guys got elected --- a relatively large class from a packed ballot. Two of them were far and away the best candidates. One (Biggio) is an excellent candidate that has been gaining momentum. The fourth guy (Smoltz) may or may not be the best of the remaining candidates, but it's certainly not unreasonable to think so. So, you know, too bad for Piazza, but he's still got his pile of money, and a sweet lifestyle to comfort him until next year. I'm kind of hesitant to get behind too many of the calls for reform. I guess what I most don't like is the 5% threshold, eliminating guys from all future ballots. I tend to think a packed ballot like this gets writers to vote no on the likes of Larry Walker and Carlos Delgado and Alan Trammel without a lot of thought. These are candidacies that were probably unlikely to gain momentum anyhow, but it stinks seeing them lost in the shuffle. Yeah, the BBWAA has not built consensus on how to handle the historic legacies of steroid abusers. Neither has MLB. Neither has society. As a body, we can hardly ask them to speak with one voice. But if we 75% can agree, that's OK by me.

They seem very committed to bringing back the heart of last year's team.

G-Fafif wrote: Long Shot came out in hardcover a month after the 2013 vote, the first one that didn't go Piazza's way. You look stupid now, Edgy.

Other 2020 Balloteers Josh Becket Paul Konerko Adam Dunn Bobby Abreu Alfonso Soriano Matt Treanor Octavio Dotel JJ Putz Possibly Torii Hunter Jason Giambi Johnny Damon Ichiro Suzuki

Valadius works an interesting street, with Huggy Bear giving tips on foreign amateur signings.

You know, if someone should come with evidence before refusing to vote for a player over steroids, shouldn't we come with evidence before making assumptions of anti-Catholic or anti-Christian bias? How goofy. Baselessly assuming somebody has a malicious and bigoted motive for their actions really has no place in the discussion. Conflating the BBWAA and ISIS is beyond the pale of any logical sense. Let's not poison the well here.

Ceetar wrote: SteveJRogers wrote: themetfairy wrote: I blame Long Shot. The book made him look like a petulant child, and probably cost him enough votes to keep him out. I've seen a tin foil theory put forth that his faith and politics actually may have something to do with people who do not share his political or religious beliefs not voting for him. 'character clause' means "hey, I don't like you." I disagree with that. I also think that Schilling's political religious views have virtually nothing to do with his non-election. (1) They weren't particularly apparent until after his retirement, and fews of the electorate could give two figs about his post-career life. (2) Baseball is teeming with Christian Republicans. Piazza's book? Probably didn't do him any favors, but it probably didn't keep him out either. I mean, it's come out since last year's election, and his vote total has climbed from 62.2% to 69.9%

I considered Carolina, but there just wasn't enough room on my ballot.

That's some Hall of Fame form right there.

Nymr83 wrote: Bacne Man's hanging on by the skin of his teeth. Impressive how Bonds and Clemens seems to be a single decision for a lot of voters. Aren't they though? they both fall into the category of having undeniable credentials and proven steroid use. i dont think anyone else has ever fallen into both categories before (McGwire is closest, but hes been on the ballot longer and failed enough already that his supporters may be allocatig their maximum of 10 votes elsewhere) How about Sosa? The dude has become little more than an afterthought. OE: Palmiero too. He got Whitakered last year on his fourth year on the ballot.

I see mostly progress here. Momentum is building for Bagwell and Raines, if not Tremmell so much. The strongest candidate eliminated by the 5% threshold is Delgado. He's a pretty strong candidate, but I feared we see two or three others get Whittakered. Mattingly is eliminated on time. Aurilia, Clark, Dye, Floyd, Giles, Guardado, and Schmidt all get Hubie'd. NameVotes (Pct.)Yrs on ballotRandy Johnson534 (97.3)1Pedro Martinez500 (91.1)1John Smoltz455 (82.9)1Craig Biggio454 (82.7)3XXXXXXXXXXMike Piazza384 (69.9)3Jeff Bagwell306 (55.7)5Tim Raines302 (55)8Curt Schilling215 (39.2)3Roger Clemens206 (37.5)3Barry Bonds202 (36.8)3Lee Smith166 (30.2)13Edgar Martinez148 (27)6Alan Trammell138 (25.1)14Mike Mussina135 (24.6)2Jeff Kent77 (14)2Fred McGriff71 (12.9)9Larry Walker65 (11.8)5Gary Sheffield64 (11.7)1Mark McGwire55 (10)9=#FF0000]Don [crossout]Mattingly[/crossout]50 (9.1)15Sammy Sosa36 (6.6)3Nomar Garciaparra30 (5.5)1XXXXXXXXXX=#FF0000][crossout]Carlos Delgado[/crossout]21 (3.8)1=#FF0000][crossout]Troy Percival[/crossout]4 (0.7)1=#FF0000][crossout]Aaron Boone[/crossout]2 (0.4)1=#FF0000][crossout]Tom Gordon[/crossout]2 (0.4)1=#FF0000][crossout]Darin Erstad[/crossout]1 (0.2)1=#FF0000][crossout]Rich Aurilia[/crossout]0 (0)1=#FF0000][crossout]Tony Clark[/crossout]0 (0)1=#FF0000][crossout]Jermaine Dye[/crossout]0 (0)1=#FF0000][crossout]Cliff Floyd[/crossout]0 (0)1=#FF0000][crossout]Brian Giles[/crossout]0 (0)1=#FF0000][crossout]Eddie Guardado[/crossout]0 (0)1=#FF0000][crossout]Jason Schmidt[/crossout]0 (0)1

Craig Biggio too. Switching positions before he was completely established as a hitter. His career was at a real crossroads.

Trending in the right direction, anyhow.

Bacne Man's hanging on by the skin of his teeth. Impressive how Bonds and Clemens seems to be a single decision for a lot of voters.

Mussina would be looking down from the top of this list if Rich Garcia got the call and Jeter was called out and Jeffrey Maier ejected.

This came up earlier, but Mussina had a pretty solid post season career also. Schilling was simply stellar. Dynamite. Won a World Series MVP (or co-MVP, anyhow), and brought down a hateful dynasty in doing it.

It's good to see my little big buddy back in the fold. A dozen free agents remain. 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.222/.500//.722Position=#8000FF]Infielder=#8000FF]Infielder=#8000FF]Infielder=#8000FF]Infielder=#8000FF]Infielder[fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_446263.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_527038.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_502517.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_514913.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://mlb.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_431151.jpg[/fimg]NameLucas DudaWilmer FloresDaniel MurphyRuben TejadaDavid WrightDoB2/3/86 #218/6/91 #44/11/85 #2810/27/89 #1112/20/82 #5MLB Stats596 PA, .253/30/92 .349/.481//.830274 PA, .251/6/29 .286/.378//.664642 PA, .289/9/57 .332/.403//.735419 PA, .237/5/34 .342/.310//.652586 PA, .269/8/63 .324/.374//.698AAA Stats241 PA, .323/13/57 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14/954-1 (16), 0.63 57.0 IP, 22/89Position=#FF8000]Relief Pitcher=#8000FF]Infielder=#8000FF]Infielder=#0000FF]Outfielder=#0000FF]Outfielder[fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_458730.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_599096.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_541600.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_544925.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_527049.jpg[/fimg]NameBobby ParnellDilson HerreraWilfredo TovarMatt den DekkerCesar PuelloDoB9/8/84 #395/3/94 #28/11/91 #708/10/87 #64/1/91 #65MLB Stats0-0, 9.00 1.0 IP, 1/166 PA, .220/3/11 .303/.407//.710 3 PA, .000/0/0 .000/.000//.000 174 PA, .250/0/7 .345/.322//.667AAA Stats384 PA, .334/8/36 .407/.540//.947371 PA, .252/7/37 .355/.393//.748 AA Stats278 PA, .340/10/48 .406/.560//.967285 PA, .282/2/29 .345/.345//.690A+ Stats309 PA, .307/3/23 .355/.410//.76523 PA, .353/0/4 .522/.588//1.110RK Stats7 PA, .333/0/2 .429/.599//.929 Also in Camp Position=#FF8000]Relief Pitcher=#FF8000]Relief Pitcher=#BF0000]Catcher=#8000FF]Infielder=#BF0000]Infielder[fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_234194.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_446488.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://www.milb.com/images/476192/generic/180x270/476192.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://www.milb.com/images/450315/t400/180x270/450315.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://mlb.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_543008.jpg[/fimg]NameBuddy CarlyleScott RiceJohnny MonellBrandon AllenAlex CastellanosDoB12/21/77 #449/21/81 #563/27/1986 #??2/12/86 #??8/4/86 #??MLB Stats1-1, 1.45 31.0 IP, 5/281-2, 5.93 13.2 IP, 12/13408 PA, .275/8/42 .351/.439//.790AAA Stats4-2, 2.16 33.1 IP, 12/360-0, 3.38 5.1 IP, 4/6226 PA, .238/4/24 .301/.364//.665375 PA, .266/13/52 .368/.434//.802408 PA, .275/8/42 .351/.439//.790A+ Stats25 PA, .471/0/5 .640/.647//1.287 Major League Free Agents Position=#008000] Catcher=#8000FF]Infielder=#0000FF]Outfielder[fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_460003.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_435560.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_458913.jpg[/fimg]NameTaylor TeagardenOmar QuintanillaEric Young, Jr.DoB12/21/83 #2310/24/81 #05/25/85 #22MLB Stats30 PA, .143/1/5 .200/.250//.45031 PA, .207/0/3 .258/.241//.499280 PA, .229/1/17 .299/.311//.610AAA Stats211 PA, .303/14/39 .403/.579//.981 170 PA, .232/3/27 .271/.381//.652 AA Stats11 PA, .000/0/0 .182/.000//.182A+ Stats6 PA, .333/0/0 .333/.333//.667SS A+ StatsRK Stats7 PA, .200/0/0 .333/.400//.733 Minor League Free Agents Position=#FF0000]Starting Pitcher=#FF0000]Starting Pitcher=#FF0000]Starting Pitcher=#FF0000]Starting Pitcher=#FF8000]Relief Pitcher[fimg=90]http://www.milb.com/images/425826/t400/180x270/425826.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://www.milb.com/images/468528/t400/180x270/468528.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://www.milb.com/images/silhouette/180x270.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://mlb.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_458550.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_445968.jpg[/fimg]NameGiancarlo AlvaradoJoel CarrenoAngel CuanJeremy HefnerDana EvelandDoB1/24/78 #??3/7/87 #??5/29/89 #??3/11/86 #5310/29/83 #61MLB Stats1-1 (1), 2.63 27.1 IP, 6/27AAA Stats3-6, 7.29 84.0 IP, 51/582-4, 4.76 58.2 IP, 23/494-1, 3.91 46.0 IP, 12/58AA Stats3-5, 6.23 39.0 IP, 11/29A+ Stats0-0, 6.00 9.0 IP, 1/40-0, 9.00 8.0 IP, 9/9RK Stats0-0, 3.00 6.0 IP, 0/2Position=#FF8000]Relief Pitcher=#008000]Catcher=#8000FF]Infielder=#8000FF]Infielder[fimg=90]http://www.milb.com/images/462515/generic/180x270/462515.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://d3k2oh6evki4b7.cloudfront.net/images-009/headshots/d/d3f49aa8_mlbam.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://www.milb.com/images/457810/t505/180x270/457810.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://www.milb.com/images/554190/t453/180x270/554190.jpg[/fimg]NameIsmael TijerinaKai GronauerBrian BurgamyDimas PonceDoB8/19/89 #??11/28/86 #??6/27/81 #??1/22/91 #??MLB StatsAAA Stats33 PA, .167/1/7 .300/.417//.717AA Stats39 PA, .176/1/4 .282/.294//.576527 PA, .276/23/76 .376/.504//.880SS A+ Stats63 PA, .109/0/2 .183/.182//.365SS A Stats1-0 (6), 2.21 20.1 IP, 9/15 Coaching Staff Position=#BF0000] Manager=#BF0000]Hitting Coach=#BF0000]Pitching Coach=#BF0000]First Base Coach=#BF0000]Third Base Coach[fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/coaches/mugshots/492632.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/coaches/mugshots/438989.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/coaches/mugshots/123951.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/coaches/mugshots/114961.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/coaches/mugshots/123212.jpg[/fimg]NameTerry CollinsKevin LongDan WarthenTom GoodwinTim TeufelDoB5/27/49 #1012/30/6612/1/52 #597/27/68 #277/7/58 #18Position=#BF0000]Bench Coach=#BF0000]Int'm Ass't Bench Coach=#BF0000]Bullpen Coach=#FF0000]Ass't Batting Coach=#BF0000]Strength and Cond. Coach[fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/coaches/mugshots/114712.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]https://metsinpeace.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/wally-backman.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/coaches/mugshots/111191.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]https://metsinpeace.files.wordpress.com/2014/11/pat-roessler.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]https://metsinpeace.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/mike-barwis.jpg[/fimg]NameBob GerenWally BackmanRicky BonesPat RoesslerMike BarwisDoB9/22/61 #79/22/59 #64/7/69 #2512/27/596/6/73Position=#BF0000]Bullpen Catcher=#BF0000]Strength and Cond. Coach=#BF0000]Bullpen Catcher[fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/coaches/mugshots/534948.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]https://metsinpeace.files.wordpress.com/2014/11/dustin-clarke.jpg[/fimg][fimg=90]http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/images/coaches/mugshots/430002.jpg[/fimg]NameDave RacanielloDustin ClarkeEric LangillDoB6/3/78 #54circa 19877/7/58 #18

Ceetar wrote: ...it's that by any measure, being great for 240 innings is roughly 4x as good as being great for 60 innings. I disagree with this.

Buddy Carlyle has re-signed to Metville, to a minor league contract, which, you know, is a pretty cool deal for a guy who gave the team a 1.45 ERA over 31 innings season the last. Hey, Bud! Let's party! For a right-hander, he's a master of that Tim Byrdak face. The "What do I keep doing this to myself for?/I don't have one more pitch in me/OK, I'll throw one more pitch" face.

Happy feet too, a little bit.

You remember the Vladdy Wars. The Mets were negotiating with the 'Pos for their star right fielder, but were shy because of reports on his back. Well, that was 2004. Jim Duquette Days. At the time, the guy the Mets should have been looking at (maybe they were!) was Vladdy's then-five-year-old son, Vladdy Jr. Yes, he was born in 1999. He is now a strapping 6'2", 220-pound 15-year-old that the Mets are in the running for... along with the Angels, Yankees, and Blue Jays. Check out video of him punishing beisbols. QyidnANLS0A

I think our Twitter benefactor might have been our captain in exile, Soupcan.

I like the notion that the Mets can/should look for something between two and half months and two and a half seasons out of Flores at short, all the while believing that they can get a more well/rounded answer out of Reynolds/Cecchini/Rosario, while Flores remains a future investment at other positions around the infield --- insurance against Wright's shoulder not healing, Herrera not developing, Duda becoming mired in his enigmatic Dudaness.