Postmortem thoughts on the Game!!!

[Edgy MD]

I have a job. I'd be datamining 24-7 if I could.

[Ceetar]

Edgy MD wrote: I have a job. I'd be datamining 24-7 if I could.

Sure, but that one took me like 4 seconds ;-)

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

A Boy Named Seo wrote: Edgy MD wrote: I'm not sure that pulling Harvey worked out all that fine, but it played out as it played out. But perhaps if Harvey goes one more inning, we compress our bullpen needs, and the one batter who tied the game never comes to bat. Yeah, agreed. Seemed like an advantage we earned and chose not to use. Maybe after the shaky 6th, Terry just thought Harv was done.

OH, yes. During the runup to the Series/afterglow of the last one, there's been so much results-based praise of Terry's 'gut calls' with the bullpen, but the process-- personnel choices (or absences), timing of moves-- has been quizzical at times. Outside of Zobrist-- and he's a guy who always takes good at-bats, and is looking very potentially irritating-- Clippard did an okay job, but, honestly, he's not the guy he was anymore; it might be worth it turning him into more of a "situational lefty" (he's been better against lefties in his career AND of late). And, yeah, whither Robles?

Looking at the game on DVR this morning, I feel like our guys were one or two more judicious midgame Conforto and/or Flores swings away from turning this game into a Volquez shellacking.

[Diamond Dad]

It was a flawed game on both sides, but KC got the final break. Reminds me of game 1 of the 1986 series. Exciting. Watchable. Enjoyed the International feed.

Don't know who the producer in the truck is for FOX, but how the hell do you show a replay of the runner rounding the bases and scoring before you show a replay of the actual PLAY in the outfield? That's just stupid. It's not like FOX has never aired a baseball game before. Sheesh.

Just bad luck on first play. Cespedes should have had it, but it's just a fluke. We still had the lead 3-1 with Harvey on the mound in the 6th, so the game was there to win. Harvey didn't have best stuff and giving up the 2 in the 6th was on him and not on the defense.

Cespedes looked far worse at the plate than Wright, who had 2 hits. d'Arnauld also left runners in scoring position a few times. Lay off the Captain. Everybody had missed offensive opportunities. Chalk it up to the long layoff and get ready for tonight.

Loved Lagares dropping down the bunt single. He never does that, but glad he did in that spot. Now if Duda will only do it when they give it to him and when it's a lead off situation.

Surprised to see Wright running, but thought it was a good risk. Have to push things sometimes and score on one more hit instead of two more.

Liked Wilmer's at bats. Looks good at the plate and will have a big offensive moment in this series before long.

deGrom throws a first pitch changeup tonight, then blows Escobar away with high heat.

LGM!!!

[Edgy MD]

Yeah, it was a tough night for most of the righties, save for Lagares.

But the first play* was something less than a fluke, or something more, as Cespedes didn't even have his glove in the air, and seemed to make this weird stab at very last moment to catch it at his hip, only to end up sticking his leg under it and have it carom away.


*I'm still not sure how that was scored by the way: Homer? Four-base error? Double and a two-base error?

[Benjamin Grimm]

It was scored as a home run but I think that's a strange decision. I'd think that if an outfielder lets a fly ball hit him in the hip it should be scored an error.

[Edgy MD]

Amen. Outfielders get way too many fielding breaks from official scorers.

[Lefty Specialist]

Really, in my book that's a double and a two-base error. Home scoring, I guess.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

I guess once you're calling his attempted fielding of the play a not-error, you're accepting everything that comes with it as part of the hit. Given how it unfolded, it was either all hit or all error; it's not as if he kicked it additionally beyond that first misplay.

[Diamond Dad]

Edgy MD wrote: But the first play* was something less than a fluke, or something more, as Cespedes didn't even have his glove in the air, and seemed to make this weird stab at very last moment to catch it at his hip, only to end up sticking his leg under it and have it carom away.

This is why I don't want to sign Cespedes to a 5-year $150 million contract. I think with all his talent that we would see plays like that all too often if he were here under a long-term deal, and his act would get old fast when he's not red-hot at the plate and hitting 700-foot homers every day.

[Edgy MD]

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: I guess once you're calling his attempted fielding of the play a not-error, you're accepting everything that comes with it as part of the hit. Given how it unfolded, it was either all hit or all error; it's not as if he kicked it additionally beyond that first misplay.

Have you ever seen anything ruled a four-base error? I guess the bounce of of Canseco's head had to be one, right?

[Benjamin Grimm]

I guess that four-bases errors have to be awfully rare, but I agree with LWFS. It's either a home run or a four-base error. And I'd be inclined to go with the latter.

[Ceetar]

Edgy MD wrote: Have you ever seen anything ruled a four-base error? I guess the bounce of of Canseco's head had to be one, right?

This is one I can't think of an easy way to quickly look up.



Inside Edge says Cespedes made 100% of the 'routine' (90-100% made) plays (315) this season. But only 85.7%(14) of the 'likely' (60-90%) plays. Those are actually better numbers than Lorenzo Cain. The league averages are 99.3% and 81.5% for those.

[Edgy MD]

May 26, 1993. Amazingly, Canseco got off scot free (is this a slur against Scotsmen?) and that ball was scored a home run. Carlos Martinez was the batter, Kenny Rogers, the hard-luck pitcher.

[Frayed Knot]

Scorers generally don't give out errors when OFers have trucked a long way just to get to a batted ball.
So a four-base error would have to be one where the fielder either wasn't moving at the time or was in cruise control to the point where the catch would be considered ordinary - and then he'd have to somehow botch it into a round-tripper. I suspect it's happened at some point but back-handed grabs on the warning track after long runs where the ball, two fielders, and the wall are coming together aren't going to fit most definitions of an error. Canseco too was leaping while still chasing a ball over his head (until it was ON his head) at the warning track.

[batmagadanleadoff]

HahnSolo wrote: Lefty Specialist wrote: But so was throwing a dead-red fastball down the middle to the hottest hitter this side of Daniel Murphy, who ALWAYS swings at the first pitch. If Fox Sports knows not to do that, why didn't Harvey? Verducci was all over this, but I don't get the outrage. If the ball was caught, as it should have been, it's the first out. It's not like he hit it 480 feet.

I know. If Harvey could get every batter to hit the ball like that shot, he'd pitch a perfect game every start out. That was a routine fly ball out.

[Elster88]

I thought Terry had a horrible day.

****The lineup that makes sense with a DH is Lagares in center and Coforto DH, especially with a righty pitcher. We are so perfectly set up to go that way that it's absurd that Terry didn't do it. Especially if Johnson is the backup shortstop as Terry said before the series started. And ESPECIALLY if you're going to put Lagares in for defense in the fucking sixth inning anyway.
****Took out Harvey too soon
****Putting Cuddyers corpse in the game
****Bunting Wilmer (and then not replacing DH Cuddyer as the next batter)

All that said we were in position to win if Familia stays as perfect as he's been since August. Terry said something along the lines of its all about the players and I'm just trying to stay out of the way. Which is the perfect way for a manager to think. He got in the way yesterday.

[Elster88]

batmagadanleadoff wrote: HahnSolo wrote: Lefty Specialist wrote: But so was throwing a dead-red fastball down the middle to the hottest hitter this side of Daniel Murphy, who ALWAYS swings at the first pitch. If Fox Sports knows not to do that, why didn't Harvey? Verducci was all over this, but I don't get the outrage. If the ball was caught, as it should have been, it's the first out. It's not like he hit it 480 feet. I know. If Harvey could get every batter to hit the ball like that shot, he'd pitch a perfect game every start out. That was a routine fly ball out.

That should've been Conforto's ball all the way. It was a fly ball that Cespedes had to run a mile for. Conforto said he thought he heard Cespedes calling for it. Probably a combination of a little nerves, a little too much deferment to the center fielder, and a really loud stadium.

Agree on not understanding why the broadcast crew made a big deal out of it like the dude hit it to the moon.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

To be fair, Kauffman Stadium has huge gaps. Escobar hit it far enough (just a shade under 400 feet) that it would have been a home run in about half of major-league parks (borderline in Citi, IIRC).