Once Upon a Quince�era

[Guest Edgy DC]

The Top Fifteen 15s in Met History

1. Carlos Beltran, 2005-2011
   
2. Jerry Grote, 1966-1977
   
3. George Foster, 1982-1986
   
4. Al Jackson, 1962-1965
   
5. Jose Vizcaino, 1994-1996
   
6. Matt Franco, 1996-2000
   
7. Rick Aguilera, 1987-1988
   
8. Ron Darling, 1989-1991
   
9. Claudell Washington, 1980
   
10. Richard Hidalgo, 2004
    
11. Jeff McKnight, 1989
    
12. Don Aase, 1989
    
13. Brady Clark, 2002
    
14. Butch Benton, 1978
    
15. Kevin Elster, 1992

Class of '81, Outside, Looking In:
Dave Roberts, 1981
Brian Giles, 1981

At least six of these guys, to my knowledge, wore a different number in addition to 15, which is pretty strange, because 15 is nothing to sneeze at.

Pretty funny what similar animals Washington and Hidalgo were, but Claudell rebuilt his career after his half season with the Mets, and Ricardo just faded.

[seawolf17]

Franco ahead of Vizcaino, methinks.

[Guest Edgy DC]

We'll have the gremlins look into it.

[Guest Edgy DC]

The gremlins asked the gnomes to do some math. The gnomes said they did but they actually just called up baseball-reference.com, which gave Vizcaino a total of 1.5 WAR with the Mets, and Matt Franco a blushworthy -.3.

I don't think WAR is particularly fair to pinch-hitters or relievers, not taking into account the high-leverage situations in which they more frequently appear, but that's a large gap. Or so the gremlins say.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

If you're ranking by Metliness, Franco wins that one.

[seawolf17]

Stop using stats as a crutch, especiallly when you're comparing apples and oranges due to playing time. Vizcaino was worthless offensively for some terrible teams. Franco was an important cog on multiple contending teams.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Really, I meant to compare Mets to Mets, batters to batters, and 15s to 15s.

Viz was a good player. Had the best-ever offensive season as a Met shortstop before Reyes came along.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

seawolf17 wrote: Stop using stats as a crutch, especiallly when you're comparing apples and oranges due to playing time. Vizcaino was worthless offensively for some terrible teams. Franco was an important cog on multiple contending teams.

Franco was USED as an important cog on multiple contending teams.

A few key moments-- and their accompanying Metliness-- notwithstanding, he was actually kind of an inconspicuously awful cog (See also: "Lenny Harris").

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

Viz was a better player than many remember for the Mets but his journeymanism vs. Franco's relative Met bloodlines IMO makes Franco a more representative Met No. 15 than Vizcaino. But I'll put it to the MBTN readership, if that exists anymore.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Yeah, feel free to build a blog post off of this.

I like that I (I think) coined a nickname in "Viz" and now it's catching on.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

There was an article in a scorecard during the Vizcaino era titled "Nobody Beats the Viz" -- The Wiz being a big Mets sponsor then.

[G-Fafif]

There's probably some killjoy advanced statistic that will douse cold water on my recollections, but I remember thinking Vizcaino was darn good between 1994 and 1996, certainly a steal for Anthony Young. Was my runner-up all-time SS to Harrelson until Ordonez (now Harrelson is my runnerup to Reyes).

But even without deducting points for going to the MFYs and fucking us over in Game One 2000, I'd still take M. Franco over Viz when 15s are being thrown around. Points will always be added for fucking over MFYs.