Joel Sherman-Minaya out at year end

[Guest Edgy DC]

I don't think it's politically correct, but rather resporting on the facts. Women are and will be among apllicants.

[MFS62]

Edgy DC wrote: I don't think it's politically correct, but rather resporting on the facts. Women are and will be among apllicants.

I hadn't heard about any other women with the possible qualifications to be a GM in this market.
Who are they?
For which teams have they have been working?

Later

[Guest Edgy DC]

Depends on what you call qualified. I personally don't think there's necessarily any reason to believe a person can run a college or a library system or a military camp, but can't run a ball team.

I don't think the Mets have any women currently in what can be necessarily deemed as "front office" positions. The juiciest position a woman currently holds in the organization, I think, is senior director of marketing, occupied by Tina Mannix.

[MFS62]

Of course you're correct.
Some executive skills are transferrable across industries. They include developing a business plan (with contingencies), setting a budget and managing to that budget. And there have been many women who have broken through the "glass Ceiling" to achieve chief executive positions in many large corporations (Xerox, H-P?)
A quick search turned up some others now in baseball:
Jamie McCourt - LA
Wendy Selig-Prieb - Milwaukee
Susan Jason - VP of finance - Marlins
Robin Wallace - GM of the indie Nashua Pride

The first two on that list are related to the owners.

But if you bring in someone from outside baseball, the additional baseball-specific skills I would want in a new GM for the Mets would take time to learn (player evaluation, experience in working with/ knowing the other GMs). That's why I used the term "qualified" - someone who could hit the ground running without a long learning curve.

Later

[Frayed Knot]

From Martino's piece:
"Though they are fighting a perception that ownership is overly meddlesome in baseball operations, team brass would be far less inclined to intervene if it felt the organization were running smoothly."

This is, of course, key. 'Hands-off' ownership is easy when things are going well. Not just easy but in most cases almost stupid to do anything else.
But when things start going south often the first question to pop up is; 'why doesn't the owner do something?'

The early years of Steinbrenner featured success but also resentment because he didn't know how NOT to stir things even during good times both because of his massive ego but also his total lack of grasp at the difference between what was good and his unobtainable version of perfect. When they were crashing and burning in the early '90s, his meddling style had grown so thin of fans that the in-game announcement of his banishment from baseball was met by a standing ovation of Yanqui fans in the stadium that day. Later, after their string of championships in the late '90s devolved into a string of 1st round exits and Steinbrenner's health started fading, cries of 'if George was still George this never would be allowed to happen' were heard from all corners; IOW, fans now wanted (and media demanded) a more activist ownership!

[Frayed Knot]

Not sure where Kim Ng is today.
She's been both an exec with the Yanx and later with the Dodgers on the player personnel side of things and has been, at least at one point in the past, a candidate for a GM position.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

I still recall the press conference introducing new GM Omar when he said he had "total autonomy." (someone asked "total autonomy?") and he said "Total autonomy."

Total autonomy!

I think however some things were interfered with. When the bullpen spit the bit in 08, Jeff strongly dictated a thorough bullpen-washing was in order and Omar followed suit by way overcompensating.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Or, as implied in the post above yours, total autonomy eroded as success did, beginnnig (it seems) after Willie's 2007 September crash. Quite natural, if not pretty to watch.

[Benjamin Grimm]

I can see that. There can be a transition period between totally trusting somebody and firing him.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

Edgy DC wrote: Or, as implied in the post above yours, total autonomy eroded as success did, beginnnig after Willie's 2007 September crash. Quite natural, if not pretty to watch.

Oh, I agree. And I guarantee the next guy who gets the key to the GM's office will be given total autonomy (total autonomy?!?) Total Autonomy! upon his arrival.

[Guest metsguyinmichigan]

Speaking of women leaders and the Mets...

Was Joan Payson the first woman to own a sports franchise?

Sometimes I think her contributions to Mets history are overlooked. We have Bill Shea's name on the wall, with Casey's number, and Casey has that gate entrance photo. Just seems like she deserves something.

[Frayed Knot]

And that's where I think Sherman makes his best point, that total autonomy* is something a 'top level' GM is going to want and something that Wilpon's rep (whether real or imagined) might limit.




* realizing, of course, that no GM has absolute total autonomy - but that even if ownership wants its voice heard in player personnel matters that the GM needs to retain final say in trades/signings, etc. as long as things fit into the assigned budget. You get the opinion that here, even if they don't go as far as ordering a trade of 'Smith for Jones', they do tend to decide that 'X' needs fixing first and hamstring the GM by forcing him to start there before moving on.

[Benjamin Grimm]

metsguyinmichigan wrote: Just seems like [Joan Payson] deserves something.

I agree. She probably deserves more than Bill Shea. (I tend to see the SHEA on the wall, and the name of the Citi Field bridge, as more of a tribute to the former stadium than to the former person.)

She is in the Mets Hall of Fame, though. (An original inductee from 1981.)

[Guest Edgy DC]

She's considered the first, but she wasn't really when you consider that the only woman in the Hall of Fame was a white owner of a Negro League team.

Payson was an original member of the team's Hall of Fame, has a wing named for her which houses her art collection at the Portand Museum of Art, and she probably has a few thoroughbred races named for her, but yes, it would be nice and appropriate if a big chunk of CitiField was named for her.

[Frayed Knot]

All this reminds me about hearing recently that Georgia Frontierre (StL Rams - late '90s) was the first woman to own a franchise that won a championship.
The fact that this was some ESPN outfit means it didn't surprise me. The guys passing along this "info" were all geeked out by the fact that the two clubs in the recent WNBA finals were both owned by women and therefore the U.S. sports world was assured one way or the other of having its second female-owned title team. I wonder if they merely forgot about the likes of Payson or Marge Schott or if (more likely) that, under questioning, they wouldn't be able to place either name.

[Benjamin Grimm]

Andy Martino wrote: The Mets... are currently researching and discussing potential candidates for a prominent baseball operations position - that will not be Torre - although they are relatively early in the process and have not yet interviewed any candidates, let alone arrived at any decisions. Once someone is hired, he or she will be involved in the decision over whether to reassign or fire GM Omar Minaya, and the Mets will consider Torre - who is expected to listen to any and all offers - for a front-office position.

[metirish]

Fucks sake if you hire Torre then don't do it for a for office role. Weather Jeff wants to or not I think he probably will feel compelled by the building media sentiment to talk to Torre, like the mets owe him a damn thing.

[G-Fafif]

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Total autonomy!

Great name for a Rush cover band.

[Guest Edgy DC]

And I feel there's no reason that a person who can operate a Rush cover band can't operate a ball team.

[G-Fafif]

Edgy DC wrote: And I feel there's no reason that a person who can operate a Rush cover band can't operate a ball team.

Today's Tom Seaver, he gets high on you.

[MFS62]

Frayed Knot wrote: All this reminds me about hearing recently that Georgia Frontierre (StL Rams - late '90s) was the first woman to own a franchise that won a championship.

I remember that when Georgia took over the team, someone wrote "If hairspray was football smarts, Georgia Frontierre would be Vince Lombardi."
I wonder if that person ever publically ate those words when Georgia's team won that championship?

Later

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

Edgy DC wrote: And I feel there's no reason that a person who can operate a Rush cover band can't operate a ball team.

Or a team... of salesmen! OF SALESMEN!

I'd be exceedingly curious to see what Ng or Daniels can do.

[Benjamin Grimm]

Scratch Kevin Towers off the potential GM candidate list; looks like he's going to Arizona.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

This frees us up to begin the DiPoto Era!