New Skipper Candidate Scorecard

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

In which I practice making a chart and assess the mentioned candidates for next Met manager by attributes likely to come into play.

Candidate	ML Experience	Met Heritage	Will work for Peanuts?	Media Charm	Strategic Rep	'Leader of Men' Rep	Fan Appeal	Good with 'Kids'?	Juice	Box-Office Power
Bobby Valentine	Lots	Excellent	No way	Good, but some detractors	Excellent	Known to feud with some	Dynamite	Somehat?	Gallons	Fearsome
Ken Oberkfell	None	None	Yes	Unknown	TBD	OK, presumably	Maybe among prospect geeks	Yes	Little	None
Lee Mazzilli	Yes (Orioles)	Plenty	Presumably	Some (Madden likes him)	OK?	Had some issues	Some	Presumably	some	Poster Day!
Bob Melvin	7 yrs	None	Probably	Good	Not great	Good?	Little	Maybe?	Some	Nope
Wally Backman	a Few days	Good	Yes	They love him	TBD, but looks pretty frightening	Good	Strong	Should be	Some	Yup
Joe Torre	Tons	Player, manager and player/manager	Nope	Good if somewhat damaged	eh	Very good	Some	Doubtful at this stage	Yes	Good
Bob Brenly	Lots	None	Unknown	Popular broadcaster	Used Johnson in relief	OK?	Little	Unknown	Maybe some	Little
Tony Pena	Some (KC)	Son is high-profile prospect	Probably	Won a MOY award	Don't know?	OK?	Little	Probably	Some	Some

[Guest Edgy DC]

Any thought that Hale comes into play? He has but one life to give to the Mets.

There will also, most certainly, be a minority to be named later in the mix. Julio Franco?

[Ceetar]

How about Don Mattingly?

[Guest Edgy DC]

Maybe to replace HoJo.

[metirish]

Ceetar wrote: How about Don Mattingly?

No freaking way....the manager in waiting out in LA got embarrassed by Boche when he made the two mound visit in that game a while back, no experience and for fecks sake you should know the rule book. Bobby V could recite that thing back to front.

How's about Ron Gardenhire?

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

I wasn't speculating on candidates myself but rather going with those mentioned as possibilities. That said, the only way Mattingly gets here is as Torre's butt-boy and I think Torre's a long shot due to the fact that the team doesn't look ready for immediate contention and the salary thing.

Who else has been mentioned?

[Benjamin Grimm]

LaRussa, but he's every bit as unlikely as Torre.

Maybe Tim Teufel will be a candidate? Maybe he and Wally can platoon as Mets managers, depending on whether the opposing manager is left-handed or right-handed.

[HahnSolo]

If I'm Teufel, and with the years I've put into the organization, I'd be a little irked that Oberkfell, Backman, Mazzilli, and Melvin were getting consideration while I'm not.

And I don't know how you define juice, but at this point I'd say Wally has more juice than Mazzilli or Melvin.

[MFS62]

Although he has never managed, I think that somewhere in the deep recesses of his mind, Tim McCarver would like the chance to manage a major league club. Based on some of the things he has said, from positioning players on defense (e.g. - the third baseman should play in to cut down the angles rather than guarding the line in late innings) to moves on offense (e.g.- the hit and run vs the bunt), he certainaly would be different.
I'm not sure if different = better, but it would be interesting to find out.

Later

[Benjamin Grimm]

Isn't McCarver almost 70? I doubt he'd have any interest in becoming a rookie manager at this stage of his life.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

"Juice" -- A measure of personal magnetism in reserve to effect personnel changes, stand up to meddlesome owners, shut up noisy talk radio hosts, etc etc.

I think Wally would be somewhat beholden to the folks who hired him and not so "juicy" at least not right away and/or without the OK to be that way.

[Frayed Knot]

McCarver said many years ago - like 20 or more - that he thought about going the manager route at one point but conceded that once the booth biz turned out to be so lucrative for him there's no way he'd give up the security of it for the hours & volatility of the dugout. Now at his age (70?) there's not a chance in the world.

And "based on things he's said" is nothing more than his current job description. Every announcer is a candidate or wannabe based on that logic and the only one I can think of who went right from the booth to the dugout is Larry Dierker. He was also much younger and the results were mixed at best.

[Guest Edgy DC]

If Tim McCarver was going to manage, 1988 would have been a good time to start. No way he's going to jump in at this age. (And even more certainly not in Flushing.) The salary, burden, and stability are probably a lot better doing what he's doing.

As for Tim Teufel, with the record he has, I'd be real gracious about continguing to be offered any sort of work.

Wins in the minors aren't necessaraily necessary to justify your continued employment, but they certainly help if you're thinking of expressing irk about lack of promotions.

Season	Team	W	L	Pct	Finish	Playoffs
2003	Brooklyn	47	28	.627	2	Lost League Finals
2004	St. Lucie	64	65	.496	7	None
2005	St. Lucie	66	68	.493	7	None
2006	Out of Org.
2007	Savannah	41	94	.304	16	None
2008	St. Lucie	53	81	.396	12	None
2009	St. Lucie	66	68	.493	7	None
2010	Binghamton	66	76	.465	T-9	None
	Total	403	480	.456		Once

[Guest metsguyinmichigan]

Isn't Terry Collins a name that gets tossed out there? I think he's got some role with the Mets.

[bmfc1]

Nice chart, thanks. I enjoyed your comments.

[metirish]

bmfc1 wrote: Nice chart, thanks. I enjoyed your comments.

Yes, I meant to comment on that....good work....in regards to your Wally comments...the media guys love him of course but I feel they would love to rip him down too and one reason I think they love him is the hope that he'll mess up while in the big job....it would be a "typical Mets move" then.

I take it your comment on his strategic rep is not a good one?

[Guest Edgy DC]

That's part of loving a guy as a candidate. A guy with a history of a "dynamic" personality is easier to write about, even if that means writing about what a disgrace he is. There have been more than one drumbeat for Lou Pinella in Mets history.

[ashie62]

Great chart!

How come Jerry Manuel is not on it?

[Guest metsguyinmichigan]

Speaking of Lou, does anyone else think that his "retirement" will be short-lived? Could he be in a Mets uni finally?

[Frayed Knot]

metsguyinmichigan wrote: Speaking of Lou, does anyone else think that his "retirement" will be short-lived? Could he be in a Mets uni finally?

Not me.

[metirish]

metsguyinmichigan wrote: Speaking of Lou, does anyone else think that his "retirement" will be short-lived? Could he be in a Mets uni finally?

For me , if you are going to hire a guy with a big personality with bags of experience and who's Italian then you hire Valentine....

[Guest Edgy DC]

I certainly wouldn't advocate for it.

He additionally strikes me as someone in terrible health, and he'd do well to use his retirement wisely in that regard.

[Frayed Knot]

metirish wrote: metsguyinmichigan wrote: Speaking of Lou, does anyone else think that his "retirement" will be short-lived? Could he be in a Mets uni finally? For me , if you are going to hire a guy with a big personality with bags of experience and who's Italian then you hire Valentine....

Piniella's heritage is Spanish -- but we get your point.
Besides, Lou is 67, not in the best of health, and is, I'm convinced, done for good.

[metirish]

He's Spanish?.....I really thought he was Italian....

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

metsguyinmichigan wrote: Isn't Terry Collins a name that gets tossed out there? I think he's got some role with the Mets.

Roving minor league coordinator since last year. Supposedly-- and evidently-- doing a fantastic job. The major league track record's a little iffy-- mostly, a bunch of second-place finishes and many burned bridges while working with some talent (the Killer Bs-plus-young-Hampton-and-Kile, the future core of the Angels 2002 team). But it's been a few years... and it bears noting that Bobby V had a similar looking track record when he came on board*.

*I'm not saying... I'm just saying.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Other guys on the periphery of the radar screen

[list:1coan1a4][*:1coan1a4]Bob Brenly, currently broadcasting for the Cubbies.[/*:m:1coan1a4]
[*:1coan1a4]Tony Pe�a, currently bench coach for the Yankees.[/*:m:1coan1a4]
[*:1coan1a4]Gary Carter, currently head coach of the NCAA Division II Palm Beach Atlantic University Sailfish baseball team.[/*:m:1coan1a4]
[*:1coan1a4]Fredi Gonzalez, currently unattached, as far as I know, but I think is high on the list of potential Bobby Cox replacements.[/*:m:1coan1a4][/list:u:1coan1a4]

[Ceetar]

Ashie62 wrote: Great chart! How come Jerry Manuel is not on it?

who?

[Theoldmole]

I'm surprised that Oberkfell isn't getting more serious mention. He's worked with all the young players who form the core of the Mets' future.

[dgwphotography]

Gotta love a guy whose nickname was 5-0-2-0

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

TheOldMole wrote: I'm surprised that Oberkfell isn't getting more serious mention. He's worked with all the young players who form the core of the Mets' future.

Yes, he'll really need to play that up (or the Wilpons would need to weigh that category extra) to overcome big deficits in the Fan Appeal, Experience, Juice and Media categories.