The Truth About Shoe Polish

[Fman99]

This didn't come up in yesterday's IGT, but I happened to be listening to Howie and Wayne on XM during the early part of last night's game, and Howie was relating some stories from having hung out with the '69 Mets on the field.

Howie revealed that it was revealed to him, and that it was OK to re-tell, that the infamous Cleon Jones HBP in game 5 (the "shoe polish" incident), that Jerry Koosman had put some of his own shoe polish on the ball as instructed to by Gil Hodges, and that this ball was the one that Hodges showed to the umpires to get him on base.

I never heard such a thing before!

[Guest Edgy DC]

It's actually in here.



It's one of the few useful tidbits in an otherwise poorly edited rehash.

[Valadius]

I read that book!

[metirish]

="Valadius":1kwk6mis]I read that book![/quote:1kwk6mis] The first book on the Mets I ever read , I enjoyed it throughly but have since hear from several long time fans that didn't think much of it. IIRC I enjoyed the first half of the book most.

metsfanbook Aug 26 2009 07:56 PM

Gollenbock's book is immensely enjoyable but its lack of accuracy is legendary. You just can't use it as a source for anything. To my dying day, I will refuse to believe that Jerry Koosman and Gil Hodges would have tried to win a World Series by cheating. And to this day, I can't believe that the umpire gave Jones the base.

G-Fafif Aug 26 2009 09:09 PM

It can give a nice shine to your wing tips. Well, that is the truth about shoe polish.

Edgy DC Aug 26 2009 10:24 PM

="metsfanbook"]To my dying day, I will refuse to believe that Jerry Koosman and Gil Hodges would have tried to win a World Series by cheating. He's got Jerry in quotes there, so you've got to do something with it. Some alternatives to it being the God's-honest truth are: A) He wanted to add color to the story and didn't think about what it would to the legend of Hodges' character. He heard that somebody smudged the ball, and stuck himself into the story just because. C) He lied to Golenbock just like he lied to the IRS because Jerry Koosman's got some issues and he just can't stop lying. D) Golenbock stuck those words into Jerry's mouth and Jerry never bothered denying them because he never read the book and it wan't big enough for any journalist to call him up and confirm the story. There are other alternatives, I guess. All of these are plausible, but all are unwieldy, to varying degrees.

Benjamin Grimm Aug 27 2009 05:08 AM

Michigan is a journalist. He should reach out to Jerry Koosman and follow up.

G-Fafif Aug 27 2009 05:42 AM

From Marty Noble: ]Koosman provided a new story, too, confessing he, seated in the dugout, had rubbed the baseball on his shoe at Hodges' direction in Game 5 of the World Series. Jones was deemed to be a hit batsman as a result. Whatever it takes! The statute of limitations evidently expires once the guilty team has participated in three additional World Series. "Koozie's the only guy who ever saw it," Swoboda said later. "Maybe that's Koozie's urban myth."

RealityChuck Aug 28 2009 10:49 AM

Actually, right after the game, Hodges said they kept baseballs with shoe polish smudges on them in the dugout for just such an occasion. It was considered a joke at the time.

Swan Swan H Aug 28 2009 02:12 PM

My guess is that Kooz's story is pure shinola.

metsfanbook Aug 29 2009 12:33 PM

I agree. Koosman has a history of liking to pull journalists' legs. He has a pretty good ironic sense of humour. If he and Hodges had actually done this, I don't think they would have admitted it. I think he meant this as a joke, but it just isn't identified as such in Gollenbock's book, which seems to be just directly transcribed at points from the tape recorder.

Edgy DC Aug 29 2009 12:48 PM

I guess there's (E) Kooz was joking and Golenbock didn't get it, but he makes a big fanfare in the book of telling the truth about this small turning point for the first time.

metsguyinmichigan Aug 29 2009 02:25 PM

Golenbock lost me when he referred to the Mets in 1967 signing someone named Thomas George Seaver. If he's so sloppy that he can't get the name of the team's best player correctly, then it's hard to take stock in anything else in there.

MFS62 Aug 29 2009 03:11 PM

Those are his good points. He's also an arsehole. I was in the men's club at my Temple a few years ago. We invited him to come to one of our Sunday breakfasts (he lived in the next town, maybe 5 miles away), give a little speech, answer some questions, and sell some autographed books. He asked for an appearance fee, even after we told him that the small admission fee we charge goes for a schollarship fund. We told hm no thanks. Later

[Guest metsfanbook]

Gollenbock's book is immensely enjoyable but its lack of accuracy is legendary. You just can't use it as a source for anything. To my dying day, I will refuse to believe that Jerry Koosman and Gil Hodges would have tried to win a World Series by cheating. And to this day, I can't believe that the umpire gave Jones the base.

[G-Fafif]

It can give a nice shine to your wing tips.

Well, that is the truth about shoe polish.

[Guest Edgy DC]

="metsfanbook"]To my dying day, I will refuse to believe that Jerry Koosman and Gil Hodges would have tried to win a World Series by cheating.

He's got Jerry in quotes there, so you've got to do something with it. Some alternatives to it being the God's-honest truth are:

A) He wanted to add color to the story and didn't think about what it would to the legend of Hodges' character.

He heard that somebody smudged the ball, and stuck himself into the story just because.

C) He lied to Golenbock just like he lied to the IRS because Jerry Koosman's got some issues and he just can't stop lying.

D) Golenbock stuck those words into Jerry's mouth and Jerry never bothered denying them because he never read the book and it wan't big enough for any journalist to call him up and confirm the story.

There are other alternatives, I guess. All of these are plausible, but all are unwieldy, to varying degrees.

[Benjamin Grimm]

Michigan is a journalist. He should reach out to Jerry Koosman and follow up.

[G-Fafif]

From Marty Noble:

]Koosman provided a new story, too, confessing he, seated in the dugout, had rubbed the baseball on his shoe at Hodges' direction in Game 5 of the World Series. Jones was deemed to be a hit batsman as a result. Whatever it takes! The statute of limitations evidently expires once the guilty team has participated in three additional World Series. "Koozie's the only guy who ever saw it," Swoboda said later. "Maybe that's Koozie's urban myth."

[RealityChuck]

Actually, right after the game, Hodges said they kept baseballs with shoe polish smudges on them in the dugout for just such an occasion.

It was considered a joke at the time.

[Guest Swan Swan H]

My guess is that Kooz's story is pure shinola.

[Guest metsfanbook]

I agree. Koosman has a history of liking to pull journalists' legs. He has a pretty good ironic sense of humour. If he and Hodges had actually done this, I don't think they would have admitted it. I think he meant this as a joke, but it just isn't identified as such in Gollenbock's book, which seems to be just directly transcribed at points from the tape recorder.

[Guest Edgy DC]

I guess there's (E) Kooz was joking and Golenbock didn't get it, but he makes a big fanfare in the book of telling the truth about this small turning point for the first time.

[Guest metsguyinmichigan]

Golenbock lost me when he referred to the Mets in 1967 signing someone named Thomas George Seaver.

If he's so sloppy that he can't get the name of the team's best player correctly, then it's hard to take stock in anything else in there.

[MFS62]

Those are his good points.
He's also an arsehole.

I was in the men's club at my Temple a few years ago. We invited him to come to one of our Sunday breakfasts (he lived in the next town, maybe 5 miles away), give a little speech, answer some questions, and sell some autographed books.

He asked for an appearance fee, even after we told him that the small admission fee we charge goes for a schollarship fund.
We told hm no thanks.

Later