Endangered: Lorn Brown

[Guest Edgy DC]

Somebody ("Scarykitty") gave my Wikipedia article on Lorn Brown the greatest wikinsult, proposing it for deletion with this tag:

It is proposed that this article be deleted, because of the following concern:

Non-notable person per WP:BIO

The criteria for notability are here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:BIO

Should the Lorn page die? Is Wilbur Huckle next?

[soupcan]

That's crap.

The criteria isn't 'shit that ScaryKitty cares about' is it?

[Guest Edgy DC]

Thanks for your support. I'm thinking of removing the tag under the the last two critera here:

Entertainers

: actors, comedians, opinion makers, and television personalities who have appeared in well-known films, stage plays or television productions. Notability can be determined by:

• Multiple features in credible magazines and newspapers


• A large fan base, fan listing, or "cult" following


• A credible independent biography


• Wide name recognition


• Commercial endorsements of notable products

Do endorsements count if you're a spokesman, or do they have to be celebrity endorsements. Millions of us have heard his NFL spokesmanship, though few of us may have realized it was him.

[nymr83]

the tag has been removed, gee i wonder who could have done that?

[Guest Edgy DC]

Somebody else went at it --- rather than killing my page, they killed my editorializing, which is progress, I guess.

Brown's travelled career included working alongside some legends of baseball broadcasting, including Harry Caray, Bob Uecker, and Bob Murphy, each a recipient of the prestigious Ford C. Frick Award, the highest honor in the field. He would be go on to be replaced in the Mets booth by a relative neophyte, Tim McCarver, who would shine in the role and soon parlay it into network jobs and become the most prominent baseball television analyst of his generation.	becomes	Brown's career included working alongside =green]such baseball broadcasters as Harry Caray, Bob Uecker, and Bob Murphy, each a recipient of the prestigious Ford C. Frick Award, the highest honor in the field. He would be go on to be replaced in the Mets booth by a relative neophyte, Tim McCarver.
Brown has also turned his sonorous baritone and smooth delivery toward an extensive body of work in the commercial voice-over field, narrating commercials for Budweiser beer, Ace Hardware, and the National Football League, among others. He is represented by Grossman & Jack Talent, Inc.	becomes	Brown has also turned his =green]voice toward work in the commercial voice-over field, narrating commercials for Budweiser beer, Ace Hardware, and the National Football League, among others. He is represented by Grossman & Jack Talent, Inc.

I guess I can live with that, but what a bunch of fuckin' wikidickies.

[nymr83]

i've never liked wikipedia much for that reason, all of someone's hard and accurate work can easily be replaced by someone who is lying or even someone who wants to say the same thing but thinks his way of saying it is better

[Guest Edgy DC]

That stuff is all editorial, but it's all also hightly supportable, except for maybe "smooth delivery." Should I get a reference for each before putting it back in?

[Guest iramets]

Nymr83 wrote: i've never liked wikipedia much for that reason, all of someone's hard and accurate work can easily be replaced by someone who is lying or even someone who wants to say the same thing but thinks his way of saying it is better

I 've never liked you, for much for that reason: all of someone's hard and accurate work can easily be replaced by that of a liar or even someone who agrees but has only stylistic changes to offer.

[Guest Yancy Street Gang]

Nymr83 wrote: i've never liked wikipedia much for that reason, all of someone's hard and accurate work can easily be replaced by someone who is lying or even someone who wants to say the same thing but thinks his way of saying it is better

Wiki leaves an audit history, though. If something is replaced by something else that's inferior, it can always be restored. The idea of the Wiki model is that ultimately the best content will survive.

It's not foolproof by any means, but the resulting product is pretty darn good and pretty darn useful.

[seawolf17]

Useful, yes, as long as you realize the context. I wouldn't cite it as an factual source in a doctoral thesis, but when I'm looking to check what album a particular song is on, or something like that, it's an easy place to look.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Checking Trevor Hoffman's page to confirm out his kid's names, I learn that he "is considered to be one of the best closers in baseball history."

Now, that's just as much editorial as "some legends of baseball broadcasting," and just as true. At least I assert my statement, rather than placing it in the wimpy passive voice. Is the Hoffman statement more legitimate encyclopedia style? Isn't that begging for a citation?

[Guest iramets]

It's a typo for "considered to be one of the best losers in baseball history." When Piazza hit that monster walkoff HR off him one fine spring night six or seven years ago, he was mellow and affable after the game. That's what they meant.

[Guest Yancy Street Gang]

Yes, that comment about Hoffman is probably too "editorial." They probably should have mentioned instead where he ranks among all-time save leaders or something like that.

I agree with seawolf: Wiki should be used for entertainment purposes, for answering trivia questions, stuff like that. I certainly would use it for anything important. I've been reluctant to even use it for vacation planning.

And back to Lorn Brown: He didn't actually work with Bob Murphy, did he? 1982 was Bob's first year in the radio booth and Brown was partnered with Ralph Kiner. (I think, actually, there may have been one "Murphy Brown" pairing when Ralph missed a telecast for the Cooperstown inductions.)

[Guest 86-Dreamer]

I think its funny that they "corrected" some fine wording, but they be missed the only error:

"He would be go on to be replaced in the Mets booth by a relative neophyte, Tim McCarver."

[Guest metsguyinmichigan]

As a reporter, we are prohibited from using Wikipedia as a reference source. It's just not reliable.

It's worth something for a quick look-see. But I'd have to double check every fact if I was going to use it.

[Guest Edgy DC]

86-Dreamer wrote: I think its funny that they "corrected" some fine wording, but they be missed the only error: "He would be go on to be replaced in the Mets booth by a relative neophyte, Tim McCarver."

Is that incorrect? UMDB shows the broadcast team in 1982 as Lorn Brown, Ralph Kiner, Steve LaMar, and Bob Murphy, and in 1983 as Bud Harrelson, Ralph Kiner, Steve LaMar, Tim McCarver; Bob Murphy, Steve Zabriskie.

So Brown left, and Zabriskie, McCarver, and Harrelson arrived. Harrelson only did selected work, as I recall. I guess you can say that Zabriskie was more the replacement, as he wasn't a former player.

[nymr83]

the grammar is incorrect. "he would be go on" should read "he would go on"

[Frayed Knot]

metsguyinmichigan wrote: As a reporter, we are prohibited from using Wikipedia as a reference source. It's just not reliable.

The CPF, however, is accepted as an unimpeachable source by news gathering organizations everywhere.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Nymr83 wrote: the grammar is incorrect. "he would be go on" should read "he would go on"

Of course.

[Theoldmole]

I like your version better.

[Guest Yancy Street Gang]

Edgy DC wrote: ="86-Dreamer"]I think its funny that they "corrected" some fine wording, but they be missed the only error: "He would be go on to be replaced in the Mets booth by a relative neophyte, Tim McCarver." Is that incorrect? UMDB shows the broadcast team in 1982 as Lorn Brown, Ralph Kiner, Steve LaMar, and Bob Murphy, and in 1983 as Bud Harrelson, Ralph Kiner, Steve LaMar, Tim McCarver; Bob Murphy, Steve Zabriskie. So Brown left, and Zabriskie, McCarver, and Harrelson arrived. Harrelson only did selected work, as I recall. I guess you can say that Zabriskie was more the replacement, as he wasn't a former player.

McCarver and Zabriskie did replace Lorn Brown. (There was a two-man team in 1982 and it expanded to three in 1983.)

Maybe Dreamer was quibbling about the use of "neophyte"

McCarver had spent some time in the Phillies booth before coming to the Mets.

[Guest Edgy DC]

I'm guessig he was referring to the grammatical error.

I'll wait a week or two and put the editorial back in. Anybody find any new Lorn lore, please add it.

[Guest 86-Dreamer]

sorry for the confusion - i be was referring to their failure to correct the typo