Kris Benson trade revisited

[Guest GYC]

A lot of people (not necessarily from here) complained that we were giving up too much (Matt Peterson & Ty Wigginton) for a 6-month rental (Kris Benson) and an average prospect (Jeff Keppinger,) as well as sending a AAA catcher (Justin Huber) to Kansas City, who, in turn, sent a decent prospect (Jose Bautista) to Pittsburgh. How has it fared?

Matt Peterson - 5.24 ERA in AA last year, worse in the AFL and released today.

Ty Wigginton - hit .258 in 155 at bats in MLB last year before being sent down to AAA and was released December 8th.

Kris Benson - decent 3rd/4th starter, but otherwise unimpressive.

Jeff Keppinger - started off great in AAA last year before breaking a leg; could compete for starting job or reserve role in majors this year.

Justin Huber - tore up AA last year, and decent in AAA (274/.374/.540 in 32 games) before coming up to the majors (.218/.271/.256 in 78 at bats.)

Jose Bautista - hit 22 homers and 87 RBIs (296/.367/.442) in AA before being called up to AAA Indianapolis. Performed decently in DWL, but is still a year away from showing up in the majors.

[Zvon]

Wiggy was released?!

I voted undecided.
If Benson was a 6th month rental and was now gone, Id say I didnt like the trade. I liked Ty. But I knew we had Wright and had to make room.
Thats baseball.

Being we still have Benson I wanna say I like it.
But he would have to stay on and pitch well this season for me to say that.
He'd have to win at least 15 in 2006.
I say he can.

[smg58]

There was no reason not to wait two months. Somebody had suggested in an article that it prevented the Braves from getting Benson, but they got Tim Hudson instead.

That being said, it remains to be seen if the Mets lost anything in the exchange. Huber will likely have a good career but that's not a guarantee, and he'd benefit the Royals not the Pirates. As for Wiggy, his BA/OBP/SLG last year wound up being right in line with his career numbers; his problem was that the Bucs had too many infielders fighting for spots to wait out a slump from one of them. If the Mets didn't already have Nady and Franco I'd willingly offer Wiggy at least a minor-league deal.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Bautista is immaterial.

It's hard to argue that this one hasn't been breaking the Mets way.

[Guest Yancy Street Gang]

I was okay with the Benson trade when it happened, and I like it more since then.

It was the deal on the same day with Tampa Bay that had me perplexed. Unlike others, I'm not gnashing my teeth over the Kazmir-Zambrano trade, though. I'm still not convinced that it won't turn out to be more or less a wash.

[Elster88]

smg58 wrote: There was no reason not to wait two months. Somebody had suggested in an article that it prevented the Braves from getting Benson, but they got Tim Hudson instead.

This is where I get upset. I think if we had traded Kazmir and Huber and (whoever the other rookie was that Pittsburgh got) we could've gotten Hudson ourselves. IIRC, I was unimpressed with the package that Atlanta sent to Oakland. I'd rather have Hudson than Benson and Zambrano.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Nonetheless, I think we have to judge the trade that was made and seperate it from the trade that wasn't.

Oakland was in a pennant race anyway, and weren't selling Hudson to no Mets team trying to scramble back into the race.

[Willets Point]

Edgy DC wrote: It's hard to argue that this one hasn't been breaking the Mets way.

You're just begging Bret to come in argue exaclty that aren't you?

[Frayed Knot]

I liked getting Benson and still do. The part I disliked was the inclusion of Huber.
Pittsburgh had lost a slew of guys in the Rule 5 draft that year and Bautista was one that they wanted back. The Mets had probably already committed (mentally) to the deal and so decided to "do whatever it takes" to complete it. Once you make the decision that you have to have a particular player it's easy to keep adding on (players or years or dollars) until you get him.

[Guest Rockin' Doc]

I don't recall being to upset about the Benson trade when it occurred. It has turned out pretty well for the Mets thus far.

As with Yancey, it was the Kazmir trade that I didn't like. I'm not convinced that Kazmir will ever be as good as many (including myself) once expected him to be. However, I would rather have him and his potential as the #4 or #5 starter in the rotation over Victor Zambrano.

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

Willets Point wrote: ="Edgy DC"]It's hard to argue that this one hasn't been breaking the Mets way. You're just begging Bret to come in argue exaclty that aren't you?

I don't think I can at this point. I'm trying to figure out how the Pirates--the Pittsburgh freakin' Pirates!!--could send Wiggy down to the minors, and then release him after he did okay at the MLB level last season and pretty damned spectacularly at AAA. Further I'm not understanding why no one's picked him up. Do you see minor leaguers with near .900 OPS being ignored like this every day?
http://63.236.6.146/baseball/player.htm?ID=7100

Don't the Mets need a second baseman? Are his offensive numbers better than Kaz's? Could his defense at 2B be worse than Kaz's?

If the Mets could reacquire Wiggy, then I'd have to say that the Benson deal turned out o-reet!

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

Third baseman Ty Wigginton, released yesterday, was the main piece acquired from the New York Mets 17 months ago in the Kris Benson deal, but he never worked out. This past season, he batted .258 with seven home runs in 57 games while spending more than half the year in the minors. He is first-time eligible for arbitration. "It just didn't work out as well as we or he had hoped," Littlefield said. --today's Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

I mean, does this make sense to you? That's 7 HRs in 155 ABs, a rate over 20 HRs in under 500 ABs. I understand that not going to get you in the Hall of Fame, but sent down to the minors? And then released? Have I just gone insane?

[Zvon]

Bret Sabermetric wrote: ="Willets Point"] ="Edgy DC"]It's hard to argue that this one hasn't been breaking the Mets way. You're just begging Bret to come in argue exaclty that aren't you? I don't think I can at this point. I'm trying to figure out how the Pirates--the Pittsburgh freakin' Pirates!!--could send Wiggy down to the minors, and then release him after he did okay at the MLB level last season and pretty damned spectacularly at AAA. Further I'm not understanding why no one's picked him up. Do you see minor leaguers with near .900 OPS being ignored like this every day? http://63.236.6.146/baseball/player.htm?ID=7100 Don't the Mets need a second baseman? Are his offensive numbers better than Kaz's? Could his defense at 2B be worse than Kaz's? If the Mets could reacquire Wiggy, then I'd have to say that the Benson deal turned out o-reet!

mark the calander.
I like something Brets sayin.

Last I looked Wigg was doin okay on the MLB level.
Not earthshaking but more than adequate.
I was very surprised he was released by a team like the Pirates.
__________________________
Just to weigh in on the Kaz deal,...the other Kaz, Kazmir, I must say I was shocked we dealt him, but from what I read it was not done because of any lack of talent. I do believe the Mets wanted him to pay some dues he didnt think were necessary.
He got what he wanted, to as soon as possible pitch at the MLB level.

[Zvon]

i didnt see any of Wigginton in 05, I dont think.
But I remember noticing his numbers in 04.
Im looking for them now and cant find em at CBSsportline.

Guess they pulled em.....

[Elster88]

Edgy DC wrote: Nonetheless, I think we have to judge the trade that was made and seperate it from the trade that wasn't. Oakland was in a pennant race anyway, and weren't selling Hudson to no Mets team trying to scramble back into the race.

I meant in the offseason. Keep the players, call it quits on the season, get Hudson in the winter.

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

Zvon (in the David Wright Internet Chat thread, for reasons of his own) mentions "roids" as a possible explanation for the strange turn Wiggy's career is taking.

Personally, I feel that if they didn't stop Geogre Brett's career, Wiggy should be able to rise above a case of 'roids. A smidgen of Preparation H, and you're good as new, correct?

[Guest Rotblatt]

Still undecided, mostly because of Huber. By all accounts, he was switched to 1B not primarily for his defense, but because they had a better C prospect ahead of him. With Huber in our system, we wouldn't have had to trade for LoDuca.

I had high hopes for Peterson at the time, and clearly that didn't pan out and I thought Wiggy was a solid regular. Count me in on the whole "sign Wiggy to a minor league deal and give him a shot" wagon.

[Elster88]

Luckily for the fans, we're allowed to make up our minds two years after the fact and talk trash. Kind of sucks for the front office that they can't do that.

[Guest Edgy DC]

With Huber in our system, we wouldn't have had to trade for LoDuca.

�Por que no? The Mets traded for him even though they had Jacobs in their system.

[DocTee]

LoDuca arrived after Jacobs was dealt, no?

[Guest Edgy DC]

Sure, just, but my broader point was sort of that Huber was as unlikely to get handed the catchng job as Jacobs.

But, yeah, and I guess that's speculative.

[Frayed Knot]

"By all accounts, [Huber] was switched to 1B not primarily for his defense, but because they had a better C prospect ahead of him. With Huber in our system, we wouldn't have had to trade for LoDuca."

There's been talk of having to move Huber out from behind the plate since he was in A ball. To assume that he'd be a full or even part-time ML backstop were he still here is pretty speculative at this point.

I'm thinking that maybe he and the other good bat/defensively-challenged minor league catcher would have made an interesting experiment as a LH/RH 1st base duo and made the trade for Delgado unneccesary and young Mr. Petit bait for someone else instead (Arrrgh ... Manny!!!)

[Guest Giant Squidlike Creature]

There's a certain irony to this thread now. Ty Wigginton now equals Jorge Julio.