soupcan

Voted with the majority. I kinda like 'em. Disappointing, but redeemable You can't be too hard on them, literally decimated by injuries. (okay use of 'literally' there?)

Fernando is the new Carlos.

="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr":olvohski]But who... will be the Seventh-Inning Guy? Who can get their glands to most effectively secrete regulatory hormones when there are still 9 outs left to record?[/quote:olvohski] Lovin' it. Edgy DC Jun 05 2009 01:48 PM That Eddie Kunz star sure seems to have dimmed, huh? LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 05 2009 01:56 PM ="Edgy DC":w6x1snna]That Eddie Kunz star sure seems to have dimmed, huh?[/quote:w6x1snna] He was walky in college, and he's walky now. Draft a HS/college starter, and he fails to develop as you'd hoped... you can stick him in the bullpen, and try to have him refine on his best 1-2 pitches. Draft a college reliever, and he fails to develop/deliver... you can stick him in your rear end, and consider him an uncomfortable lesson learned. G-Fafif Jun 05 2009 02:10 PM ="Benjamin Grimm":f0gx8zt0]I'd like to see a committee approach to the seventh inning. It can be shared among Santana, Maine, Pelfrey, and Hernandez.[/quote:f0gx8zt0] Best. Solution. If not ever than in ages. MFS62 Jun 05 2009 02:25 PM Roster moves: ] Fernando Nieve will replace J.J. Putz on the roster. Nieve was claimed off waivers from the Astros late in spring training. He began the season at Double-A Binghamton, and was 3-0 with a 3.70 ERA as a starter since joining Triple-A Buffalo. *** The Mets also have claimed lefthander Pat Misch off waivers from the Giants. He will be assigned to Buffalo. Misch appeared in four games for San Francisco this season. Later Centerfield Jun 05 2009 03:37 PM Omar says at least three months, according to MetsBlog.

I wouldn't bet against them either really. I was just illustrating my disappointment in all of these injuries. At this point, I am resigned to what I believe is the fact that without Delgado and Reyes for a significant part of the season, our boys are cooked. If I did make that bet, I'd be happy to have to fork over the thou at the end of the year.

Aren't there only two decent Christian Slater movies? 'Heathers' and 'True Romance'

I'll bet you $1,000.00 that the Mets don't make the playoffs.

="Benjamin Grimm"]Surprised that there's not a doubleheader today, since the Mets don't have a scheduled return to Pittsburgh. Neither team has to travel far after the game. The Mets are off to Washington and the Pirates are headed to Houston. I thought that as well then wondered if its b/c the Mets are considered a 'draw' in Pittsburgh and they didn't want to give up the gate on weekday as opposed to a week night. That's if it is rescheduled as a night game.

You know - if that McCutcheon guy turns out to be any good, that's not a horrible lineup at all.

I love 3,000 hits so much that if Jetah evah gets there, I'd actually have to consider him a HOFer.

Um....'Dougnuts'?

It might be good for me and you to get the pig virus right now, but personally I'd rather Beltran does get it in December or January. KnowwhatI'msayin'?

'Pizza - It's The Greatest!'

="holychicken":1670vd26]For some reason this one did not bother me all too much.[/quote:1670vd26] Yeah - you know what? Me too. For some reason it didn't tighten my colon like it should have. Maybe because they've been winning games with the B team for a while now that I half expected a bad loss at some point. Edgy DC Jun 02 2009 09:46 AM I've come to expect a mugging by Pittsburgh once a year, so I just rolled over and played dead so they wouln't kick me as much. LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 02 2009 09:57 AM A point nobody's mentioned in this: the Valdez boot. The thing is, if your lineup's struggling, you can plug in someone with hitting skills and he can help you right away, assuming he just keeps doing what he does. If your defense is struggling, you can't just plug in someone with defensive skills. Defense-- especially middle-infield defense-- is one of the only places in baseball where actual teamwork comes into play, innit? If teammates have the chance to play together for some time, they know the capabilities of their mates, and-- it follows-- they know what they can do together and must do individually. As a SS who knows his keystone partner, you know what balls you have to sell out to get to, how fast you can/have to turn an attempted DP, where the ball's getting delivered and in what rhythm on forceouts. If they haven't had an opportunity to get to know each other, two defensive players with superior skills can produce some embarrassing moments. Maybe some extra infield is in order? Edgy DC Jun 02 2009 10:02 AM It was interesting. My thinking was the runner had him partially screened or else he's have taken it on a shorter hop. He played back on it because he couldn't read it, causing him to rush the transfer. I don't think they'd have turned it anyhow. Willets Point Jun 02 2009 11:10 AM Whatever. The Mets went 19-9 in May. I expect they'll go 18-10 in June with some dramatic wins versus the Phillies and the Yankees. This is just one of those games. Centerfield Jun 02 2009 12:58 PM Nights like these I think about Ben Grimm and his "happy if they win, no skin off my back attitude". I don't see how it's possible to simply turn off the TV and go to sleep without missing a beat after something like this. I've tried for years to get to the BG Point, but find myself no closer than when I started. I've pretty much concluded that he is not human. Willets Point Jun 02 2009 02:03 PM ="Centerfield":116axrxy]I've tried for years to get to the BG Point, but find myself no closer than when I started. I've pretty much concluded that he is not human.[/quote:116axrxy] Duh! He isn't human. He's a big. orange scaly monster. Benjamin Grimm Jun 02 2009 02:21 PM ="Centerfield":3od0yu6j]I don't see how it's possible to simply turn off the TV and go to sleep without missing a beat after something like this.[/quote:3od0yu6j] And yet, I did. Look at it this way: Donuts are tasty. You don't need a donut to be happy, but when you get one, you enjoy it. It's not necessary to me for the Mets to win. When they do, it's great. Like getting a free donut. But I can live a happy life without donuts. And I can also enjoy my life if the Mets don't win. I think 1986 was the threshold for me. Falling short in 1985 bothered me. But now that I have that World Championship under my belt, I'm good. 1987 didn't bother me for long, and neither did that loss to the Dodgers in 1988. Remember, this is FUN. It's not IMPORTANT. LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 02 2009 02:49 PM ="Benjamin Grimm"]="Centerfield"]I don't see how it's possible to simply turn off the TV and go to sleep without missing a beat after something like this. And yet, I did. Look at it this way: Donuts are tasty. You don't need a donut to be happy, but when you get one, you enjoy it. It's not necessary to me for the Mets to win. When they do, it's great. Like getting a free donut. But I can live a happy life without donuts. And I can also enjoy my life if the Mets don't win. I think 1986 was the threshold for me. Falling short in 1985 bothered me. But now that I have that World Championship under my belt, I'm good. 1987 didn't bother me for long, and neither did that loss to the Dodgers in 1988. Remember, this is FUN. It's not IMPORTANT. Yes, I enjoy donuts. But I don't care about donuts. I don't spend long hours and prodigious amounts of money-- hours and money that could otherwise be devoted to more productive (not to mention less mercurial) pursuits-- consuming donuts. Well, not only consuming donuts but discussing the finer points of the donuts' taste, and texture, and whether or not I like the package in which they came, and what the music that plays in my favorite donut store does for digestion, and that bonding over donuts was the one way I could communicate with my mother. If I did, I think I'd feel pretty terrible if my favorite donut shop changed the recipe suddenly, or shuttered its nearest store, or fired my favorite counter guy. I mean, everything in its right place and measure and all that... but I can't divorce the "fun" part from the "caring" part. And that means, to some degree, that I'll feel a little bad when things turn out especially badly. Benjamin Grimm Jun 02 2009 03:32 PM Well, sure. I'm unhappy when the Mets lose, but I just groan and shake it off. All I know is, it works for me. Edgy DC Jun 02 2009 08:14 PM ="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"]Yes, I enjoy donuts. But I don't care about donuts. I don't spend long hours and prodigious amounts of money-- hours and money that could otherwise be devoted to more productive (not to mention less mercurial) pursuits-- consuming donuts. Well, not only consuming donuts but discussing the finer points of the donuts' taste, and texture, and whether or not I like the package in which they came, and what the music that plays in my favorite donut store does for digestion, and that bonding over donuts was the one way I could communicate with my mother. If I did, I think I'd feel pretty terrible if my favorite donut shop changed the recipe suddenly, or shuttered its nearest store, or fired my favorite counter guy. I mean, everything in its right place and measure and all that... but I can't divorce the "fun" part from the "caring" part. And that means, to some degree, that I'll feel a little bad when things turn out especially badly. Jeez, no wonder my newsletter is failing. Edgy DC Jun 03 2009 07:50 AM And isn't it time for the new issue to drop? Fman99 Jun 03 2009 07:54 AM ="Edgy DC":28rds1sz]And isn't it time for the new issue to drop?[/quote:28rds1sz] Wow. I love their tagline. "All gave some. Some gave all. Others gave donuts." John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 03 2009 07:55 AM Best issue ever. soupcan Jun 03 2009 08:21 AM Um....'Dougnuts'? Edgy DC Jun 03 2009 08:29 AM Don't be such a soupcan. I have real work to do. Typos will happen. metirish Jun 12 2009 09:00 PM 6/12/2009 The Castillo game... Frayed Knot Jun 12 2009 09:01 PM This contest is over. Fman99 Jun 12 2009 09:06 PM What's worse is that YES will add this to their rotation of "classic Yankee games" to play during rainouts and such. Swan Swan H Jun 12 2009 09:35 PM The Mets have lost games before under bad circumstances - errors, bases-loaded walks issued, all sorts of stuff - and I understand that fresh wounds sting worst, but I've been watching this team since Ed Kranepool couldn't vote and I can't remember one that hurt worse. Consider: First game at that fucking sewage plant in the Bronx Punked their big-mouth starter Exposed their shabby bullpen Our golden boy beat their infallible closer While our closer popped up their 25 million dollar juicehead in the most clutch of situations And it's the Yankees. The motherfucking cocksucking evil Yankees. We hashed all of this out during the Sox series, but to me a loss to these scumbags is worse than a loss to anyone else. You disagree? I don't give a fuck. In my world this is worse than losing to the Phillies or Braves. Way worse. I know it's regular season, and compared to Beltran v. Wainwright or the Stone/Seaver/Matlack fiasco it's small potatoes, but Damn! this one hurts. MFS62 Jun 13 2009 08:20 AM Swannie, I'll ditto everything you said and add one more to what fman said. My boss is a Yankee fan. It won't have to wait for replays on YES before I have to endure the pain again. It will happen on Monday. Later Swan Swan H Jun 13 2009 09:18 AM My response to Yankee fans (and I have had to do this a couple of times already) is pretty simple - we had you beat, and you know we did. Wright beat Rivera and Frankie beat A-Rod, Joba nearly pissed himself out there, and you won on a miraculous fluke. Savor it all you want, but you know we had you. Gotta keep pushing their couple of failures in their face, hoping to distract from the hideous bottom line. I feel like Sean Hannity in October '08. Benjamin Grimm Jun 13 2009 11:31 AM Whatever argument we can make about how the Mets lost on a fluke can be made by Red Sox fans about Game 6. Swan Swan H Jun 13 2009 12:05 PM ="Benjamin Grimm":15t9dwqh]Whatever argument we can make about how the Mets lost on a fluke can be made by Red Sox fans about Game 6.[/quote:15t9dwqh] Well, the Mets had tied that one already, but otherwise I'm fine with that. Gwreck Jun 13 2009 03:41 PM Yeah, for that reason alone, that analogy doesn't work. dgwphotography Jun 13 2009 04:45 PM ="Frayed Knot":1iap5wrc]This contest is over.[/quote:1iap5wrc] So is the contest for worst loss of the decade... Edgy DC Jun 13 2009 05:04 PM Benitez 2001 is so relieved. Centerfield Jun 15 2009 08:03 AM Who said Benitez is not to blame for last Friday? Gwreck Jun 23 2009 10:09 PM It might not be top 3 but the 6/23 game (2 hits over 9 innings) is on this lsit. Nymr83 Jun 24 2009 12:21 AM ="Gwreck":1a8sk3gv]It might not be top 3 but the 6/23 game (2 hits over 9 innings) is on this lsit.[/quote:1a8sk3gv] to me its not, i'd consider the "worst losses" to involve blowing leads in spectacular fashion, failing to tie up a game despite loading the bases with nobody out, etc. when the other pitcher just shuts you down you shrug your shoulders and get ready for tommorow. i wont remember this loss soon enough. metirish Jun 24 2009 04:45 AM It's on my list. I thought it was embarrassing they way Pineiro mowed them down . I've no problem with getting shut down by an elite pitcher , he is not one of those. LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 24 2009 06:49 AM Pineiro handled a healthier version of this team during the St. Louis games, so this didn't exactly come out of nowhere. "This team," by the way, was a couple of different roster moves away from starting Wily Mo Pena and Argenis Reyes. All of which is to say, I respectfully disagree-- this doesn't come close to the neighborhood of being in the vicinity of shouting distance of my list. Centerfield Jun 24 2009 07:54 AM Last night's game pissed me off, and it's about as "unfun" as a game can be, but it wasn't the kind that rips your heart out and stomps on it. I'm serious, I think this contest is over after the Castillo game. Gwreck Jun 24 2009 07:58 AM I don't disagree, but the thread title says "Losses" (ie. plural). Centerfield Jun 24 2009 08:03 AM That's true. For me, the Castillo Game, the Pittsburgh game, the Church Misses Third Game, and the Murphy Drops the Fly Ball game were all worse. I think last night would have been a miserable game to go to. But as long as I could change the channel, last night wasn't excruciating. metirish Jun 24 2009 08:05 AM I'm sure there will be worse losses and yeah the Castillo game will live long in my memory but last nights game while it didn't claw my heart out it was in my opinion a shitty loss, we waste a fine start by Hernandez and can't touch the other guy and our manager didn't paint himself in glory either. themetfairy Jun 24 2009 08:11 AM I'm with CF here. The worst losses are the Castillo-esque ones. Last night was just a bad game, but it didn't grab defeat from the jaws of victory in a heart-wrenching manner. Hawkeye57 Jun 24 2009 08:23 AM Agreed, two hitters happen every now and again and aren't always remembered. Castillo's error, missing third base, those things will probably be remembered more than a two hitter. Wouldn't rate yesterday as a huge loss, but it was tough. Gwreck Jun 24 2009 08:44 AM I'm very surprised to be so strongly outvoted here. For the record, there have been a total of three other games put in this thread: 1. Church misses third/Reed throwing error to end game (at LA) 2. Bullpen meltdown (at Pittsburgh) 3. Castillo drops flyball (at Yankees). --- I guess I missed the memo where this list was limited to 3 games. Edgy DC Jun 24 2009 08:49 AM It seems to be elusive that you're not trying to knock the Castillo game down the list, but rather trying to add to the bottom. I think you should flesh out a top ten right NOW!!!! and then we can argue and (hopefully not) add to the list and knock some games off of it as the season progresses. As long as we similarly maintain the list of top wins. metirish Jun 24 2009 08:53 AM ="Gwreck"]I'm very surprised to be so strongly outvoted here. For the record, there have been a total of three other games put in this thread: 1. Church misses third/Reed throwing error to end game (at LA) 2. Bullpen meltdown (at Pittsburgh) 3. Castillo drops flyball (at Yankees). --- I guess I missed the memo where this list was limited to 3 games. Thanks for this little list......I am going to add last nights game to that list , will it be there at the end of the season as one of the worst losses? , maybe not but right now it is. John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 24 2009 09:21 AM I'm gonna throw last Thursday's game onto this list, at No. 4, and suggest April 21 at St. Louis for No. 5 (Perez blows a 4-0 lead, Murphy misplays a fly ball into a triple, Putz sucks, Mets lose 6-4). Edgy DC Jun 24 2009 09:25 AM 6-4 is the score of the season. LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 24 2009 09:35 AM Second all of JCL's choices. We're missing a bunch of Phil losses, no? The two blown-in-the-seventh Phils losses on 6/10 and 6/11 (Beltran dropped flyball opens gates for three runs in 7th, 5-4 loss in extra innings on Utley HR, spoiled Pelf start; and Redding spoils his own 3-1 lead/Ibanez nails Takahashi in 11th) stung. Also, I was in CBP for the walking party on 5/2 (Ollie walks 6/doesn't last 3; Takahashi makes great debut, but Feliciano tagged by Ibanez; Mets come back behind Castro and Murphy HRs; Beltran first-and-third DP in top of 11 kills a threat, followed by Bad Sean Green walking Victorino for winning run). It sucked. Fman99 Jun 24 2009 09:58 AM ="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr":ys44xiw2] Also, I was in CBP for the walking party on 5/2 (Ollie walks 6/doesn't last 3; Takahashi makes great debut, but Feliciano tagged by Ibanez; Mets come back behind Castro and Murphy HRs; Beltran first-and-third DP in top of 11 kills a threat, followed by Bad Sean Green walking Victorino for winning run). It sucked.[/quote:ys44xiw2] I'd add this one. I watched this on TV and it was a turd. Anytime the Cryin Hawaiian is scoring the winning run against the Mets auto-qualifies for this list doesn't it? Frayed Knot Jun 24 2009 10:43 AM I view this thread a way to track those games which either are, or will be, eligible for a 'Top 10' (read: bottom) at the end of the year. We've had those best/worst 10 threads in the past although it's much tougher trying to reconstruct those by looking back than it is tallying them as they go by. Bottom line: I'm OK nominating last night's even though I agree with the view that I don't think it'll make my final cut. Gwreck Jun 24 2009 11:46 AM I guess the Johan meltdown in the Bronx also goes in the bottom 10. SteveJRogers Jul 05 2009 02:20 PM I'm nominating all three games from this weekend, 7/3-7/5. As much of a must sweep/take two out of three as a series can be in the first week of July, and the Mets end up getting swept, falling 5 back in the loss column. A lost weekend to be sure. Fman99 Jul 05 2009 07:16 PM This was an awful series to be sure, but none of these games have that crotchpunchitude that some of the other ones do. Even the bad defense on Saturday was after they were trailing and didn't really affect the score. So, to me, none of these games as individual events make this list. metirish Jul 05 2009 07:30 PM I think I have become immune to such losses and this weekend sweep was not the least surprising. LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jul 05 2009 10:25 PM This weekend-- right up to and including today's Johan Game TM-- had a sick inexorability to it. Depressing, yes. But, sadly, all too expected. John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 17 2009 08:56 PM I'm going to nominate Thursday's game, a 5-3 loss to the Braves in the first game back from the Break. Very typical of the 09 Mets but for the fact nobody got hurt and nobody made an egregious error. But a loss like so many others: Not enough offense, all the scoring confined to a single inning, outs and at-bats given away. We were tied and played not to lose, wasting our best relievers who needed (and received) bailouts from the back-end anyway, so everyone is good and used up in the first game of a 10-game road trip. Not to mention it snapped another modest win streak at 2-games, cost us third place in the standings, illustrated the folly of the Francoeur trade in his first chance for revenge, and brought everyone's spirits down in time for a 11-run waffling Friday and another series we won't win. Despite all the worthy candidates already on this fine list, this was the first loss of the year after which I said, yes, I think they're done. Pull the plug. Farmer Ted Jul 17 2009 09:47 PM They're sellers at this point. Mos def. Fman99 Aug 04 2009 08:30 PM Ha! Found it first. Pujols extra innings grand slam. Assuming the Cards hold on, 12-7. Edgy DC Aug 04 2009 08:35 PM Ugh. Premature bookage. Kong76 Aug 04 2009 08:42 PM Have to admit I went fishing for this thread too before it was over. Fman99 Aug 04 2009 08:44 PM ="Edgy DC":10jo8uvo]Ugh. Premature bookage.[/quote:10jo8uvo] Yeah, as soon as the ball left PooHoles' bat. I know, ya gotta believe, yada yada yada, but hell. Edgy DC Aug 08 2009 09:02 AM August 7: The Mets score two in the first and then go into offensive cryongeinic sleep, which is a pity because Oliver Perez turns in his best outing of the year, absoultely dominating the Padres with six innings of non-walky shutout ball. When he falters in the seventh abnd gives up half his two-run lead, Brian Stokes comes in and bails him out huge time. No matter, as Francisco Rodriguez enters in the ninth, has nothing on his fastball, and walks the leadoff batter. Ultimately, he faces five batters, retires none, and tops his appearance by giving up a game-winning grand slam to a mostly punchless shortstop scarcely out of A-ball. Chunky and grumpy ex-Met Heath Bell walks off with the win. LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 08 2009 04:52 PM ="Edgy DC":2zh033cf]August 7: The Mets score two in the first and then go into offensive cryongeinic sleep, which is a pity because Oliver Perez turns in his best outing of the year, absoultely dominating the Padres with six innings of non-walky shutout ball. When he falters in the seventh abnd gives up half his two-run lead, Brian Stokes comes in and bails him out huge time. No matter, as Francisco Rodriguez enters in the ninth, has nothing on his fastball, and walks the leadoff batter. Ultimately, he faces five batters, retires none, and tops his appearance by giving up a game-winning grand slam to a mostly punchless shortstop scarcely out of A-ball. Chunky and grumpy ex-Met Heath Bell walks off with the win.[/quote:2zh033cf] Add the aspect of a blown call to let the tying run score that nobody-- save G-Fafif-- is really complaining about, since the BS felt so sickeningly inevitable anyway, and the ump didn't put the leadoff guy on or let Venable whack it, yadda yadda yadda. The 10:05 start always gives a bad west-coast loss five points extra-credit, as well. LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 16 2009 11:06 AM 8/15, Giants, 5-4 (10). Let's go through the nightmare scenario checklist: Last man standing/face of franchise/best all-around player during the last four years hit in head by 94-mph fastball? Check. Ace/only Met to believe in roughed up by a free-swinging lineup Bobby Parnell shut down a day earlier? Check. Dongs for insurance and go-ahead runs hit by two players against whom said ace "sent a message?" Check. Gift of blown save (again) from Giant sorta-closer promptly returned? Check. No dropped popups, and not to the Phils/Yanks/Braves, but it's a contender. Kong76 Aug 16 2009 11:18 AM Funny, I was thinking on the subway that the only thing that didn't go wrong was Murphy and Castillo didn't hurt each other in right field on one play. Castillo was limpy for a minute but he's kinda limpy anyway. I hope they shut Wright down for the rest of the season at this point with the team's luck and track record with injuries especially ones to the coconut. LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 23 2009 11:04 PM This one[/url:3q7nwdhz]'s got to go in the scrapbook, no? Demoralization early, then increasing interest with the scrapping and the Misching (even as chances get squandered), then the adrenaline rush of the 9th-inning comeback... and the car crash cardiac arrest of the close. And all against our favorite delinquents from down the 'Pike. For a game in which a literal once-in-a-lifetime play delivered the sword stroke to the shoulder blades, what's startling is how routine this feels by now. We're about one game-lost-by-catcher's-interference-followed-by-South-American-football-stadium-style-Pepsi Porch collapse from filling out the "Worst Season Ever" bingo card. metirish Aug 24 2009 07:50 AM Just me but no loss this past month and more warrants being in this thread , nothing surprises , nothing even hurts anymore......it's nothingness . G-Fafif Aug 24 2009 07:52 AM It might be more efficient to start a thread cataloguing which losses aren't the worst of 2009. Tidier anyway. metsguyinmichigan Aug 24 2009 08:04 AM ="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr":7lkl3daw]This one[/url:7lkl3daw]'s got to go in the scrapbook, no? Demoralization early, then increasing interest with the scrapping and the Misching (even as chances get squandered), then the adrenaline rush of the 9th-inning comeback... and the car crash cardiac arrest of the close. And all against our favorite delinquents from down the 'Pike. For a game in which a literal once-in-a-lifetime play delivered the sword stroke to the shoulder blades, what's startling is how routine this feels by now. We're about one game-lost-by-catcher's-interference-followed-by-South-American-football-stadium-style-Pepsi Porch collapse from filling out the "Worst Season Ever" bingo card.[/quote:7lkl3daw] Brilliant! Actually, you're missing the "best player tagged in steroid scandal" box on the card, but the Yankees already filled that one in this year. Benjamin Grimm Aug 24 2009 08:09 AM ="metirish":2gf3l66x]Just me but no loss this past month and more warrants being in this thread , nothing surprises , nothing even hurts anymore......it's nothingness .[/quote:2gf3l66x] I agree. The losses are worse (and the wins are better) when the games aren't meaningless. metsmarathon Aug 24 2009 08:10 AM i'm really not sure if the circumstances surrounding last night's game warrant its inclusion in this thread. i feel its much more of a tip-your-cap kind of loss. this was a different kind of loss than the luis castillo popup. a very different animal. this was no blown save, no missed third base. if the roles had been reversed - the phils down two, two men on, no outs, top nine - they send the runners, castillo moves over to cover the bag, and gets a screaming liner hit right at him... that pops out of his glove as he prematurely looks down to step on the bag for the second out, and subsequently allows both runners to score - well, then it would belong in this thread. history jumped up and bit us on the ass. c'est la vie, i guess... LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 24 2009 09:13 AM ="metsmarathon"]i'm really not sure if the circumstances surrounding last night's game warrant its inclusion in this thread. i feel its much more of a tip-your-cap kind of loss. this was a different kind of loss than the luis castillo popup. a very different animal. this was no blown save, no missed third base. if the roles had been reversed - the phils down two, two men on, no outs, top nine - they send the runners, castillo moves over to cover the bag, and gets a screaming liner hit right at him... that pops out of his glove as he prematurely looks down to step on the bag for the second out, and subsequently allows both runners to score - well, then it would belong in this thread. history jumped up and bit us on the ass. c'est la vie, i guess... Fair point. And I'd be lying if I said this killed me as much as even the Pittsburgh game from June. These games don't sting anymore. But on a lazy Sunday, driving back from southern NJ, Howie and Whatshisface dragged me back somewhat in for a day. Plus, losing to Philly when you've got a legitimate shot at the end that didn't seem at all possible an hour earlier... doesn't it ache something fierce? (Spoiling the Phils is about the only thing I'm really hoping for, Mets-wise, for the season's remainder. Hate is all I have left.) metsmarathon Aug 24 2009 10:08 AM it does. but this is an ache i can live with - an 'oh well, you got me' kind of ache. like when your pitcher puts his pitch right were he wanted to, and the batter still manages to push a soft fly ball into short right field. you do your best, and if they beat you they beat you. its like that pitch vlad hit a week or so ago that actually bounced in front of home plate - i mean, what are you going to do there but say, "damn, he got me there"? dgwphotography Aug 24 2009 01:58 PM ="metsmarathon":1snick2b]history jumped up and bit us on the ass. [/quote:1snick2b] Your 2009 marketing slogan. Edgy DC Aug 24 2009 02:00 PM Well, something has to be 10th. metsmarathon Aug 25 2009 08:22 AM i'm gonna wander out on a limb and suggest that johan santana might well be the worst loss of 2009...

] June 1, 2009 Hips Are Bringing More Athletes to Their Knees By MICHAEL S. SCHMIDT The quest to build ever more proficient athletes keeps hitting unexpected snags, and perhaps nowhere is this more vivid than in Major League Baseball. Several top players have been hampered by a hip ailment that was unheard of in the sport a decade ago. Knee injuries to countless recreational and professional athletes in recent years made anterior cruciate ligament a household phrase and compelled trainers to emphasize building leg strength. Sports medicine experts now say that approach, while mitigating knee injuries, may be making hips vulnerable. �No matter what we do, as complex as we try and make workouts and training methods, we lose sight of other things,� said Mackie Shilstone, a trainer based in New Orleans, who works with baseball, football and hockey players who are rehabilitating injuries. �We tend to concentrate on what is directly in front of us. �In all my years as a trainer, I have not seen anything like the increase in hip injuries that I have seen over the past two years.� No studies have been published to confirm this phenomenon. But many trainers and orthopedists say the anecdotal evidence is jarring, and medical staffs for Major League Baseball teams and franchises in other sports are scrambling to understand why athletes� hips suddenly seem so fragile. Experts said other factors could be at work in addition to the overemphasis on leg strength. Advances in magnetic imaging have enabled doctors to see inside the hip and identify certain ailments, and the increasing number of children playing sports at younger ages has led to more instances of improper bone development. Several of baseball�s biggest stars � including Alex Rodriguez of the Yankees, Chase Utley of the Philadelphia Phillies and Carlos Delgado of the Mets � have been forced to the sideline after having surgery to repair a torn labrum, the cartilage that runs along the rim of the hip socket. Rodriguez recently returned after missing two months, and Delgado has said he may not return this season. On Thursday, one of Utley�s teammates, pitcher Brett Myers, was found to have a damaged labrum in his hip. He is expected to have surgery this week. Not all doctors are convinced that training is the culprit. �It�s not like workouts have changed all of a sudden; it doesn�t explain it,� said Christopher Powers, an associate professor of biokinesiology at the University of Southern California. �People and doctors are just more aware of it diagnostically. We�ve always had hip problems; now we are just finding it better.� The number of players on the disabled list because of hip and groin-muscle injuries rose to 34 in 2008 from 20 in 2007. Through the first quarter of this season, at least 13 players have gone on the disabled list with hip injuries. �Delgado and A-Rod asked me about it,� said Utley, who had hip surgery last November after the Phillies won the World Series. �They both wanted to know what I did to keep playing. �Before, guys never had hip surgeries and never let them work on their hips. But this was different.� No sports medicine experts pointed to performance-enhancing drugs in explaining the rise in hip injuries. But dozens of major league baseball players, including Rodriguez, have been linked to performance-enhancing drugs in recent years, raising suspicions every time a new injury trend appears. �It�s interesting to see what injuries increase as we come out of the steroid era,� said Stan Conte, the head trainer for the Los Angeles Dodgers. The sudden prominence of hip injuries comes a year after an unusual number of baseball players sustained strained oblique muscles, which run from the ribs to the abdomen. The apparent rash of hip injuries extends beyond baseball, doctors and trainers said. Athletes of all ages and skill levels and in varying sports are having hip problems at higher rates and being found to have labral tears, they said. Soccer and hockey players in particular have followed the conventional training wisdom in recent years and bolstered their knees. Now some of them, including Islanders goalie Rick DiPietro and midfielder Freddie Ljungberg of Major League Soccer�s Seattle Sounders, who have both had labrum surgery, are having hip trouble. �In soccer, they train harder than they used to train 10 to 15 to 20 years ago, when soccer had had a lot of A.C.L. tears,� said Dr. Andreas H. Gomoll, an associate professor of orthopedic surgery at Harvard Medical School and a surgeon at Brigham and Women�s Hospital. �They started worrying much more about knees; they now do special training to protect the knee. And one belief is that this is why we have more of these injuries because the strength is putting more pressure on the hips.� Dr. Bryan T. Kelly, a surgeon at the Hospital for Special Surgery in Manhattan, performed Utley�s operation and is scheduled to operate on Myers. He said he did not believe it was a coincidence that �I get 40 hockey players in a six-week period at the end of the season all coming into my office with the same-looking bone structure in their hips, all saying that they have been skating since they were 3 years old.� Kelly added, �I believe we are seeing some consequences from having our kids over the past few decades playing sports more at younger ages.� As magnetic imaging has become more sophisticated, doctors have gained the ability to see inside the hip and identify labral tears. �We are doing a much better job at imaging the injuries, and we are also seeing athletes with bigger bodies that are working harder on strength and conditioning, and the bigger, stronger muscles are allowing athletes to torque faster and more pressure is being put on the hip,� said Dr. Jordan Metzl, a sports medicine specialist at the Hospital for Special Surgery. Problems with labral tears occur when the head of the femur does not fit correctly in the hip socket. If it is not a good fit, the labrum is squeezed between the ball and the socket when the hip is flexed. Over time, the labrum can become irritated and tear. The problem with an adolescent, doctors said, is that the head of the femur is still growing. Stress on the hip can cause the bone to become misshapen. As the athlete continues to play sports into adulthood, the improperly shaped bone rubs against the labrum. �I believe the situation with the hips is similar to Little League baseball, where there is a high awareness to elbow injuries from pitching too much because the joints are still developing,� Kelly said. �But with the hips, nothing is said. There is nothing done to try and prevent damage from being done.�

Are the Mets numbers retired all through the minors as well? I mean I think it would be odd to see Broadway Lance wearing 41 on the Bisons, but why the hell would that team have 41 retired? I would assume that a minor league club would not issue numbers that the parent club has retired but wouldn't it become a bit cumbersome as minor league affilates change hands? I suppose that when one organization contracts with a certain minor league team that minor league team just respects those numbers retired by the major league club rather than retire them themselves. Yes, no?

Marlins didn't look too good at the plate either last night. Mets defense doesn't look half-bad. Redding pitches decent today he could get hisself a 'w'.

="Edgy DC":2qsynsu1]Better to have a big-ass head than to be a big ass-head.[/quote:2qsynsu1] True dat. Elster88 May 30 2009 10:51 AM The first thing I think of is the almost grand slam in the last game of 2007. From my seat in the mezzanine it looked like it was gone off the bat. The second thing I think of is a gatorade cup upside down on top of his hat with a giant bubble gum bubble stuck on top, courtesy of the young prankster David. So long Blastro, I enjoyed your work. Kong76 May 30 2009 11:01 AM Three years from now at a cranepool function ... KC: We had that other Castro too, Ramon, remember him? JQP: Yeah, had that big head. KC: Big caboose too, seemed like he was always hurt. JQP: He had some big hits for the Mets, won games, I liked him. KC: He was ok, when he wasn't on the DL. I'm going to remember him most as the guy that got traded the night Sweet Caroline was finally ditched at Citi Field. * JQP: Oh snap. To Castro! KC: Ramon! * Hopeful thinking.

Pelfrey - 3 Santos -3 Parnell - 1 Putz - 1 Rodriguez -1 Sheffield - 1

="metirish":zh9iq5vv]I think they will trade Castro to the White Sox[/quote:zh9iq5vv] Funny guy.

Big-ass head.

Probably just to have another body in Buffalo since the Mets now have Fartinez and Pagan.

C'mon - you can't be surprised at this.

="Edgy DC":n23lxh9l]I've long thought the forum should put out our own set of Mets cards --- for sharing among members and not for resale --- featuring our photos and designs.[/quote:n23lxh9l] As completely nerdy as this idea sounds - I love it. Edgy DC May 28 2009 08:35 PM Should we all submit front and back designs and vote or should we just give Zvon the design editor job and Iubitul the photo editor job Methead May 29 2009 06:52 AM When I started a little design business on the side, my first business cards were made to look like baseball cards. I never finished them, but they would have been awesome. I'm pretty sure I used the 1976 Topps Hank Aaron card as a base to work from, and just changed his name to mine. I left the picture of him on it though. Had I kept going, the back was going to have all kinds of work-related stats for my entire career... such as hours of sleep lost, and gallons of coffee consumed... you get the idea. Edgy DC May 29 2009 07:32 AM Post it now.

="Edgy DC":24vyn41o]Your contract can be sold overseas without your approval?[/quote:24vyn41o] Didn't the Mets do that with someone...? Matt Franco maybe? metirish May 28 2009 10:01 AM I guess if your name is Wilson Valdez it can be. I don't imagine Carlos Beltran needs to worry about that happening. Edgy DC May 28 2009 10:02 AM I know they've sold guys overseas, but I guess I figured it was with the player's consent. This seems to be another version of the reality that minor leaguers (guys not protected by the general agreement) have no rights. He probably could have refused the assignment (he's not a slave), but feared he'd be relaeased and blacklisted if he did. metirish May 28 2009 10:07 AM Don't want to sidetrack this but Ron Darling mentioned this exchange during the game with Valdez Ron " Hi Wilson I'm Ron Darling" Wilson - blank look " ummm" Ron said it was humbling that Wilson didn't know who he was. Frayed Knot May 28 2009 10:11 AM Yeah, I think it's a case of: 'we can't use you and couldn't find any other club on this continent who could -- so we sold you to this Korean outfit and you can either play there for a guaranteed paycheck or get cut and look for work on your own'. Edgy DC May 28 2009 10:13 AM But as a minor leaguer, he wouldn't even collect the rest of his annual salary if he went for option B, right? Frayed Knot May 28 2009 10:16 AM Would depend on his exact status at the time and at what point in the year he was cut. Some cuts earn guys just 30 days pay and 30 days a minor league pay ain't much, making the Korean option look all that much better even if not quite mandatory. Edgy DC May 28 2009 10:26 AM That sucks is what I'm saying. His visa is at stake also. I met a minor leaguer who told me of a friend who got hurt, got a diagnosis that put him out for the season, worked his ass off to get back by August, pitched five solid innings in his debut, and got back to his locker to find a pink slip. They weren't allowed to release him while he was hurt, so he ended up screwing himself by working so hard, because it just allowed them to cut him earlier. I guess the upside is that the money's better in the civilian world. I met these folks on the LIRR. They were convinced that, if major leaguers make millions, surely minor leaguers make hundreds of thousands. But after their bonuses, all they see is chump change until they make a big league roster. And outside of the lucky few, most bonuses won't get you very far either --- enough for a car and the rest goes to your parents. Fman99 May 28 2009 10:34 AM Re: Kitten for Sale ="Edgy DC"]Ben Shpigel of the Times does a profile of the last MEt off the bench. Journeyman Gives Mets Insurance at Shortstop By BEN SHPIGEL Published: May 27, 2009 As a slick-fielding 15-year-old, Wilson Valdez reminded his friends of another smooth shortstop from the Dominican Republic: Felix Fermin, whose nickname was El Gato, Spanish for the Cat. A nickname was born for Valdez: El Gatito � the Kitten. Wilson Valdez was hitting .198 for the Indians� Class AAA affiliate when the Mets obtained him.�I�m proud of it,� Valdez said. That moniker has followed Valdez from stop to stop over a long and, for the most part, undistinguished professional career, which has taken him to the Mets after a trade with Cleveland on Tuesday. Playing in 111 games for four teams � he has been a member of 10 organizations � Valdez has a lifetime .211 batting average with one home run. He has not played in the major leagues since 2007. But he has relished the role of El Gatito throughout, filling in capably for the injured Rafael Furcal in 2007. The Mets acquired Valdez, who was hitting .198 for the Indians� Class AAA affiliate, for a similar reason. �I know my strength is defense, and I know they needed a middle infielder,� the 31-year-old Valdez said before Wednesday�s game against the Washington Nationals. �I�m just happy to do whatever I can for the team.� How long Valdez remains with the Mets is linked to the returns of Alex Cora (thumb ligament) and Jose Reyes (tendinitis behind the right calf) from the disabled list. The Mets are optimistic that both players will return as soon their stays are scheduled to end: June 2 for Cora and June 5 for Reyes. As it happens, the Mets� need for a capable middle infielder is far less dire than it was just last Friday, when Ramon Martinez had his second two-error game in two starts. Martinez and Luis Castillo have developed continuity up the middle, and Manager Jerry Manuel said he probably will not start Valdez until Saturday afternoon against the Florida Marlins. �Those guys are now playing very well in the middle, and I�d like to keep them out there,� Manuel said. �I don�t feel as if we have to find out at this point� about Valdez. Manuel added: �From what I understand, he�s a very good defensive player. Looking at his bio, he has some history of hitting a little bit, and there�s been some history where he hasn�t hit.� That bio includes playing in South Korea and Japan in 2008. Much to his dismay, in January 2008 the Los Angeles Dodgers sold him to the Kia Tigers, and he played four months in Korea before joining the Yakult Swallows. His wife, Kamie, and son, Wilson, spent much of the year at their home in Albuquerque. �It was uncomfortable going so far away when it wasn�t my choice,� Valdez said. �I�m much happier back here playing in the United States.�Your contract can be sold overseas without your approval? If I was a woman I would use Yakult Swallows as my porn star name. duan May 28 2009 10:39 AM I know I've gone on about it in the past but I can NEVER understand how people are so morally ambivalent about the way the whole contract system in MLB is from an ethical standpoint, and yeah I know the guys at the top get loads of money, but that doesn't make it ok. Edgy DC May 28 2009 10:45 AM Yeah, I'm saying more or less the same. I think it's part ignorance and part petty jealousy. ("They get played to play baseball! Why should they complain if they get traded?") Curt Flood is a hero, and it needs to be remembered that his initial objection wasn't over salary but getting traded. duan May 28 2009 10:48 AM yeah, I know you have been banging the same drum. Edgy DC May 28 2009 11:35 AM I also want to add that fan criticism of players like Peavy or Barry Larkin who exercise hard-won rights to refuse trade assignments is woefully misplaced. As is criticism of J.D. Drew for not wanting to sign with the team who drafted him. metsguyinmichigan May 28 2009 01:44 PM I think we sold Felix Millan's contract to a Japanese team when they broke up the team in the 1970s. TheOldMole May 28 2009 03:10 PM This is my beef with the union. They seem to be all about protecting the superstars, not the little guy. Edgy DC May 28 2009 06:55 PM Explicitly un-interested in expanding to include minor leaguers. Willets Point May 28 2009 08:27 PM The first thing that I thought when I saw the subject was that John Rocker was moving. Then again, he'd probably just shoot the kitten. Rockin' Doc May 28 2009 08:53 PM A kitten would be safe with Rocker, he appears rather fond of them. It's people, particularly those that aren't like him, that Rocker doesn't seem to like. themetfairy May 28 2009 08:57 PM Triple Dee May 29 2009 04:44 AM Re: Kitten for Sale ="soupcan":1vjgs45i]="Edgy DC":1vjgs45i]Your contract can be sold overseas without your approval?[/quote:1vjgs45i] Didn't the Mets do that with someone...? Matt Franco maybe?[/quote:1vjgs45i] Kyle Kendrick thought it happened to him once.

Murphy - 3.25 Santana - 2.5 Sheffield - 2 Rodriguez - .75 Pagan - .5 Parnell - .5 Putz - .5