Elster88

Urbina Speaks. CARACAS, Venezuela -- Staring at the prison bars in front of him, Ugueth Urbina says he can't help but think about his mother being held hostage by kidnappers only a year ago. For more than five months she was captive in a remote camp in the southern mountains near Colombia, some 300 miles from Venezuela's capital. Bandits, disguised as police, stole her away from Urbina's ranch, then demanded $6 million for her release. Pay it, they warned the veteran major-league pitcher, or he would never see her again. It's been 10 months since a squad of Venezuelan anti-kidnapping police, in a heroic rescue mission, traveled through thick jungle terrain before eventually killing one of her abductors, capturing four more and freeing Urbina's mother. ESPN In prison awaiting trial for attempted murder, Ugueth Urbina says he feel like he's being extorted for money.Now, Urbina says, he wonders when he'll hear the price tag placed on his freedom. Since early November, Urbina has spent his days and nights in a prison in Los Teques, on the outskirts of Caracas, where he awaits his trial on a charge of attempted murder. On Oct. 15, two weeks after Major League Baseball's regular season ended, there was a bloody episode at Urbina's ranch. Five ranch hands, employees of Urbina for only a month, claim that Urbina and several of his friends attacked them after falsely accusing them of taking a pistol from his home. One suffered machete wounds to his shoulders, back and hands. Two others suffered severe burns and accuse Urbina of ordering his friends to set them on fire. "I love my country, but here, there are people that love money," Urbina told ESPN in an exclusive interview from his jail cell. "What do they gain from this? They say that it was me so that they can get money, you understand? These are people that live simply, let's say. So by them saying it was me, they could somehow gain and take money from all of this." He added: "I'm trying to find a solution to this problem and clear my name as much as possible so that people can see I had nothing to do with this problem." Urbina's family has been the target of thieves and kidnappers before. In an 11-year major league career, Urbina has made more than $25 million in salary. Drug lords tried to extort $6 million of it with his mother's kidnapping. A decade before, his father was murdered while fending off a robbery attack. Now, if convicted of the attack, Urbina could face 10 years in a Venezuelan prison. But Urbina's arrest, says one of his accusers, is not an elaborate extortion plot. "What we want is justice, for him to pay with jail time," said Ricardo Osal, who needed 300 stitches to close wounds on his back and another 150 to repair severed tendons in his hands. "We're not looking for any type of financial arrangement. Nothing that has anything to do with money. We don't want them to offer us any money and we're not asking them for any money." An Unforgettable Party According to accounts of the incident, here's what is known. Around noon on Saturday, Oct. 15, Urbina and his son drove up to his ranch, located in Valles del Tuy, 30 miles southeast of Caracas. In addition to the family's adjacent construction-supply business, the journeyman pitcher raised cattle with the help of a handful of employees. Upon his arrival, he found some of his employees swimming in the pool. There were approximately 10 people, and they had brought two cases of beer and several bottles of liquor. Vinkler Gallegos, one of the employees, told authorities that seeing Urbina reminded him of the Florida Marlins cap he had kept for the moment when he would have the chance to ask his idol to sign it. After fraternizing with the men and women in the pool, Urbina left, returning later at midnight with five friends. What happened next is in dispute. According to Jose Luis Tamayo, Urbina's attorney, alcohol consumption led to an altercation. "He tried to calm things down," Tamayo said. But Gallegos tells a different story. The 20-year-old farmhand said he woke up on Sunday morning with several injuries. So did Osal, Argenis Farias, Mickel�n Echenique, Tony Rodriguez, Bernardo Navarros, Jonathan Duarte and four others who claim they were attacked. ESPN Bernardo Navarros says he was burned by Ugueth Urbina and his friends.According to Venezuelan Police's forensic report: � Navarro had burns on 50 percent of his body. � Osal had injuries on his shoulder, hands and back, as well as burns on his face and blood clots in his eyes. � Rodriguez had burns on his neck and in his right ear, injuries to his face and both eyes, a knife cut on his right arm and a perforated eardrum. � Gallegos had bruises on his face and ribs. � Farias had fractures in his nose and cheekbone. � Echenique had minor injuries and several contusions. "He told us he was going to kill us and bury us underneath the ranch," Osal told ESPN. "After he gave me the last machete chop, he said to leave me there alone because I was going to die on the ground bleeding like a pig. 'This one is dead,' he said. 'This one's a cadaver. He'll be the first one we'll bury beneath the ranch.'" Said Tamayo: "If you believe the testimony of the victims, it's unexplainable why Ugueth Urbina did not kill these people, because he had ample opportunity, according to their testimony." According to the accusers' statements, Urbina and his friends attacked them after he discovered several personal items, including a gun, were missing. "He hit us in a brutal manner, and he told us that if we pressed charges, he would kill our families," Osal said. Rodriguez said three of the victims were tortured by Urbina, who ordered his friends to set on them fire using a variety of flammable liquids, including paint thinner and gasoline. They were allowed, he said, to dive into the pool to extinguish the flames. Navarro and Duarte were hospitalized for several days after the incident. Navarro said Urbina sprayed him with fuel, then set him on fire with a match. Investigators arrived at Urbina's property on Sunday morning after receiving a phone call, apparently from a girlfriend of one of the victims. The woman says she, too, was tortured, and then locked in a room with a minor, who was slapped several times that night. The minor, whose identity is being protected by Venezuelan authorities, said that before the police arrived, Urbina was kind to him, as if nothing had happened. Urbina even offered him a towel and asked him to make some coffee. From his jail cell, Urbina disputes the allegations. "Those people started drinking from 3 in the afternoon, and it was almost midnight when this happened. You can imagine how inebriated these people were," he said. "When I woke up the next morning I was surprised that the police were there, telling me there was some sort of problem the night before. I told them, 'As far as I know, there has been no problem here.'" The Morning After By the next morning, the story was on the front page of every newspaper in Venezuela. Images of the injured workers were shown on television-news shows. Theories abound about what might have happened on the ranch. Ariel Prat, president of the Caracas Lions, the Venezuelan team that Urbina plays for during offseasons from the majors, said he doesn't believe what he has read in the papers. AP Photo Since helping the Marlins to a World Series title in 2003, Ugueth Urbina has been faced with off-the-field trouble."The story describes a monster, and that doesn't fit with Ugueth," Prat said. "It is hard for me to believe in the whole incident, like the press described it. I never saw him lose his head in that way. He is tough; he never folded against pressure. He has always had his feet on the ground." But this isn't the first time that Urbina has been accused of violence. In 2004, Urbina was briefly imprisoned along with a friend for firing a gun while under the influence of alcohol on a street in Caracas. Four years earlier, when the relief pitcher played for the Expos, he was accused of assaulting a man in a Montreal night club. He has had three other run-ins with Venezuelan police, two for allegedly fighting and another for a traffic incident, in which the pitcher's car ran over an old man. All three cases were resolved out of court. "What I know is, I don't think Ugueth's a murderer," said Ozzie Guillen, Chicago White Sox manager and a Venezuelan. Guillen was a coach and Urbina a pitcher for the 2003 World Champion Miami Marlins. "The people in the United States think Ugie tied these guys up, put gas on them and lit them on fire," Guillen said. "No, I know that's not true. These were people who got on fire, but they were fighting, the same people fighting each other." Awaiting Resolution The prosecuting attorney in charge of the case did not immediately ask for Urbina's incarceration. Family members of the injured employees claim the police did not take the incident seriously, which is why they went to the National Guard, a wing of the Venezuelan military. ESPN Ugueth Urbina has struggled to answer the many questions surrounding what happened at his ranch on Oct. 15.It wasn't until Nov. 7, more than three weeks after the alleged incident, that Urbina was eventually arrested. He said he never considered leaving the country: "I came to give face. Everything will be cleared in the future." More than a month later, he's still awaiting his trial. When exonerated, he said, he plans to leave Venezuela and move to the United States. "I've had two experiences, with my mother and this one. It's like someone is telling me to live in another place," he told ESPN. "After this, once everything is cleared up, I have my house in Miami. I'll probably come on vacation, one week, maybe two weeks, to see my family. But I think I'm going to take residence in Miami."

We've already discussed this one on the old forum, but I noticed another reason why it's by far the best of the bunch: Lucas gets neither screenplay nor directing credit.

I started a new thread for this post, but it really isn't worthy of it's own thread. I'm sticking it here because sometimes you get good things out of what seems like a horrible idea or your second and third choices: I found that thread that I was searching for: My point here is not that the Red Sox make dumb moves, just that they have had a good deal of luck to help them get where they are, as many other winners will have luck. And someone who switches allegiance and claims it's because the organization is much smarter needs a dose of reality. Condensed the thread: I like the Red Sox, but the idea that they are geniuses in putting a team together and are what every organization should aspire to is kind of silly. They are a good team, obviously, but it's not like their moves put the Mets to shame. (from a Sports Guy article in the middle of the 2004 WS, I added the bracketed text): You need a little luck to get this far. Consider the things that didn't happen for the Sox in the past 24 months: 1.) The A-Rod deal fell through; 2.) Millar's Japan deal fell through; 3.) The Expos told them that they didn't have enough to get Vazquez, so they turned to Plan B (Schilling); 4.) The Yankees trumped them for Contreras; 5.) Nomar turned down two different extensions in 2003; 6.) Anyone could have claimed [2004 WS MVP] Manny off waivers this winter; 7.) They almost traded D-Lowe for Loiaza before the Yankees trumped their bid; and 8.) They probably wouldn't have gotten Cabrera if Nomar hadn't sulked throughout that 13-inning game at Yankee Stadium, turning public sentiment against him just enough so they could eventually trade him without causing a riot. JUST LIKE THEO DREW IT UP! Added by another poster: Don't forget their signing of Jeremy Giambi in 2003 (.696 OPS), who was supposed to be their full-time DH until Ortiz (a front-office afterthought) took over the job. Or that they failed to lock up Pedro when they had the chance (what would their season have looked like this year with Petey on the hill instead of Wade Miller & Jeremy Gonzalez?). Or that Tito keeps playing a weak-hitting, poor defensive first baseman (.759 OPS in 433 AB) while Olerud (.858 OPS in 151 AB) and Petagine (.799 OPS and only 39 AB) languish on the bench. (Mientkiewicz--.735 OPS--and a good defender) Or that they clearly signed the wrong shortstop, locking up a .704 OPS man with 29 errors for four years and $40M. (K-Mat last year: .727 OPS & 23 errors, signed for 3 years & $20.1M ). Back to Elster: And let's not forget the David Wells signing. This slob get signed (and Pedro is turned loose because he is going downhill and too expensive?!?!), and this is the organization that puts the Mets to shame? Again....the Red Sox have a shiny WS trophy to their credit and are regular post-season attendees. How can I bash them? I'M NOT. Merely pointing out that their supposed genius may not be all that's it's cracked up to be, or that they may not be so far superior to other teams out there. Of course, I'm sure you'll all see my hidden agenda: To single out and direct my ire at anyone who dares to bash the Mets.

]Just reading the CPF and the dailies, I thought he was being hailed as the new King Jesus for a small-sample blip on the radar. I remember events differently. Personally, I went the entire year bashing people for saying that Minky's defense would offset what we didn't get from Delgado's bat. There was also an entire thread devoted to comparing their numbers throughout the year, which clearly highlighted what we were missing. Perhaps your memory is selective? Nah, didn't think so.

]How come I've got to come up with new material, btw, yet everyone else can just blather and repeat and blather some more without your getting on their cases, Elster? Obviously you don't read many of my posts. I get on everyone's case equally. You're assuming I single you out. Perhaps you're incorrect that I'm getting on your case simply because you bash the Mets? Nah, didn't think so.

]Opting for him over Delgado as 2004's firstbaseman This did not happen. ] (and don't let anyone try to tell you the Mets couldn't have signed Carlos a year ago if they'd had a clue between them, or a testicle) while signing Pedro and Beltran is the clearest sign of the Mets having their heads up their asses You went away for three months, don't you have anything new to say?

Love that pic of the '99 infield, and that Olerud has his helmet on. I wonder if he even owned a cap.

Rockin' Doc wrote: That bench could use a left handed power threat. Tike Redman and John Valentin don't offer much power from either side of the plate. I think too much of this is made sometimes. We didn't have a left-handed power threat on the bench last year and the bench had one of the greatest "bench seasons" of all time, I think. Woody and Castro, just off the top of my head, had game winning homers, even if Castro's was as a starter. Both of those guys are coming back. Now we add Valentin who has power. Lefty vs righty may not be such a big difference. Put a guy up there who can hit a double and hope for the best if nothing else.

*sigh* Asking for a response, even as persistently as I do, is NOT the same as saying he's a fraud of a writer or whatever it is you say. I have no personal problems with him, and I seriously doubt that I ever will. I only disagree vehemently with some of the things he says, and hope he'll stand up for what he is saying by responding to a very fair yet difficult question. I think the difference between that and "personal problems" is obvious. I also think that a discussion of who has a problem with who is stupid.

Johnny Dickshot wrote: I was only pointing out that while Mark is quick to defend himself against those questioning his integrity here, he and his partner have dished out even cheaper shots in their own work. Any comments?

And a nude scene for Maria Bello.

Edgy DC wrote: II don't remember or understand, "ARod is a cooler." This is a line my [normally] intelligent Met-fan buddy laid on me as the reason why he wouldn't want on the Mets. A cooler is a guy who drains the surrounding area of luck and success. His opinion was based on the success of Seattle and Texas after ARod's departure, and the failure of the teams he has played on to win a WS. I went on a rant about this right on the CPF after the MVP award was announced because it was incomprehensible to me. I am NOT attributing it to anyone on this or any other Met board.

That's the second worst argument ever. The worst is that ARod is a cooler.

Nor I. I don't think you should be surprised [that your memory is saying no one wanted Tejada on the old ezBoard], Yancy. Most of the old-timers still don't seem to want Tejada if they can keep Jose Reyes at short instead.

From this quote: "We put in so much work here," Minaya said, "over the next week or so, things will come out." the Newsday correspondent comes up with the headline: "Not Ready to Stop: Minaya hints about making more big moves after adding reserves Valentin and Franco." Newsday SUCKS!!!

Hopefully Diaz will not be patrolling right when Pinball Alley is constructed.

]This is not a personal affront, just the way I feel. My opinion. I respect yours. I simply disagree. Same.

]He's fucking Roger Clemens, that's why. I agree completely, though I prefer Roger Fucking Clemens.

Zvon wrote: ="Elster88"] When I read lines like this, Sal's complaint---that fans get too attached to their guys at the expense of the overall quality of their team---rings true. Talk to me again when Reyes is no longer on the up quality side of the equation. Right now your just blowin wind. Then I can talk to you right now, because he's not on the upside of quality to what I am comparing him too (Tejada). I want to improve the quality of the team by getting Tejada.

]Reyes is my shortstop. Im not interested in any other. Not even a better shortstop. I want to take the ride this guy provides, come hell or high water, at this point in time. ]If he comes up lame next season (or the season after that..), or really blows chunks as far as playing the game, I can change my opinion. So he's your shortstop, come hell or high water....OR loss of ability. Do you see how ridiculously those two quotes contradict each other? You're saying he's your guy no matter what. And then in the next line you basically say "unless he sucks." That's basically what I'm saying. He's my guy, unless I can get something much better. You're saying you refuse to replace him unless he doesn't perform at certain level. That is not saying you like him. That is saying you like his playing ability. You're not any more attached to him than I am.

]Reyes is my shortstop. Im not interested in any other. Not even a better shortstop. I want to take the ride this guy provides, come hell or high water, at this point in time. When I read lines like this, Sal's complaint---that fans get too attached to their guys at the expense of the overall quality of their team---rings true.

metirish wrote: ]Who, after the scene when he headlocked Zimmer, didnt have anything but ill will for Martinez? And talk about a guy with a rep as a headhunter. That never bothered me at all Me neither. Asshead is in a ballpark of anger and disgust of his own.

Nymr83 wrote: Elster, don't insult real reporters by calling him one. He is a real reporter. He uses unnamed sources and brags about his trips to baseball's winter meetings. Just like the guys in the Daily News! Seriously, though, I don't have a major problem with Mr. Healey. I don't want to disparage him the way you seem to, Nymr. He comes off as a pompous ass when he talks about his connections, but I can be an ass myself. The main problem I have is with the times when he goes on and on about reporters being unwilling to fudge facts or move quotes to support their positions...and how dreadfully insulting it is to him personally to insinuate such about one of his brethren. That's what I keep harping on. That and how he gets overly sensitive when someone is critical of what he posts (when he's posting them while asking for discussion and critique). You seem to dislike the man. I don't dislike him, I dislike the (directly above) message. Just want to clarify that.

Love the throwaway marathon line at the bottom. LOL.

Ah I said that funny. What I meant was, it is not criminal to not take a look at Tejada, but it should be done to some degree. To not explore all avenues is stupid. I got the group backwards...shouldn't be the anti-trade, home grown crowd, but the pro trade, TITTS crowd. Fixing.