Frayed Knot

I believe the most ridiculous statement of the month contest already has a winner.

Nats had a chance to ruin it - had the sacks loaded w/2 outs in the 8th - but Adam Dunn K'd on a borderline pitch that would have tied the score if it went the other way (and given RJ an ND in the process). Then the Nats pen followed the script by giving up several more runs in top 9 and #300 was sealed.

Unit goes 6 innings of 1-run/2-hit ball. Leaves after that (possibly for an injury) leading 2-1 And, yeah, it's raining.

]I'm with FK on the odds of this working out for Pittsburgh. But hell, if you're going nowhere, might as well pan for gold, right? That's essentially what they've been doing for the last year or so; going for decent up-side, though hardly guaranteed prospects - Jose Tabata as the main bait for Nady - Andy LaRoche for Bay - and now Gorkys Hernandez for McLouth plus some spare pitching parts thrown in on the side. If they all live up to their potential things could work out real nice for them. If not ... One thing they will have if/when Gorkys comes up is a nice relay team in their outfield: McCutchon, Morgan & Hernandez They might have a HR total for the season that's in single digits but they'll probably save a bunch of runs.

MFS62 wrote: ="Fman99"]Sean Green has another encouraging inning. He thrives with the mop. I remember listening to Howard Cosell giving the out of town scoreboard. Whe he got to the Braves' game he said (a close paraphrase), "The Braves must have given up on winning this one. Ron Piche is in the game." I get that same feeling when I see Sean Green coming in out of the bullpen. Later Don't look now, but Green has given up 1 run over his last 8 outings (6.1 IP) on 5 hits, 2 BBs & 7 Ks. Or you can continue to label guys as lifelong failures based on 5 weeks or so of pitching. Your call.

]That's the thing with McLouth -- he's a bit overrated. He's good, but not really great. But legitimately good especially when you factor in 27 y/o and under team control for a while. Yeah, he's not really a superstar and ideally shouldn't be playing CF (despite his gold glove last year) - but compared to what Atlanta's been trotting out in CF this season: .198/.298/.271 with 2 HRs & 8 RBIs!! it's a huge upgrade (ditto when compared to Melky/Gardener). I mean, jeez, Atlanta pitchers have knocked in 6 in barely half the ABs. Braves, meanwhile, have re-demoted Jordan Schaefer and his 2 Ks/game bat. ]As for McLouth, I don't think it was a lack of money so much as the right trade at the right time ... I want this trade to break for the Buccos, but I think it has a good chance of doing that. I dunno. I'd opt for fair chance at best. Morton's already 25 and crashed in his not-so-brief trial last season. Doesn't mean he's destined to failure but I don't think he's a real high-upside guy. Hernandez is supposedly your classic speedy/slappy CF-type w/lots of speed and a real good glove but almost no power. Sounds like a guy who'll live or die on his OBP. He also sounds like a lesser version of their own prospect Andrew McCutcheon who the trade supposedly cleared room for. Locke is in Low-A ball. ]I think the Mets should sign Glavine just to aggravate everyone. That's the front office's main goal right?

Well it turns out that they'll play an old-fashioned "twi-night" DH today with Unit going in game 1. But I don't care what the circumstances were, four hours is way beyond reasonable for a game to be called. Especially when you see films of water pouring into dugouts like the stadium had been transported to Niagra.

Washington must have sold a bunch of tickets for this potential milestone because it's been raining all night and now, more than 3 hours past the scheduled game time, they still haven't called the game nor do they have a target time for first pitch!!

ESPN: Atlanta gave up outfielder Gorkys Hernandez, one of their top prospects, along with pitchers Charlie Morton and Jeff Locke. Maybe those guys are good, but they have better prospects in both the OF & pitching. [to replace Glavine], the Braves called up highly touted prospect Tommy Hanson, who has dominated at Triple-A Gwinnett and will make his first major league appearance Saturday against the Milwaukee Brewers. The minor league blogosphere has been saying that Hanson has been overdue for weeks now. Another plus: McLouth is under contract through at least 2011, having signed a three-year, $15.75 contract in spring training. The deal includes a team option for a fourth year at $10.65 million, with a $1.25 million buyout. So if Pittsburgh can't afford him who can they afford? By trading McLouth, Pittsburgh cleared a spot for one of its best prospects, 2005 first-round pick Andrew McCutchen. The 22-year-old outfielder was called up from Triple-A Indianapolis, where he was hitting .303 with four homers, 20 RBIs and 10 stolen bases. So why not him AND McLouth? "When we signed Nate to a long-term contract, we did so with the intent on having him remain part of our core of homegrown talent. said GM Huntington -- But the quality and quantity of talent we are receiving in this trade moves us closer to our goal of building that sustainable championship-caliber club." I hope they're right. If so it'll be the first time in a long while.

="G-Fafif":pjxua9lt]="Frayed Knot":pjxua9lt]What that team really needs is hitting outfielders.[/quote:pjxua9lt] And they got one, according to Adam Rubin[/url:pjxua9lt], in the person of Nate McLouth.[/quote:pjxua9lt] Holy Shite ... I didn't mean THAT quickly!! It kind of helps us out for tomorrow but that's a major pickup for los Bravos. I can't believe Pitt dealt him. He just turned 27 and, unlike last year with Nady & Bay, is still a couple years away from FA-gency. I hope they got themselves a good return. If nothing else it'll piss off Francesa who declared McLouth to be "the perfect Yanqui" on numerous occasions last year. IOW, he's a young, under control All-Star who plays the one place the MFYs don't have a star so I suppose he figured it was inevitable that he be picking up his mail in the Bronx before long. Frayed Knot Jun 03 2009 08:20 PM ESPN: Atlanta gave up outfielder Gorkys Hernandez, one of their top prospects, along with pitchers Charlie Morton and Jeff Locke. Maybe those guys are good, but they have better prospects in both the OF & pitching. [to replace Glavine], the Braves called up highly touted prospect Tommy Hanson, who has dominated at Triple-A Gwinnett and will make his first major league appearance Saturday against the Milwaukee Brewers. The minor league blogosphere has been saying that Hanson has been overdue for weeks now. Another plus: McLouth is under contract through at least 2011, having signed a three-year, $15.75 contract in spring training. The deal includes a team option for a fourth year at $10.65 million, with a $1.25 million buyout. So if Pittsburgh can't afford him who can they afford? By trading McLouth, Pittsburgh cleared a spot for one of its best prospects, 2005 first-round pick Andrew McCutchen. The 22-year-old outfielder was called up from Triple-A Indianapolis, where he was hitting .303 with four homers, 20 RBIs and 10 stolen bases. So why not him AND McLouth? "When we signed Nate to a long-term contract, we did so with the intent on having him remain part of our core of homegrown talent. said GM Huntington -- But the quality and quantity of talent we are receiving in this trade moves us closer to our goal of building that sustainable championship-caliber club." I hope they're right. If so it'll be the first time in a long while. metsguyinmichigan Jun 03 2009 08:35 PM If we signed Glavine, I'd be devastated, not disappointed. Edgy DC Jun 03 2009 09:40 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jun 04 2009 05:33 AM I think we're buying into Cerrone's foolery by even reacting to his speculation. As for McLouth, I don't think it was a lack of money so much as the right trade at the right time. Somewhere on your block is a dork getting his ass kicked in fantasy baseball but certain that his day will come because he has Gorkys Hernandez down on his virtual farm. Morton can step into a rotation now (the Braves had him filling a spot) and has done well at AAA. I can't telll you anything to get excited about Locke, but he was a second rounder. Obviously I want this trade to break for the Buccos, but I think it has a good chance of doing that. John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 04 2009 04:55 AM ="Frayed Knot":37edpb1t]="G-Fafif":37edpb1t]="Frayed Knot":37edpb1t]What that team really needs is hitting outfielders.[/quote:37edpb1t] And they got one, according to Adam Rubin[/url:37edpb1t], in the person of Nate McLouth.[/quote:37edpb1t] Holy Shite ... I didn't mean THAT quickly!! It kind of helps us out for tomorrow but that's a major pickup for los Bravos. I can't believe Pitt dealt him. He just turned 27 and, unlike last year with Nady & Bay, is still a couple years away from FA-gency. I hope they got themselves a good return. If nothing else it'll piss off Francesa who declared McLouth to be "the perfect Yanqui" on numerous occasions last year. IOW, he's a young, under control All-Star who plays the one place the MFYs don't have a star so I suppose he figured it was inevitable that he be picking up his mail in the Bronx before long.[/quote:37edpb1t] That's the thing with McLouth -- he's a bit overrated. He's good, but not really great. Rotblatt Jun 04 2009 06:49 AM Re: Pitching News ="Willets Point":1znihsau]="bmfc1":1znihsau]Second, the Braves released Glavine. In one of the stranger comments I've read of late, Cerrone writes: "� i shutter to say this, but, the Mets need a starting pitcher, and he always had a strong relationship with Omar Minaya and Jeff Wilpon�"[/quote:1znihsau] ::twitch:: ::twitch::[/quote:1znihsau] Indeed. If we're going to bring on aged superstars, I'd rather sign Petey. Benjamin Grimm Jun 04 2009 06:58 AM Yes, but I think the Mets should sign Glavine just to aggravate everyone. HahnSolo Jun 04 2009 07:30 AM Has anyone seen, or commented on this, from Adam Rubin: ]After struggles in 8th inning continue, Mets drop J.J. Putz 7th inning BY Adam Rubin DAILY NEWS SPORTS WRITER Thursday, June 4th 2009, 4:00 AM PITTSBURGH - Jerry Manuel met with J.J. Putz Wednesday and informed the ex-Mariners closer that he was being moved from an eighth-inning to seventh-inning role until he can rediscover his form. Putz was the primary culprit in a five-run eighth inning Monday night that resulted in the Mets' second loss in 22 games in which they led with sixouts to go. He will be replaced by rookie Bobby Parnell as the primary set-up man. Manuel described the move as temporary. "I watched some film today, and we think we've found a pretty big, glaring mechanical flaw that's kind of slowly progressed, maybe even through last year," Putz said. "I think we're going in the right direction." As for a lesser role, Putz added: "When you get into those pressure-packed situations, you really don't have a chance to work on anything. All you're really trying to do is figure a way to get somebody out. Maybe, by taking a step back, you're allowed to kind of pitch with a clear head and really think about what you're doing as opposed to just trying to think about getting a guy out." I like it in concept. I just dislike how they continue to try to define undefinable roles like "7th inning guy" or "8th inning guy". Benjamin Grimm Jun 04 2009 07:39 AM I agree. I approve of the demotion but not of the distinction. Hopefully more Mets starters will be completing the 7th inning. Frayed Knot Jun 04 2009 07:43 AM ]That's the thing with McLouth -- he's a bit overrated. He's good, but not really great. But legitimately good especially when you factor in 27 y/o and under team control for a while. Yeah, he's not really a superstar and ideally shouldn't be playing CF (despite his gold glove last year) - but compared to what Atlanta's been trotting out in CF this season: .198/.298/.271 with 2 HRs & 8 RBIs!! it's a huge upgrade (ditto when compared to Melky/Gardener). I mean, jeez, Atlanta pitchers have knocked in 6 in barely half the ABs. Braves, meanwhile, have re-demoted Jordan Schaefer and his 2 Ks/game bat. ]As for McLouth, I don't think it was a lack of money so much as the right trade at the right time ... I want this trade to break for the Buccos, but I think it has a good chance of doing that. I dunno. I'd opt for fair chance at best. Morton's already 25 and crashed in his not-so-brief trial last season. Doesn't mean he's destined to failure but I don't think he's a real high-upside guy. Hernandez is supposedly your classic speedy/slappy CF-type w/lots of speed and a real good glove but almost no power. Sounds like a guy who'll live or die on his OBP. He also sounds like a lesser version of their own prospect Andrew McCutcheon who the trade supposedly cleared room for. Locke is in Low-A ball. ]I think the Mets should sign Glavine just to aggravate everyone. That's the front office's main goal right? John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 04 2009 07:55 AM I predict PNC will soon be known as Gorkys Park. MFS62 Jun 04 2009 08:11 AM When I heard "Morton" I immediately thought it was this guy: http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/m/mortoca01.shtml And wondered how the Braves were still able to trade him. Later LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 04 2009 08:39 AM ="Frayed Knot"]]That's the thing with McLouth -- he's a bit overrated. He's good, but not really great. But legitimately good especially when you factor in 27 y/o and under team control for a while. Yeah, he's not really a superstar and ideally shouldn't be playing CF (despite his gold glove last year) - but compared to what Atlanta's been trotting out in CF this season: .198/.298/.271 with 2 HRs & 8 RBIs!! it's a huge upgrade (ditto when compared to Melky/Gardener). I mean, jeez, Atlanta pitchers have knocked in 6 in barely half the ABs. Braves, meanwhile, have re-demoted Jordan Schaefer and his 2 Ks/game bat. He's got significant power (ISOs of .210-.220 the last two years) that's just starting to develop. He's got decent plate awareness and patience (a rising walk rate that's just a shade above 11 percent). He plays a credible-- if not "Gold Glove"-quality-- outfield. And he runs a bit, with good baserunning instincts (20 steals each of the past two years, with a lifetime 93 percent rate). In essence, he'll be a poor man's-- maybe "homeless man's" would be more accurate-- Beltran for them. I'm with FK on the odds of this working out for Pittsburgh. But hell, if you're going nowhere, might as well pan for gold, right? Edgy DC Jun 04 2009 08:41 AM Well, in cases like Aramis Ramirez, sometimes the Pirates haven't known that the pan itself was golden, but I'm still hopeful. metirish Jun 04 2009 08:50 AM ="John Cougar Lunchbucket":3c1ay6lb]I predict PNC will soon be known as Gorkys Park.[/quote:3c1ay6lb] Love it....his at bat music should be the whistling from "Winds of Change" G-Fafif Jun 04 2009 12:48 PM ="metirish":2oy3itk5]="John Cougar Lunchbucket":2oy3itk5]I predict PNC will soon be known as Gorkys Park.[/quote:2oy3itk5] Love it....his at bat music should be the whistling from "Winds of Change"[/quote:2oy3itk5] But will he rock Pittsburgh like a hurricane? Frayed Knot Jun 04 2009 01:22 PM ]I'm with FK on the odds of this working out for Pittsburgh. But hell, if you're going nowhere, might as well pan for gold, right? That's essentially what they've been doing for the last year or so; going for decent up-side, though hardly guaranteed prospects - Jose Tabata as the main bait for Nady - Andy LaRoche for Bay - and now Gorkys Hernandez for McLouth plus some spare pitching parts thrown in on the side. If they all live up to their potential things could work out real nice for them. If not ... One thing they will have if/when Gorkys comes up is a nice relay team in their outfield: McCutchon, Morgan & Hernandez They might have a HR total for the season that's in single digits but they'll probably save a bunch of runs.

Bringing back Glavine was sort of a fail-safe for the Braves this year. But seeing as how their question-mark guys are working out decently (Jurrgens - Kamakami), and their main minor league guy (Tommy Hansen) is thriving and probably due for a call-up soon, there was no pressing need to try to work Glavine in. What that team really needs is hitting outfielders. Suxx for him that he's not going to go out on his own terms but thems the breaks. And, no, I don't expect Omar to give him a call. I'd sooner bring back Pedro at this point.

Why limit the boo-boos to only the major league crew? BA: The Mets placed high Class A St. Lucie shortstop Reese Havens on the disabled list retroactive to May 31.

G-Fafif wrote: Cora! Cora! Cora! (If he were an MFY, I assume Sterling would be all over that one.) He could combine that call with the one where he drops A-Bombs on Matsui and we'd all be partying like it's 1945

I can barely keep up with this crap anymore and what mentions there are of this stuff here is buried inside several threads: - Jose Reyes suffered a setback with his right calf when discomfort returned. Reyes was forced to leave an extended spring training game Wednesday after his second at-bat. He's headed to New York to be seen by team doctors Thursday. - Ryan Church played an uneventful six innings and is on target to return Sunday as scheduled when he's eligible. - Ramon Martinez has a fracture in his left pinkie and will require surgery. He'll be prevented from doing any baseball activities for six weeks. All the above from Adam Rubin's blog. AR also had a 3:17 announcement that Beltran would again miss tonight's game ... and then checked back in 20 minutes later to say that Carlos declared himself healthy (skinny, but healthy - as the result of 5 or more pounds lost) enough to play And that Emil Brown is now a NYMet as a result of R Martinez going on the DL That's all for now ... or at least until someone gets hurt during warmups.

I heard this on the radio this morning. Sterling is just so fired up to go into his schtick that it's usually only coincidental if he also happens to call the game correctly

I don't get overly jazzed up about "counting number" stats either ... mainly I just wanted to get the joke about the Nationals in. Hell, I used a variation of the same one almost 30 years ago when Len Barker tossed a perfect game against the then-pathetic Blue Jays (I recycle more than Al Gore). But I also wanted to acknowledge the (potential) feat and, like JCL, I'll tip my hat to the guy for hanging around and succeeding as long as he did. He's a guy who was MUCH better in his mid/late 30s than he was in his mid/late 20s and even as little as two or three years ago I thought he was going to come up short. I won't have to hang on every pitch (he'll probably be 3 or more innings gone from the game if/when the Giants win anyway) to appreciate the accomplishment. His will also be the last one for a while. Even Moyer's recent 250th will hold up for some time.

That Haddix game btw (as noted in that song's lyrics) was 50 years ago last week and so SI ran an article on it in their recent edition. The 13th inning started with an infield error. Braves then had [u:2f3ag2k4]Eddie Mathews[/u:2f3ag2k4]! bunt the runner over. Aaron was IW'd. Adcock then HR'd but touched 3rd before Aaron did and therefore was declared out and only one run scored. Several future Mets were involved: - starting with Haddix himself, he coached for a brief time - Felix Mantilla hit the bouncer that Pitt 3B Don Hoak threw away for an error - Joe Christopher was the RF who watched Joe Adcock's HR sail over his head

... against the Nationals tonight. I'm kind of thinking that if he gets it there should be an asterisk.

="John Cougar Lunchbucket":v2sd7py3]Old footage tho -- Romero still pitching for the Red Sox.[/quote:v2sd7py3] Back before his P.E.D.'s and when he still sucked. And it was back before Pedroia forgot how to shave. And, presumably though we didn't see him, when Papi could still hit. MFS62 Jun 03 2009 08:32 AM I find it funny that this thread is right over the one called "Belly Aches" on the forum list. Cause/effect? Later LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 03 2009 08:55 AM Crap. Now I want a slice.

]The thing about Martin, like Pete Rose, he gets plently of support amongst fanbases soley because of his scrappy "do anything to win" persona. When outside of the game, that type of personality is looked down upon in a "come on, how old are you?" kind of way. After Martin's death, the Yankees produced a video about his life which included interviews with various MFYL Douchebags, presumably in bars around MFYS. Anyway, one of these douches, with bandages covering his eye, mentions that he loved Martin because he got into lots of fights, and used the fact that he, the douche, was a bar room brawler himself. Somehow that demographic in fandom, no matter what the actual size, always seems to be the most vocal. Especially when you consider Martin described himself as "I may not have been the greatest Yankee, but I sure am the proudest." In many ways, that speaks volumes more about Martin's ego than his dedication to the "pinstripes." And all three paragraphs speak volumes about the folks willing to play up that sordid and borderline criminal image as traits to be admired and ones that are emblematic of their franchise.

Santana - 3.0 Castillo - 0.8 Sheffield - 0.4 Tatis - 0.7 Green - 0.8 Stokes - 0.3 Reed - 1.5

The search for Beltran continues ... Castillo - 2B F. Martinez - LF Wright - 3B Sheffield - RF Tatis - 1B Santos - C R Martinez - SS Reed - CF Santana - P

One could argue, I suppose, that he did bring in the effective mid-relief guy (Parnell) at the time when 'the real save' might occur: 6th inn, 2-on/2-out, 2-run lead and he got out of it (IF single - K). But if that truly was 'out of the box thinking' then it got steamrolled right afterward when he swapped Parnell out before the next inning (even though he wasn't PH'd for) in favor of Feliciano on account of 4 of the next 5 hitters being LH-swingers. How 'bout letting Parnell fail first - or even look like he might - and then make the switch when it's necessary? Instead, he made the 'by the book' move ahead of time which left him with less to fall back on when one of the later relievers does start to fall apart.

- while most of the blame for this one will come down (and deservedly so) on Putz, do note that we also got no-hit from the 4th inning through Tatis's bloop single in the 9th. Those backup lineups will only take you so far. - and also, why, with 0 outs and a 2-run lead in the top of the 8th, are we wasting one of our 6 remaining outs by bunting Wright's lead-off walk over to 2nd? ... especially when (nice night for Valdez aside) you're bunting w/Reed (2 2Bs himself) into two really weak hitters in Valdez & Schneider. I missed a big chunk of the middle of this game (settling in just in time for the bottom of the 8th) so I can't say I was pissed off about it at the time ... but I am now.

="Nymr83":w21z4rsg]... I'd like to know who these idiot coaches were who thought this was acceptable behavior.[/quote:w21z4rsg] I think they'd call it 'job security'. Billy would undoubtedly refer to it as 'loyalty'. Certain law enforcement personnel, on the other hand, might see it as 'abetting'. metirish Jun 02 2009 07:45 AM It doesn't mean these were the guys there as Martin's muscle but these were his coaches in 1982 Art Fowler, Charlie Metro, Clete Boyer, George Mitterwald, Jackie S.Moore, Lee Walls Edgy DC Jun 02 2009 07:47 AM What I took from that story is a lot exclamation points. Yeah, I'm sure coaches under a bully like that live in the knowledge that to defy the manager is to guarantee you never eat another big league meal again. Wayne Hagin is telling (!) the story (!) but I don't see him standing up for the player either. I'm sure he lived under the same reality. metirish Jun 02 2009 07:56 AM From what I am reading Martin was the GM of the A's that season too. Sounds like a fun place to work. John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 02 2009 08:05 AM That's Wayne all right. Superfluous descriptions of things other than the point, but the point, eventually. Yes, Rickey sounds like a good egg and Martin a douchebag. Edgy DC Jun 02 2009 08:22 AM This is who I was able to find from the 1982 coaching staff. Clete Boyer Art Fowler Charlie Metro George Mitterwald Lee Walls John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 02 2009 08:24 AM Were you able to accomplish that by reading this thread? Lee Walls -- Met expansion draft pick, traded before the season began. Edgy DC Jun 02 2009 08:33 AM I went looking before the post appeared. I'm like a punching bag. metirish Jun 02 2009 08:47 AM It actually wasn't as easy as I thought to find his coaching staff. Didn't baseball reference list the entire coaching staff at one time? , I couldn't find anything there about the A's 1982 staff except the manager. LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 02 2009 09:42 AM ="Frayed Knot"]Mostly what I take out of that story is further confirmation that Billy Martin was an ass (and a chicken-shit one at that) and that his beloved status as a Yanqui icon is a yet another stain on their sordid history. Over the years, I've started to think of Billy Martin-- smart bordering on devious, hypercompetitive, paranoid, alternately hateful and pathetic-- as sort of a living Dorian Gray portrait of Mantle, the archetypal MFY Legend. The hagiography and the underlying dirtiness are pretty inextricably linked, no? TheOldMole Jun 02 2009 10:11 AM These guys were professional athletes, Hagin was not. I don't blame him for not stepping into the middle of this one. Wonderful story about Ricky, nice story about Lon and Wayne. SteveJRogers Jun 02 2009 10:21 AM ="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"]="Frayed Knot"]Mostly what I take out of that story is further confirmation that Billy Martin was an ass (and a chicken-shit one at that) and that his beloved status as a Yanqui icon is a yet another stain on their sordid history. Over the years, I've started to think of Billy Martin-- smart bordering on devious, hypercompetitive, paranoid, alternately hateful and pathetic-- as sort of a living Dorian Gray portrait of Mantle, the archetypal MFY Legend. The hagiography and the underlying dirtiness are pretty inextricably linked, no? The thing about Martin, like Pete Rose, he gets plently of support amongst fanbases soley because of his scrappy "do anything to win" persona. When outside of the game, that type of personality is looked down upon in a "come on, how old are you?" kind of way. After Martin's death, the Yankees produced a video about his life which included interviews with various MFYL Douchebags, presumably in bars around MFYS. Anyway, one of these douches, with bandages covering his eye, mentions that he loved Martin because he got into lots of fights, and used the fact that he, the douche, was a bar room brawler himself. Somehow that demographic in fandom, no matter what the actual size, always seems to be the most vocal. Especially when you consider Martin described himself as "I may not have been the greatest Yankee, but I sure am the proudest." In many ways, that speaks volumes more about Martin's ego than his dedication to the "pinstripes." DocTee Jun 02 2009 03:30 PM Another view of Billy and Rickey (courtesy SF Chronicle, 31 May) In 30 years as the A's traveling secretary, Mickey Morabito has traveled roughly 1.65 million miles. If you add the four years before that, when he was the Yankees' publicist, he's flown nearly 1.8 million miles. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- To put that in perspective, he has flown enough miles to circumnavigate the egos of George Steinbrenner, Billy Martin and Reggie Jackson. He has met the Queen of England, President George H.W. Bush and Frank Sinatra. Of the three, he was most in awe of Sinatra. He has worked for two of the most controversial owners in baseball history, Steinbrenner and Charlie Finley. He has worked with two highly successful managers, Billy Martin and Tony La Russa, and been to six World Series. "Tony would always say the season is a marathon," Morabito said. "He didn't want the players to be too high or too down. That wasn't Billy's way at all. Every game was the seventh game of the World Series." While making all the A's travel arrangements, Morabito has had to deal with numerous transportation problems, even though the A's and other teams stopped flying commercial in the mid-'80s. On one scary occasion, the A's plane had a near-miss while descending into Oakland just as another plane was climbing. A trusted confidante Along the way, he has become a friend and confidante of managers, coaches and players. Morabito insists that the tempestuous Martin saved the A's franchise in Oakland. He argues that La Russa's 1988-90 A's should have been considered nearly on a par with Cincinnati's "Big Red Machine" of the 1970s as one of the greatest teams of all time. It was Martin who lured Morabito, now 58, to the A's in 1980. The two had become close during Martin's first two (of five) stints as the Yankees' manager. That first year in Oakland, he said, was one of the most enjoyable of the 30. The previous A's team had lost 108 games under manager Jim Marshall, but Martin, who was born and raised in Berkeley, pushed them to 83-79 and second place. "You could say that Billy single-handedly saved this franchise," Morabito said. That year, Finley agreed to sell the team to Marvin Davis, who was going to move the team to Denver. The deal fell through, and Oakland officials and business people sought local investors to buy the team, leading to the purchase by Walter Haas. "If Billy doesn't come here in 1980 and create that excitement," Morabito said, "I don't know if the A's are even here." That might be overstating Martin's contribution. With the Raiders' announcement that they were moving to Los Angeles, Oakland wasn't about to let the A's out of their lease. Martin brought winning There was no disputing the fact that Martin had brought about a radical improvement in the A's. "What happens with a team sometimes is that losing begets losing, and people get comfortable with losing," Morabito said. "Billy was never comfortable around losing. After a game, he would slam his door shut or scream at the coaches or somebody. The guys would be frightened about this a little bit. I think Billy almost scared that team into winning." In the strike-shortened 1981 season, the A's reached the American League Championship Series before losing to the Yankees. Morabito, who grew up in New York, had been a Yankees batboy at age 18 and their public relations director at age 25. That meant he was thrust at a tender age into what he called the "Vicious Triangle" of Steinbrenner, Martin and slugger Reggie Jackson. In the late 1970s, they were the center of the infighting that made the Yankee clubhouse the Bronx Zoo. "You'd come in and some days Reggie and Billy would be together and they'd be mad at George," Morabito said. "Some days Reggie and George were mad at Billy. Or Billy and George were mad at Reggie. You'd come in and say, 'Who's on what side today?' " Martin gets mouthy Martin was fired in 1978 after telling reporters, "They deserve each other. One's a born liar (Jackson) and the other's convicted (Steinbrenner, who had been convicted of making illegal campaign contributions to Richard Nixon in 1972)." Steinbrenner changed his mind about Martin, and the Yankees announced he would return as skipper the following season. Without the owner's knowledge, Morabito and general manager Al Rosen arranged for a lunch meeting with Martin and the beat writers. "Somebody asks Billy about Reggie, and Billy's had a couple of glasses of wine, so he goes off on Reggie," Morabito said. "After the luncheon, I know I'm dead." Save by newspaper strike Incensed over the lunch idea, Steinbrenner said, "Morabito, if you're so smart, let's see how this comes out in the papers." Picturing banner headlines of Martin ripping Jackson and certain he was about to lose his job, Morabito found out - to his relief - that the New York papers went on strike that night. "So I survived." Martin died in a one-car crash in Fenton, N.Y., on Christmas Day 1989. He and a friend, who was driving, had been drinking heavily. Morabito served as a pall-bearer at the funeral at St. Patrick's Cathedral in New York. Thousands lined the procession route. "It was like the president was coming through," Morabito said. "New Yorkers related to Billy. They loved him. They never related to Reggie. They liked Reggie, but if it ever came down to Billy or Reggie they were going to back Billy." What about between Martin and Steinbrenner? "Billy was their boy." The cast of characters Here are Mickey Morabito's thoughts about some of the people he has worked with during his 30 years as the A's traveling secretary and his four years before that as the Yankees' publicist. Mark McGwire - "One of the more misunderstood guys right now. Mac has always been quiet. He's getting the reputation that he's a recluse. He really isn't. This is just the way he was. He never sought publicity. It came after him." Jose Canseco - "Totally the opposite. A guy that was loud and brash and sought the limelight. The sad thing is, he was a five-tool player but fell in love with hitting home runs and unfortunately stopped working on (the rest of) his game." Rickey Henderson - "One of the funniest guys I've ever been around. He had an on-off switch. He could be moody and pout a little bit, but when he turned the switch on, there was nobody better." Tony La Russa - "The most intense, most organized guy I've ever been around. Constantly thinking about the game. At a bar or restaurant, you're trying to relax, and Tony will pull out a napkin and start writing the lineup for the next day." Bill King, the late A's broadcaster - "He could be the classiest individual out there. He loved fine dining, the ballet, the opera. On the other end, he could slop food, he was one of the more casual dressers you could see, and he had this beat-up old car. He was like two people." Billy Martin - "Billy managed by his gut. In this day with scouting reports and videos, Billy would say, 'I know what I want to do. I don't need charts and graphs.' They'd send matchups (statistics) to him, and he'd say, 'I already know what the hitter has done against this pitcher.' " Dennis Eckersley - "If he wasn't on your team, you hated him. You always thought he was showing you up. But as a competitor, you wanted him on your team." Dave Stewart - "One of the nicest people I've been around in this game. Cared about everybody around him. He's one of those guys you meet in your life who, if you were down and out, you could call and he'd be there to help you out." Thurman Munson - "We used to play hockey with a roll of tape in the Yankees' clubhouse. Once I stepped on his hand, and the other players (jokingly) said, 'You're done. You broke Thurman's hand.' When he died in the plane crash in Ohio, we had to find Billy, who was out fishing. When I told him, Billy broke down and cried like a baby." Reggie Jackson - "A little moody. When he got on the field, he played hard. He wanted to be in the limelight. He went out in New York. He loved to see and be seen. He was an interesting guy to be around." George Steinbrenner - "When a fireman or policeman got killed in New York City, he made sure the families had everything they needed, like money for the kids for school. With all the publicity he did want, he didn't want anybody to know about this." Met Hunter Jun 02 2009 05:22 PM In defense of the "other" players, who knows what their motives were? Maybe they were on the bubble as far as playing time or staying on the team. Imagine the pressure of maintaining your playing performance, while working under a nut job like Billy Martin and his lush ass kissing cronies? Or maybe Brian Kingman was a dick that needed a good ass kicking. Number 6 Jun 03 2009 12:44 AM I feel like a diorama should have been included with this article. Frayed Knot Jun 03 2009 06:56 AM ]The thing about Martin, like Pete Rose, he gets plently of support amongst fanbases soley because of his scrappy "do anything to win" persona. When outside of the game, that type of personality is looked down upon in a "come on, how old are you?" kind of way. After Martin's death, the Yankees produced a video about his life which included interviews with various MFYL Douchebags, presumably in bars around MFYS. Anyway, one of these douches, with bandages covering his eye, mentions that he loved Martin because he got into lots of fights, and used the fact that he, the douche, was a bar room brawler himself. Somehow that demographic in fandom, no matter what the actual size, always seems to be the most vocal. Especially when you consider Martin described himself as "I may not have been the greatest Yankee, but I sure am the proudest." In many ways, that speaks volumes more about Martin's ego than his dedication to the "pinstripes." And all three paragraphs speak volumes about the folks willing to play up that sordid and borderline criminal image as traits to be admired and ones that are emblematic of their franchise. TheOldMole Jun 03 2009 07:01 AM There's all sorts of reasons for not standing up, and I'm not saying I wouldn't have done what the other players did. But Rickey stood up. G-Fafif Jun 04 2009 07:59 PM Exploring the Wayne Hagin 'FAN blog unearthed this gem on a night with no game and bad news. He addressed the Cardinal fan half of it during the last trip to St. Loo. Lovely thoughts on his partner from last September 28. (Howie also has a FAN blog in which he writes almost as he spoke when he had his talk show. His story about not getting fruit at the Steel City Diner is very cute.) ]I am asked by the multitudes about broadcasting in New York City as opposed to other cities where I worked and resided. The answer is, broadcasting in New York brings you face to face, mind to mind, and heart to heart with the fan. In this case, the New York Mets fans. People designate the St. Louis Cardinals fans as "baseball's greatest fans" and Keith Hernandez and I have spoken often about the Cardinals fortune of having a collegiate type of following. Mistakes are made on the field but the fans will support you as if you were a member of the family. They revel in their midwest hospitality and that transcends to the baseball diamond at Busch Stadium. It's their legacy and there was no better example of that then when the Cardinals played the Red Sox in the 2004 World Series. Game four was played in old Busch Stadium and Derek Lowe shut down Albert Pujols and company to win the game, the World Series, and beat the demons of not winning it all over the past 86 years. What did the St. Louis crowd do? They not only clapped their hands in tribute but ushers and stadium officials actually let Red Sox fans ,who didn't have seats and had stood outside the stadium, come in and join in the history of the moment. That was St. Louis and as you know, that wouldn't have happened at Shea nor will it happen at Citi Field. It doesn't make one city "better" than the other. They are different cities altogether and that's what makes my experience special to me. I love the heart and soul of the Mets fan. I work with a man, Howie Rose, who exemplifies the Mets fan. Howie is a true pro and it's fabulous to sit next to him broadcasting a game. I hear his anguish in the words he utters and I feel the triumph when a big moment is reached in the game. I know this, Howie would love to "put it in the books" about a hundred times this season following a Mets win and so would the fans. I saw and felt the compassion for the closing of Shea Stadium and the memories shared there by fans. When we signed off the air after a disheartening loss (another one) to the Marlins that knocked the Mets out of the postseason, we were down to our final segment which is where we sign off and say good bye. I looked to my left and there stood Howie Rose. It is my job to finish off our post game show every day but something didn't feel right. As I looked at Howie during the commercial break, the thought occured to me, this man needs to say good bye to this stadium, not me. Howie had come to see the Mets in his youth and now drew a paycheck watching them in his prime. I will never forget how he captured the moment with his words and hid his tears until he signed off. To me, that was the definition of what a Mets fan is all about. You love your Mets but expect them to win. If they don't, there is no silence in the crowd. The Mets fan wears his or her emotions on their lungs and we hear it every day at the ball park. Would you want it any other way? Vic Sage Jun 05 2009 11:32 AM ="SteveJRogers":1zzyzhrl] After Martin's death, the Yankees produced a video about his life which included interviews with various MFYL Douchebags, presumably in bars around MFYS. Anyway, one of these douches, with bandages covering his eye, mentions that he loved Martin because he got into lots of fights, and used the fact that he, the douche, was a bar room brawler himself.[/quote:1zzyzhrl] If you're talking about the movie "Billy Martin: The Man. The Myth. The Manager (1990)", it wasn't produced by the Yankees. It was produced, directed and edited by my brother. It started out as a how-to-manage video, featuring Billy. After his death, they added interviews with many of his former players, including Ricky, talking about Billy. It wasn't about his life, and it wasn't "The Bronx is Burning", nor was it ever intended to be. It was about Billy on managing, a subject he was more than qualified to talk about, and then it became a tribute to him from his former players, none of whom were under any obligation to offer such a tribute. http://www.amazon.com/Billy-Martin-Man-Myth-Manager/dp/B000R7HY4G