IGT 5/16/12 Reds@Mets - Winner holds the road WC slot

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

JCL Presents ... Ms. Mets' Thoughts on the Game!

1. There's just no good reason for Parnell to throw just 5 or 6 pitches an outing. Especially when Terry's going to explain away having to go with Carrasco later because Ramirez wasn't available.

2. It ruined an otherwise pleasant night at the park. It was my first game at CF this year. Got a single seat in 414, right behind home plate. Lots of Reds fans in colors, they are enjoying an extended NYC week with an MFY series following this one. Their peeps at least were polite.

3. Wings from the Prom Club suck, but they come in a jumbo souvenier helmet to match the smaller Carvel ones.

4. It's easy to forget how awesome baseball players are at playing baseball sometimes, but watching something as simple as Brandon Phillips pick a routine grounder can remind you. There was something beautiful watching how efficiently he moves, nothing goes to waste, the ball sticks in his glove like it's magnetized and it all allows him to come up slowly and throw accurately. I guess all ballplayers can do this but it's worth appreciating sometimes.

5. I'm all for Duda's no-nonsense approach to hard singles up the middle but can't remember the last time he had an XBH.

6. Mike Leake is a good athlete. Two hits, a successful 2-strike sac bunt, good baserunning and a good slide at home. That was huge.

7. That said the Mets conceiveably could have knocked him out by the 3rd inning. Muffy and Davis snuffing the 3rd inning rally on consecutive pitches was the kind of thing that would come back and get us. Not to mention Kirk's overslide (he was out).

8. Baxter's catch was very nice.

9. Bad night at the dish for Muffy.

10. Santana made his own troubles to a degree, threw too many pitches to stiffs like Ludwick.

11. Nickeas is worthless offensively but did a good job staying with the ball on that squeeze bunt.

12. Chapman's numbers look like a misprint. wtf.

[batmagadanleadoff]

I thought that if the Reds won this game --which they did -- they'd gain sole possession of the road WC slot, hence the thread title. But the Mets, now tied with Miami in the standings, still hold a share of the road WC slot, despite their loss. ESPN had mistakenly listed the Reds record at 18-16 last night, instead of 18-17, thus the error.

[Edgy MD]

Fman99 wrote: How is Chapman not closing for this team? Dusty Baker is a tard. I think he's got a toothpick lodged in his brain.

How is Chapman not starting for this team? I'd want that guy pitching 270 innings.

(Enough on the "tard" jokes, please. They hurt my feelings.)

Good job on the game thoughts. Mike Leake also did a great job getting the Bad News Bears into game shape in a few days.

[Edgy MD]

Hey, wearing the snow whites in a night game was a bad move!

[Ceetar]

Edgy DC wrote: Hey, wearing the snow whites in a night game was a bad move!

Blame Santana.

[Edgy MD]

I do. Or at least I will, just as soon as I figure a way to sell Terry on the reality that his bullpen strategy is utterly, utterly doomed.

To me, the key to focus on with DJ Carrasco is that the guy they tossed overboard at midnight is the the guy Terry let himself get foxed into using with the game on the line a hour or two earlier. And it's not like it was the 17th inning. That's crazy if you're willing to stop and think about it. Terry, you've got to stop and think.

It's not so much whether he was bad or good, but that they so desperately needed him to be good, because they so liberally burn through everybody else.

The notion that the key to your success is lining up seven consistently effective relief pitchers is just a maddeningly self-destructive approach. Your're always approaching this level of consistency, but you never arrive. One hole is plugged, then another springs somewhere else. Everyone works hard, and the manager is proud as hell of his entire staff, but you look up and suddenly the season is over. Oh, but we were so close. Then Vinny hurt his foot and Domingo lost his fastball. And he never stops to think it didn't have to be that hard.

I swear, it seems like a championship team used to sometimes be able to get through the season with seven or eight effective pitchers, the playoffs with six or seven, the World Series with five or six.

My point in cranking in this thread is that a team used to be able to carry a Carrasco or two, hoping he'd find his shit as his pitched some mopup once or twice a week, dealing with it if he didn't, and hoping he'd maybe bail the better pitchers out whether he found it or not.

[Ceetar]

Edgy DC wrote: To me, the key to focus on with DJ Carrasco is that the guy they tossed overboard at midnight is the the guy Terry let himself get foxed into using with the game on the line a hour or two earlier. And it's not like it was the 17th inning. That's crazy if you're willing to stop and think about it. Terry, you've got to stop and think.

Yeah, using a guy that's one bad spot from being released in the most crucial spot in the game doesn't seem wise. Neither does the short role for Parnell given the short pen. I could've maybe bought their roles reversed. Give Carrasco that one out spot so you can us Parnell later. He was probably managing to get Santana a win in that spot though.

Still, for a team showing itself real capable of comebacks, Terry needs to pitch 1-run deficits with better pitchers.

[Edgy MD]

Why bring Carrasco in the get the one out in the seventh? Why bring him in at all? Why not bring in Parnell and, if he's getting the job done, try to let him get seven outs?

It's so simple, it's stupid. Every out he gets for you is one out you don't have to look for from the last guy on your staff.

[Ceetar]

Edgy DC wrote: Why bring Carrasco in the get the one out in the seventh? Why bring him in at all? Why not bring in Parnell and, if he's getting the job done, try to let him get seven outs? It's so simple, it's stupid. Every out he gets for you is one out you don't have to look for from the last guy on your staff.

Well, pitching him seven outs probably eliminates him from being used today. Whereas 3 or 4 wouldn't, but I agree, I was just musing on a different possibility. Lower leverage in the 7th due to the 9 outs left and still having the lead. I also would've preferred he leave Santana in.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

Santana turned into a pumpkin pretty quick. That we even had a lead to protect was mostly Baxter's catch and Votto's error.

edit: Parnell's out was huge and we needed it, so I had no problem going to him when we did. It was rotating him out so soon that so little sense.

Edited May 17, 2012 by Guest

[Edgy MD]

Well, pitching him seven outs probably eliminates him from being used today.

Who would need him today? If he finished the game, the Mets would have the win, and the whole rest of the staff would be available.

It's almost a law, but using four pitchers leaves your staff more gassed, in general, than using one does.

[Guest LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr]

Leave a guy in until he can't go anymore--whether via fatigue or proving definitively that he's having an off-night-- then giving him a rest the next day. Seems self-explanatory.

[ashie62]

This loss belongs to Collins.

[Frayed Knot]

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Santana turned into a pumpkin pretty quick. That we even had a lead to protect was mostly Baxter's catch and Votto's error.

Which is a point in the argument from the other day (pre-virus attack) when we were discussing PH-ing for Niese.
Here Terry did not PH for Johan and not only didn't get an extra run in (runner on 3rd/2-out) but the starter served up an HR and didn't finish the inning he was left in for anyway.

Bottom line is: if the pen is going to keep imploding like this night after night with the only alteration being whose turn it is to throw the gas can we're going to lose a lot of games because of it no matter what happens - so managing it wisely becomes all the more important.

[Edgy MD]

If Santana's went bad, we were able to get help in there soon enough to mitigate it. It seems far wiser than lifting starters --- or relievers* --- pre-emptively.

*I will bang this damn drum in every thread on this forum if I have to.