Fernando Martinez & Wilmer Flores

[Guest AG/DC]

There we go.

Is there a place between a superstar and a washout? Is anything less than a Hall of Fame career a washout once you've been ranked number-one in the Mets system?

Look, furor.

[Benjamin Grimm]

AG/DC wrote: Is there a place between a superstar and a washout? Is anything less than a Hall of Fame career a washout once you've been ranked number-one in the Mets system?

Well, you don't have to be a Hall of Famer to avoid being a washout. (I don't think!)

Was Edgardo Alfonzo ever considered a Number One? Or was he more of a pleasant surprise? (I seem to remember the latter.)

Gregg Jefferies, who had a nice career: Washout.

Darryl Strawberry and Dwight Gooden: not Hall-of-Famers, but not washouts.

But when you look at how many fans wanted to give up on Jose Reyes when he was only 23 or 24, I do have to question the rationality of many of the fans who rush to judgment.

I really do think that Fernando Martinez, if he comes up with the Mets, will face some undeserved heat from the fans.

[Valadius]

Hell, David Wright didn't face anywhere near the expectations that Fernando Martinez is facing. As I recall it, we were so focused on whether or not Jose Reyes was going to live up to his hype (which he has, for the most part) that when David came along, the reaction seemed to be, "Oh, look, we've got another one!"

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

I had wood for David Wright about a year before he arrived as a matter of fact.

[Guest AG/DC]

Valadius wrote: Hell, David Wright didn't face anywhere near the expectations that Fernando Martinez is facing.

I'm calling bullshit.

OE: Also, it's reasonable to conclude that Wilmer's displacement of Fernando in some rankings might be more (or as much) related to Wilmer's ascendancy as to Fernando's slipping.

[Valadius]

Come on. David's our last great home-grown hitter, and when he came up, he had Reyes to compete with in terms of who was going to be better. F-Mart's had the super-hitting-prospect label all to himself, pretty much, for the last few years. Escobar is a great example to compare him to. No one else stood out when he was being touted. That's what Martinez has been dealing with for the most part. It wasn't like that for David Wright.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

That's nonsense. Everyone familiar with analysis and projections, etc. couldn't help but know Wright stood a better chance than Reyes of being good, and at any rate was a completely different kind of player than Reyes and would garner different attention than he would.

Reyes may have been more exciting to watch play but Wright was every bit as exciting, if not more, to arrive.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

="AG/DC"] Valadius wrote: OE: Also, it's reasonable to conclude that Wilmer's displacement of Fernando in some rankings might be more (or as much) related to Wilmer's ascendancy as to Fernando's slipping. That's how it works, for the most part.

AG/DC Sep 09 2008 12:48 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Sep 09 2008 12:50 PM

Valadius wrote: Come on. David's our last great home-grown hitter, and when he came up, Most recent, maybe. Not, I hope, the last. Valadius wrote: ...he had Reyes to compete with in terms of who was going to be better. F-Mart's had the super-hitting-prospect label all to himself, pretty much, for the last few years. Escobar is a great example to compare him to. No one else stood out when he was being touted. That's what Martinez has been dealing with for the most part. It wasn't like that for David Wright. I don't agree that expectations (whatever that means and however they are measured) are hooked to how alone you are in the system. And as far as being alone "for the last few years," Martinez has come along behind Lastings Milledge and Carlos Gomez, who were both similarly promoted aggressively to levels that were huge challenges to players their age, and it was something of a surprise when he surpassed those two (only this past off-season) in the esteem of rankers (some, not all, I think), as well as the Mets. He's been alone (in that sense) a little over seven months.

metirish Sep 09 2008 12:49 PM

I remember just being excited that Wright was up at all , those were some dark times for a Met fan.I recall Howe handling the whole thing rather well.

duan Sep 09 2008 02:04 PM

AG/DC wrote: There we go. Is there a place between a superstar and a washout? Is anything less than a Hall of Fame career a washout once you've been ranked number-one in the Mets system? Look, furor. I refuse to think anywhere with signature lines of women in (a very small amount) of underwear is worth of any time.

Benjamin Grimm Sep 09 2008 02:08 PM

Yikes. There's an example of the slippery slope you're on once you allow graphics and fonts in signature lines. I'm so glad we don't do that here.

AG/DC Sep 09 2008 02:09 PM

Sure, but how do you feel about places with avatars with Morrissey showing off his cowbones?

Benjamin Grimm Sep 09 2008 02:13 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Sep 09 2008 02:15 PM

I do think we've stepped gingerly over the shark with avatars. If it were up to me, I'd impose a maximum height (to go with the maximum width). This is about as big as an avatar should be:

themetfairy Sep 09 2008 02:14 PM

AG/DC wrote: Sure, but how do you feel about places with avatars with Morrissey showing off his cowbones? I keep thinking that's what Duan looks like.

duan Sep 10 2008 05:06 PM

i've tamed my avatar a little.

[Guest AG/DC]

Valadius wrote: Come on. David's our last great home-grown hitter, and when he came up,

Most recent, maybe. Not, I hope, the last.

Valadius wrote: ...he had Reyes to compete with in terms of who was going to be better. F-Mart's had the super-hitting-prospect label all to himself, pretty much, for the last few years. Escobar is a great example to compare him to. No one else stood out when he was being touted. That's what Martinez has been dealing with for the most part. It wasn't like that for David Wright.

I don't agree that expectations (whatever that means and however they are measured) are hooked to how alone you are in the system.

And as far as being alone "for the last few years," Martinez has come along behind Lastings Milledge and Carlos Gomez, who were both similarly promoted aggressively to levels that were huge challenges to players their age, and it was something of a surprise when he surpassed those two (only this past off-season) in the esteem of rankers (some, not all, I think), as well as the Mets. He's been alone (in that sense) a little over seven months.

[metirish]

I remember just being excited that Wright was up at all , those were some dark times for a Met fan.I recall Howe handling the whole thing rather well.

[duan]

AG/DC wrote: There we go. Is there a place between a superstar and a washout? Is anything less than a Hall of Fame career a washout once you've been ranked number-one in the Mets system? Look, furor.

I refuse to think anywhere with signature lines of women in (a very small amount) of underwear is worth of any time.

[Benjamin Grimm]

Yikes. There's an example of the slippery slope you're on once you allow graphics and fonts in signature lines.

I'm so glad we don't do that here.

[Guest AG/DC]

Sure, but how do you feel about places with avatars with Morrissey showing off his cowbones?

[Benjamin Grimm]

I do think we've stepped gingerly over the shark with avatars. If it were up to me, I'd impose a maximum height (to go with the maximum width).

This is about as big as an avatar should be:

[Guest themetfairy]

AG/DC wrote: Sure, but how do you feel about places with avatars with Morrissey showing off his cowbones?

I keep thinking that's what Duan looks like.

[duan]

i've tamed my avatar a little.