Now I know you guys hate Rumors

[Guest Johnny Dickshot]

Not for nothin Mark, but couldn't help but notice your boss took more cheap shots at Marty Noble this week (you know, sorta like the kind you fired at the Phoenix writers in your Backman exclusive) than anything you've gotten here in this thread.

One trouble with using annonymous sources almost exclusively is that when they steer you wrong (see: RICK PETERSON TO BE FIRED, by Mark Healey) readers never know whether your mystery liar is continuing to use you as a mouthpiece and your credibility, despite how many times you link to a bio mentioning a "real" employer whose standards these websclusives could never meet, is damaged.

[Guest Mark Healey]

]Not for nothin Mark, but couldn't help but notice your boss took more cheap shots at Marty Noble this week (you know, sorta like the kind you fired at the Phoenix writers in your Backman exclusive) than anything you've gotten here in this thread.

Mike's my partner, not my boss.

]One trouble with using annonymous sources almost exclusively is that when they steer you wrong (see: RICK PETERSON TO BE FIRED, by Mark Healey) readers never know whether your mystery liar is continuing to use you as a mouthpiece and your credibility, despite how many times you link to a bio mentioning a "real" employer whose standards these websclusives could never meet, is damaged.

[Guest KC]

JD:>>>Not for nothin Mark, but couldn't help but notice your boss took more cheap shots at Marty Noble this week (you know, sorta like the kind you fired at the Phoenix writers in your Backman exclusive) than anything you've gotten here in this thread.<<<

MH:>>>Mike's my partner, not my boss.<<<

Address the cheap shots at Noble or the Phoenix writers vs. a poster on a
message board questioning your column's sources or just move on.

When all these links to your site started to appear I originally thought they
should really be in the member promotion forum but didn't move them be-
cause you're Mets' fans. The way you let your sensitive ego get in the way
the second an internet poster says something a little brusque to you, you kind
of demonstrate (to me, at least) that this is all about promoting you and your
stuff - and you're not really interested in being friends with us.

[Elster88]

Not to pile on, but I thought you had agreed to keep all your links in one thread. That went away pretty quickly too.

[Guest Mark Healey]

Elster88 wrote: Not to pile on, but I thought you had agreed to keep all your links in one thread. That went away pretty quickly too.

Sorry about that, I thought the single thread idea was for Going Nine, not for any Gotham Baseball story. Won't happen again.

[Elster88]

Oh. Well I thought they were the same thing. Maybe I should be the one apologizing. Ahhh, I won't get involved. You all decide.

[Guest Mark Healey]

]Address the cheap shots at Noble or the Phoenix writers vs. a poster on a message board questioning your column's sources or just move on.

Apples and Oranges. In both instances the writers in question took facts, compared it to the stories said person served to the public, and called said writers to task. It's a little different. If you don't understand the difference, I can't help you. Also, you didn't question, you said they were "made up", which is a gig difference.

]When all these links to your site started to appear I originally thought they should really be in the member promotion forum but didn't move them be-cause you're Mets' fans. The way you let your sensitive ego get in the way the second an internet poster says something a little brusque to you, you kind of demonstrate (to me, at least) that this is all about promoting you and your stuff - and you're not really interested in being friends with us.

That's your opinion. Since my site is free, and I get no more than 20 or so reads on GB a week from here, there's no reason for me to "promote" my site here. I've stayed and tried to make nice becausae I have the utmost respect for Mr. Prince.

As fairly new person, I wasn't aware of any rules or guidelines regarding where posts should go. Had Mod or Webmaster had PM'd me and asked me to do so, I gladly would have. Edgy did tell me once to post my stories in the Baseball Forum, so I did.


It's pretty simple.

You, Dickshoit and a few others have had a stick up their ass about me and GB since I showed up, so I am certain "being friends" is something you could care less about. So please spare me. I don't know eher any of you are from, but I'm from E39th Street in Flatbush, so when somebody fires across my bow, I get in their face (verbally, I mean) and defend myself, my site and my colleagues.

If Edgy wants me to leave, I'll leave. But I'm not going to leave in a huff because there's one or two of you that are clearly jerking my chain.

[Guest heep]

Ouch.

[Guest KC]

I do bring out the fire in people sometimes. Not sure why.

Edgy's not my boss, we're partners lolololol.

[G-Fafif]

Mark Healey wrote: I've stayed and tried to make nice because I have the utmost respect for Mr. Prince.

I feel like Bill Clinton at the dedication of his library in November 2004 when he asked, "Am I the only person in America who likes both George Bush and John Kerry?" I'm down with Mark and I dig you guys. All questions about stories and motives are legitimate -- that's the beauty of the interactive life. But Mark is not making up stuff. He's a hard-working baseball journalist who shares a lot more a lot quicker than most do. And CPF is not a rumble. It's intelligent and generally friendly baseball talk, the only such place I've wandered to when I've wandered from my cozy blog nook.

Bill Clinton tried to make peace in the Middle East. He didn't get it done. You guys can keep going at it if you want. But since my name was invoked, I just wanted to say that.

And Let's Go Mets.

[Guest Johnny Dickshot]

Mark Healey wrote: Apples and Oranges. In both instances the writers in question took facts, compared it to the stories said person served to the public, and called said writers to task. It's a little different. If you don't understand the difference, I can't help you. Also, you didn't question, you said they were "made up", which is a gig difference.

That's not what happened. You suggested the Phoenix writer penned a peice damaging to Backman not because it was news but because the writer had a rooting stake in who was named manager. Even if that was dead-on, you know and I know that's a more serious charge than a cynical reader who won't buy what you write when it comes without attribution. Now, if you've chosen to run that risk with practically everything you write you cannot be surprised this kind of criticism comes your way. Saying that Bill Madden does the same thing doesn't change that either, and you know that too.

And your boyfriend (sorry, cheap shot -- partner), whose published work we've gone over here already ought to provide him the world's smallest podium from which to lecture journalism, leaped from exposing an error in Noble's peice to the conclusion that he'd done so because he'd become a tool of Met management and an embarrassment to his colleagues at MLB.com. That's the same thing?

[Guest Mark Healey]

G-Fafif wrote: ="Mark Healey"]I've stayed and tried to make nice because I have the utmost respect for Mr. Prince. I feel like Bill Clinton at the dedication of his library in November 2004 when he asked, "Am I the only person in America who likes both George Bush and John Kerry?" I'm down with Mark and I dig you guys. All questions about stories and motives are legitimate -- that's the beauty of the interactive life. But Mark is not making up stuff. He's a hard-working baseball journalist who shares a lot more a lot quicker than most do. And CPF is not a rumble. It's intelligent and generally friendly baseball talk, the only such place I've wandered to when I've wandered from my cozy blog nook. Bill Clinton tried to make peace in the Middle East. He didn't get it done. You guys can keep going at it if you want. But since my name was invoked, I just wanted to say that. And Let's Go Mets.

How can I argue with that? Right back atcha' pal...

[Guest KC]

You've ignored a lot here.

[Guest Mark Healey]

]That's not what happened. You suggested the Phoenix writer penned a peice damaging to Backman not because it was news but because the writer had a rooting stake in who was named manager. Even if that was dead-on, you know and I know that's a more serious charge than a cynical reader who won't buy what you write when it comes without attribution.

I simply took the words he chose in his story, presented the facts of the case, and made my judgement call based on facts.


Now, if you've chosen to run that risk with practically everything you write you cannot be surprised this kind of criticism comes your way. Saying that Bill Madden does the same thing doesn't change that either, and you know that too.

You obviously don't read everything I write. If you did, you wouldn't make that statement.

]And your boyfriend (sorry, cheap shot -- partner), whose published work we've gone over here already ought to provide him the world's smallest podium from which to lecture journalism, leaped from exposing an error in Noble's peice to the conclusion that he'd done so because he'd become a tool of Met management and an embarrassment to his colleagues at MLB.com. That's the same thing?

I'd answer this withe the spirit with which it was asked, but I just said I'd be good.

A writer who has worked the same room with another writer is far more qualified to criticize him. Many, if not all, choose not to. Mike knew what price he would pay for writing what he wrote and chose to take it. At at the every least, he out his name to it, which is far more than I can say for others in this business.

Did it ever occur to you that he did so for the benefit of the reader? I fully believe that he did.

[Guest Edgy DC]

]I'm from E39th Street in Flatbush, so when somebody fires across my bow, I get in their face (verbally, I mean) and defend myself, my site and my colleagues.

Paulie, is that you?










Old joke, Mark, and not at your expense.

[Guest Mark Healey]

Edgy DC wrote: ]I'm from E39th Street in Flatbush, so when somebody fires across my bow, I get in their face (verbally, I mean) and defend myself, my site and my colleagues. Paulie, is that you? Old joke, Mark, and not at your expense.

lol...

[Guest martin]

seriously though, do yall keep it real in your hood?

i cant take a journalist seriously unless they get in people's faces.

cmon man, are you kidding?

[Guest Mark Healey]

martin wrote: seriously though, do yall keep it real in your hood? i cant take a journalist seriously unless they get in people's faces. cmon man, are you kidding?

Perhaps I should act/react like many of my colleagues, who would never in a million years, use their real names or debate with their own readers in a public forum.

All I am trying to do is explain why I defend myself and/or my staff and my site so vehemently.

Oh and if you want to make fun of my "tough guy" act, please make it relevant.

I have never said Y'all...keeping it real...or hood (well, maybe on a sweatshirt)., in my life.

[Guest martin]

Mark Healey wrote: ="martin"]seriously though, do yall keep it real in your hood? i cant take a journalist seriously unless they get in people's faces. cmon man, are you kidding? Perhaps I should act/react like many of my colleagues, who would never in a million years, use their real names or debate with their own readers in a public forum. All I am trying to do is explain why I defend myself and/or my staff and my site so vehemently. Oh and if you want to make fun of my "tough guy" act, please make it relevant. I have never said Y'all...keeping it real...or hood (well, maybe on a sweatshirt)., in my life.

it seems to be that more than debating readers, you are recruiting them, which you need to do because your rumors are as entertaining as dice rolls.

maybe its just me, but all your talk here makes me take you less seriously. seems like just writing a good column and having your rumors turn out true would be enough.

[Guest Johnny Dickshot]

Mark Healey wrote: I simply took the words he chose in his story, presented the facts of the case, and made my judgement call based on facts.

The implication being you'd advocate having sat on the information and said nothing had he liked Backman, correct?

]A writer who has worked the same room with another writer is far more qualified to criticize him. Many, if not all, choose not to.

My bad. I didn't realize Marty Noble worked for a home electronics trade publication.

]Mike knew what price he would pay for writing what he wrote and chose to take it. At at the every least, he out his name to it, which is far more than I can say for others in this business.

So he's unprofessional AND has poor judgement. Got it.

]Did it ever occur to you that he did so for the benefit of the reader? I fully believe that he did.

Pointing out an errors in another publication is fine, and right (we have that much in common). Dropping a safe on a guy the way he did is unprofessional and slanderous and you know it.

My opinion? I think McGann wrote what he did for the benefit of himself. Without claiming to know all the politics of what goes on the beat I understand that Noble is unpopular among his colleagues. Klapisch and Harper condemned him in WORST TEAM for breaking from the "pack" in pursuit of one-on-ones (as if hustling were a crime) and I guy I know in the biz once described him to me as "a pain in the ass." And I know that competitors on the beat frequently bury sharp criticisms of one another in their copy. On the other hand, he didn't spend what -- 30 years? -- on the beat as a "tool of management" steering readers wrong, as someone who'd read that reckless column might conclude.

My guess is that McGann's remarks amount to a ham-handed attempt to ingratiate himself with others on the beat and appear "insidery" to readers by publishing that which other's professionalism, ethics and/or editors prevent them from saying. But the "service to the reader" part ends when he points out the errors in the column. The rest is a show of petty and unfair character assassination and looks positively ugly on your publication. Why not just out-write the guy and let the work speak for itself?

[Guest KC]

>>>I'm from E39th Street in Flatbush, so when somebody fires across my bow, I get in their face<<<

I was conceived in that neighborhood. I've tried to use it as an excuse for
being an ass on the internet but have failed every time.

I find it hard to believe that you've taken all this as seriously as you acted, Mark.
Getting old mofo jokes and stuff, one would think your skin would be a little thicker.

(note to self: never really piss off Dickshot)

[Guest Johnny Dickshot]

I'm not pissed off! (or have a stick in my ass).

I was only pointing out that while Mark is quick to defend himself against those questioning his integrity here, he and his partner have dished out even cheaper shots in their own work.

[Guest KC]

I hear ya, compadre.

[Guest ScarletKnight41]

I think the problem boils down to the fact that Mark invites us to discuss his articles, but doesn't like it when people disagree with them or wish to debate his points.

You can't expect this crew not to pipe up when we have issues with something. And Kase may have a point - if Mark's primary goal is just to promote his website, then perhaps the Member Promotion forum is more appropriate for his posts.

OTOH, if he really wants us to think about the articles and discuss them, then this is the proper subforum, but he has to be prepared for a full range of reactions to them.

[Elster88]

Johnny Dickshot wrote: I was only pointing out that while Mark is quick to defend himself against those questioning his integrity here, he and his partner have dished out even cheaper shots in their own work.

[Elster88]

Johnny Dickshot wrote: I was only pointing out that while Mark is quick to defend himself against those questioning his integrity here, he and his partner have dished out even cheaper shots in their own work.

I'm hoping he'll comment on this.

[Centerfield]

KC wrote: CF is a pillar of this group, he's not some shark hiding behind an alias out to bite the ass of anyone who strays into the pool with an opinion.

I'm a pillar. Cool. Thanks KC, but for what it's worth, that wasn't me arguing with Mark.

[Guest KC]

I find I confuse easier and easier as I slip into senilitiy.

[Guest Edgy DC]

Mark speaks: http://www.gothambaseball.com/audio/livefromdallas.mp3

More: http://www.gothambaseball.com/audio/LiveFromdallas2.mp3

Not for dialup connections.

[Elster88]

Johnny Dickshot wrote: I was only pointing out that while Mark is quick to defend himself against those questioning his integrity here, he and his partner have dished out even cheaper shots in their own work.

Any comments?